[Basic] Blood Moon Mafia - Game Over.

[Hallia]

I haven't been quiet this entire game, and I'm working on not being ^^

[Tommyrod]

Because I don't believe your claim sir.

That's unfortunate. It won't change the reality that I am the tracker though.

[Tommyrod]

Anyway, I've put scum in a delightfully difficult position:

If we lynch down my list, they're dead by D3. One of Despot or Hallia will apparently counter-claim me in the next day or two, because there's no available avenue left for them to win the game, particularly with a jailkeeper still safe somewhere. 

 

The less WIFOM gullible players like Cloud, Salami and Peace should be enough to lock this game down.

You're welcome.

 

[Hallia]

It won't be me, because I'm not a tracker. O.o BABABABUMMMMM

[Tommyrod]

It won't be me, because I'm not a tracker. O.o BABABABUMMMMM

 

If you're actually not scum then you should start thinking about who fits with Despot. 

[Tommyrod]

Goodnight all. I don't think the JK needs to protect me, as I become a martyr if I'm NKed.

[GoldeneyesND]

Well done everyone. Excellent reasoning.

[hazelkrs1]

Looks like I won't be able to finish my wotifesto before audit. It IS juicy tho!

 

 

And GE, you will be missed.

 

*drops some drank on the ground for his lost homie*

[Hallia]

Purple drank!

[hazelkrs1]

Okay first thing- I am slightly disappointed in the day's results, since we didn't lynch who I thought was the better candidate by a substantial margin. However, I aint too mad cause Tommy is a smooth criminal and I understand his last second claim would have def put some doubt in some people's minds, even those who saw through his scummy facade.

 

Second, to Tom directly- Thank you Tom.

 

I had been a little disheartened lately because it seemed I was too easy to catch as scum in some recent games. My pride forced me to attribute this to being such a good scumhunter that town was able to tell when I was constructing fake cases instead of real ones. But the pessimistic side of me though mebbe I just wasn't as good as I thought I was.

 

You have given me hope. If someone even as skilled and experienced as you can come out looking as scummy as you did D1 as scum (and yes, I AM sure you are mafia), it gives me some hope. And yeah, thank the inactive townies who failed to stay current in this game. Had we had their help, your wolf ass would be swinging among the rafters right now.

 

Okay, on to my wot!

 

In the beginning I was poking fun at Golden a bit because I thought he was trying something out that I hadn't seen him do as scum when he said I was cute and that I was off my meta. I thought he was just being really aggressive to start off in an attempt to flush out reactions. But his reasoning was totally counter-intuitive "scum tommy is verbose and town tommy is verbose so you're not verbose and must be scum!" made no sense, so I was poking fun at him by asking if that means I must be indie since what he said was that I'm apparently always verbose.

 

The only real link I've had to Mish is me thinking that her behavior hasn't been scummy enough to warrant the L-1 rush that transpired on her, and when I haven't understood her thinking I've asked her for clarification. When she left and said she'd be sick I mused about it in thread because it's hard to defend someone who won't even be around. It's never impossible that two players are aligned, but you should look at my questions to her and her responses and tell me if you still think we're scum-scum.

 

1st paragraph: *buzzer sound* EH! Wrong! GE said you were verbose and ____ as town, verbose and something else as scum. Can't remember the wording exactly. Point is, he DID say you were verbose in both alignments, but he also pointed out what he felt was different between the two as well. You ignored the other stuff he said in that post and just focused on the fact that he said verbose twice- you did this because it was a very easy way to discredit his meta argument on you.

 

2nd paragraph: *buzzer sound, louder this time* Wrong again muchacho! I established three early links between you BEFORE you started hardcore defending her. She mentioned you out of very few people in her OP, and then you soft defended her and immediately chainsaw defended her early in the game.

 

@Despo: Also, I suggest you try gifs or memes instead because you don't seem to have a knack for name distortion. I've bought an extra 1gb of net access.

 

I suggest you step up your game a LOT if you expect town to believe that it's possible you might be town

 

Hallia

Are you voting me because you genuinely think I'm scum

Or because you're mad at me

 

Classic scum move- attempting to classify votes on him as based on something outside the game so they have less weight

 

Just to clarify what I said about Tommy being aggressive - and then I'm going to drop it and try to put it aside, because I think my annoyance with him is clouding my read on him, so it's not very helpful right now -

 

I don't have a problem with aggressive styles in general, and my problem with Tommy so far is not really that he's aggressive - it's that he's clearly online a lot of the time, certainly a lot more than I am, so it was starting to feel like every time I came online, he was asking me again for updated reads or more questions about others. I'm sorry, I find it incredibly annoying. I posted my general reads Wednesday night, and then when I woke up Thursday morning, he was asking me again for reads. That was frustrating to me; I don't know if he didn't read my post to begin with, or if he actually wanted me to post again how I felt less than 12 hours later, when I had been asleep.

 

I know I haven't been super active, but I have made several posts contributing to the game so far, and he's acting like I haven't said anything at all. He's never made any kind of response to what I have said, except to repeat his demand that I answer his questions and/or make a post with my reads on all players.

 

Anyway. /end rant. The whole thing has me totally unable to even guess at this point if he's scum or town - if he's town, I don't find what he's doing helpful. But maybe that's just me, and I should just get over it. I have been kind of cranky this week, for some reason.

 

Anyway, I have only skimmed up to here, so I'm going to go back and try to read through again. Could be soonish, could be in a few hours - I'm at work right now.

 

Don't like this post. It's still continuing the whole thing about someone's playstyle annoying her so that's somehow an excuse for her lack of participation. Plus, it's a fairly long post, albeit a bit rambly, yet the only player she comments on at all is Tommy, and she makes it seem like it's not game stuff but outside stuff with him. Also see a hint of whyme fryme here.

 

 

I find that I enjoy toying with my levels of emotion, I generally play aggressively. That said, I have a pet peeve for people who make a meal of logical fallacies. Tommy's comments like "you copy your questions and stances down for me and I'll do the same for you so we can answer them" followed by fos'ing me when I showed up in the thread and told him I was ready for his questions is a perfect example of the passive aggressive play I've been getting from him. I've asked him questions and yet his response to me is generally "OMG why aren't you answering MY questions, why are you being so evasive." Anyone who has had to deal with people like this in real life knows how ridiculous and annoying this general attitude is. Sadly, because they are so off-putting, these fake-offended people usually get their own way. I like to deal with them by trolling and pissing them off right back. That may mean I get a little hyperbolic.

The first paragraph is a very long winded way of saying "I think he's pushy." That's true of me as a player in general. But this argument is particularly odd because I have been decidedly un-aggressive in this game. I dd get annoyed at Hallia refusing to answer my questions, yeah. As you appear annoyed that I did the same.

 

Giant misreps here on your part Tommy-

 

In GE's first paragraph, he raises specific points against you and showed contradictions in your behavior. It was NOT a long winded way of saying you're pushy. Gigantic misrep there, all designed to make it so you don't have to respond to the point he brought up, which was a good one. So I'll give you another chance to respond here-

 

During your back and forth with GE, at one point you say you should both answer questions from one another. Later on, he says he's available for any questions you had. You then fos him for doing this. Do you not see how incredibly scummy this is?

 

Edited out the other stuff cause altho you WERE misrepping, the arguments you were misrepping there weren't really that strong to begin with, so meh.

 

 

 

 

I'll bite. Oh and FYI I always look scummy because I talk a lot. I have no interest in lying low and I don't apologize for being aggressive. Sometimes that means I will get lynched early, it happens and I'm fine with it. I find Cloud odd this game-slight scum lean. I have a null read on Alanna, I've never played before, but I like her gameplay. I have a scum read on Mish as well. Peace has been a little bit all over the place in games lately, I know he's got stuff going on in RL, but I wouldn't feel comfortable giving a read on him right now. Des is Des, I always think he's scummy, but he plays very similarly to me, so I usually need to ISO him to see him more objectively. SLIGHT town read on him at present. I think we both enjoy some good schadenfraude. Csarmi and I tend to rub each other the wrong way and there hasn't been that much posting in the way of gameplay from him-null. There really hasn't been enough gameplay from most people. Of the 17 pages in this thread I'd venture a guess that 6 were warming up and probably 6-7 pages are you and I, Hallia and Mish going back and forth. That leaves very little actually gameplay from everyone else. What about you?

From your comments:

Hallia - town obviously
Tom - scum
Mish - scum
Cloud - scum
Peace - too soon to say
Des - slight town
Salami - null
Alanna - null

That's not very good. If Cloud is scum why are you okay with him being on the Mish wagon? I don't think anyone else has read Cloud as scum yet, so that surprised me. Explain why Cloud is odd.

I've seen you give zero indication that you find Des scummy in this game, so why mention that you always see him as scummy?

Salami has made a list of reads and is currently voting for you. I wouldn't say that's null worthy. I would like to see your analysis of his reads list.

It looks like you're leaving yourself open to changing opinion on basically every other player.

 

 

 

I have to take pretty big issue with that list of reads, Golden.

Here's why;
 

(edited out post of Peace's to fit quotes in)

Here's a post from Peace. You said he's null because he hasn't contributed much. But here he clearly FOS you and supports me. Why are you not linking us if you think linking is so important?

Here Salami is clearly supporting me and voting you but you still have him as a null read? Why aren't you (very obviously) linking us? You just chastised me for not linking Hallia directly to you as scum-scum. Whys it okay for you not to?

But here's the kicker: Cloud has been busy and hasn't said much, but here he's clearly siding with you earlier in the game, and yet he's your only SCUM read apart from me and Mish?

I think you're just not reading the thread, which matches your "I'm rubber you're glue" arguments. Your logic certainly doesn't make sense as to why you suspect people.

Can we vote Golden now? Is this enough evidence yet? =\

 

 

 

 

Spoilered just cause they're a wee bit lengthy. In the spoiler above is another classic scum move- when in a heated back and forth with someone, ask them for a list of reads of other players in the game, then try and make the reads seem incongruous with non-contextual posts and info. I don't think GE's reads seemed incongruous with the thread in the slightest. Obviously hindsight looks to be on my side here, but while catching up I had planned on mentioning this. Guess yall will have to take my word for it hehe.

 

 

 I'm very uncomfortable with the high levels of buddying going on. Tommy has gone beyond what I'd see as normal town defense. 

My defense of you has to do with three things:
1) Other than being inactive, you haven't been very scummy
2) Everyone on that L-1 wagon of you is scummier than you
3) I doubt 4/7 townies saw something in you that was scummy enough to lynch you for

Well reasoned posts like this support #1.

 

1. Someone not being that scummy is NOT merit for strongly defending them as town. Strong defense should really only be reserved for someone you have a STRONG town read on, not someone that is more null than scummy to you. So fail on this point.

2. BS.

3. It was 4 votes on D1- that's not unreasonable considering what she had done.

 

 

 

So far my scum reads are Mish and Tom. I started reading Despo and Golden as more townie during my re-read and I agreed with the things Golden said about Tom while reading page 10 and 11.

 

 

Anyway, I will continue with catching up and give my thoughts per page.

 

 

Cloud go ahead and catch up. That's all been addressed through further discussion already

 

 

 

Apologies for the wait but the dishes really had to be done, lol.

Here are my reads until the start of page 16. I'm about to dive into the endless depths of a Despo case :P
 

(edited out two posts from Tommy to fit quote wall in)

Tommy actually comes across as very reasonable and also quite honest in these two posts. It's clear that he is starting to get frustrated without getting aggressive at those who are attacking him which is giving me a townie vibe.

I do know that Golden and Tom can’t be wolf-wolf because they are both starting to get too emotionally invested in their argument for it to be staged.

 

(edited out stuff about Peace)

Tom is looking more and more townie to me since the start of page 12 because he has made valid arguments and I think he is just trying too hard for him to be mafia.

 

(edited out two wots from Tommy)

Me gusta. These posts were so good they actually made me reconsider my reads on both Hallia and GE. Well done.

 

Yeah, I misunderstood the setup initially. Feel free to vote me. I believe strongly Mish and Tommy are scum. Tommy's reasoning is suspect, but he's managed to make the whole thing about people avoiding his sanctimonious line of questioning. The fact that Tommy seems incapable of understanding my issue is with him is ridiculous, I know he's intelligent enough to realize this. As such, the whole argument is obviously staged on his part to cover for Mish, who he's been white-knighting.

I find this defense from GE to be weak. Like Tom said the first part is whyme-fryme, a scumhunting tool that both GE and Despo like to use a lot. He is restating that he believes Mish and Tommy are scum, but isn't able to provide more reasoning so he settles for using the word "strongly" in the hope that it would add more weight to his statement, lol. He calls Tom's reasoning suspect, but again isn't willing to point it out what exactly he finds to be suspect about his most recent cases on him and Hallia. He calls Tom's disagreement with him ridiculous (are you starting to see the trend here?), and calls his play obviously staged. I find you a lot more convincing when you actually back the things you are saying up with evidence, but sadly it seems like you ran out of words here.

unvote
vote Tommy

Simply cause you're proving to be as incompetent at scum hunting as you are arrogant in this game. Oh and you're obviscum

Yep. GE is scum after all.

Also, Tom admitting to not reading Hallia’s response while annoying isn’t a scumtell.

 

 

 

^This stuff right here makes me think Cloud could have tried something fairly clever as scum, if he's scum with Tom. He starts off with town reads on both GE and myself, says he's still catching up. Tommy says to finish catching up, that the stuff he pointed out was already resolved (actually, it wasn't). Cloud then "finishes catching up", only this time he says over and over how Tom is starting to seem more town. Those statements are interspersed with comments about others, but yeah over and over he keeps agreeing with Tommy all of a sudden, after first saying he seemed like scum.

 

To me it looks like scum Cloud trying to make his read look organic, like it's changing as it goes along, when really he was planning on agreeing with Tommy all along. In general I find the points he makes against GE to be extremely weak.

 

Incidentally, I do like using the "whyme fryme" scumhunting tool, both because it's effective and I KNOW HOW TO USE IT. GE DID NOT whyme fryme in that post, not one bit. If you think he did, you don't know what whyme fryme is. You could say GE was AtE'ing by saying Tommy should vote him, that would be acceptable. But whyme fryme straight up does NOT apply to active scumhunters. Whyme fryme is when someone only seems to respond in thread to defend themselves, they don't look as concerned with catching scum as they do with staying alive. As GE was actively pursuing leads on those he thought were scum, this doesn't apply to him at ALL.

 

Despot is frozen

 

I'm actually going to give you the benefit of the doubt HERE, since you don't know me all that well yet.

 

Dude, I work third shift. I sleep during the day. During the evening, I'll rarely mafia cause I like to spend that time with my family. As such, the main time I mafia is late at night when most Murricans are asleep. I try to make up for this by spending hours at a time developing reads and opinions, instead of a bunch of little 10-15 min spurts during the day like most do.

 

So yeah dude, I wasn't frozen. I was asleep. And town or scum, I'll rarely let an argument pass without getting involved. I don't duck other's arguments.

 

I've had brain farts before, but I won't say it's impossible Cloud is scum. I like that he seems to be thinking things through though, I'd give him a town lean. What do you think about me at this point?

 

Yeah this strengthens the possibility of a Tom/Cloud wolf team imo. "I won't say it's impossible Cloud is scum" puhlease. Saying such a thing about anyone in virtually any mafia game would be tremendously stupid. You just wanna support your scumbuddy while still acting like you're open to him being scum.

 

@Tommy; Confused. Still reading through, I can't concentrate so it's taking me forever. But it does discomfort me that through all the heat I got you don't seem to even consider once that I might not be town. And that makes me wonder if it's because you know... And there's only one way you'd know. But on the other hand, it seems to weird to so hardcore defend a townie, because if I'd gotten lynched you would probably have caught heat from it. So yes, confused and on the fence.

 

Hmmm. At first I liked this post, and quoted it to say this gave me good vibes about Mish. But I'm actually now worried that this actually might be scum Mish realizing she has to distance somewhat... I dunno.

 

I will say that I can be rather stubborn in my early reads, I tend to tunnel on one POV for most of Day 1, and end up totally wrong and then scramble to correct it by D3 or so. But things usually work out.

In this case, I think I'm more correct than not. There's definitely scum between Hallia/Golden/Des. 

 

Bahahaha bolded is so obviously setting the foundation for Tommy to backpedal once GE flipped town (which he knew he would do). You're a funny guy Tommy

 

 

God I'm seriously way too tired for this right now. I just finished page 16, but I'm seriously at my limit after spending the entire day finishing a project and then analyzing this game. Despo's case is bad. Tom is playing awesome. I'm still happy with my vote on GE. I will deal with the rest of you tomorrow and sort out who is derp town and who is the second wolf. I'm going to bed.

 

In the words of Corso- NOT so fast my friend.

 

You don't get to get away with just saying "Despo's case is bad." WHAT about it is bad? Which points do you not agree with? Is it comfortable sitting on Tom's lap like the puppet you are?

 

I... so hate this game right now. Lol, okay, well, I don't actually hate it. But we've got two trains right now on Tommy and GE, and I honestly do not know which one to vote for. I guess I'm leaning a little more towards Tommy as scum, but I'm concerned that my personal dislike for his playstyle is clouding my judgment on that, and I hate to lynch an active scumhunter just because I have personal issues with his play. Happens all too often, I think.

 

DEFINITELY don't like this post. Alanna hedges WAAAY too much here, and tries to distance herself from either train by saying she thinks Tom could be scum, but thinks that could be because of personal issues.

 

I just gotta say, I don't really buy that Alanna has that big a problem with Tommy, or any problem at all for that matter. Tommy really hasn't been THAT aggressive this game, and Alanna has played with plenty of jerks and assholes before, yet this is prob the first time I remember him making comments like these. I think it's some trumped up distancing type maneuver.

 

However, in the off chance I'm wrong about Tommy and he's just playing a spectacularly scummy town PR game (not likely), Alanna still looks suspicious imo, for overusing this whole thing as a smokescreen to keep from having to contribute as much today.

 

*** HARD CLAIM ***

 

I'm the tracker

 

I think we've gotten a lot done for a D1; with a game this size my ability isn't too special, and the votes on me should be mostly scum, so let's wrap this up

I expect unvotes and scrambling post-haste as a hammer vote for me is a scum claim

 

Lol so I checked, this claim came an HOUR before deadline. One freaking hour. There is NO WAY Tommy will get me to believe that he waited at L-1 for so long until claiming with ONE SCUMTASTIC HOUR before deadline. A number of people could have come and ninja hammered him at any point with deadline coming up, and Tom would have let that happen because he wasn't claiming.

 

Another advantage to claiming at the very last second? Reduces the chance you'll get CC'ed by the real role if you're scum. And looky here...

 

Lolz. I take it all back Tommy, you are the best :D

 

Anyway, I'm still not sure how I feel between Tommy or Golden, but no one else has jumped in and we're an hour from deadline. Tommy's claim could very well be false, but it's uncontested so far, so it'd be dumb to lynch him.

 

Vote Golden.

 

Trolololololololololololol uncontested so far? He claimed an HOUR BEFORE DEADLINE you sillyhead. You seriously think that there was enough time there for someone else to CC if it was fake? I just saw you play an excellent game Alanna, I know you're not daft. Ergo, you almost have to be scum, cause I think you'd have to be fairly daft to say something like that as town when the claim just came out and deadline was right there.

 

Anyone who fake counter-claims me is just assuring they will be lynched.

 

I didn't claim until I was at L-1 because I usually don't claim PRs if possible; why give scum the upper hand? Claiming needlessly is very anti-town. But tracker isn't terribly important in a game this small, and it served the purpose it needed to: allowed me to see who would take my bait and try to bury me.

I'll note that Despot and Hallia were nice and quiet until the flip, although they were apparently here the whole time, saw my hard claim, and still didn't move votes.

Don't get WIFOMed on this, it's pretty simple. I've basically solved the game for you. 

 

Bold: Why in the wide world of sports would scum fake counter claim in this setup? Are you even listening to the garbage you're pushing out?

 

There are two wolves. You REALLY think the scum team would sacrifice half their team just in an ATTEMPT to get ONE town PR lynched? I just cannot believe in any way that you would say this as town Tommy. It would completely change everything I thought I knew about you as a mafia player.

 

Moreover, why would you care about a CC? It would be guaranteed scum, whereas your "role" wouldn't be guaranteed to find scum. Your attempt to preemptively combat any CC's just once again shows to me how scummy a good player can still look as scum on Day 1.

 

Italics: How is it apparent I was here the whole time? I'm asking this because it's total horseshit, I was catching up on my phone while working, then finally finished catching up on my laptop and said so. I never posted before that, and as I mentioned, I don't really mafia except for at work.

 

I will say tho, that HAD I been around at the time, I wouldn't have moved my vote for crap. It was a bogus fake claim at the 11th hour. Eh, it worked, but not for long.

 

Underlined: Lol you haven't "solved" jack bull honkey. You ended up being completely wrong about GE, and you're wrong about me, and likely wrong about Hallia. Cause you're scum.

 

Anyway, I've put scum in a delightfully difficult position:

If we lynch down my list, they're dead by D3. One of Despot or Hallia will apparently counter-claim me in the next day or two, because there's no available avenue left for them to win the game, particularly with a jailkeeper still safe somewhere. 

 

Lol yeah you ended up being SOOO right on GE, town should just continue following your scum list, right?

 

[hazelkrs1]

Not spoilered cause I'm like a BOSS

 

[hazelkrs1]

It won't be me, because I'm not a tracker. O.o BABABABUMMMMM

 

Overall Hallia, your game has been superb this round, I'm lerving it like it's a mickey Dees commercial.

 

However, claiming any sort of thing at night, whether you are or aren't a role, isn't very wise. Limits the pool for scum PR-hunters to choose from.

 

Other than that tho, keep yo swag on!

 

[hazelkrs1]

This was funny to me too- kept a separate post for these.

 

Another common scumtell Tom fell prey too was the "I'm town" word vomit, wherein scum will repeatedly say over and over how they're town and not scum, blah blah blah. Sometimes newbtown will do this as well, out of frustration at not being able to convince others. Scum will do this because they think that if they repeat something enough times, they'll eventually get others to subconsciously think they are indeed town. Kinda like how scum will say someone is scummy a bunch without actually saying why, hoping others will follow them blindly.

 

Check it out:

 

And I'll let you in on a secret

Don't tell anyone

I'm not scum

 

 

Could just be fluff, or could be a prime example of what I'm talking about. Tom aint newbsauce.

 

Golden I simply don't believe you're town because every argument you've used to pin me as scum is nearly the exact thing you've accused me of doing that's scummy

In short, we're both hypocrites. But I know I am town, I do not know you are town. I find it extremely hard to believe you.

Let's try this: assume we're both town. I doubt Mish is scum, but if she is there will be one other.

Who else is a good scum candidate to you?

 

Quick, let me state something that really should have gone without saying!

 

Also, this post is funny cause he admits to being a hypocrite, yet he continues doing the same things he was fos'ing GE for.

 

Imagine a world

In this world I am town

Because I am

 

Hehe why would we need to imagine that world if he's town in this one?

 

Sup

I am town

 

Scum team is FROZEN

 

It must suck to let a mislynch slip away like this

Kekekeke

 

 

Ooooh here he even bolds and colors the word town, so that means he MUST be town, right?

 

 

 

[_CLOUD]

So here are my thoughts from page 16 until the most recent page:
 

 

Didn't like this post at all. Hallia posted from work saying she didn't have much time (and was prob on mobile), and you fos her for not saying more at the time? This pretty much completely confirmed for me that you are scum. Town Tommy wouldn't need to use such a tactic to strengthen his case on someone. You were using anything you could to make her look worse.

 
This part actually made me almost stop reading your case. You are putting a lot of emphasis on your meta reads of Tommy while you later claimed (post #311) that you are against the idea of relying on it too much. More importantly however it’s a weak reason to accuse Tom of doing everything he can to make Hallia look bad, which I don’t think he has been doing at all. He said that he is surprised that she didn’t have more things to say, and then tells her to get back to him later. How you drew the conclusion that he is obviscum because of this is beyond me.

 

I really feel like town Tommy would just tell GE he doesn't know you enough yet, or just shrug off the meta read entirely since it's unreliable anyways. Instead you seem to be too aware of how you defend yourself from the meta thing.

 
You are once again relying on meta reasons in your case against him. I don’t think meta is a bad scumhunting tool, but if you are playing against players of Tom’s skill level then you might as well just discard the idea of searching for differences in meta.
 

Also, you are way too focused on helping Hallia improve her game on thread. You aren't her mentor so stop behaving like it on thread. It's distracting and it leads to bias. I do agree with your analysis of her playstyle and that she is actually a lot better than most people give her credit for, but you are defending her too much right now and are giving her the benefit of the doubt on too many occasions. A few examples:
 

For instance, the thing about Mish sitting at L-1 for a bit. She's prob seen this argument referenced in a lot of games, so threw it out there because she thought it was relevant, without considering the wifom behind it or the fact that that argument is most often used at endgame or at least later in the game.

As for her voting record, I don't think it's opportunistic really, I think it's more indicative of her trying to assert herself more. Normally she's very cautious with her vote, but after I and others have kinda pressured her about this in the past, I think she's trying to change that.

Looks to me like she's following her gut with her vote, and wasn't as concerned with how the trains were, which actually seems more townie to me.

Hallia as scum prob wouldn't have put Mish to L-1 imo, as that would have seemed to stand out too much to her. Hallia as town trying to improve her play could have voted Mish to continue following her instincts. I got no problem with either of her votes so far.

You should have no way of knowing for certain what Hallia's thought process was when she made those moves, especially because she is getting coached by Leelou and is changing her meta in this game, and yet you come across as so fired up in your defense of her just because you like her play.
 

And you liked his reaction to being called out for setting up lynches? I didn't think it was that good at all. He essentially tried answering it in a manner that would attract the least amount of attention, instead of turning into a protracted argument. I find this to be a lot more indicative of a scum alignment on Cloud in this case.

Why should I have turned it into a protracted argument? I have repeatedly explained that there wasn’t anything to discuss in the first place. You should have also understood this and yet you argue that me not flailing around while answering Salami is an indicator of me being mafia. This line of reasoning is wrong and not to mention scummy because you would have also called me out for it if I acted like that.

 

This makes zero sense if you were actually town. Town Tommy would have wanted to see and study her responses to see if they seemed more townie or scummie.

It shows you were more interested in lynching Hallia than lynching someone you thought was scum.

Anoter meta read on Tom. And no, skimming isn’t an indicator of alignment, it is an indicator of lazy play.


Tom and Golden continue their battle where they try to best each other at every turn. Tom is only looking more townie to me, but Golden has also made a lot of valid arguments. We now know that Golden was town and I actually believe that this was a town vs town fight where both players have been incredibly stubborn.

 

 

My last game I was scum with Golden. He got lynches D1 but was good at distancing from his partners. It helped us win at the end.

But he wasn't particularly good at not being scummy. Someone (I forget who) pegged him almost immediately as scum because he was simply not making sense. The argument was that as town Golden is articulate and well reasoned, as scum he just rams into things.

Which would you say he's doing now? I know my answer.

That was me. :P


Tommy, to clear something up. I was definitely not clearing you with that early post I made. I was making a joke referencing our little tangle that started off the Christmas game.

On the Golden/Tommy fight. Tommy is coming across as deliberate and giving concrete reads. Golden is coming off as emotional and throwing insults.

Town does get emotional often. Scum are often very logical.

This is the second game where Tommy has buddied me or used my play to support his thesis. The first game he was scum. So, although I like a lot of his approach I am wary.

I also think both players could be strong town assets.

Better to lynch Hallia instead.

VOTE HALLIA

##VOTE HALLIA

Don't remember the voting rules of this game.

 

 
I guess this post from Peace clears him as town now that we have seen Golden flip. I see zero value for a wolf Peace to keep both a town Tom and town Golden alive because they are both great scumhunters and an immediate threat to his team. If both Peace and Tom were mafia then he would have voted for Golden to save his teammate and prevent him from fake claiming. He could have easily done this if he were mafia because he has been wishy washy with his reads all game. I believe that both Peace and Tom are town, but I understand that some of you still hold doubts about this but let it at least be clear that they can’t be wolf-wolf.

 

Tell me about them because if you think me VS golden is town-town fighting then we are wasting our time

And sanity

Oh the irony

 

Ahem. Told you guys.

You did? I don’t remember you putting yourself out there trying to clear Golden. You only said that you had a town read on him but didn’t talk much about him at all despite him mentioning you every other post.
 
 

*** HARD CLAIM ***

I'm the tracker

I think we've gotten a lot done for a D1; with a game this size my ability isn't too special, and the votes on me should be mostly scum, so let's wrap this up

I expect unvotes and scrambling post-haste as a hammer vote for me is a scum claim

Lol just finished catching up.

For the real Tracker out there- don't bother CC'ing. Tommy is OBVISCUM and will surely die for it. Waiting to claim till hours before the deadline when it was fairly obvious Tom had a good chance of getting lynched for a WHILE is extremely antitown, and Tom has been dropping even MOAR scumtells lately.

Anddd time to go back and fashion my wot together.

NEWSFLASH: TOM CLAIMING TO BE THE TRACKER WOULD SEAL HIS DEATH IF HE WAS ONE OF THE TWO WOLVES. He would have more luck not claiming anything and relying on his own play to get Golden lynched instead of him despite the fast approaching deadline. I know that this is WIFOM, but I don't see him trying to save himself with this move knowing that half of the players here thought he was scum even before Golden flipped town.

[_CLOUD]

Allana and Mish make me uncomfortable as they haven't taken any kind of firm stance during these last few pages, especially Mish who hasn't shared any reads when she has been online and has only been going on a gut feeling which might be as credible as a coinflip. Salami has also acted in a similair way by refraining from commenting on the ongoing fight between Golden and Tom and instead started chatting here and there. If you three are actually town please start acting like it.

[csarmi]

OK either DM or NY phone is messing with me.

 

Been truing tosebf for twenty mins.

 

Cloud you make a lot of sense but I don't think you understand what town!Tom means. Of someone is talking about what town!Cloud or scum!Cloud means that don't mean its a meta rwadm.

[_CLOUD]

Que?

[csarmi]

Despo I stopped giving a damn about what people would read me at in my last game. I don't care and I don't try anymore Its not worth it I'm just here for the fun from now on. Hopefully win my games gibt some scunsvims and all...

 

But when I give NY hardest strongest ubertown game and I get soeedlynched Day-effing-one for it before the game would even begin in earnest well that's when I thought I was done.

[csarmi]

Meta read.

 

I don't think it means what you think It means.

Talking about Town!Cloud does not mean I'm making a meta based argument. I think you're misinterpreting Despo there at several places along the sane line.

[csarmi]

Same line.

[_CLOUD]

Oh I think I understand what you were trying to say now. You are argueing that when Despo says that a town Tommy wouldn't do something he actually isn't giving a meta read but is instead only talking about general town behavior? Yeah, looking back I can see that I might have misinterpreted him there.

[hazelkrs1]

OK either DM or NY phone is messing with me.

 

Been truing tosebf for twenty mins.

 

Cloud you make a lot of sense but I don't think you understand what town!Tom means. Of someone is talking about what town!Cloud or scum!Cloud means that don't mean its a meta rwadm.

 

Thank you! Jesus I was getting so annoyed at seeing him say that over and over. It's another way of me saying "I don't think this person would do this if they were town, since it's not a townie thing to do"

 

And yeah, Cloud is Tom's scumbuddy.

[csarmi]

Its language. Lingo. Despo and I picked up some f I reign forum stuff like that.

[hazelkrs1]

Despo I stopped giving a damn about what people would read me at in my last game. I don't care and I don't try anymore Its not worth it I'm just here for the fun from now on. Hopefully win my games gibt some scunsvims and all...

 

But when I give NY hardest strongest ubertown game and I get soeedlynched Day-effing-one for it before the game would even begin in earnest well that's when I thought I was done.

 

That wasn't your fault. That was a perfect example of LOLVillage. Darthe should have been frizzle fried for that the very next day. Shouldn't let something like that disillusion you, that's out of your control (people's stupidity I mean)

[hazelkrs1]

Its language. Lingo. Despo and I picked up some f I reign forum stuff like that.

 

Lol like LOLvillage?