The Aiel

[MountaineerWV]

Are there Aiel or their descendants in any other parts of the world?

 

The Aiel from the Aiel Waste seem to be the descendants of the Aiel from only one city in the Age of Legends. From them the Tinkers shoot off in their own direction, but the earliest stock is still the same.

 

I would argue that the Ayamar and their Water Way could be Aiel from the AoL, only from a different city.

 

Do you think that Aiel could have survived in Shara or Seanchan or where they all killed out during and immediately after the Breaking elsewhere in the world?

[Vardar]

Are there Aiel or their descendants in any other parts of the world?

 

The Aiel from the Aiel Waste seem to be the descendants of the Aiel from only one city in the Age of Legends. From them the Tinkers shoot off in their own direction, but the earliest stock is still the same.

 

I would argue that the Ayamar and their Water Way could be Aiel from the AoL, only from a different city.

 

Do you think that Aiel could have survived in Shara or Seanchan or where they all killed out during and immediately after the Breaking elsewhere in the world?

 

Well they hung out with AS, so I'd assume all the AS would have come together to decide what to do, meaning all their Daishan came with them. Its' really all the Aiel.

[MountaineerWV]

So you disagree that the Amayar are descendants of the AoL Aiel?

 

Also, we have evidence that not all Aiel traveled with AS. In one of Rand's throw back memories in Rhuidean, his ancestor over hears a comment on how all the Aiel from (some city) lined up and sang to distract a male channeller to allow the inhabitants to flee. Sure, all those Aiel perished, but there were many cities in the AoL with Aiel.

[Vardar]

So you disagree that the Amayar are descendants of the AoL Aiel?

 

Also, we have evidence that not all Aiel traveled with AS. In one of Rand's throw back memories in Rhuidean, his ancestor over hears a comment on how all the Aiel from (some city) lined up and sang to distract a male channeller to allow the inhabitants to flee. Sure, all those Aiel perished, but there were many cities in the AoL with Aiel.

 

Hmm. I always assumed they asked to go there, the AS gatewayed them there.

Good point.

 

The Amayar could be...

[Mulk]

It's sort of a given that there were other Aiel not involved with the great wagon train. Some Aiel became Aes Sedai. A fair number became the Tinkers. Those did not stay racially Aiel, though, if that was even a race instead of a group of people made distinct by their oath in the AoL. The Tinkers and Aes Sedai intermarried with others and left behind the oath that made them Dashain. The Tinkers still refer to themselves as the People, so they have retained that much of the old ways - I think the biggest reason they don't call themselves Aiel is because they wished to distance themselves in the beginning from those who would not desert their purpose.

 

I would think, though, that if the Amayar were in their origin Aiel that they would have retained the name at the very least. I could be wrong, mind. My thought is that if a group of people who have lost everything that it was to be Aiel except for the name can retain the name, then others probably could and would do so as well, save for the Tinkers whom I have addressed. It's still possible that they are, though.

[MountaineerWV]

It's sort of a given that there were other Aiel not involved with the great wagon train. Some Aiel became Aes Sedai. A fair number became the Tinkers. Those did not stay racially Aiel, though, if that was even a race instead of a group of people made distinct by their oath in the AoL. The Tinkers and Aes Sedai intermarried with others and left behind the oath that made them Dashain. The Tinkers still refer to themselves as the People, so they have retained that much of the old ways - I think the biggest reason they don't call themselves Aiel is because they wished to distance themselves in the beginning from those who would not desert their purpose.

 

Right, but we only see that in Randland. The Tinkers, as far as we know, are from the same source as the Aiel in the Waste, not Aiel from other continents.

 

I would think, though, that if the Amayar were in their origin Aiel that they would have retained the name at the very least. I could be wrong, mind. My thought is that if a group of people who have lost everything that it was to be Aiel except for the name can retain the name, then others probably could and would do so as well, save for the Tinkers whom I have addressed. It's still possible that they are, though.

 

The Aiel maintained their name because they retained the memory of failing AS. The don't know much, but they remember being the People of the Dragon, failing the AS, and going to the Waste as punishment.

 

The ruling class of Shara, the Ayyad, may be a mixture of both AS and Aiel...

[Durinax]

The Amayar could very well be, they even have similar views of death as I recall.

 

It is speculated that there is quite a bit of aiel blood in andor, due to the blonde and light eye traits that show up every now and then.

[Luckers]

It's not just the Aiel of one city that gathered at the gates of Paaren Disen, but rather all the Aiel that the Aes Sedai could gather. Jonai speaks of it.

 

He ran from the Hall of the Servants, all the way out of the city to where the great gathering waited. Thousands of wagons in ten lines stretching nearly two leagues, wagons loaded with food and water barrels, wagons loaded with the crated things the Aes Sedai had given into Aiel charge, angreal and sa’angreal and ter’angreal, all the things that had to be kept from the hands of men going mad while they wielded the One Power. Once there would have been other ways to carry them, jo-cars and jumpers, hoverflies and huge showings. Now painfully assembled horses and wagons had to suffice. Among the wagons stood the people, enough to populate a city but perhaps all the Aiel left alive in the world.

 

It's quite clear this is not just whichever Aiel happened to be present in the city that day, but rather the results of a great effort by Solinda to gather the surviving Aiel and keep them as safe as she could by sending them off on this task (as otherwise they would stubbornly remain with their Aes Sedai and die, as did those who tried to remind Jaric Mondaren of who he was).

 

That being said, it's possible that there were other, small groups of Aiel still out there, ones that Solinda didn't manage to get to. If so it would explain why the modern Aiel kept more of their culture than any other group, because those other groups would have been small (even the Tuatha'an, when they finally split, suffered from this issue). Very likely any other Aiel ended up falling in with other groups, or maybe at most, like the Tinkers, accepting others into their group out of necessity where the Aiel through sheer numbers were able to retain more cultural purity.

 

As a result the suggestion that the Amayar and the Water Way has an offshoot, some distance back, amongst the Aiel doesn't seem unlikely, though I doubt you could call them Aiel. Too much is lost and too much new added. By the same note I've seen it suggested in the past that the tribal folk who live in the Kaisaida Hills in Seanchan (of which Karede's man, Arijumba is one) might be descendents of Aiel--they match the physical description, the keen sense of honour, and the method of serving all might result from an Aiel cultural heritage.

 

It's also a fairly common pseudo-belief that the Andoran Royal line is descended from the Aiel via Rhea, daughter of Adan, who was kidnapped from amongst the Jenn in a raid were they were somewhere to the East of the Mountains of Mist. Rhea, in greek mythology, was the mother of the Olympian Gods, but not one herself (mother of the Andoran Royal line, but not a Queen herself). Rhea was often depicted in Greek art as sitting a throne flanked by two lions, or in a carriage drawn by lions.

 

The whole thing is very RJ, and would explain why the Andoran Royal line have Aiel colouring and height.

[Durinax]

once again luckers has stated it much more eloquently and more informative than I have :P

[thisguy]

Does Amayar mean anything in the old tongue that we know of?

[Aulduron]

I could see them being related. The Water Way and Way of the Leaf are similar.

 

"When the salt first stilled after the Breaking, the Amayar asked our protection from brigands and raiders, and we owe them protection still" sounds like the Aiel and Carheinen deal

 

According to the wiki, The Amayar are physically shorter and much fairer than the Atha'an Miere, with lighter hair and blue or hazel eyes. The Aiel can be recognized through their unusual height, characteristic pale eyes and light-colored hair.

 

Those islands may have been part of the main continent, before the Breaking. The Amayar may have been living near the Choeden Kal for a very long time.

[thisguy]

By the way, this probably should go in the real words of the old tongue thread - Maia (maya) in Hinduism or the vedic tradition means illusion.