Lanfear's Domain

[True Source Creator]

Most of the Forsaken settled into important places as people of high esteem (Mesaana in the White Tower, Sammael in Illian, Graendal in Arad Domon, etc.). One thing that I've noticed recently on my re-read is that when Lanfear weaves a Gateway to her presumed hideout after speaking with Rand, she always make it to some place with white silk hangings and silver (several references, including FoH Ch. 6). Where was Lanfear hiding out when she departs to this place? Was she also impersonating some powerful lady in one of the nations?

[kght22]

i doubt that lanfear was up to anything like rahvin, samael(bad spelling), or bel'lel. she likely took over some minor household somewhere for a place to rest and relax. i think her whole goal concerned following and tracking rand, and attempting to turn him to her point of view, and dealing with orders/requests from ishy or the do in the meantime, like her impersonation in the wt, inside mesanna's(bad spelling again) domain. i suspect she was thinking allot bigger than the 3 i mentioned at the start of this, or any of the other forsaken save ishy, and maybe damondred(bad spelling again?). her target was the subversion of the dragon reborn himself, and an army or nation would not help her do that.

[DaoineSidhe]

I've thought of this also, and given what she was responsible for in the AoL, I've always wondered if she was travelling to her own little demesne in Tel'aran'rhiod. Given that going into the World of Dreams in the flesh was something known to be a major tool of the Shadow bag in the AoL, and that Lanfear's claimed domain is Dreams, I thought it just kind of seemed natural. I don't really know if it's possible, but it would make a certain kind of sense.

[Barid Bel Medar]

It is in TAR, she has her own little place dreamed up for her, she goes there in the flesh. Perrin sees it in tDR 9: Wolf Dreams, and there are other instances in the book where we see the white palace in TAR.

[kght22]

the tar idea has some merit, but then where would she sleep? regardless of her control over the world of dreams, sleeping there seems like a death wish to me.

[Naggash]

the tar idea has some merit, but then where would she sleep? regardless of her control over the world of dreams, sleeping there seems like a death wish to me.

Maybe if you're in the flesh you can actually sleep normaly. Who knows what she could really do there? Maybe she could even control the timing problem with the WW. She always claimed that the TAR was her domain...and given she's a TAR obssesed from AoL...she could know quite a few things indeed. I never bought it when Moge said she was better at it than Lanfear, and look what she could do. Notice that we never got to see her fighting in the TAR.

For example, she enters Rand's dreams and SHE is in control. Ok that Rand doesn't know a lot about Dreaming, but it was HIS dream and SHE was in total control of ti. I think we must take this as prove of her abilities, as the WO always said that controling another person dreams is sooooo hard, and almost impossible if not completely impossible (not even Melain could with Bael) if there's strong feelings involved. Well call me stupid but I think when she's stark naked rounding him with her legs there's quite a few strong emotions running (if not already from the beggining when she searches his dream), and she still is in a total control of the situation.

[Barid Bel Medar]

The OP has nothing to do with sleeping. The white Palace that is glimpsed from the gateways = TAR abode. How long she spends in there, or where she goes to sleep isn't exactly relevant.

 

She spends most of her time travelling with Rand, I don't think she had need of a manor or anything. She just used disguises and such. Her main concern was Rand, and staying close to him.

[kght22]

the tar idea has some merit, but then where would she sleep? regardless of her control over the world of dreams, sleeping there seems like a death wish to me.

Maybe if you're in the flesh you can actually sleep normaly. Who knows what she could really do there? Maybe she could even control the timing problem with the WW. She always claimed that the TAR was her domain...and given she's a TAR obssesed from AoL...she could know quite a few things indeed. I never bought it when Moge said she was better at it than Lanfear, and look what she could do. Notice that we never got to see her fighting in the TAR.

For example, she enters Rand's dreams and SHE is in control. Ok that Rand doesn't know a lot about Dreaming, but it was HIS dream and SHE was in total control of ti. I think we must take this as prove of her abilities, as the WO always said that controling another person dreams is sooooo hard, and almost impossible if not completely impossible (not even Melain could with Bael) if there's strong feelings involved. Well call me stupid but I think when she's stark naked rounding him with her legs there's quite a few strong emotions running (if not already from the beggining when she searches his dream), and she still is in a total control of the situation.

hard to control vs someone who has an idea what is going on (someone who has no idea wtf might awake from a nightmare, or might kill the attacker, but if the infiltrator intends to kill the target, they could do so before either happens, especially if they observe before the attack). and what happened at the end of tom was very weird, because "zen rand" was very confident in his control of his own dreams, so it could have been anything. and my whole problem was if you sleep normally in tel'aran'rhiod that still doesn't fix the issue that the unseen world is very dangerous and malleable, and even a random person asleep could bring a nightmare into your tar room. and you cannot truly rest unless you go to real sleep, if you are in tar in the flesh, your flesh i would think remains there while you sleep, leaving you very vulnerable to random and possibly insanely improbable events.

 

EDIT: added the first ( ) section

EDIT2: nothing added but this, perhaps they cannot kill in a person's internal dream, they can also snatch them out then kill

EDIT2: nothing added but this again, lanfear is a cold calculating bitch and any strong feelings she has i doubt apply to a human other than perhaps herself, and at the time rand really didn't have any strong feelings about her either way, so the strong feeling thing doesn't add up.

[Naggash]

The OP has nothing to do with sleeping. The white Palace that is glimpsed from the gateways = TAR abode. How long she spends in there, or where she goes to sleep isn't exactly relevant.

 

She spends most of her time travelling with Rand, I don't think she had need of a manor or anything. She just used disguises and such. Her main concern was Rand, and staying close to him.

Who said nothing about the OP here? I missed it...

I think that you are right about sleeping wherever she could be near Rand.

But also now I'm quite eagger (good spelling?) to see a Cyndan TAR display. Her abilities in the World of Dreams hasn't changed.

[Naggash]

the tar idea has some merit, but then where would she sleep? regardless of her control over the world of dreams, sleeping there seems like a death wish to me.

Maybe if you're in the flesh you can actually sleep normaly. Who knows what she could really do there? Maybe she could even control the timing problem with the WW. She always claimed that the TAR was her domain...and given she's a TAR obssesed from AoL...she could know quite a few things indeed. I never bought it when Moge said she was better at it than Lanfear, and look what she could do. Notice that we never got to see her fighting in the TAR.

For example, she enters Rand's dreams and SHE is in control. Ok that Rand doesn't know a lot about Dreaming, but it was HIS dream and SHE was in total control of ti. I think we must take this as prove of her abilities, as the WO always said that controling another person dreams is sooooo hard, and almost impossible if not completely impossible (not even Melain could with Bael) if there's strong feelings involved. Well call me stupid but I think when she's stark naked rounding him with her legs there's quite a few strong emotions running (if not already from the beggining when she searches his dream), and she still is in a total control of the situation.

hard to control vs someone who has an idea what is going on. and what happened at the end of tom was very weird, because "zen rand" was very confident in his control of his own dreams, so it could have been anything. and my whole problem was if you sleep normally in tel'aran'rhiod that still doesn't fix the issue that the unseen world is very dangerous and malleable, and even a random person asleep could bring a nightmare into your tar room. and you cannot truly rest unless you go to real sleep, if you are in tar in the flesh, your flesh i would think remains there while you sleep, leaving you very vulnerable to random and possibly insanely improbable events.

I agree about the dangerous part of sleeping there, but I disagree about "hard to control vs someone who has an idea what is going on". As I said Melain got cough in Bael dreams and he knows even less than Rand for that matter. Also, Egwene in Gawyn's.

[Barid Bel Medar]

Ahh, sorry, there are the two abbreviations.

 

OP = Original Post in this case.

 

I am not sure about sleeping in TAR. Can you sleep in the Dream world? Seems hard. However, that's a different topic.

[Naggash]

OP = Original Post in this case.

Oops sorry. What a headache we newbies are xD

[Barid Bel Medar]

OP = Original Post in this case.

Oops sorry. What a headache we newbies are xD

 

Not at all. That one was trickier. And engilsh is not your first language if I recall, so no trouble !

[kght22]

The OP has nothing to do with sleeping. The white Palace that is glimpsed from the gateways = TAR abode. How long she spends in there, or where she goes to sleep isn't exactly relevant.

 

She spends most of her time travelling with Rand, I don't think she had need of a manor or anything. She just used disguises and such. Her main concern was Rand, and staying close to him.

i basically agree with you here, as does my statement above yours, but i think she at least enthralled a comfortable location somewhere in the real world, she would want somewhere nice to sleep after all. and many minor nobles have luxuriant homes from generations of success even if the current generation isn't of note.

[kght22]

I agree about the dangerous part of sleeping there, but I disagree about "hard to control vs someone who has an idea what is going on". As I said Melain got cough in Bael dreams and he knows even less than Rand for that matter. Also, Egwene in Gawyn's.

keep in mind that in that case the strong feelings could have been on either side, or both, and more likely on both. when it comes to rand and lanfear at that point the strong feelings could have possibly been on her side, i doubt it, and i know for a fact that at the time rand had no real feelings for lanfear or selene(bad spelling) good or bad, even though he had fear of lanfear, after facing forsaken his fear likely wouldn't have been strong enough to pull someone in the same way egwene was pulled into gawyn's dreams. and he clearly wasn't initially dreaming of her in her guise as selene(same word still spelled wrong), she came in later.

 

i must admit though that i will likely think that mierin made a nest for herself in the real world in some forgotten noble's home until hariet, brandon, or another staff member says otherwise.

[Naggash]

I agree about the dangerous part of sleeping there, but I disagree about "hard to control vs someone who has an idea what is going on". As I said Melain got cough in Bael dreams and he knows even less than Rand for that matter. Also, Egwene in Gawyn's.

keep in mind that in that case the strong feelings could have been on either side, or both, and more likely on both. when it comes to rand and lanfear at that point the strong feelings could have possibly been on her side, i doubt it, and i know for a fact that at the time rand had no real feelings for lanfear or selene(bad spelling) good or bad, even though he had fear of lanfear, after facing forsaken his fear likely wouldn't have been strong enough to pull someone in the same way egwene was pulled into gawyn's dreams. and he clearly wasn't initially dreaming of her in her guise as selene(same word still spelled wrong), she came in later.

 

i must admit though that i will likely think that mierin made a nest for herself in the real world in some forgotten noble's home until hariet, brandon, or another staff member says otherwise.

I recall reading that with one-side feelings was enough for the attraction, only that if the feelings are returned the attraction is much stronger.

I get your point though...maybe with one-side feelings it's easier to control but I keep my position. Once you're inside the dream of other things get busy. Rand didn't seem bothered at all for having her above him. At that point in the situation I think it would be impossible for someone other than Lanfear to retain control.

And remember that her feelings for him are true. Maybe they're selfish, maybe she loves him because of his power or position, but that doens't weakens the feeling. She's totally obssesed with him.

[kght22]

I agree about the dangerous part of sleeping there, but I disagree about "hard to control vs someone who has an idea what is going on". As I said Melain got cough in Bael dreams and he knows even less than Rand for that matter. Also, Egwene in Gawyn's.

keep in mind that in that case the strong feelings could have been on either side, or both, and more likely on both. when it comes to rand and lanfear at that point the strong feelings could have possibly been on her side, i doubt it, and i know for a fact that at the time rand had no real feelings for lanfear or selene(bad spelling) good or bad, even though he had fear of lanfear, after facing forsaken his fear likely wouldn't have been strong enough to pull someone in the same way egwene was pulled into gawyn's dreams. and he clearly wasn't initially dreaming of her in her guise as selene(same word still spelled wrong), she came in later.

 

i must admit though that i will likely think that mierin made a nest for herself in the real world in some forgotten noble's home until hariet, brandon, or another staff member says otherwise.

I recall reading that with one-side feelings was enough for the attraction, only that if the feelings are returned the attraction is much stronger.

I get your point though...maybe with one-side feelings it's easier to control but I keep my position. Once you're inside the dream of other things get busy. Rand didn't seem bothered at all for having her above him. At that point in the situation I think it would be impossible for someone other than Lanfear to retain control.

And remember that her feelings for him are true. Maybe they're selfish, maybe she loves him because of his power or position, but that doens't weakens the feeling. She's totally obssesed with him.

she is obsessed with him, and perhaps that would count as a strong feeling. but that would mean that she was in his dream. but lanfear's feelings are only directed at herself, she is the ultimate narcissist, and only truly cares about herself. after she dies and becomes cyandane and even a bit before she likely hates rand as much as it is possible to hate, but we are speaking of earlier times where she was trying to further her own cause, and her feelings for lews therin were always false, not just likely, but most likely why he dropped her regardless of how attractive and powerful she was.

 

EDIT1: i mentioned that it would mean for sure that she was in his dream because someone, i don't pay enough attention to who i am responding to in order to remember off the top of my head who, mentioned something about not being able to overpower someone in their own dream, like melena(bad spelling) and bael.

[Naggash]

She was in his dream. There's no doubting that. He was dreaming with Min, Elayne and Avi and then Lanfear appeared in it and not only that but she made the three girls disappear...in another one's dream...Too much.

Her feelng could be false, true, but I don't think so. We just have different opinions...I think her feelings are true, for much slefish and lunatic that she is....

Sorry if the last part isn't understandable I couldn't express it better :S

[kght22]

She was in his dream. There's no doubting that. He was dreaming with Min, Elayne and Avi and then Lanfear appeared in it and not only that but she made the three girls disappear...in another one's dream...Too much.

Her feelng could be false, true, but I don't think so. We just have different opinions...I think her feelings are true, for much slefish and lunatic that she is....

Sorry if the last part isn't understandable I couldn't express it better :S

well making sense of a forsaken shouldn't make sense. if it did they wouldn't all be nuttbars of one flavor or another. i'd love to see a candy machine with the candybars named after forsaken, now that would sense. (although you might correct the spelling of the word selfish, but don't take that as a downer, i'm much worse, i just get a red underline)

[kght22]

Yeah she's nuts....I mean look at Lan for example "I will hate the man you chose because he is not me, and I will love him if he can put a smile in your lips"

lol for not having the english version your quote is very good. very accurate. i just hope you were using it in contrast to what lanfear said to rand (the rest of this post looked like you were). but there is a huge contrast between this and what lanfear thinks she can do with rand. if she were he, she would hate him because he makes her smile.

 

EDIT: a mess on the words, to make it clearer, lanfear would hate any woman who makes rand smile because she made him smile not because he chose her, that would just make lanfear hate her even more.

 

lan by contrast will hate the man that nyn chooses, but love him if he makes her smile.

[Naggash]

The contrast was what I was looking for obviously xDDD

[Sharaman]

I think she deliberately uses the White Palace construct as a 1/2way house in TAR so she can't be followed back to wherever she's hanging out in the real world. If somebody manages to trail her back, she'll lose that person (more likely kill him/ her) in the White Palace and then carry onto wherever.