how do they know his name?

[llamedos]

if to speak the name of the dark one draws his attention how does anyone know his name assuming that they would not desire to speek it aloud ever would there be some day upon which his name can be spoken without fear. Any ideas would be wellcome if something like this exists somewhere else could you direct me to it this has bugged me for some time

[Luckers]

I've always thought this a good question. There are certain semantic arguments about, but frankly i do not see how a word that is absolutely forbidden could be known so universally. Yes, there would be those that would know it... people like Verin, who know many archaic things. But how would it be known to all of the kids in the Two Rivers... Mat admits to having heard it twice in his life, but the others do not, and show no sign he told them.

 

The universality of it is simply unlikely after three thousand years of it being taboo.

[llamedos]

i had wondered perhaps a theory similar to that in hitch-hikers guide to the galaxy about the krikket wars and a genetic memory how about the sheer prescence of the dark one and perhaps the weakened barriers

[Taren]

It probably would have been known to the people in the Age of Legends, maybe it has just been passed down through generations and the supersticions[sp?] have grown not to say it aloud lest it draw his attention to you. Its like in Harry Potter, everyone knows Voldermorts name but most people generally avoid saying it, even the likes of Ron, its been passed down from his parents and society.

[yolindamo]

Just because you avoid saying something out of superstition doesnt mean you do not know the word. You would have to know what word you dont say to know not to say it. Just like you cant say Macbeth in a theater doesnt mean you cant say Macbeth in a theater. It is bad luck, but people still do it all the time.

[llamedos]

There is i think evidence of a sort that bad things tend to happen, whenever his name is mentioned (i would be gratefull if someone could find one and post it up my mamory of the books is a bit hazy at the moment, but i am certain that the scenes that suggest ill effect are present) so i am doubtfull of your suggestion, that it was a form of superstition that made them reticent to speak his name aloud.

 

The macbeth analogy doesn't fit particularly well either as macbeth is a fairly well known play and quite a few people know the name but as the rand world is entirely self contained, unless that suggests that perhaps there is an outside force enabling them to know the name (maybe his name is Robert Jordan or whatever other pseudoname he chooses to go by. Not sure whether I have spelt that right or not.)

 

But unless contrary to evidence the speaking of his name is just a superstition the question still remains how the bloody hell do they know his name.

 

(Edited now:I apoligise for the lack of grammer previously, I don't think i've missed anything now. But my grammer has always been a bit hazy so I probably have)

[Gentled Ben]

llamedos, please punctuate your sentences. It makes it difficult for us to follow the good trains of thought you have when you spill them out in one long string.

[LordDaemonDracos]

in my opinion they know the name the same way we know the things that are supposed to be kept hidden these days. Since it is known that the DO was forgotten in the Age of Legends, once hte bore was formed he must have told the forsaken his name. They likely wrote it down, it was read by their followers and it slowly leaked out to all the people of the world.

 

Being such a horrible name, thing it was whispered about among everyone.

 

Eventually getting the stigma of you should not say it aloud.

 

As time passed, it was still whispered down the years and passed along in other ways to keep from saying the name as little as possible and will simply not be forgotten till the age of forgetfullness comes again.

[Suzaku]

I believe in the McBeth superstition after having a light rig fall on the stage a few seconds after a friend jokingly said "That McBeth thing is all superstition and no proof"...Needless to say, he has never broken the code since then.

[Fryn]

They probably know it because it is forbidden. Even before Rand knew who he was he said it as a pank as a kid. One of the fastest ways to make something commonplace is to ban it without enforcing a severe penalty. Since there is no physical penalty to saying his name only one placed on the person itself it would of been passed down through the generations by children and soldiers and the like that don't believe its more than a story tale. (side note: Its sort of like the know not supposed to take the lord's name in vain thing. Even though its supposedly bad lots do it every single day - side side note: Using this as an example only as its probably the easiest reference that many will relate to.)

[kobra_khan69]

I'm pretty sure that when Mat said Shai'tan after Rand killed Ishy there was an effect to saying the name I'm not positive though its been a while since I read the early books. I'll check on it and respond back with a quote if I can find it.

[richglennon]

i had wondered perhaps a theory similar to that in hitch-hikers guide to the galaxy about the krikket wars and a genetic memory how about the sheer prescence of the dark one and perhaps the weakened barriers

 

I think that explains it best. LOL

 

I think RJ is the master of using middle age references. We have the Inquisition, Sir Galahad and Gawain, the sword in the stone, etc... Saying Satans name is another one.

 

If you want greater detail, starting in the 10th century or so, the Catholic church wanted yet another grip on the idiots and pious so they perpetuated a rumor that naming Satan was a punishable sin. It carried on into all of later Christianity. If you uttered Satan, that meant he was involved in your mishap. Some people still believe this.

 

Same thing in the books. 3000 years of hearsay. I dont think it means crap though. Just watch how many times Mat says it.

[pinkkaz]

Also, bear in mind that it's only recently that the dark one has been touching the world again. Presumably until then you could say the word and suffer no ill effect. Maybe it's only really recently that when you say it you are "drawing the dark one's eye" in a manner that you really shouldn't.

 

If this was the case then it would pass around the world in much the same way as "The Creator" - by stories and rumour.

[Gentled Ben]

Edited now:I apoligise for the lack of grammer previously, I don't think i've missed anything now. But my grammer has always been a bit hazy so I probably have

 

Thanks, that's much better! I can survive some fragments and run-ons; my grammar could use help, too.

One long, 3-paragraph sentence without so much as a comma was a bit too much, though. :P