Ebook release delayed until Nov 2011 at Harriet's request.

[yoniy0]

Hold on there. We don't know her reasons yet. I seriously doubt her considerations are financial. She might just be old fashioned. Can't blame her for something like that, right?

For what it's worth, though, I would've borrowed the book from a library instead of buying the hardcover if that were an option where I live.

[Elend]

Hold on there. We don't know her reasons yet. I seriously doubt her considerations are financial. She might just be old fashioned. Can't blame her for something like that, right?

For what it's worth, though, I would've borrowed the book from a library instead of buying the hardcover if that were an option where I live.

 

This. Its probably just a tradition thing, and I can understand that. I prefer a physical book as well anyway. If anything they'd be losing money by not putting out the e-book version the day of release.

[Rinog]

Hold on there. We don't know her reasons yet. I seriously doubt her considerations are financial. She might just be old fashioned. Can't blame her for something like that, right?

For what it's worth, though, I would've borrowed the book from a library instead of buying the hardcover if that were an option where I live.

 

I've spent several hundred dollars on this series over 20 years. I don't care what her reasons are, the only way a consumer has to show their displeasure is by not purchasing a product. So yeah, sorry, I hope enough people are pissed that she takes a nice financial hit. That way she KNOWS people are pissed.

[yoniy0]

No, I do see your point. I'm just not willing to go without ToM to make it.

[Rinog]

Oh, neither am I. But I'll just read the book while drinking coffee at Borders or B&N. I'll probably spend more money that way, but I'll get a nice caffein kick in the process, so it's all good.

[sumquy]

i originally started a new thread because i didn't see this one. i looked, but went temporarily brain dead when staring at this thread, so here it is again:

 

i'm curious, with the news that the ebook version of ToM is being delayed for a year, do you think it is wrong to download a pirated copy instead? did you, or will you buy a copy of the hardcover instead/also? supposedly this delay comes "at the request of the authors estate" meaning Harriet? does that influence your decision?

 

personally, i haven't read a paper book in years, and so find myself in somewhat of a dilemma. i ordered a copy of the hardcover, just because it looks nice on my shelf next to the other 11 books, but i also ordered a kindle copy to actually read, but won't be getting it. is it wrong to download a pirated copy online even if i have a hard copy?

 

what do you think?

[yoniy0]

Well, since the book exists as e-content (even though right now it's just a hypothetical) I think it is wrong to download a pirated copy, no matter whether you have the hardcover. For a series that wasn't published as ebooks, my answer might've been different, I'm not sure. I'm not talking legally. Of course it's wrong to download a pirated copy from a legal point of view, hardcover or no.

 

More to the point, I won't be buying both ebook and hardcover. I'm still fervently hoping that the ebook will come out in a month or so, in which case I'll wait for it. If I find someone who travels to the States/UK in the next month, I'll ask them to pick me a copy. If I can't find anyone and the ebook really won't come out until next year, I'll (sadly) swallow the shipment costs and order the hardcover anyway. But I won't be buying the ebook, in that case. At least, not right away. I don't know why, but having just bought a Kindle, I'd feel like a fool to buy both hardcover and ebook as soon as they come out. Oddly, I don't feel the same about the other ebooks, which I already own in paper. Maybe it's because they didn't have ebooks when they came out.

[sumquy]

Well, since the book exists as e-content (even though right now it's just a hypothetical) I think it is wrong to download a pirated copy, no matter whether you have the hardcover. For a series that wasn't published as ebooks, my answer might've been different, I'm not sure.

 

but that's really the point isn't it? it doesn't exist as e-content. even though i paid for it for delivery on a certain day. not sure how much my own upsetness (i made up a word! ) over that is influencing me here. let me ask it a different way then, if i took my hardcover and scanned it into a pdf format for my own use, would that be "morally" wrong. does my own work product somehow justify what just downloading somebody elses work product wouldn't?

 

in which case I'll wait for it. If I find someone who travels to the States/UK in the next month, I'll ask them to pick me a copy. If I can't find anyone and the ebook really won't come out until next year, I'll (sadly) swallow the shipment costs and order the hardcover anyway

 

not sure i understand that correctly. are you saying you won't be getting the book on Nov. 2? are you insane? it's book 12! Towers of Midnight!?! i don't believe you. NOBODY has THAT much willpower.

[yoniy0]

but that's really the point isn't it? it doesn't exist as e-content. even though i paid for it for delivery on a certain day. not sure how much my own upsetness (i made up a word! ) over that is influencing me here. let me ask it a different way then, if i took my hardcover and scanned it into a pdf format for my own use, would that be "morally" wrong. does my own work product somehow justify what just downloading somebody elses work product wouldn't?

Hmm, it's hard to argue with that. It's very similar to converting CD's you own to mp3 for backup and ease of playback purposes, which is actually legal, as far as I know. The thing is, it's clearly wrong once the ebook's out, right? So, by doing it before it's released, aren't you cheating Tor? Even if you keep your preorder and pay the moment they're willing to take your money, it's still cheating a product they don't yet offer out of them.

 

not sure i understand that correctly. are you saying you won't be getting the book on Nov. 2? are you insane? it's book 12! Towers of Midnight!?! i don't believe you. NOBODY has THAT much willpower.

Don't mock your powers of deduction. You got it right. It helps if you live somewhere the book doesn't come out in. If your only option is to make an international order (which takes up to a month and a half anyways), waiting isn't an issue of willpower anymore, now is it?

Think about moderating this board when everyone but you already know what's what. Fortunately, jenniferl already declared that posting spoilers will earn one an automatic-temp-ban. Any perverse pleasure I might take in enforcing that is beside the point

[sumquy]

Hmm, it's hard to argue with that. It's very similar to converting CD's you own to mp3 for backup and ease of playback purposes, which is actually legal, as far as I know. The thing is, it's clearly wrong once the ebook's out, right? So, by doing it before it's released, aren't you cheating Tor? Even if you keep your preorder and pay the moment they're willing to take your money, it's still cheating a product they don't yet offer out of them.

 

i don't know. part of the problem is i'm the product of a society that feels it's entitled to whatever it wants, whenever it wants it. part of the problem is i resent the control games publishers like Tor play with these kind of things. (you can read it on this device, but not this one. you can read it yourself, but not have the device read it out loud to you, and if you buy a new device your sol cuz we don't support that format.) this even spills over to the point that in my more honest moments i don't even care anymore about the author/publisher/recording studio/movie producer. i've never really thought of it in terms of book before, but with music and movies and programs, i look for the best product. period. i'm well enough off financially that 10, or 20, or even 100 dollars isn't really a concern in my decision to buy something. the quality of the product is. in my younger ,college, ramen for dinner every night day, before i got a good job i used to pirate all my music. now i buy it all from itunes. not because it's "right", but because it's a better product. it's all organized neatly, and fits right into my collection with all its metadata in place. i'm not buying the music anymore, i can get that for free somewhere else. i'm buying the convenience of a good service.

 

i guess what it comes down to is that respect isn't given it's earned. and if i feel that a publisher is jerking me around that does affect my judgement on it. this does conflict with my respect for RJ and BS and what they have created. i bought a hardcover, and i tried to buy an ebook version. the fact that BS wants me to be able to buy an ebook version, but Tor and "RJ's estate" don't want me to makes me feel kind of like "i tried to play by the rules, but you want to change the game halfway through? well screw you i can get it somewhere else. the most galling thing about this is that i (the legitimate, paying customer) am the only one effected by it. the pirates don't care. pirate copies of the book will be on the web the day after the hardcover release. how is that right?

 

thanks for reading through such a rambling post, but my thoughts are all over the map on this one and i honestly don't know what i'm gonna do.

 

Don't mock your powers of deduction. You got it right. It helps if you live somewhere the book doesn't come out in. If your only option is to make an international order (which takes up to a month and a half anyways), waiting isn't an issue of willpower anymore, now is it?

 

i wouldn't care if i was on the moon! they better rethink the ebook thing, or restart the apollo program. I don't care which, but i'm getting that book!

[yoniy0]

 

I didn't mind reading through that. I feel your frustration myself (and yes, I would have called NASA administrator by now if I thought it would make a difference). That's why it's a good thing that we can vent it here, on DM. That way, when I eventually cave in, I'll feel like I've bitched about it enough that I've saved some face.

[lenardo]

you know if you own a hard copy, would it not be fair use to have an e-version of that book? interesting question i'll let the lawyers argue overand not worry about it

[Roga]

Voting with your wallet may be the loudest means of protest fans have, but it isnt the only one, or the most clear. If sales are well under projections, there are a million reasons to blame besides people miffed about the ebook delay. We have other ways of letting Tor and Harriet know the ebook is sorely missed, including Tor's website, facebook and twitter accounts.

[Rinog]

Voting with your wallet may be the loudest means of protest fans have, but it isnt the only one, or the most clear. If sales are well under projections, there are a million reasons to blame besides people miffed about the ebook delay. We have other ways of letting Tor and Harriet know the ebook is sorely missed, including Tor's website, facebook and twitter accounts.

 

 

Yeah, I hit all of those up too.

[yoniy0]

Bitter sweet news, you guys:

Nov-1 13:37(MDT)

Ebook readers, I have some news for you. I sent a letter to Harriet on your behalf, asking if we could move the ebook of TofM up.

 

Nov-1 13:39(MDT)

She said yes, though for various reasons, she still wants some delay. It will now come out in February. 3-month delay instead of 12.

 

Nov-1 13:41(MDT)

I realize that many of you will still find this late, but the choice is Harriet's, and I support her in it. At least it's coming sooner now.

[Itsjustb]

Bitter sweet news, you guys:

Nov-1 13:37(MDT)

Ebook readers, I have some news for you. I sent a letter to Harriet on your behalf, asking if we could move the ebook of TofM up.

 

Nov-1 13:39(MDT)

She said yes, though for various reasons, she still wants some delay. It will now come out in February. 3-month delay instead of 12.

 

Nov-1 13:41(MDT)

I realize that many of you will still find this late, but the choice is Harriet's, and I support her in it. At least it's coming sooner now.

 

Sorry Harriet. Yes it's your choice, but this decision is an epic fail. Unfortunately you'll probably still get away with it.

[firstfishman]

The problem is that noone will tell us why exactly. "Because" just doesnt cut it. I am sure that you have a very valid reason for delaying it, but just stating "various reasons" is a pile o something else. Tell us why, then we can all see the value of your wisdom. Or the lack of it...

[Elend]

Can we just be happy that its not a year long delay?

 

ETA: I'm not saying that its good to delay it or anything, I'd likely not do it if it were me. But it does good to remember that e-books are reasonably new to people that have been in the business as long as Harriet. Tradition can be a powerful thing.

[Rinog]

Can we just be happy that its not a year long delay?

 

ETA: I'm not saying that its good to delay it or anything, I'd likely not do it if it were me. But it does good to remember that e-books are reasonably new to people that have been in the business as long as Harriet. Tradition can be a powerful thing.

 

Put simply, no. Put less simply, many of us bought ereaders for a reason, be it space, weight, convinience, etc... The basic choice we are being given is buy a hardcover, or wait three months. And if we choose to wait, no reading any WoT related message boards, etc. eReaders aren't exactly the cheapest thing around, it takes a pretty decent number of books to offset the initial cost, and the publishers STILL want to charge us nearly hardcover costs. The publishers already showed their greed by forcing prices up. Throw in Harriet's crap to the publishers BS and I have a very hard time finding any goodwill for the woman. It would be one thing if they never released the series in ebook format at all. At least then the reason was just flat out hesitance to accept the format. That I could deal with, which is why I was fine with no ebook last year. Fast forward to this book, when the rest of the series is out in the format that Harriet is blowing off and it's a different story. The tradition card got tossed out the window.

[gethane]

I am really disappointed by the ebook delay. I got TGS for christmas last year and never read it. Why? I DESPISE holding those giant books. It hurts my fingers, I can't take it on the bus easily, etc. I paid another 9.99 to get the ebook a few weeks ago and zipped through it. I was thrilled and surprised to find out the next book was coming out in less than a month! And then I saw this thread :(. I guess I'll wait until February. I wouldn't read the giant book anyway judging from my past behavior.

[blee1555]

...now i buy it all from itunes. not because it's "right", but because it's a better product. it's all organized neatly, and fits right into my collection with all its metadata in place. i'm not buying the music anymore, i can get that for free somewhere else. i'm buying the convenience of a good service.

 

This++

[daveq65]

Well this has made my day. February I can live with a lot easier than November 2011. I am in the camp of not being able to hold heavy books it kills my wrists and fingers, so I now use a Kindle. I think we should be happier that it is sooner rather than much, much later. Yes, of course we'd have preferred it the same day as the physical copy but at least we are getting a copy a lot earlier than we were going too.

[tneva82]

If your only option is to make an international order (which takes up to a month and a half anyways), waiting isn't an issue of willpower anymore, now is it?

 

 

Dunno. I pre-ordered book from Amazon, it got shipped yesterday. Albeit postal strike at Finland could delay it so it comes next week only but that's not something you can count for and still...Week, maybe 1.5 week is hardly month and a half ;)

[yoniy0]

If your only option is to make an international order (which takes up to a month and a half anyways), waiting isn't an issue of willpower anymore, now is it?

Dunno. I pre-ordered book from Amazon, it got shipped yesterday. Albeit postal strike at Finland could delay it so it comes next week only but that's not something you can count for and still...Week, maybe 1.5 week is hardly month and a half ;)

I'm not the least bit surprised that you 'finns get it before the rest of us.

[tneva82]

I'm not the least bit surprised that you 'finns get it before the rest of us.

 

It's not finns. It's anybody who orders from amazon.co.uk. Or you think amazon priorities finland higher than rest of countries?-)

 

I don't know does any store in Finland even sell ToM. We have the translated version and we are still waiting for TGS to be translated let alone ToM. TGS will probably be split into 2 or 3 books as with previous book with each part of book taking atleast 1+ years to be released. First translated part might come somewhere around 2011, 2nd 2012, possible 3rd 2013. Then ToM #1 would be 2013 or 2014, part #2 year later etc. This is about fastest schedelude I expect us to get ToM from finnish stores ;)

 

So you expect to get ToM around 2015 or thereabout?-) Otherwise your comment doesn't make much sense :)

 

And you guys complain about delay in ebook ;) Think of us poor finnish readers who aren't fluent in english and wants to read it in finnish :) We are easily talking about DECADE before they have finished WOT.