the seanchan

[sumquy]

so i have a theory about the seanchan. as of the ending of tgs they still seem focused on "the return" and conquering randland in preparation for TG. something from Cadsuanne pov in tgs caught my attention though. she has several AS that she trusts trying to work out weakness of the adam. i think that they will succeed. something that would allow a damane to be able to remove the collar herself. obviously that wouldn't have much effect on native seanchan damane who think that they should be collared. but if information like that was widely spread in randland it would put a serious crimp in their expansion plans. especially if it spread to randland born damane that the seanchan had already captured. some of them are too beaten down to try escape, but i would bet that a lot of them aren't. this would cause a major upheaval in the seanchan ranks, and effectively cripple their ability to expand. combined with the info that suldam can channel, it would be a rot in the corp of damane. even damane from seanchan would start questioning their fundamental assumptions about the need for channelers to be leashed.

 

kind of long and rambling, but hopefully gets the point of what im thinking across. what do you think?

[Durinax]

majority of captured damane now would rather have the collar on than off. The seanchan are impressively good at brainwashing, only fresh caught ones would be able to utilize it, and once discovered the suldam would command they never do that. thus making the knowledge ineffective and unable to be used. The main thing the AS could do to defeat the seanchan is consciously allow themselves to be captured, have the warders release them and put the collar around a suldam and then make a shield around themselves in the middle of a street

[sumquy]

majority of captured damane now would rather have the collar on than off. The seanchan are impressively good at brainwashing, only fresh caught ones would be able to utilize it, and once discovered the suldam would command they never do that. thus making the knowledge ineffective and unable to be used. The main thing the AS could do to defeat the seanchan is consciously allow themselves to be captured, have the warders release them and put the collar around a suldam and then make a shield around themselves in the middle of a street

 

i don't think the suldam can "command" like compulsion. they rely on the fact that the adam makes the damane feel sick when they try to do proscribed actions. specifically, damane are never allowed near the edge of heights because they might jump. if all it took was a command not to kill yourself, then that wouldn't be neccessary. im not real clear on if those actions are preset in the adam, or if they are commands from the adam, but the previous example makes me lean toward as part of the adam, and not modifiable.

 

even damane who had been long collared would start to question their captivity, if it was known that suldam could channel. it is difficult to suppress an idea. the more interaction they had with "free" channelers the more that idea would spread, even if just among themselves.

[Majsju]

If the Aes Sedai discovered a way to break free from the a'dam, then eanchan would most likely adapt quite fast, by starting to execute randland channelers on the spot. Sure, this would mean way less damane to fill their ranks, but the number of channelers opposing them would decrease rapidly, since it is a lot easier to kill someone than capture them fairly undamaged.

[Mystica]

it would be funny if the randland damane went about it in stealth, snapping the collar around the sul'dam's neck when they come to collect her. It's already established the collar works just as well on sul'dam as on damane. Would be a nice procession leaving Tarabon. lol I wonder what would happen if an Aes Sedai collared a sul'dam and then ordered her to take two seanchan damane each while being collared to the AS still. Would that work like a link or would that simply give access to the AS holding the leash to the Sul'dam to all the power of the two damane through the sul'dam holding them?

 

Can you imagine the eyes of the Seanchan if suddenly 2/3 of their damane force marched right out of the city and turned on them when they try to stop them (by order of the AS)? Would be funny as hell. lol

[yoniy0]

Can you imagine the eyes of the Seanchan if suddenly 2/3 of their damane force marched right out of the city and turned on them when they try to stop them (by order of the AS)? Would be funny as hell. lol

Cool idea Myst (reminds me of a Better Off Ted episode), but I think the a'dam prevents you from entering circles. If that's the case, they will probably find that they can't direct someone else while wearing the collar. That, or die a horrible death upon trying to do it. I'm kinda rooting for option B, it's no more than they deserve.

[Guest]

Remember, in TGS Egwene shows at least the head of the green ajah (and probably more) how to remove the collar with the one power. how awesome would it be if they in ToM starts to really train to master that teqhnique? think about it, its not really using the power as a weapon, and while they remove damane collars, their now joint towerguard-rebel army force will steamroll the other seanchan forces :D

[Durinax]

Remember, in TGS Egwene shows at least the head of the green ajah (and probably more) how to remove the collar with the one power. how awesome would it be if they in ToM starts to really train to master that teqhnique? think about it, its not really using the power as a weapon, and while they remove damane collars, their now joint towerguard-rebel army force will steamroll the other seanchan forces :D

except that if they did that the seanchan born damane would go crazy and strike out against all around them (like in tGH) making them extremely dangerous to everyone

[yoniy0]

except that if they did that the seanchan born damane would go crazy and strike out against all around them (like in tGH) making them extremely dangerous to everyone

What now? Don't they just sit quietly on the ground and wait for someone to re-leash them? If memory serves, they consider it an abomination for them to channel undirected by a sul'dam.

[Guest]

Remember, in TGS Egwene shows at least the head of the green ajah (and probably more) how to remove the collar with the one power. how awesome would it be if they in ToM starts to really train to master that teqhnique? think about it, its not really using the power as a weapon, and while they remove damane collars, their now joint towerguard-rebel army force will steamroll the other seanchan forces :D

except that if they did that the seanchan born damane would go crazy and strike out against all around them (like in tGH) making them extremely dangerous to everyone

 

in TGS as Egwene removes the collars of 2 damane they start whimpering like babies on the floor.

 

i guess some would go crazy, but broken damane will not

[ajfurst]

Remember, in TGS Egwene shows at least the head of the green ajah (and probably more) how to remove the collar with the one power. how awesome would it be if they in ToM starts to really train to master that teqhnique? think about it, its not really using the power as a weapon, and while they remove damane collars, their now joint towerguard-rebel army force will steamroll the other seanchan forces :D

except that if they did that the seanchan born damane would go crazy and strike out against all around them (like in tGH) making them extremely dangerous to everyone

Most don't as others noted. And if they were ones who did, so what? They are trying to collar or kill the Aes Sedai anyway, so it's not any worse.

This one really annoys me that once Egwene had the rebels under her control in TPOD (law of war), that she didn't have every AS, novice and Accepted in the rebel camp learn this ASAP. I mean it's a flick of the power, not a complex weave of all 5 powers requiring wondergirl strength to do it. At the very least if in TOM we don't see (or otherwise find out) every AS has been taught this after the Tower raid then it's a plot contrivance big enough to drive a truck through.

 

The next attack by the Seanchan (and there still is the dream of sul'dam collaring AS and forcing them to call the Power against the White Tower - the first part might be considered fulfilled, but not the second), should (if it wasn't made so for the books) be a fairly straight forward victory for the AS. You only need 1 AS left running around releasing others and you soon have most Damane/AS free. That and as soon as the Seanchan appear it should be every AS / Novice / Accepted link with at least one other, since the Damane can't link. So suddenly they are attacking an enemy they can't shield (due to linking strength) and who whilst they are trying are in turning freeing the damane. Of course plot requirements dictate it won't be the cakewalk it should be if the AS had any common sense - as one of the underlying themes (whether intended or not), is for all their Power, the Aes Sedai of the current age are a bunch of incompetent fools whose 'accomplishments' have been more luck then skill.