Bashere

[RobertAlexWillis]

Funny, Mat and Perrin both married royalty and Rand is the most powerful man in the free world. Gotta love fate.

 

Well, Rand does have a Queen in his harem too ...

[OzzieAlThor]

Well' date=' Rand does have a Queen in his harem too ...[/quote']

 

Indeed. Big pimpin' Rand. He's a playa.

[Luckers]

Seeing the crown doesn't mean he has to take the throne before TG. It means he probably will do it afterward. The Bashere's probably won't die

 

Tenobia and Devram both have to die whenever for him to take the crown. Moreover Min's viewings implicate something dark in Bashere's future. And then there is the fact that there is one book left. It would be anti-climatic and pointless to elevate Perrin after the series has ended when you can gain drama from him rising now.

[Guest Majsju]

Tenobia and Devram both have to die whenever for him to take the crown. Moreover Min's viewings implicate something dark in Bashere's future. And then there is the fact that there is one book left. It would be anti-climatic and pointless to elevate Perrin after the series has ended when you can gain drama from him rising now.

 

Not necessarily. Tenobia has to die, yes. But I can definitly see Davram flat out refuse to accept the crown, and pass it directly to Faile. He doesn't seem like the kind of guy who would appreciate becoming a king.

Depends a lot on what his wife wants, of course.

 

I don't see the problem with letting Perrin and Faile take over at some point in the future, after AMOL though. It's not a very important plotline, just a funny little tidbit to let us know that Perrin won't go back to being a blacksmith when the smoke settles.

[Luckers]

I don't see Bashere fobbing the responsibility off on his daughter... not during Tarmon Gai'don. No, for Faile to inherit i think Bashere must be dead. (plus Min's vision adds weight to it also).

 

As to Perin getting the job post-TG. i suppose in part its because it fits with my idea of whats going to happen with the borderlanders, but i see it happening sooner. Too many things are in position, Perrin is near, the vision of him aiding rand, the vision of him with the broken crown, the vision of potential darkness in Basheres future, and the connection between that and something bad happening to Rand, the vision of Aes Sedai hurting Rand (note how i linked those last two), the fact that the borderlanders have been south for four books without Rand going near them.

 

It just... fits, in my mind.

[Guest Majsju]

Perrin has to be there for Rand, not aiding from a distance. And it would be harder for Perrin to run off adventuring with Rand if he had the responsibility of an entire nation on his shoulders. Granted, he kinda already has that, since he has learned what he got himself into by marrying Faile, but it will make a difference once he actually becomes king.

 

And then it's worth thinking about Mins viewing of davram. "IF he dies or betrays you..." Her viewing indicates that it would be very bad for Rand to lose Davram, which gives him a decent chance of surviving at least long enough to be in the middle of TG, and that's not the most convenient timing to start thinking about crowning a new queen.

[RobertAlexWillis]

I agree with Luckers about something bad likely happening with the Borderlanders, and Bashere and Tenobia eating it. That said, if they don't, I could see Bashere refusing the Broken Crown in favor of Perrin. I could also see Perrin leading the armies of Ghealdan (such as they are), the Two Rivers (at three hundred paces), and Saldaea (wives stay home please!) in the Last Battle simply because Rand says "Hey, Perrin, you take these guys here." Bashere doesn't have to be dead for Perrin to lead, or for Perrin to get the crown. But I still think he eats it ... Min's viewing is suggestive of something dark, and for a man who looks at a fella who just had his hand blown off and says in effect "Meh ... I've seen worse" something "dark" has to be bad indeed.

[Taishar Manetheren]

Robert i hope you dont mind me doing your own trick on you , so here goes.

 

 

Indeed.

[RobertAlexWillis]

YES!

 

I'm a franchise.

[schizm]

Well' date=' Rand's going to be hard pressed to find a BETTER general. Bashere is one of the Great Captains... Mat may be better... may.

 

But still, your point is well taken, he is disposable. Perhaps even needs to be disposed of for other character arcs to continue.[/quote']

Well there are plenty of good generals that Rand can make use of. That's not even counting the Seanchan generals, some of which would have to be on a par with the great captains of Randland.

 

I think Mat will have almost complete control of Rand's armies at the last battle. Seeing as he is a military genius now, and he'll be there to blow the horn, it makes sense to me.

 

The other great generals will follow Mat's command. Perrin will have some authority as well just being who he is. He proved he could make complex battle plans when he planned against the Shaido with the Seanchan. So it isn't out of the realm of possibilty that perrin will be some sort of commander at TG as well.

[Luckers]

I doubt direct control personally. The armies are too large, and there are too many other generals. I suspect it will work more on the basis of suggestion. Mat will suggest something, that, either because Rand backs it or because the others realise that it is a brilliant suggestion, is followed.

[Luckers]

Forgive the double post, edit seems to not be working today.

 

Perrin has to be there for Rand, not aiding from a distance. And it would be harder for Perrin to run off adventuring with Rand if he had the responsibility of an entire nation on his shoulders. Granted, he kinda already has that, since he has learned what he got himself into by marrying Faile, but it will make a difference once he actually becomes king.

 

I agree, but i think Perrin is in a position to be near enough to the borderlanders to be there physically for Rand. I don't see Perrin going off adventuring with Rand following that incident. By then Tarmon Gai'don will be begining. Very likely Perrin will take the borderlanders as well as the Ghealdanin, the Mayeners and his own people, north. It seems likely that he will join with Elayne and the Forces of Andor.

 

And then it's worth thinking about Mins viewing of davram. "IF he dies or betrays you..." Her viewing indicates that it would be very bad for Rand to lose Davram, which gives him a decent chance of surviving at least long enough to be in the middle of TG, and that's not the most convenient timing to start thinking about crowning a new queen.

 

I actually think that lessens his chance. This is the last book, RJ needs to up the pace. Killing off Devram, Tenobia and having Rand captured in the early parts of that book are a good way of doing that. He also needs to raise the risks. Min's vision indicates losing Devram will be a massive loss to Rand, and cause him trouble--is that any reason for a writer not to do it in the last book? I rather think its massive reason for him to go forward with it.

[Guest Majsju]

I agree, but i think Perrin is in a position to be near enough to the borderlanders to be there physically for Rand. I don't see Perrin going off adventuring with Rand following that incident. By then Tarmon Gai'don will be begining. Very likely Perrin will take the borderlanders as well as the Ghealdanin, the Mayeners and his own people, north. It seems likely that he will join with Elayne and the Forces of Andor.

 

I am quite convinced Perrin has to be by Rand's side during TG, as well as mat. Keep in mind Min's viewing of how Rand is fighting a darkness, and that the sparks he sends against it grows in strength and numbers when perrin and mat is around. Quite significant.

 

I actually think that lessens his chance. This is the last book, RJ needs to up the pace. Killing off Devram, Tenobia and having Rand captured in the early parts of that book are a good way of doing that. He also needs to raise the risks. Min's vision indicates losing Devram will be a massive loss to Rand, and cause him trouble--is that any reason for a writer not to do it in the last book? I rather think its massive reason for him to go forward with it.

 

Rand is in deep deep trouble as it is, you can only add so much before it gets so unrealistic that it's over the edge. It's not a goodkind book we're talking about here.

[Luckers]

Yeah, i dont really think Rand is in as much trouble as people make out.