The three lives of Ishamael.

[The Watcher and Wanderer]

As I'm sure you are all aware Rand battled Ishamael three times before he finally kicked the bucket.  I've been wondering how did Ishy survive and/or get resurrected after the first two battles?  Has there ever been an official explanation?  We know he was not trasmigrated as he reappears in the same body with the same name.  At the time I just assumed that Ba'alzamon could not be killed by conventional means and that Calundor possessed some special quality that made it the only means of killing Ba'alzamon.  However, we now know that Ba'alzamon was none other than the Forsaken,  Ishamael and that the Forsaken can potentially be killed by any means that would kill a normal human.  So how did Ishy come back after his first two battles with Rand?

[Hallow]

Do we know he actually died the first two times?

[OptimusPrime]

As I'm sure you are all aware Rand battled Ishamael three times before he finally kicked the bucket.   I've been wondering how did Ishy survive and/or get resurrected after the first two battles?   Has there ever been an official explanation?   We know he was not trasmigrated as he reappears in the same body with the same name.   At the time I just assumed that Ba'alzamon could not be killed by conventional means and that Calundor possessed some special quality that made it the only means of killing Ba'alzamon.   However, we now know that Ba'alzamon was none other than the Forsaken,  Ishamael and that the Forsaken can potentially be killed by any means that would kill a normal human.   So how did Ishy come back after his first two battles with Rand?

 

Remember what was said about Ishamael though, about him being more than half mad and less than half human. It might have taken the Power to kill him

[Mr Ares]

He wasn't killed. In book 1 he was burnt (still injured in subsequent appearances), in book 2 he had a sword shoved through his chest (and is still injured in subsequent appearances). Injured, but not mortally.

[The Watcher and Wanderer]

Do we know he actually died the first two times?

 

No we don't, but I'm assuming he probably didn't.  I'm just wondering if there was ever an explanation for how he survived.

 

Remember what was said about Ishamael though, about him being more than half mad and less than half human. It might have taken the Power to kill him

 

Good point.  Exactly what was meant by "half human" is open to interpretation but it also opens up a lot of possibilities.   If he has physically become something other than human then I would guess it is an effect of overuse of the TP.

 

He wasn't killed. In book 1 he was burnt (still injured in subsequent appearances), in book 2 he had a sword shoved through his chest (and is still injured in subsequent appearances). Injured, but not mortally.

 

Good observations of Ishy still bearing the wounds of his previous two battles with Rand, I had forgotten about that.   I agree that the most likely explanation is that he was not killed in his first two battles with Rand but this still doesn't explain exactly how he survived.  The chest contains a lot of vital organs, the heart, lungs, aorta etc.  It is difficult to get stabbed through the chest and survive.  I'm wondering if his survival was ever explained or if it even got a RAFO at any point.

 

Did someone heal him?  If so who?

 

Is it possible to heal oneself with the TP?

 

Was Ishy just unusually resilient to trauma at that point and if so why?

[Duneflayer]

how far have u read watcher

[OptimusPrime]

Good point.  Exactly what was meant by "half human" is open to interpretation but it also opens up a lot of possibilities.  If he has physically become something other than human then I would guess it is an effect of overuse of the TP

 

Thats what I always thought, that Ishamael was maybe inheriting Shadowspawn traits maybe. Look at Myrddraal for example; even cutting their head off doesnt make them die for a while. The Power, though, is a different matter entirely.

[mb]

It might have taken the Power to kill him

Rand used the Power against Ishamael the first time.

 

[The Watcher and Wanderer]

how far have u read watcher

 

Well, you know I've read at least far enough to get my name, which is CoS I believe.  But actually I have only read "The Eye of the World", "The Gathering Storm", and everything in between ;)

[OptimusPrime]

It might have taken the Power to kill him

Rand used the Power against Ishamael the first time.

 

 

Not enough though. Callandor did it, I imagined that to be why Rand could finally kill him.

[The Watcher and Wanderer]

Good point.  Exactly what was meant by "half human" is open to interpretation but it also opens up a lot of possibilities.   If he has physically become something other than human then I would guess it is an effect of overuse of the TP

 

Thats what I always thought, that Ishamael was maybe inheriting Shadowspawn traits maybe. Look at Myrddraal for example; even cutting their head off doesnt make them die for a while. The Power, though, is a different matter entirely.

 

Also Ishy seems to spend a lot of time in TAR, so much that he has a private sitting room there.  I'm guessing that he probably hangs out in TAR physically.  The wise ones said that entering TAR in the flesh was evil and could damage one's soul so I wonder if this had anything to do with him not being fully human anymore.

[Blackhoof]

It was mainly a combination of TP overuse and his partial imprisonment in the bore.

[OptimusPrime]

It was mainly a combination of TP overuse and his partial imprisonment in the bore.

 

I believe Ishamael wasnt fully bound because of the True Power side effects. That about TAR is a good obseration, nice one Watcher