Formula 1 Grand Prix discussion thread - no off topic spamming !

[Elgee]

We switched over to the cricket, and only popped back between overs to see what was happening  ;D

[WhiteWolf]

You would :P

[Elgee]

We beat the cr*p out of the Aussies  ;D

 

But back on topic: I would really rather have seen a full race, and their idiotic decision deprived me of that

[WhiteWolf]

I am not sure why todays result in qualifying has come as such a shock to the so called "experts". It is not as if Vettel, and Webber, have not shown themselves capable of a result like this. When you, also, factor into the equation Adrian Newey, who is considered one of the pre eminent designers, then where is the shock factor?

 

What is more shocking, to me, is the utter lack of performance shown by the Ferrari's yet again. The cars were nothing special with the KURS System, now they have taken that away and the cars seem worse.....how many times are they going to shoot themselves in the foot this season?

 

Perhaps we should start a book on that, although i doubt we would have good odds ;D

 

So, top three for tomorrow?

 

I think the top two, and maybe even the top three cars, are running light on fuel, two maybe three laps lighter. Altough Vettel and Webber have the pace over one or two laps, will they over an entire race? Somethign always seems to go wrong for these drivers and with the forecast saying there is a good chance of rain tomorrow, there is even more scope for error/bad luck.

 

As for Alonso? Where did that lap come from? It is possible to say he and the team were sand bagging, but look where Piquet ended up, 17th. Now if the car was improved that much why is he still stuck in the basement. He is not a bad driver. However i do have a theory that might explain it. Alonso has the No 1 driver status in that team, so i would not be suprised if Piquet is still driving the non updated car. However, i still think the Renault is light on fuel.

 

If this is the case then with last weeks race as an example, Button can be blindingly fast when he needs to be, and if he does have 3 laps more fuel than those in front of him, as the qually times suggest, he should be in good shape for the race.

 

Barricello? Stands a good chance as well, espexially if it rains where he seems to have an advantage over other dirvers in the wet. But as Button has shown in the past he is no slouch in the wet either.

 

So top three, in no particular order.

 

Barrichello

 

Button

 

Vettel.

 

Over to you Elgee ;)

[Elgee]

I'm a bit surprised by Red Bull's performance, but not completely astonished. I don't hold out high hopes for either Webber or Vettel winning, though - they seem to have an extraordinary amount of bad luck!

 

IF it rains tomorrow, I'd put my bet on Glock and Barricelo for top spots, and a roll of the dice for everyone else.

 

If not, I'd go with:

 

Button

Vettel

Kimi (ok that's wishful thinking  :P)

 

Ferrari ... *sighs and shakes head*

 

They must really be wishing they had Brawn back  ::)

 

 

[WhiteWolf]

More like wishing they had a car ;D

 

Any car, even a Reliant Robin would be faster and more reliant than the current Ferrari.......the old sauerkraut must be turning in his "grave" ;D

[Elgee]

Soooo ... I managed not to curse Red Bull  ;D

 

Wasn't that absolutely frigging awesome? Weber with his still broken body, and Vettel who only had 1 flying lap in qualies 1 & 2, then had Buemi (sp?) crashing into him in the race, yet they're 1 & 2 in what must have been an extremely difficult and arduous race. And we couldn't have had 3 nicer guys on the podium. I loved the by-play between the 3 at the interview too  ;D

 

Ok enough sappy stuff ... 

 

Ferarri need a major shakeup. Not only are their cars not up to scratch, but it seems whoever makes their race decisions is sniffing glue.

 

McClaren seems to have picked up their game a bit, but I think TYG had a good bit of luck on his side. Interesting back and forth between him and Kimi, though - haven't seen so many overtakings in many years  ;D

[WhiteWolf]

Hmmmmm......not sure i enjoyed that race, wet races have never been my fav as they are sop arbitary. However, the best driver/car on the day won, and coming home second as well is a superb and well deserved result. What was even better was to see what appeared to be the genuine feelings of happiness from all the drivers. Seeing Button congratualting Vettel,Webber and Horner before the podium presentation was very good. Even more so after the partisan years when the "great kaiser" rulled all.

 

Williams had a bad day, Renault were ok, Ferrari cannot catch a break right now. Mclaren??? I am not so sure about. When push came to shove neither of their cars seemed to be able to even come close to the pace of the first four cars. I think todays result for Mclaren was a conbination of good tatics and excellent driving, although the Hamster did his best to throw his car off the road enough times to need a car park pass.

 

BMW? Another team that has not got a handle on the new car and are really all at sea right now, which is a surprise considering they started developing this new car about this time last year.

[Elgee]

BMW? Another team that has not got a handle on the new car and are really all at sea right now, which is a surprise considering they started developing this new car about this time last year.

 

Or all at lake?  :P

 

I must say I enjoyed it - there was constant overtaking and changing of position, and driving was actually the determining factor, not pit crew times. Made a welcome change from the processions of previous years.

 

And Glock did well too, considering he started in the pit lane.

[WhiteWolf]

Hmm well wet races have never bee nmy fav, too much of a lottery.....as was shown by what happened to Suttel. Aquaplaned and end of his race when he was in th points and only 6 laps from the end. That has nothing to do with luck or skill, that is just plain unfortunate.

[Elgee]

There is that, but then you also get some idiot taking a perfectly innocent driver out under normal conditions too.

[WhiteWolf]

You mean like the "Great Kaiser" did to Coulthard one year at Spa? ;D

 

Oh man i wish he had "tackled" Coulthard when the helmets were off, i reckon David woudl have flattened him*rofl*

[Elgee]

DC is a big guy with a nice set of shoulders ... that would have been fun  ;D

[WhiteWolf]

The Good

 

Vettel and Button, with Button just getting the vote on what was an amazing last gasp quali lap to put him on pole for tomorrow

 

The Bad

 

Has to be the Mclaren boys, yet again. Although Ferrari have shown some improvment in their pace, it seems that Mcclaren have gone backwards with the Hamster posting a time that was only good enough for 14th and his team mate not even making it to Quali 2.

 

The Ugly

Kimi Raikkonen/Ferrari. Whoever thought that Kimi's time in Quali 1 was good enough to get through to Quali 2 needs their head examining. Kimi has turned around and said it was his fault, but why did the team not insist that he go out again when he had the time? Amazing to see such fundamental errors still occuring. It is also strange how when it was Massa that did not make it through Quali 1 the team accepted the blame. This time, under similar circumstances, Kimi has said it was his fault. I am beginning to think that Kimi will not be Ferrari driver next year.

 

Race Result?

Vettel or Button, race win. Barrechello or Massa for third.

 

 

Elgee edit: fixed the broken bolds  ;)

 

[Elgee]

I hate it when I can't disagree with someone on any points  :P

 

Though the bit I heard was that Kimi's 2 engineers said THEY thought he didn't need to go out again. But that was what the commentators said just after / at the end of the qualies. I presume Kimi spoke about it later?

[WhiteWolf]

in an intewrview quoted on the BBC website, Kimi said the blame lay with him.........i just wonder if he is taking one for the team.

[Elgee]

I would still blame the team. Everyone knows Kimi's not the brightest spark, so he's team managers shouldn't leave a decision like that up to him.

[Talya]

I still haven't managed to watch much, though did see some the other week. And Jensen Button is doing really well from what I gather!

[Elgee]

Jenson's doing beautifully  ;D

 

4 wins out of 5 races so far, and he was on the podium for the other one.

[Tayol]

Ferrari threatened to pull out of next season today

 

*nods*

[Elgee]

I saw that. It's because of the new cap on spending the FIA are proposing. So I guess it's going to come down to who blinks first.

[WhiteWolf]

Well seeing how badly they are doing right now i do not see a down side to them pulling out.....except that Elgee will no longer be able to drool over a certain Kimi ;) on any given Sunday ;D

[Elgee]

Exactly! Now if some other team would offer Kimi a ride, I wouldn't have a problem  :D

 

But how do you guys think this cap on expenditure will help the sport?

[WhiteWolf]

How will the FIA police this? Unless they switch to a "component" lead supply system i am not sure how they will stop teams going over budget. Cost estimates for the production of parts is always notoriously in error, and usually they under estimate.

 

Look at this season as an example. Ferrari, McLaren and BMW are all trying to spend their way out of the trouble they are in. If there is a price cap they would not be able to do that. I cannot see any of the teams liking the thought of being stuck with the car they start with and not being able to improve it throughout the season.

 

There needs to be more details supplied by the FIA before a proper decision can be made about this. Personally i think they should go back to when Teams built their own cars, but things like engines and gearboxs were sourced from outside suppliers and not from the teams engine partners. There also needs to be a relaxation of the rules so that teams can be more inovative in their designs and thus push the technology even further forward. With the current rules i beleive F1 is heading into a technological backwater. Obviously that point of view is dependent on how you see F1. I would prefer a series where there is design inovation rather than design restriction as we have now and have had for several years.

 

Imagine how Colin Chapman would be viewing the current state of F1 if he was still alive. I think he would be appalled at all the restrictions that are in place and would wash his hands of any involvement.

[WhiteWolf]

Added to the above is that both Renault and Toyota have said they will also pull out if the "cap" is introduced..........in the times of economic uncertainty that we are living in right now, you would think these teams would be happy to cut cost. Toyota for the first time in their history posted a loss for last year and this year is looking no better. Why then are they so against a cost cutting exercise when it has to be to the benefits of the teams and their finances.