Did anyone else find this odd?

[Leopoled Boothe]

In "The Dragon Reborn" when Mat is taken to the White Tower and healed of the effects of the dagger from Shadar Logath it took about six or eight AS to heal him.  I don't have my WOT books with me at the moment so I can't look it up, but I remember that it did tell who each AS was and her Ajah.  The weird part is that not a single one of them was Yellow Ajah.  So what's going on here?  This was rather early in the series so does this mean that RJ had not yet decided that one of the Ajah's specialties would be healing?

[Jelly]

I think the Ajah's specialities would be something he planned first. Doesn't seem something he'd make up as he went along. ;)

[Majsju]

From the description, this Healing depended more on strength than skill.

[wvlr]

In "The Dragon Reborn" when Mat is taken to the White Tower and healed of the effects of the dagger from Shadar Logath it took about six or eight AS to heal him.  I don't have my WOT books with me at the moment so I can't look it up, but I remember that it did tell who each AS was and her Ajah.  The weird part is that not a single one of them was Yellow Ajah.  So what's going on here?  This was rather early in the series so does this mean that RJ had not yet decided that one of the Ajah's specialties would be healing?

 

It does sound a little curious, but definitely not conclusive.

 

The AS study all sorts of things before they become full AS.  An Accepted may have many skills before she chooses an Adja.    What if she has very high healing skills, but thinks protecting the world from men who can Channel is more important so she joins the Red - or some other Adja.    Would that mean that she looses all her healing ability?    Obviously not.

 

None the less - it is curious!    Nice catch!

[nashdude]

One thing I'd like to point out is that the Yellow Ajah at the time dealt primarily with PHYSICAL sickness, and Mat's sickness was not physical but more METAphysical. This might have presented a grave problem for the Yellow, who would see this issue as outside the "established" uses of their abilities.

 

I think rather that Mat's Healers were chosen not just for her ability to Heal, but specifically because she was not Yellow, and thus not predisposed to what "can" be Healed with the One Power and what "can't". After all, it wasn't until Nyneave did what was previously "impossible" that the Yellow Ajah realized their own limitations.

[dreago]

on a side note, this room contains a Ter'angreal that "suspends chance" according to Egwene and Nyn(I think). I have wondered if this could be where Mat got his Luck, say a stray bit of Saidar passes through this and Mat....but meh, I just wonder how he got so lucky. Others have suggested his Taverness or a side effect of the dagger, but the ter'angreal was specificaly mentioned so, it just made me wonder.

[Guest The Thin Inn Keeper]

If I remember, weren't the healers selected by Moirane et al?

 

I think it might have had something to do with their reliability and the fact that Mat was found in the company of a man who could channel and, at that point, might have been the Dragon Reborn.

 

I think it had more to do with finding Aes Sedai who were on-side rather than those who were respected healers.

[Jonn]

If I remember, weren't the healers selected by Moirane et al?

 

I think it might have had something to do with their reliability and the fact that Mat was found in the company of a man who could channel and, at that point, might have been the Dragon Reborn.

 

I think it had more to do with finding Aes Sedai who were on-side rather than those who were respected healers.

 

That's an interesting point. I might assume that if the Yellow were involved, they would be obliged to record and document the event quite thoroughly for their own purposes. Undo attention may not have been what was called for in this case.

[Guest Dreadlord]

Moiraine certainly had plenty of tricks up her sleeve. Cant wait till she comes back.

[Guest The Thin Inn Keeper]

If I remember, weren't the healers selected by Moirane et al?

 

I think it might have had something to do with their reliability and the fact that Mat was found in the company of a man who could channel and, at that point, might have been the Dragon Reborn.

 

I think it had more to do with finding Aes Sedai who were on-side rather than those who were respected healers.

 

That's an interesting point. I might assume that if the Yellow were involved, they would be obliged to record and document the event quite thoroughly for their own purposes. Undo attention may not have been what was called for in this case.

 

I mean that's how I've taken it every time I've read it.

 

My take is that they were a number of Aes Sedai who, for whatever reasons, could be relied upon to keep it to themselves, or at least not talk about the dagger to many people.

 

I don't think it was an organised group as such, just a lot of "reliable" individuals.

[Guest cw]

The circle was chosen by Suian and she chose from among the strongest currently present in the Tower.  As Majsju pointed out, strength was more important than Talent in Healing and that drove the selection.  Aes Sedai who would sooner let a man die than look at him would obviously be passed over.

 

As a side note, while the best Healers tend to be Yellow, you don't have to be Yellow just to be good.  Technically, you don't even have to be that good to be Yellow, you just need to have your interest focused primarily on Healing.  Moiraine has a Talent for Healing and can probably rival many Yellows.  She probably could have surpassed many of them had she applied herself to studying Healing rather than whatever she did choose.

[aussie_ashaman123]

If I remember, weren't the healers selected by Moirane et al?

 

I think it might have had something to do with their reliability and the fact that Mat was found in the company of a man who could channel and, at that point, might have been the Dragon Reborn.

 

I think it had more to do with finding Aes Sedai who were on-side rather than those who were respected healers.

 

Alviarin- head of the Black Ajah

Alanna- green who bonds rand against his will

Verrin- god knows what shes doing, there or at any time

 

werent those three involved with healing him?

[Alexius]

One other thing: the healers are a linked circle. In a circle, only the skill of the leader matters- only strength matters for the other  members. Thus, Sheriam, who "can't heal much more than a bruise" but is one of the stronger Aes Sedai, would have been of more use than a skilled but weak Yellow.

 

As for who leads, this is a problem more to do with ancient artifacts and the Shadow than with conventional Yellow-Ajah healing, and Siuan (IIRC) is the one who knows enough to take charge of the effort- unless there's a rule than whenever the Amyrlin is in a circle, she leads.

[Guest The Thin Inn Keeper]

Alviarin- head of the Black Ajah

Alanna- green who bonds rand against his will

Verrin- god knows what shes doing, there or at any time

 

werent those three involved with healing him?

 

Like I said, I was trying to remember, haven't read the book in a while. In any case...

 

I'm not sure what point you're trying to make. I can't remember if those 3 were involved, but at the time I'd still argue that they were all reasonably reliable. -- Rand hasn't been bonded, Alv. is still in the closet and Verin hasn't really begun to do all the things that make Verin, well, Verin.

 

Verin and Alanna always seem to be at the front of things and Alvirian is often referred to as reasonably approachable and a little more "real world" (my quotes) than your average White. I'd still say that those 3 are OK.

 

Anyways, wasn't sure if you were disagreeing or just putting up candidates.

[Emily_Sedai]

 

It should also be considered that perhaps Siuan didn't *really* care if Mat lived or died.  At the time, she had the horn in her grasp, and the choice between keeping Mat alive and bound to the horn, or letting him pass away so the horn could be given to one of the warders or a trusted Sister.  Siuan seems to be one who usually puts the war against the shadow above anything else...   

 

It is said time and again that the *best* healers come from the yellow ajah, and for such a difficult healing, I would imagine at least one would be present.  In addition, how often would someone tainted with something from Shadar Logoth be healed?  Would the Aes Sedai really know what would happen during the healing, or plan for possible medical complications that may come up, which would warrent a yellow's presence.  Granted, Moiraine seemed to know what Mat was infected with right off the bat, but is that part of standard Aes Sedai training, or something she picked up in the real world?

 

 

[Guest leebarr]

It had to do with skill, knowledge, and trust. Mat could not be looked at as a darkfreind because of the dagger

[aevogt]

Other than the title of the chapter, was there any actual capital H Healing involved in breaking the bond between Mat and the SL dagger?  In other words, other than the side effects - Mat wasting away, was there any actual physical injury that the dagger caused that would even require the skills of a yellow.  My theory is that what they used was something like a modified severing weave comprised of Spirit, using that to cut the thing away from Mat's soul.  This brushing against his very soul was what brought his ancient memories to the surface.

 

None of the yellows would know any more about that than any other Sister, and possibly less than a Brown (Verin) who had studied the corruption of Shadar Logoth and it's effects on Mat for sveral months.

 

I doubt that Suian didn't care whether Mat, a powerful Ta'veren, known to be tied to the Dragon Reborn, lived or died.  She knew well enough that Mat must live to see TG just as much as Rand.

 

[42Bonzo88]

    I think it's interesting about the question of Siuan 'allowing' Mat to die or even Verin bringing it up. Mat is Ta'veren and Moiraine told Siuan that at Fal Dara in EotW. Siuan wouldn't allow a Ta'veren to die without trying to heal him because of how closely linked he would be to the pattern. I believe the shadow knows the three have to be together for Tarmon Gaidon. Even if Siuan doesn't know that I really can't believe she would allow him to die for her own purposes. Ta'veren are too rare and what part he will still play in the future is too scary to just kill him off.

[Juggler]

I think you also have to remember Siuan probably knew there were Black Ajah in the tower and didn't trust anyone else to have control over her AND matt. Doesn't the leader of the circle have "feelings" of the others when they link?

I don't think the Amyrlin would let anyone else lead so the choice of women was mostly based on power and what little trust she had, their indivdual talents would have no impact if Siuan was weaving the flows.

[Alexius]

Other than the title of the chapter, was there any actual capital H Healing involved in breaking the bond between Mat and the SL dagger?  In other words, other than the side effects - Mat wasting away, was there any actual physical injury that the dagger caused that would even require the skills of a yellow.  My theory is that what they used was something like a modified severing weave comprised of Spirit, using that to cut the thing away from Mat's soul.  This brushing against his very soul was what brought his ancient memories to the surface.

Severing weave makes sense, especially since that weave is almost always made by a linked circle (judicial stilling or gentling). I don't know whether that's just tradition or because it's an unusually difficult weave to make- Egwene and Nynaeve have done it, Egwene by accident, but they are powerful enough to do stuff single-handed that many Aes Sedai could not. Also, when we hear about the rogue Reds gentling Owyn Merrilin, we hear that "they" did it, so maybe they had to link to do so.