Egwene - Character Arc and Acting

[Meskell]

I know a lot of people were frustrated by Egwene during the book series but she was one of my favourite characters. I only say this to preface the below…

 

I have significant reservations about the actress and her ability to hold scenes throughout the proposed 8 seasons. Whilst she started ok and looks the part, the longer it has gone the more her acting has deteriorated. 
 

Her accent keeps dropping, she is very much chewing the scenery when she has any emotional moments but the part that really hit home for me was when she was crying next to Perrin in Fal Dara and did the telegraphed her to the side lurch and then launch onto the man’s shoulder move. You see this in amateur dramatics quite a bit because people can’t sell subtlety but a professional actor should be beyond this. 
 

Secondly, through no fault of the actor, the character arc has been completely obliterated. I’m not too bothered that Egwene and Nynaeve have been made TV’s, as they basically were in the books, but making Egwene a TV removed her power and agency as an individual. 
 

In the books she makes decisions, is independent, strong willed, determined and just an all round dominating and powerful personality. If she hits the same beats but it is all explained away as being TV, it removes some of her power in being able to choose to be who she is. 
 

The other side is that she is now pushing with her One Power ability so early that it makes it almost irrelevant for her to bother with training / being forced by the Seanchan. She can already do miracles, such as either healing the dead or bringing someone back from the being of death.

 

The growth from precocious idealist to a woman of power and independent thought appears to have been decimated to show that she can do whatever Nynaeve can e.g. be a Wisdom and super healer. 

[Meskell]

Got to bump it as it took 4 hours to be approved. 

[Mirefox]

I thought she was fine as an actress but that could be because the myriad other problems I had with the snow may have overshadowed her.

 

I completely agree with you regarding her being TV.  Her accomplishments should be hers and not a result of the pattern doing with her what it needs, so to speak.

 

I thought is was a terrific shame that she was sleeping with Rand from the very start of the show, seeming with the approval of her parents.  It was a complete change to her character, Rand’s, and all the world building done by Jordan.

 

I don’t think the circle should have happened in Episode 8 but I could have loved with it if the boarderlanders were competent and had a moment to shine and if Rand had had his moment.

 

Healing Nyn was one of the top 5 stupidest things in a series full of stupid things.

 

I was never a huge Eg fan in the novels and overall I’m fairly ambivalent about her in the show outside of those complaints, which I suppose can be high praise for how down I am on so many other elements of the show.

[Lethira the second]

Personally, I would not have cast someone who is unable to maintain an accent for the duration of the production. That said, lets remember at the end of the day she is a human being, and that what we see on the screen is the product of others input. A lot of my complaints with the acting in the show can equally be laid at the fault of the director.  

 

I'm definitely not a book Egwene fan, but I loved the way her character was written.  I think both her and Nynaeve are being pushed into the foreground too much and rather than seeing them grow as people and as channelers, we almost have the fully formed powerhouses from day one.  

[flinn]

 I think Egwene had some of the best scenes period in the book series. I didnt love her, but I didnt dislike her either.

 

 In the show it is the same way. I think her acting is OK and her character is OK.

 

I cant place my finger on why.. but I was becoming more annoyed with her every episode. I still dont dislike her (or the actress) but she is starting to annoy me.

[Owayn The Traveller]

In her defence (not that she needs me defending her or would want that - thanks Rand ?), she does have one of the best scenes in the series. 
 

The smirk when she thought Amyrlin was referring to her as the strongest channeler in centuries and how her face fell when it was Nynaeve  

that the Anyrlin was referring to. ?

[Sabio]

She is much more likeable in the series.  In the books she always came off as a know it all, had to be right brat.

[Chivalry]

2 hours ago, Sabio said:

She is much more likeable in the series.  In the books she always came off as a know it all, had to be right brat.

They've softened the rough edges of multiple characters, including Lan, Egwene, and Nynaeve. 

[Jaysen Gore]

Of the seven main cast, I do think she's the weakest of the actors. She's also the character I'm least interested in, and I am much too concerned that she is too much "end of series" Egwene, which opens up complaints of Mary Sue (I've already seen them on DM). 

 

HOWEVER...I completely reserve judgement until next season, because she will have some of the most powerful scenes in the entire series to pull off, and her role until those episodes has been relatively drama free, especially without the Raven Hunt scenes from Book 1.

[DaddyFinn]

Maybe the accent inconsistency bothers native English speakers more since I for example have not noticed anything regarding it ? I agree that the cliche "gasping" should be minimized. Maybe as she grows up more?

[Quiksilver]

I give benefit of the doubt to the cast since the writing and dialog is generally atrocious. I would not be surprised to see more departures at the end of next season. To be frank, the cast deserves an apology from the writers.

 

Imagine getting cast as Perrin, signing the contract, reading the books and getting excited to play a reluctant hero, then getting handed the script and realizing the writers want you to play a bumbling manbaby with 3 lines per episode and a permanent }:oO facial expression

Edited December 29, 2021 by Quiksilver

[fra85uk]

Well, when you are written as an unbearable Mary Sue is difficult to shine anyway but her acting is objectively bad to the point of being amatourish in some scenes. I cannot imagine her cast in a main role in a high-quality production (eg GoT) 

[notpropaganda73]

I find her character really boring in the show, though I was never really a huge fan of hers in the books either. The actress started off ok I thought but the last few episodes there has been a lot of chewing the scenery. 

 

But I think the biggest problem is just how they are writing the character. I don't find her engaging or interesting in any way whatsoever. We are told she has huge potential but really outside of burning away Perrin's restraints in the Whitecloak scene, there hasn't been any earned moments that have shown her determination and potential. The final scene with Nynaeve was just bad, I didn't come away from it thinking she had levelled up or anything. 

 

To be honest she reminds me a little of Bella in the Twilight series, sort of an empty vessel of a "character" so far. 

 

 

[Terry05]

I really liked her tbh. Really didn’t like the character in the books so was surprised how much I liked her in the show. Put that down to the actress

[Vartija]

I've liked her so far and I haven't noticed any bad acting tbh. They've made her less overbearing and headstrong as in the book (which I think is a good change) but you can still see the ambition and drive that book-Egwene has in some of the scenes, like the subtle Siuan-Egwene-Nynaeve scene referenced above. To me it feels like the actress has seemed very comfortable with the role.   

[7th age]

17 hours ago, Mirefox said:

I completely agree with you regarding her being TV.  Her accomplishments should be hers and not a result of the pattern doing with her what it needs, so to speak.

 

But that never was 100% the case. While shes not labeled TV in the books ALL characters are caught in this web and perhaps none of the non TV more so then her.

I love her arc, annoying as she can be at times, and yes more then any character she gets trained and forced plus she is the one that WANTS it the most. You can see that from the Raven chapter, but also from her pairing with Gawyn who similarly to her wants to be a hero but gets denied the chance at every point during the series until that very character impulse leads him to stupidly throwing his life away.

BUT, no matter how competent she is. Considering the whole series spans less then 3 year, meaning it takes her less time then M. spends as a novice (itself a new record at the time) to go from learning she can channel to being an awesome Amyrlin, I find it hard to to not ascribe her some "tavereness". She notices this herself in ToM, something like "Im here for a reason, hes here for a reason, to me he cant be the Dragon he must be Rand, because the Dragon is to be feared while Rand can be trusted".

[CanisNoir]

I do think the actress is one of the weaker of the ensemble, but it's just the first season and she's got great partners there to learn from and act against. I have hopes that she'll rise to the occasion in later seasons. I agree with the previous poster who stated her scene in front of Suian with Nynaeve was a fantastic character moment, but there wasn't a lot of true subtlety that others have managed to pull off. Plus, she wasn't bad by any stretch.

 

With regards to Ta'Varen, I don't see that as having a major impact on their agency any more than it does for Rand, Mat and Perrin. In fact, I think it better explains why they are able to do some of the amazing things they can do later in the books. 

 

If anything, my biggest complaint is that they told us Egwene was "unbreakable" instead of just letting it be shown through the tremendous hardships she faces, being collared, with the Aiel and finally as The Captured Amarlyn. 

[Jaysen Gore]

For the record, i'm okay with them making her Ta'veren. Nynaeve less so, since Nyn's impact outside a couple of events is much less impactful. Egwene changes the whole World, Nyn just saves it a couple of times.

[RhienneAgain]

19 hours ago, Owayn The Traveller said:

In her defence (not that she needs me defending her or would want that - thanks Rand ?), she does have one of the best scenes in the series. 
 

The smirk when she thought Amyrlin was referring to her as the strongest channeler in centuries and how her face fell when it was Nynaeve  

that the Anyrlin was referring to. ?

I so agree on this! It was that little action that gave me a bit of faith that the series really knew what it was doing with these characters (after the final few episodes I'm now more inclined to give the actress the credit for that).

 

I'm not blown away by her acting, but I don't think it's awful either. I don't like book Egwene at all but I'm mostly ok with TV Egwene so far. I think it's because the actress has combined the 'hardness' of Egwene's actions and personality (her drive, self-confidence, and ambition) with a softness or slight wistfulness in her expressions which adds a likeable extra dimension to me. It gives me more sense of her idealism and good intentions.

[Storeebooq]

Honestly, I think the "weak" acting and seeming inconsistency with the character makes her feel more real to me. She is still searching for her place. 

 

If they follow through and have her get captured in some (hopefully less dated and less problematic version) way by the Seanchan and then be taught by the Wise One's, we'll see her mature more as she did in the books. I think it will be a great way for the actress to mature along with her character in the role and really serve us a great Eqwene

 

[fra85uk]

11 minutes ago, Storeebooq said:

 

 

If they follow through and have her get captured in some (hopefully less dated and less problematic version) way by the Seanchan

 

In which sense it is problematic the way in which the Seanchan capture Egwene?

[Jaysen Gore]

2 hours ago, Storeebooq said:

Honestly, I think the "weak" acting and seeming inconsistency with the character makes her feel more real to me. She is still searching for her place. 

 

If they follow through and have her get captured in some (hopefully less dated and less problematic version) way by the Seanchan and then be taught by the Wise One's, we'll see her mature more as she did in the books. I think it will be a great way for the actress to mature along with her character in the role and really serve us a great Eqwene

 

See, I'm hoping for 12 years a slave type abuse for our little Eggy. The Seanchan broke full sisters in less than 6 months in the books, so I want the absolute brutality played up. Damane are dogs to be kennelled, nothing more, and nothing less. The Wise Ones can then work with her to resolve her PTSD into something productive, and temper her into fine steel after the fires of the Seanchan.

 

 

 

 

[Scarloc99]

On 12/28/2021 at 6:23 PM, Meskell said:

I know a lot of people were frustrated by Egwene during the book series but she was one of my favourite characters. I only say this to preface the below…

 

I have significant reservations about the actress and her ability to hold scenes throughout the proposed 8 seasons. Whilst she started ok and looks the part, the longer it has gone the more her acting has deteriorated. 
 

Her accent keeps dropping, she is very much chewing the scenery when she has any emotional moments but the part that really hit home for me was when she was crying next to Perrin in Fal Dara and did the telegraphed her to the side lurch and then launch onto the man’s shoulder move. You see this in amateur dramatics quite a bit because people can’t sell subtlety but a professional actor should be beyond this. 
 

Secondly, through no fault of the actor, the character arc has been completely obliterated. I’m not too bothered that Egwene and Nynaeve have been made TV’s, as they basically were in the books, but making Egwene a TV removed her power and agency as an individual. 
 

In the books she makes decisions, is independent, strong willed, determined and just an all round dominating and powerful personality. If she hits the same beats but it is all explained away as being TV, it removes some of her power in being able to choose to be who she is. 
 

The other side is that she is now pushing with her One Power ability so early that it makes it almost irrelevant for her to bother with training / being forced by the Seanchan. She can already do miracles, such as either healing the dead or bringing someone back from the being of death.

 

The growth from precocious idealist to a woman of power and independent thought appears to have been decimated to show that she can do whatever Nynaeve can e.g. be a Wisdom and super healer. 

You are assuming the first 6 episodes where filmed in order. The number of times in interviews actors have talked about having to find the character on day one for a huge crux scene at the end of a movie or series. 
 

As for episodes 7 and 8 she had been in lockdown due to a pandemic and we know last minute rewrites where completed when it became clear Matt was not returning to film them, I suggest you wait and see how things pan out in season 2 before starting to attack the actor. 

[Scarloc99]

15 hours ago, 7th age said:

 

But that never was 100% the case. While shes not labeled TV in the books ALL characters are caught in this web and perhaps none of the non TV more so then her.

I love her arc, annoying as she can be at times, and yes more then any character she gets trained and forced plus she is the one that WANTS it the most. You can see that from the Raven chapter, but also from her pairing with Gawyn who similarly to her wants to be a hero but gets denied the chance at every point during the series until that very character impulse leads him to stupidly throwing his life away.

BUT, no matter how competent she is. Considering the whole series spans less then 3 year, meaning it takes her less time then M. spends as a novice (itself a new record at the time) to go from learning she can channel to being an awesome Amyrlin, I find it hard to to not ascribe her some "tavereness". She notices this herself in ToM, something like "Im here for a reason, hes here for a reason, to me he cant be the Dragon he must be Rand, because the Dragon is to be feared while Rand can be trusted".

Also people seem to be forgetting that the internet pretty much named her a minor 4th TV behind the 3 boys.
 

I do love how people are complaining that Rafe hasn’t listened to the fans, he then does one of the things people on this very forum called for when the books where being written and gets slated for it. It kind of goes to show that whatever he did the same % of people would be here slating him lol. 

Edited December 30, 2021 by Sir_Charrid

[ForsakenPotato]

I'm clearly in the minority here but there's long stretches in which I like Egwene way more than Rand in the books. She has a lot fewer self-pity parties, which while understandable for Rand's position I didn't particularly enjoy reading. She's a flawed character, but they all are, and her flaws usually drive the plot forward in interesting ways.

 

I think the actress has a lot of room to grow but also a lot of potential. Her facial expressions are pretty good, and she's had a few tough scenes that I thought were great -- especially the one with her, Valda, and Perrin. She's been given a lot of pretty bad dialogue to work with, and she isn't able to pull it off as often as some of the more experienced actors. Overall she's coming through as self-righteous, willing to sacrifice herself for a cause, stubborn, optimistic, ambitious, naive, and a little self-centered, but still overall sympathetic/likeable/heart's-in-the-right-place. That feels good to me and consistent with how I read her character in the books, but obviously every reader and viewer filters things and understands characters differently, so just because it's working for me doesn't mean it will for everyone.

 

Her accent is sometimes more jarring as it is often very distinctly Australian, which is not an accent we are used to in a fantasy landscape and is not similar to the accents of the other 2 rivers folks. That said, other locations have also had a big mix of accents from people all theoretically born there (Fal Dara) and other characters have had noticeable accents (Logain and Alanna for example). I think it's more obvious with Egwene because she's given more lines, but there's not enough info for me to know if it's a problem with her acting or a deliberate decision to allow the WoT universe to sound less universally British than most big fantasy adaptions.