Sailor Moon Mafia [Advanced] Game Thread

[bopolis]

im having a hard time reading zander and part of it is me not wanting to be spiteful due to the tunnel. 

 

I agree with everything clov said, adn i think i expressed it at the time(ie the focus on penny making no sense). I feel like he saw me call him wolf and since then he's been locked in this thunderdome and even though he hasnt pursued it as hard he keeps making sarcastic comments about how you could read me/spades as town and condescending comments to spades that just shows no reconsidering the idea. I asked the otherday if he gets ultra defensive when called a wolf ebcause usually i would expect either a jokey quip(ie a you got me breaking bad gif or something similar) or maybe even a wolf read because he sometimes people find using the rand wolf sub out line as wolfy or a easy way to cast suspicion and i would have understood that. But the full on thunderdome was unexpected.

 

Also a couple selfish things where he liked clov for his read on eldrick early on but several posts earlier i gave the same read and nothing. 

 

I find the you don't read me villa, you are a wolf line a bit odd as well(the line he's taken with eldrick) especially since a reason he was villa reading clov was the eldrick read which i assume he somewhat agreed with since he also had eldrick as a villa earlier as well.

 

*for sooh/cory other MUers* i'm kinda reading the cory/zander dynamic as similar to the banks/JP dynamic that exists in their games. That is regardless of alignment JP is always buddying with banks and nowt pushing him or evaluating early and based on what i know of zander/cory through seeing them interact on MUdiscord(zander shouting out to cory the few times i've seen him pop in etc) and hearing cory talk abotu zander outside of game they are buddies and zander seems like someone who gravitates and allies with his buddies in games(purely my opinion). 

 

Spades has been concerned with zander buddying right up to cody and i've been assuming thats a normal thing for him, if that isn't a normal thing please let me know.

 

 

 

so im at this point and im kinda tired and in a fugue and completely dont know where i was going. So if i derailed or my point got muddled in here sorry. this is where im at on zander

[MrsClov]

YOUR HOURLY VOTE COUNT:

 

Eldrick(2): Scruffington, Zander

Scruffington(3): Darthe, Linz, Marsh

Marsh(1): Cuth

Fleeing Coward(1): CorDyx

Zander(2): MrsClov, Eldrick

  

A deadline is now set for Friday, July 14th at 11:30pm EST.  With 12 alive it takes 7 to lynch.

 

(votes were reset on replaced people)

 

Also until Hally gets around to update the player list ...

 

Aquilla has been replaced by Fleeing Coward

Ted Bundy has been replaced by Fredwood

 

(do not discuss subs)

I think that if Scruffington and Zander are wovles Eldrick is probably more likely to be town. Unless there's some really weird bussing going on. Probably too easy for D1 shenanigans though. 

[Spadeszee]

Interesting. Just finished reading where I signed off.

Going to read again and try to make more sense of it all.

 

 

I think I've been trying really hard to not take people reading me poorly personally, because I have a habit of doing that. My issue with Fred was that his opinion did seem like cherry picking as Bop said. The whole story didn't seem present to me and I was trying to understand how he came to his conclusions without all the other information being taken into account.

 

Trying to follow his train of thought and his intent behind them.

[bopolis]

unrelated note:

 

my home forum we play 12/12 cycles(12 hour day, 12 hour night) and our day 1's have 1500ish posts. So i have a hard time adjusting a basis for activity levels in longer games but after playing off site in them(long games) i believe i've got a better internal sense of what kind of activity someone should have.

[bopolis]

 

YOUR HOURLY VOTE COUNT:

 

Eldrick(2): Scruffington, Zander

Scruffington(3): Darthe, Linz, Marsh

Marsh(1): Cuth

Fleeing Coward(1): CorDyx

Zander(2): MrsClov, Eldrick

  

A deadline is now set for Friday, July 14th at 11:30pm EST.  With 12 alive it takes 7 to lynch.

 

(votes were reset on replaced people)

 

Also until Hally gets around to update the player list ...

 

Aquilla has been replaced by Fleeing Coward

Ted Bundy has been replaced by Fredwood

 

(do not discuss subs)

I think that if Scruffington and Zander are wovles Eldrick is probably more likely to be town. Unless there's some really weird bussing going on. Probably too easy for D1 shenanigans though. 

 

 

 I would agree. (selfishly i would also say if zander is a wolf id be doing a lickity lockity clear dance)

[Cory Caboose]

I'm fine with qualms because a lot of his content has been frustrating for me to parse, but frustration on what he is pursuing is not something wolfy for Zander in the slightest. For the most part as a wolf Zander only really gets into lengthy, stubborn arguments with fellow wolfbros as a wolf because he knows he's "right" even though he's a wolf, and I immensely doubt BopSpades/Zander are wolf/wolf.

 

He's not a good lynch today.

[Darthe]

Well, I'm back from my Zander ISO. Holy what did I just read, batman?

 

Here's what I've come away with. Zander originally sussed SpadesBop because of Spades interaction with Sooh. He said it felt awkward, and later went to say he thought they could be w/w together. When I read through the interactions between Zander/Bop it felt like Zander wasn't the one who subbed in for Penny. Like his questions were about Penny's meta and read like he was trying to figure out that slot (which is his own, mind you) not Bop's or anyone else's. The questions he asked were as follows:

 

How many games have you played with Penny?

 

Has she ever subbed as Scum before? As Town? Is one more prevalent?

 

You don't think its possible she outted before role pm's were out or she couldn't have outted as Town?

 

Do you know she doesn't like playing as Scum at all?

 

So you generally assume anyone subbing out is Scummy?

 

Does Penneh sub out as Town?

 

The entire ISO I never got the feeling he was trying to figure anyone out. He never gave reasons for his reads, and infact I'm really bothered by him having Cordyx as town. I have them as probably town (for now), but I also have reasons associated. To me, Zander reads to me like he came in to the game and was going to town read Cordyx. In fact here's one post that really bothered me related to this.

 

Pretend for a sec you knew for certain Cordyx, me and ofc no pretending but Linz are all Town.

 

He's had Eldrick as a high town read all phase, so why all of the sudden is he voting him? Especially when at one point in time he said that 1 of Darth, Sooh, or SpadesBop was scum and called Ironeyes wolfy 3 times? Zander asked several times what other people thought of HIM, but very little of asking about other people or trying to figure out their slots.

 

All in all I'm not convinced that Zander is trying to solve the game.

 

[unvote]

 

[v]Zander[/v]

Cool do you don't think the effort was genuine then?

[Cory Caboose]

Scruffington is sort of a lazy lynch but there's no real reason it couldn't be right, but I'm not sure it's the most optimal direction for today.

 

Iron is a bit spicier, but I think is pretty rand as well, though I haven't fully absorbed his content yet (will have by EoD).

 

ATM Fleeing Coward hits a wolf the most often.

[Spadeszee]

The thing with Zander as a wolf in this situation is multiple people (including Linz) told him he was hitting a wall, that he wasn't progressing thought. It wasn't until Cory told him to back off (and even then he still continued to bring it up and focus on me) that he pulled back a little. It doesn't seem like he has thought process about how his actions are being perceived. IDK if Wolf Zander does this as well, but I'd find it really odd if a wolf went around in so many circles unless they were just trying to be annoying. Where as for town it just looks like he has hyper focus issues. He's not looking at the bigger picture and people have mentioned this. Maybe because he has been getting town read he hasn't felt the need to move onto the big picture?

 

I also always take people focusing me a little personally. I'm trying really hard to not do that, but I can't help it. I don't think I've been able to really read Zander because I'm confused by him and most of his points have made very little sense to me. I've felt maybe it's my bias for being hounded.

 

IDK, I'm kind of lost here right now.

[Darthe]

Interesting. Just finished reading where I signed off.

Going to read again and try to make more sense of it all.

 

 

I think I've been trying really hard to not take people reading me poorly personally, because I have a habit of doing that. My issue with Fred was that his opinion did seem like cherry picking as Bop said. The whole story didn't seem present to me and I was trying to understand how he came to his conclusions without all the other information being taken into account.

 

Trying to follow his train of thought and his intent behind them.

This is a good post to form a read around ftr. Its being outrun about concerns that I Antonoff expect a new player to have and its game solvey..

[MrsClov]

 

Well, I'm back from my Zander ISO. Holy what did I just read, batman?

 

Here's what I've come away with. Zander originally sussed SpadesBop because of Spades interaction with Sooh. He said it felt awkward, and later went to say he thought they could be w/w together. When I read through the interactions between Zander/Bop it felt like Zander wasn't the one who subbed in for Penny. Like his questions were about Penny's meta and read like he was trying to figure out that slot (which is his own, mind you) not Bop's or anyone else's. The questions he asked were as follows:

How many games have you played with Penny?

 

Has she ever subbed as Scum before? As Town? Is one more prevalent?

 

You don't think its possible she outted before role pm's were out or she couldn't have outted as Town?

 

Do you know she doesn't like playing as Scum at all?

 

So you generally assume anyone subbing out is Scummy?

 

Does Penneh sub out as Town?

The entire ISO I never got the feeling he was trying to figure anyone out. He never gave reasons for his reads, and infact I'm really bothered by him having Cordyx as town. I have them as probably town (for now), but I also have reasons associated. To me, Zander reads to me like he came in to the game and was going to town read Cordyx. In fact here's one post that really bothered me related to this.

 

Pretend for a sec you knew for certain Cordyx, me and ofc no pretending but Linz are all Town.

He's had Eldrick as a high town read all phase, so why all of the sudden is he voting him? Especially when at one point in time he said that 1 of Darth, Sooh, or SpadesBop was scum and called Ironeyes wolfy 3 times? Zander asked several times what other people thought of HIM, but very little of asking about other people or trying to figure out their slots.

 

All in all I'm not convinced that Zander is trying to solve the game.

 

[unvote]

 

[v]Zander[/v]

Cool do you don't think the effort was genuine then?

 

Not really... I feel like there were a lot of places he could have inserted reads/thoughts on other things happening, but instead kept circling back. I got the feeling that he was almost staying in that circle because it was easy.  There was also a lot of talks of Cory saying this or Cory telling him that... So it almost felt like he was being mentored. Not saying that he's w/w with Cordyx by any means because I think a lot of it came from previous games, but yeah I never really felt like Zander ventured out of the small area he put himself in. 

[Darthe]

But Antonoff should be the word would

[Darthe]

That's cool by me. If I was gonna cop someone tonight it would be z so the read doesn't bother me

[Cory Caboose]

Re: Zander reading me & Clov town.

 

If Zander is a villager and I don't come into conflict with him (because conflict tends to blind Zander) he's pretty much always going to village read me day 1. If day 1 ends in a mislynch, he'll probably reverse direction on that, lol.

 

I think Zander committing to that early and not really even evaluating it is probably villagery ... I imagine as a wolf he'd probably put a bit more effort in faking his read on me.

[Cory Caboose]

I also always take people focusing me a little personally. I'm trying really hard to not do that, but I can't help it. I don't think I've been able to really read Zander because I'm confused by him and most of his points have made very little sense to me. I've felt maybe it's my bias for being hounded.

 

You & Sooh should have a chat lol. Sooh has been on the receiving end of a Zander tunnel probably more times than anyone, maybe she can start up a support group.

 

[MrsClov]

Cory, I hear what you are saying but I can't go solely off of a meta I've never seen only heard about. I'm going off of what's in the thread, and everything you are telling me about how he approaches things seems like it'd be easy enough to fake. 

[Cory Caboose]

Cory, I hear what you are saying but I can't go solely off of a meta I've never seen only heard about. I'm going off of what's in the thread, and everything you are telling me about how he approaches things seems like it'd be easy enough to fake. 

 

That's fine and I'd never want you to not try and interpret the game from your POV.

 

Just giving you my input and experience from someone who has played like 30+ games with Zander and has classically read him very well.

[MrsClov]

 

Cory, I hear what you are saying but I can't go solely off of a meta I've never seen only heard about. I'm going off of what's in the thread, and everything you are telling me about how he approaches things seems like it'd be easy enough to fake. 

 

That's fine and I'd never want you to not try and interpret the game from your POV.

 

Just giving you my input and experience from someone who has played like 30+ games with Zander and has classically read him very well.

 

Noted. 

[Cory Caboose]

Don't really like any of Marsh's posts on page 31. Seems very hypersensitive of Darthe's basically "jumping around" vote on him and how he's perceived by Spades moreso than really reading for people's alignments.

 

His read on our slot is a total cop out.

[Darthe]

 

I also always take people focusing me a little personally. I'm trying really hard to not do that, but I can't help it. I don't think I've been able to really read Zander because I'm confused by him and most of his points have made very little sense to me. I've felt maybe it's my bias for being hounded.

You & Sooh should have a chat lol. Sooh has been on the receiving end of a Zander tunnel probably more times than anyone, maybe she can start up a support group.

 

Doh hasn't played as many games as I've been zander tunneled, much less Des tunneled

[Darthe]

Don't really like any of Marsh's posts on page 31. Seems very hypersensitive of Darthe's basically "jumping around" vote on him and how he's perceived by Spades moreso than really reading for people's alignments.

 

His read on our slot is a total cop out.

he is okay. Let it sit a day imo

[Spadeszee]

I told Bop a day and a half ago I felt there was a wolf between Zander and Cory-Chris. Because Zander seems so off the wall with the contrast of Cory-Chris being very much in control, I find Cory-Chris to be much more likely a wolf.

 

At first I thought Cory was trying to lead Zander, but the more I see from him the less that seems to be true.

 

However, both have been ignoring each other now.

[Cory Caboose]

I am never ISOing Zander in my life. It's a solemn vow I made many moons ago.

 

 

 

I am never ISOing Zander in my life. It's a solemn vow I made many moons ago.

ISO me then?

 

I'm not really about doing peoples homework for them. If you want to start making reads, one must read.

 

 

 

I'm reading, but it'll take me a while to get up to speed. I just wanted to check in and make sure nothing urgent was happening in the meantime

 

just reads like "hey i'm gearing up to mail this one in" as a response

 

Up to page 15, starting to see the discussion about subbing. Thought I'd post my impressions before diving down the rabbit hole 

 

Def liking Spades content-wise so far, although she has an unfortunate tendency to misinterpret my posts. It's ok, we'll get used to each other. Bop I like somewhat less, but that hydra is overall feeling town to me. 

Derf gonna derf. Why that guy consistently feels the need to drop a cryptic, discussion inducing comment and the peace out is beyond me. 

I hope and pray that Cordyx is (are? grammar is hard) town. Not only are they good players, but if they're town I can confidently sheep Clov's read on Edrick. I'm not very good at reading him myself, as history shows. 

Mrs. Clov, thank you for being a wonderful, active, engaged, mod-confirmed town. Def not brown nosing lol

 

 

 

 

Darthe, what did you not like abour iron

He was a different player last game. That said, could just be that he is busy so I should retract that sus for now.

 

How did you get that impression out of just two posts?

 

Also yeah, I was busy and not paying attention to my email, which is how I usually know when games start. I found my role pm about fifteen minutes before flying back to Utah, after which I was exhausted (it being 2:30 am) and crashed until it was time for class this morning. Hopefully I can remedy my absence by staying active and engaged from now on.

 

 

I didn't think there was anything "wolfy" about Marsh getting a late start (it happens, real life is a thing) but this post just really rubs me the wrong way, like he somehow feels at fault / guilty for something that wasn't really in his control.

 

 

 

Eldrick, do you have game related thoughts and stuff?

Sorry was catching up.

 

I also think bop's response to zander was tongue in cheek. Didn't see a problem with it.

 

Zander usually isn't defensive as scum, so it reaction is ???

 

Don't like scruffy's post either. Curious why he chose me to vote.

 

Not a fan of marsh's response to zander calling his catching up post wolfy. Zander was clearly joking imo, and marsh comes off as mildly defensive.

 

Nothing else right now.

 

TBH "mildly defensive" describes the entirety of my playstyle. It's what gets me mislynched so often

 

[Cuth]

spades, not sussing scruff for lack of interest or activity in the game

 

sorry i thought i'd made that clear

 

more the way he handled the issue

[Cory Caboose]

I told Bop a day and a half ago I felt there was a wolf between Zander and Cory-Chris. Because Zander seems so off the wall with the contrast of Cory-Chris being very much in control, I find Cory-Chris to be much more likely a wolf.

 

At first I thought Cory was trying to lead Zander, but the more I see from him the less that seems to be true.

 

However, both have been ignoring each other now.

 

One of these days you're going to have to learn how to trust me.