The latest drop changes things a bit, but I can guarantee you, Moiraine will never say in the show "it's one of the five of you" in the context of being the Dragon Reborn. I'm pretty certain that exact line won't be in the show at all. She does say "the four of you", but in rather different context to what seems to be generally accepted.

Based on reports of the clips shown at MCM, this is how that scene actually plays out:

Moiraine: "The Dark One is waking. His Whispers are already in the backs of our minds, but there will be one who can stand against him. The Dragon has been born again, that's why I'm here."

Mat: "Have you fully lost your mind?"

... The bit from the trailer where they see the Trollocs coming down the Mountain ...

Moiraine: "Get the horses"

Egwene: "What? You can't leave!"

Moiraine: "You're going with me, the four of you. Your life isn't going to be what you thought." ...

Not sure if I'm allowed to link it here, but you can hear it for yourself on "Wheel of Time Theory's" break down video of the MCM clips on YouTube.

Admittedly, the "5 of you" line could be from elsewhere in the show. But considering the rest of the dialogue surrounding that line is in the clip, I kind of doubt it. More likely it's just a dub for the trailer. It is also possible the clip shown at MCM is different to the final cut, but I think it's more likely to be accurate than the trailer.

As to the latest drop and Moiraine saying they don't know if the baby was a boy or a girl. There are a number of possibilities for the way this could play out. Firstly it could be a dub that won't appear or play out in the show at all. Alternately it could still be the general belief among the population that the Dragon will be a man, but Moiraine who has studied and thought on this far more than most has some doubts. She may still think it's most likely going to be a man. That would change very little as compared to the books. It could also of course mean there is a general belief the Dragon could be a girl, I won't really like that, but I pretty much agree with what SinisterDeath is saying, it doesn't really change the main thrust of the story very much.

The Dragon Reborn is 100% going to be Rand, no doubt, none. Firstly because it would be bonkers to do anything else. But also Josha is listed as a main star above all the other EF5 and the hidden weave layer in the posters has him front and centre. In the cast interviews on IGN both Barney and Marcus compare there characters to Rand implying he is the central character.

BTW, hi. Don't think I've posted here for about 10 years.

In the world of WoT they developed really heavy accents that make it hard to understand each other. That is close enough to new languages without needing books devoted to people learning languages. I know some people love RJ's descriptions but wanting that is as rediculous as complaining that a world that revolves around magic, alternate worlds, and rebirth does not follow every law of physics that we have.

The main problem is the Seanchan. They have plenty of off-screen time to learn the language, and are completely isolated from the continent. It wouldn't require more than maybe three lines scattered throughout the books. Heavy accents are not enough to compensate for thousands of years of isolation, culture merging, and a complete language transition.

I think it more unlikely the Aiel would use the common tongue. At least the Seanchan were conquered by an army that spoke the common tongue, so at least it's possible if not very likely that the language of the conquering army spread through the continent replacing (I assume the old tongue) as the common language.

The Aiel would have have gone into the waste with the old tongue as their common language. They have had very little contact with the outside world since, why on earth would they have adopted the language of a people they had very little to do with?

I think you guys are missing the "groaning every time she moves." It seems to me that Elayne put her there not that she went there without the bracelet being worn.

 

But a mistake by RJ is also likely.

She's groaning every time she moves because Birgette beat her up, nothing to do with the bracelet:

And groaning every time she moves. She said something she didn't think Birgitte would hear, and Birgitte.... I had to take the thing off, Nynaeve. Birgitte had the right, and it hurt. I told Marigan to say she fell down some stairs

All it means is she needs to be in the same general place doing laundry and can't move more than twelve steps away. Elayne could go back and get her or place the bracelet back on when it was time to move on...

That's not what the text suggests to me.

If no one wore the bracelet, she could not move more than a dozen paces from it without falling to her knees retching

That says twelve paces from the bracelet not twelve paces from where she was when the bracelet was removed.

RJ contradicted himself.

I think it's a mistake too. But which bit?

I'm more inclined to believe it is possible to move away from an unworn bracelet with the necklace on and the first quote was a mistake.

The only reason you can't do it with a regular a'dam is because of the chain.

So what about this quote that a5m posted a few pages back:

In the middle of Fire and Spirit...

 

With a sigh she started down the street. Elayne came along as though she had been invited. That helped Nynaeve find the anger she was going to need. Abruptly she realized that Elayne's wrists were bare. "Where is the bracelet?" she asked softly. No one in the street would understand if they heard, but caution once forgotten could be forgotten once too often. "Where is Marigan?" "The bracelet is in my pouch, Nynaeve." Elayne stepped aside to let a high-wheeled cart pass, then joined Nynaeve again be* hind the cart. "Marigan is doing our laundry, with about twenty other women around her. And groaning every time she moves. She said something she didn't think Birgitte would hear, and Birgitte.... I had to take the thing off, Nynaeve. Birgitte had the right, and it hurt. I told Marigan to say she fell down some stairs."

Nynaeve sniffed, but her heart was not in it. She had not been wearing the bracelet much of late....

Emphasis mine.

So Elayne's just wandering around with the bracelet in her pouch, but Moggy's off doing laundry? She should be on her knees retching if the previous quote by Terez is correct. I'm sure there are other occurrences like this as well.

I think it was in this thread where we were discussing the altered a'dam? Anyway, just passed this in my reread:

 

"Wear it," she said as Elayne started to hang the bracelet on a wall peg with their clothes.

 

The golden-haired woman gave an affected sigh, but refastened the bracelet. In Nynaeve’s opinion, Elayne was entirely too trusting of the a’dam. True, so long as the necklace remained on Moghedien’s neck, any woman able to channel could find her with the bracelet, and control her. If no one wore the bracelet, she could not move more than a dozen paces from it without falling to her knees retching, and the same if she shifted the bracelet more than a few inches from where it had been left, or tried to unfasten the necklace herself. Maybe it would hold her even on the peg, but maybe one of the Forsaken could reason a way around that, given enough chances.

 

Good chapter name for this thread.

What I don't get about this is that I'm sure there are many times in the text where no ones wearing the bracelet and Moggy is off doing chores or something. Shouldn't she be on the ground retching the second one of them takes it off if she's more than a dozen paces away?

Have you ever been in an argument with a woman that ended with her saying "Fine, do what you want."?

I hope for your sake you didn't take her literally.

"Very well" is hardly what I'd call call a statement of intent to have a reasonable discussion with an open mind. I'm not saying she isn't, just that all that statement says is she's going to have a discussion, not that she intends to listen to reason.

I'm not an Egwene hater. Sometimes I like her and sometimes I don't. She was mildley annoying in EotW, was much improved in TGH. She was a right little b!#ch in TDR contradicting Nynaeve at every turn for no good reason, at least she got a good slapping for it. I enjoyed her time with the Wise Ones. Except the bits where she felt the need to call Rand an arogant woolhead whenever she saw him. Even though she never actually bothered to sit down and have a discussion with him about what he was going through.

Her time with the rebels was all a bit meh for me. The whole arc was one of the more boring in the series, but I can't recall anything that pissed me off wildley. Though I'm only on aCoS in my reread, so haven't read most of it since the books were released. I may have a different opinion in a couple of weeks.

I really enjoyed her as a captive in the tower, some of her best moments in my opinion. She took a turn for the worse as Amyrlin of the Tower. She comes across as arrogant and bossy. Which I guess is to be expected when you're the ruler of one of the most powerful organisations in the world. Siuan was the same, but she had the experience and mystique to back it up. I think it doesn't quite gel with me with Egwene because I know she was a wide eyed village girl only a couple of years ago.

Work together? Discuss?

Have you people been reading the same series as me?

Wasn't Suian deposed because of the fabricated accusation that she orchestrated Mazrim Taim's escape? I didn't think it had anything to do with Rand (at least not publicly).

 

Not according to the Wheel of Time wiki, the dispute was specifically about Suian letting a man who she knows can channel go when she met him in, I think it was Fal Dara, never mind that he was the Dragon Reborn. And because he is the DR, Elaida argues that that made it even more imperative that he be taken in. I wish I had copies of those earlier books to look it up.

I was think of this, which is in Chapter 47 of tSR when Min is rescuing them.

Siuan' date=' the charges against you claim you and Leane arranged Mazrim Taim's escape. Logain got away during the fighting, and they've blamed that on you too...[/quote']

 

I've no doubt Elaida's motive (aside from being a power hungry lunatic) was to do with the Dragon Reborn. I'm just not sure that was the official charge.

 

Bloody Aes Sedai are so secretive they don't even tell you what you've been charged with when they're deposing and stilling you.

When you're throwing around words like "murder," then what the law says about it is absolutely relevant. If the law says it's murder, it's murder. If the law says it's not murder, it's not murder. Now, if the question is whether Gawyn should feel guilty and lose sleep at night for having killed Hammar and Coulin, then of course he should, and I believe the books portray that he does. But he was personally, politically and professionally justified in having done it; that he could have been perhaps equally personally justified in not having done it is irrelevant. Was it the right thing to do? Well, it helped lead to the Tower split, and ultimately to Egwene as Amryllin. That's better than either Elaida or Suian continuing as Amryllin, and considering the other choices of Aes Sedai we have to possibly be the Amryllin, probably the best possible outcome, which doesn't say much for the Aes Sedai. If Hammar and Coulin and their allies had succeeded in rescuing Suian and Leane, they would have had little reason to choose other leaders, even if Suian and co. left Tar Valon to organize opposition elsewhere.

 

What I never understood about that whole rebellion thing was how Suian's supposed infractions were severe enough to warrant stilling and execution. Removal from office I can understand. She hid her knowledge of the identity of the Dragon Reborn and allowed him to walk free when she had him in her grasp. I'm sure the Hall was livid with her, and rightly so, but she didn't betray the Tower or any of the Sisters in it. She took a discretionary act that was arguably within her authority to make. This was a mere political disagreement, and the consequences of losing that argument should never have included stilling and execution. There wasn't even a trial, just a clandestine meeting of the Hall to pull her down. Still, none of this justifies Hammar and Coulin trying to rescue the former Amryllin and her Keeper through use of force, instead of taking their concerns to Sisters or through the Hall.

Wasn't Suian deposed because of the fabricated accusation that she orchestrated Mazrim Taim's escape? I didn't think it had anything to do with Rand (at least not publicly).