[Advanced]Lost mafia - Game over - Sili, SK wins!

[Eldrick4221]

 

 

I think Kivam might have been killed because of his claim. Zander is the kill I don't understand.

Can you explain?

 

I think with Hallia flipping her role that Kivam is basically cleared going into D2.

 

I don't follow this at all.

 

How does Hally flipping VT make Kivam also VT?

 

As I said before to Besie, it's the easiest friggin role to fake claim. Just because Hally was telling the truth, doesn't mean Kivam was.

 

He was, but that's a silly reason to think he got killed for it.

[Lenlo]

 

 

Turin is being really TMI this whole game and his tone/back tracking comments are doing him much. Nobody has gotten an answer from him on why he thinks their is an SK. This setup is closed and mostly seen VT flips. I'm not sure on much except that Turin is being super scummy. 

 

Darthe is super null to me and doesn't really sit well with him saying little and not voting. I want him to answer these questions.

 

1. What are your top scum?
2. What do you think about besie compared with her other games? 

 

Lenlo is mostly giving complete BS for me being scum. I don't really understand it when it's basically my usual play.

Do you even know what im saying in why I find you wolfy?

 

How bout you answer those questions, since youve done just as little as Darthe? Less actually.

 

How have I done little when I have less time to be in the thread? My top scum are in that post, you have me wavering a bit. Besie I think is slight town based purely on her tone.

 

Youve done little by not being in the thread...? You just said it?

 

So your top wolves are Me, Darthe and Turin? Thats your wolf team?

[Eldrick4221]

Ok. I looked over Penny's ISO. Not seeing why people are scumreading her, but then again nothing screams town either.

 

She had some questions that IIRC went unanswered, and she never pursued them.

 

 

who thought Kivam was lying about his claim?

 

Why did you ask this? What did you get from the responses?

 

Also did people notice Darthe didn't vote

 

I noticed. I didn't care. People not voting is null.

 

 

besie is the new cass

 

vote wolfqueen 

 

 

 

gives nyn a shoulder massage to help her stay zen

Are you really doing policy lynches now?

 

How was this supposed to be a policy lynch?

[Eldrick4221]

Still WTL Darthe. Nothing has made me feel any better about him.

[Turin Turambar]

good morning. catching back up. 

[Turin Turambar]

if mafia killed kiv..... Where is a head desk gif....

 

Turin if you are actually town, The maifa team imo has to be in besie/z2/celeste/darthe/dice 

darthe and dice is who I feel better about in my poe. your eod just sitting on besie really bugged me, when 2 people who had trains were also in your poe. I didn't mind the besie vote, but when It was going no where, why not have your vote matter?

Is the first line you saying that you don't think mafia killed Kiv? So barring other information you are assuming that mafia killed Z 1.0?

 

Obvious TMI

 

 

BTW I'm gonna go thru my catch up and reply to individual posts. Sorry for the stream of posts but I don't wanna make a huge messy post.

[Turin Turambar]

 

OFFICIAL VOTE COUNT:

 

Turin (2) - Darthe, Celeste

Besie (4) - Turin, Lenlo, Sili, seph

Seph (1) - Besie

Celeste (1) - Thane

 

Not voting (4): Dice, Shad, Eldrick, Zander

 

With 12 alive there are 7 to lynch!

 

 

What was the purpose of quoting this??? 

[Turin Turambar]

vote seph

Did you mention seph earlier? this looks a bit out of the blue. 

 

Noting to look at you in this time frame for reference.

[Sili Quirrels]

Turin is being really TMI this whole game and his tone/back tracking comments are doing him much. Nobody has gotten an answer from him on why he thinks their is an SK. This setup is closed and mostly seen VT flips. I'm not sure on much except that Turin is being super scummy. 

 

Darthe is super null to me and doesn't really sit well with him saying little and not voting. I want him to answer these questions.

 

1. What are your top scum?
2. What do you think about besie compared with her other games? 

 

Lenlo is mostly giving complete BS for me being scum. I don't really understand it when it's basically my usual play.

I'm sort of wondering how long it took you to compose this post.

 

Incidentally I get the impression darthe's top scum read is turin, since he's voting him.

[Turin Turambar]

 

Eldrick, to be fair I do assume Z1.0 got killed by mafia. The kiv kill makes more sense as a vig shot. It doesn't fit SK even to me unless the SK thought he was mafia. Or there were some sort of NA shenanigans.

It read to me like you knew they did, when you were asking besie if she was worried about it.

 

Which says to me that you were responsible for one of the kills

 

[V]Turin [/v]

 

Say I was responsible for one of the kills. I'm not but let's just say I was. which one do you think I would be responsible for? What do you think that means for my alignment? 

 

 

BTW, I just saw where Dice said he thought Seph was mafia and a small reason. still gonna look to see if there was more to it before then. 

[Turin Turambar]

that line takes that post from answering her question to insinuating that she knew that in a bad way. the tone of that line is sneering.

 

kinda like but you ALREADY knew that   DIDNT YOU!!!???

Thanks for putting words into my mouth. You are assuming my tone there. maybe I needed to put a winky emoji in there for you. 

[Sili Quirrels]

I mean I'm asking myself how long it took you, Celeste, to compose that post because it's very well formulated and completely in contrast with your style last time. The part about Turin is a c/p of Eldrick's logic although I'm not sure whether it came from him first, and the focus on the SK is weird because all Turin said was that an SK, but you go out of your way to nudge him over it. And unless you think he as SK tmi's that there is an SK what does it even mean?  I don't understand.

 

And the part about you doing what you always do reeks of scum-scusing.

[Sili Quirrels]

Like maybe it isn't scummy when you say stuff like 'but I always do this' day 1 and get exasperated with him as he keeps at you, but no that's not what's happening.  You are very stoic or rational about it.

[Turin Turambar]

 

Can you post for me the case on Turin in full? Ive only caught bits and piece of it. Seen things like people saying hes TMI.

TMI is my full case. It's a big tmi tho. I feel like it's enough.

 

So the fact that I believe that mafia killed Z1.0 which seems to be the consensus point of view is your entire case??? 

 

[Sili Quirrels]

Zander being the nk was my first guess. Kivam didn't make sense just then for scum to kill. He was a day 1 counter-wagon claimed vanilla. If the scum kill him and there's no vigilante who hero shots Zander  it brings a lot of negative attention to Kivam's scumreads which would have been the only justification for killing him therefore it was basically -ev play for scum to make in whatever scenario you can dredge up.

[Turin Turambar]

 

 

 

 

Lol Len

 

I'm leaving it to 50/50. I am for both Hallia and Kivam, so let's see.

Yeah I know. What happened to trusting your town core Bess? I thought 6 voices were better then 1? I thought you were bringing them togther to FIGHT THE RANDOM

Lol Len. I don't see what your problem is, honey. It was an idea that you obviously hated. Only 3 towns actually went for the plan.

 

 

 

... okay 3 people that I hope is town.

 

 

 

 

 

Lol Len

 

I'm leaving it to 50/50. I am for both Hallia and Kivam, so let's see.

Yeah I know. What happened to trusting your town core Bess? I thought 6 voices were better then 1? I thought you were bringing them togther to FIGHT THE RANDOM

Lol Len. I don't see what your problem is, honey. It was an idea that you obviously hated. Only 3 towns actually went for the plan.

After day ended but before hallia flipped.

 

Wanna reconsider???

 

 

 

No not really.

 

Why didnt you quote her follow up.

 

Because it was irrelevant. It was the initial post that is damning. Think back to the Eldrick voting Thane and then Turin back when Eld and Thane were mafia together. That is what it means to slip. Just because she (and he did as well) went back and caught it does not erase the first post. 

[Sili Quirrels]

it's a lot easier to be confident in a train when the subject of the train isn't around to act emotional and confuse me.

[Turin Turambar]

 

 

Okaaaaayyyyy peeps! So everybody's votes were just scattered everywhere.

 

 

OFFICIAL VOTE COUNT:

Eldrick (1) - Shad

Thane (1) - Turin

Seph (2) - Thane, Dice

Hallia (1) - Kivam

Celeste (2) - Lenlo, Nyn

Darthe (1) - Eldrick

Turin (1) - Celeste

Dice (1) - Seph

Kivam (1) - Sili

Not voting (4): Darthe, Hallia, Zander, Besie

With 15 alive there are 8 to lynch!

 

Came up with a plan to find the one (or more) person that at least most people can agree on lynching.

The idea is this: if more than 5 people think a single person is scummy, and thus lynchable, these 5 are (1) not all wolves, they (2) all have their own reasons for thinking as such, and (3) if a scum member was bussing or covering, then they just doomed their own teammate.

Okay, #3 is maybe closer to hopeful thinking and might be what they want. But #1 and #2 is true. And if #2 is true, then that person, by general consensus, is the most scummy.

I'm going to vote that person, because that person is the person that the town, in general (with #1 and #2 in mind) agree on.

On page (p) 41, I asked everyone for at least 3 of their top wtl. This is the outcome:

Besie - p41 - Shad, Hallia, Turin, Darthe

Sili - p41- Seph, Shad,  Kivam

Lenlo - p41 - NO - p42 Seph, Celeste

Celeste - p41 - Turin, Sili

Zander - p42 - Thane, Shad, Kivam, Darthe

Hallia - p44 - Besie, Kivam, Thane, Celeste

Shad - p45 - Hallia, Kivam

Seph - p45,46 - Dice, Hallia, Sili, Kivam, Celeste , Nyn, Turin, Darthe

Dice - p46,47 - Seph, Nyn

Nyn - p48 - Celeste, Darthe, Turin

Turin - p50 - ????, Thane (voted)

Thane - ????

Darthe - ????

Kivam - ????

Eldrick - ????

When each person is then sorted according to how many people is wtl him/her, the list is as follows:

(5) Kivam dead townie

(4) Turin I know I'm town

(4) Celeste: unknown

(4)Darthe: unknown

(3) Shad claimed mason

(3) Hallia dead townie

(3) Seph: unknown

(2) Sili: unknown

(2) Nyn/Z2.0: unknown

(2) Thane claimed mason

(1) Besie: unknown

So, [v]Kivam [/v]

Something that looks odd to me is that with the same number of votes at 4 and 3 the people I have as town (myself and shad) were listed at the top and the people I find as suspects (Celeste, Darthe {New} Seph) were listed under. there may be some innocent reason for this but it looks sketchy to me.

 

found some other funny things in the search but that will wait for the morning. I actually searched on mobile.

 

 

Are you saying Besie looks sketchy cause she tabulated everyone's WTL.....cause unless youre claiming her math is wrong, this is awful.

 

I am NOT saying that her math is wrong. I am saying that she framed the results in a manner to cast more doubt on townies than on people that I have found suspect during the course of the game. Kiv was town. I know I;m town (I understand this is my PoV and you may not be able to see that for whatever reason). Celeste has been a question mark to me. Darthe has been a bit weird but I am sort of waiting to see what happens by end of day.  I am saying that the people I think are townies are getting put nearer the top of the list to make it look like they are worse than the ones below. It is a psychological thing IMO. Start at tht top of the list and work your way down. The pattern repeats going down the list as Shad (claimed mason) and Hallia (dead townie) are both above Seph. 

 

(5) Kivam dead townie 

(4) Turin I know I'm town 

(4) Celeste: unknown

(4)Darthe: unknown

(3) Shad claimed mason 

(3) Hallia dead townie 

(3) Seph: unknown

(2) Sili: unknown

(2) Nyn/Z2.0: unknown

(2) Thane claimed mason 

(1) Besie: unknown

 

also think turin is saying her math is swrong and that's why and yeah that much is sketchy lol.

 

See above.

[Sili Quirrels]

uh, that's what I meant by math was wrong. Sorry that I wasn't actually paying attention because it is actually a weak argument.

[Sili Quirrels]

oops. well not paying attention says it all doesn't it.

 

but anyway that is really weak and 100% confirmation bias.

[Turin Turambar]

 

ok so where im at   I think seph is scum. his train went nowhere  there was a post at beginning of day that was weird to me and now he has largely disappeared

 

Turin is causing me concern. the SK comment then theres things like the below   he twists things to put a negative slant on them 

 

masons can also have other abilities. It is fairly rare however.

 

Mafia are frequently loathe to shoot masons that claim early because:

1. It confirms the remaining mason. In effect converting them to innocent child.

 

2. It uses up shots that can be used to cop/doc hunt.

 

But you already knew that.

 

I generally haven't felt like Turin has been twisting things--Besie's said a lot of stuff that's made me do a double take, and a lot of what he's called out are things that struck me too, though I didn't necessarily draw the same conclusions.  But the "But you already knew that" line in the post you quoted does stand out to me as a bit out of character for him.  Interesting.

 

I don't remember him ever taking up that attitude when pushing scum!me, at any rate.

 

I'm not twisting so that part is right. I do barb and bait some when I think I am right and have a baddie in my sights. 

 

 

It does make sense if she thinks she can talk her way out of the heat it will generate.

Seems to me she can't be bothered.

 

Seems to me Zander is doing it for her.

 

^^^This. My name is Turin and I am a serial defender. 

you Ithi

[Turin Turambar]

uh, that's what I meant by math was wrong. Sorry that I wasn't actually paying attention because it is actually a weak argument.

I can see how it is more of an issue to me because I now my alignment so it looks like a pattern to me.  

 

Fair enough. 

[Sili Quirrels]

i had an idea. if besie is town and she went out of her way to try and be useful even though she doesn't know how to town when she made that list, then why didn't that come across in all her subsequent posts?

[Sili Quirrels]

 

uh, that's what I meant by math was wrong. Sorry that I wasn't actually paying attention because it is actually a weak argument.

I can see how it is more of an issue to me because I now my alignment so it looks like a pattern to me.  

 

Fair enough. 

 

 

 

It fits snuggly with your reads so I understand why town you would jump to conclusions.

[Turin Turambar]

 

See that doesnt read like TMI to me, that reads like he is accusing her of BEING mafia.

 

Like, the reason she is troubled is because her kill is now subbed back into the game. Thats what I got when I first read that post back then.

I see the accusation. I also see the assumption that Zander was the mafia kill.

 

He's talked about why he thinks Kivam wasn't (that kivam was vig or possibly sk) but I'm not ruling it out that Kivam was killed my mafia, and don't like that he is.

 

Eldrick, did you just slip again???

 

How about this for funny. You are pushing my assumption as TMI because YOU are mafia and you KNOW that your team did kill Kiv but you know that I shouldn't know that.  This is fun isn't it???