[BASIC/STANDARD] Warcraft: War of the Ancients Mafia - GAME OVER, MAFIA WINS

[alannalynn]

Somebody come talk to me

[alannalynn]

Anybody?

[alannalynn]

Please?

[Celeste]

I'm here now. Going to read Cass scum game.

[Nolder]

 

Why am I being asked about things that I've already gone over more than once?

 

It can't be Nomi/Cass if it is Shad/Celeste. 

I changed my mind at the start of D2.

I legit don't like going back into your ISO over and over again to see where you talk about things. It's also difficult for mobile users, fyi

 

That makes two of us.

[Nolder]

Trying to dig up what Nolder has said about Shad...

 

 

Link

 

Shad - Shad is kind of in the same boat as Xander. I have a lot of contradictory notes and don't know what to do with him yet. He started out bad in posts #15/16. I thought it was weird to mention the players he didn't have meta on right at the start like he was setting up mislynches early. In post #617 he gave a reads list and I thought it was weird he had Csarmi at the top of it. He said he explained why but I never found the explanation. I liked his question to Turin in post #717. Then he started the whole Wish/Celeste thing. In post #788 he says Celeste is town and Wish could be either but is probably town. Post #799 stood out to me because he says he's basing his read on Celeste based on Wish's behavior. I think that stuff is ok later in the game but it seems really early not to judge people on their own merits. In post #1103 he said he was getting good vibes from me which I found a little strange and out of nowhere but it's not necessarily a bad thing. So Shad I don't know what to do with.

 

LINK

 

Slots I NEED to resolve on D2: Shad, Xander, Kaylee, Turin.

 

That's my goal anyway.

 

LINK

 

LINK

 

Shad

#15/16 - Weird to mention all the players you do and don't have meta on right at the start. Like you're setting up excuses for mislynches on townies maybe. (-1)

#429 - Points for question. (+1.5)

#617 - Gives reads list. Weird that he has Csarmi at the top. Says he explained it but may have missed the explanation. (0)

#717 - Good questions posed to Turin. (+1)

#788 - Says Celeste is probably town. Says Wish could be either town or scum but probably town. (0)

#799 - Basing his read on Celeste off how Wish acts. This doesn't bother me later in the game when connections are being made but it seems very early to me to draw these kinds of conclusions. (-0.5)

#1103 - Says he's getting good vibes from me. (0)

 

LINK

LINK

 

LINK

 

Taking a break from Shad ISO, might not finish it until later tonight.

I have some cleaning I need to do and maybe laundry.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Gun to head I'm going to say Pral is town.

I wish there was more content to work with but sometimes gotta make tough call.

 

Ok who's next?

Shad how about you. Ok let's go.

Ok.

 

Talk to me.  What are your concerns?

 

 

Let's start here and hopefully I'll have more for you tomorrow night.

 

#15/16 - Weird to mention all the players you do and don't have meta on right at the start. Like you're setting up excuses for mislynches on townies maybe. (-1)

 

#617 - Gives reads list. Weird that he has Csarmi at the top. Says he explained it but may have missed the explanation. (0)

 

#799 - Basing his read on Celeste off how Wish acts. This doesn't bother me later in the game when connections are being made but it seems very early to me to draw these kinds of conclusions. (-0.5)

 

These are your old notes iirc.  Have you advanced on any of these thoughts so far?

 

Blue -- I named you, Lenlo, Laine, Zander as the people I think I can read well.  What has my approach to these four people done to strengthen or lessen your concern?

 

Green -- It was definitely a bad reason, as things panned out, but I explained it again later.  I don't know if I explicitly stated "this was my original reason" or if I just reiterated the reason, but did anything about my treatment of csarmi towards the end of D1 ping you?

 

Red -- I am still basing a lot of my Celeste read on the same principle.  What are your thoughts on Wish/Celeste interaction?

 

No. I cancelled my note taking at the start of the day. It was taking up too much of my time.

 

1) You're not addressing my concern you're just stating a fact and then asking me a question. Deflection?

 

2) Towards the end? Not that I recall. I was more focused on Nomi than you though.

 

3) This doesn't address my concern with you basing your read on Celeste off Wish so early in the game. I've already stated I think it's weird how Wish and Celeste link themselves every game but I guess that's their thing. Don't think it's alignment indicative. 

 

 

 

Link: "think final scum Shad and Celeste"

Link: Says Shad was deflecting (quoted longer exchange)

Link: "So I'm not going to waste my time arguing and casing and whatnot when there's still a chance you could be town.:

Some yelling about Shad reads at start of game

Link ~stuff

 

 

I literally hate that I had to do this and Nolder couldn't just simply lay out his case on Shad if he's still calling him scum. It's like what Zander used to do with his reads and tell people to go back in his ISO and find it themselves

 

From what I can tell:

1. Nolder believes Shad was trying to set up mislynches by mentioning who he reads well at the start of d1

2. Nolder doesn't like that Csarmi was at the top of Shad's list early. (didn't Nolder do the same thing? I'm pretty sure he refused to vote Csarmi at EOD1)

3. Nolder does not like that Shad was reading Wish/Celeste interactions based on how they acted in relation to each other? (I think I"m getting this one wrong)

4. Nolder doesn't like that Shad is town reading Nolder

5. Nolder believes that Shad was deflecting his questions and then Nolder refused to ask his questions differently when Shad requested but still blamed it on Shad that he didn't answer his questions how he wanted.

 

Someone please correct me if I'm wrong.

You're not going to find my entire case on Shad in thread.

I haven't presented it yet. You'll find only the beginnings.

[alannalynn]

 

 

Why am I being asked about things that I've already gone over more than once?

 

It can't be Nomi/Cass if it is Shad/Celeste. 

I changed my mind at the start of D2.

I legit don't like going back into your ISO over and over again to see where you talk about things. It's also difficult for mobile users, fyi

 

That makes two of us.

 

^ This lead me to believe I would see WHY it's Pizza/Cass or Shad/Celeste in your ISO. Granted, I looked primarily at the Shad side, but when you say "why am i being asked about things I've gone over more than once" I assumed I'd see the Shad/Celeste connection or at least see why you're suspicious of Shad in relation to Celeste and when you changed your mind at the start of d2, but I'm not sure I found that in your ISO. So I'm left a bit confused and frustrated, yet again.

[alannalynn]

I'm so tired of waiting for things I'll never see. I'm going to grow old and die before I see a case on Shad and that disappoints me.

[Nolder]

Also

 

1) Changed my mind on this.

2) You tell me if you think there's a difference between like page 3 and page 100.

3) I don't like that he was reading Celeste in relation to Wish. It would be like townreading you based on how Cass acts. Think about it.

4) I don't have a problem with this per sey but I did ask if he ever explained why because I hadn't asked earlier.

5) I re asked my questions twice. I think he was screwing with me so I stopped wasting my time.

[alannalynn]

Also

 

1) Changed my mind on this.

2) You tell me if you think there's a difference between like page 3 and page 100.

3) I don't like that he was reading Celeste in relation to Wish. It would be like townreading you based on how Cass acts. Think about it.

4) I don't have a problem with this per sey but I did ask if he ever explained why because I hadn't asked earlier.

5) I re asked my questions twice. I think he was screwing with me so I stopped wasting my time.

1. I'm okay with this.

 

2. Not much, but I was liking Csarmi's catchup at that point too, does that make me scum that I wasn't even positive about Csarmi being mafia until Pizza pushed it and he flipped? Well... no. Probably not.

 

3. Celeste/Wish. Alanna/Zander. Zander and I always town read each other to 100%. It works when we're the same alignment. Town/Town, Wolf/Wolf. We can do that. Are you saying that there's no merit in using those types of interactions to judge the alignment of someone? I noticed something was off with Zander. Shad noticed our interactions were off. Would he be doing that if he were wolf with Zander and Zander was trying to pocket me/make everything seem normal?

--> Another example: do you try to read Verbal/Leelou based on their interactions with each other? (the answer is yes lol)

--> Another, RL example: I have a best friend. Would you trust ME to read my BFF better or Bob off the street to read my BFF?

So, I really don't see any problem with this at all.

 

4. Meh.

 

5. I think Shad was being reasonable. From what I read, he was asking questions back to get a better understanding of what you wanted to know. Miscommunication problem, imo

[Celeste]

I see an immediate difference between Cass already. She wasn't around trying to get her thoughts while being protected by her teammates that game. I think this is her town game.

[alannalynn]

I see an immediate difference between Cass already. She wasn't around trying to get her thoughts while being protected by her teammates that game. I think this is her town game.

Take into account that was in May and she has Cory mentoring her? Do you have any recent scum games? I literally haven't played ANY game with her since that one

[Celeste]

 

I see an immediate difference between Cass already. She wasn't around trying to get her thoughts while being protected by her teammates that game. I think this is her town game.

Take into account that was in May and she has Cory mentoring her? Do you have any recent scum games? I literally haven't played ANY game with her since that one

 

Any recent scum games of my own?

[Nolder]

I have to grudgingly admit that Nomi has been on the right track so far.

I am stubborn so I'm not clearing him but I'll put his lynch on low priority today.

As a matter of fact right now I'm not interested in lynching anyone.

I badly need more people in my village so that's my goal for today and if I manage to resolve the slots then I'll figure out how I feel about the rest of the players.

 

 

I have to grudgingly admit that Nomi has been on the right track so far.

I am stubborn so I'm not clearing him but I'll put his lynch on low priority today.

As a matter of fact right now I'm not interested in lynching anyone.

I badly need more people in my village so that's my goal for today and if I manage to resolve the slots then I'll figure out how I feel about the rest of the players.

wtf

 

Well what do you want?

I don't like being that wrong when I was so sure I was right.

He could still be scum. It's possible.

Just leave me to nurse a bit of my wounded pride ok.

If he's not on my chopping block then it doesn't really matter does it?

 

 

 

Well first of all let's start at the beginning because if you don't have a good foundation the whole thing falls apart anyway.

This is all based on the assumption that Csarmi and Xander are wolves together.

I'm not necessarily opposed to that idea since I don't have Xander in my town pile yet and a couple people were saying he's off his town meta but I'd still like to see you make the case for Xander and Csarmi being connected before I take the rest of that too seriously. 

 

If I can't buy that Xander/Csarmi are w/w the rest of it doesn't matter you know?

Well, apparently the vig bought that Zander/csarmi are w/w. 

 

What's the rest?

 

Nolder, what do you read Kaylee as atm? What about Pizza? What about Cass? Lenlo? Pralaya?

 

1) There is no rest. I never bothered to go that far because it would have been a waste of my time if you couldn't convince me of Xander's connection to Csarmi in the first place. It was your job to prove the case not my job to prove you wrong.

 

2) Kaylee light green. Been that way most of the game. If there's a deep wolf I think she's my girl.

3) IDK I was very convinced he's scum but he's said and done some very unscummy things towards EOD1 and during N1. I want him to be scum but he probably isn't. I refuse to discount it yet but I'm not putting his head on the block.

4) Cass is in kind of a similar place except instead of seeming scummy and then doing townie things I feel like she just hasn't done enough to show her scumminess yet. Maybe I'm just wrong here idk.

5) 100% Town.

6) IDK need to ISO.

 

My goal today is not to catch scum.

My goal is to add more townies to my village and lynch from whoever's not in it.

 

 

Nolder, WTL? Reads?

I think the final scum are Shad and Celeste.

 

 

You changed your mind.  So you no longer consider the particular action in question scummy, no?

 

Restate the question.  I have no idea what it is that I didn't answer.

 

If you think I am scum, why would you want to wait until D4 to discuss it?

I do, but for different reasons now.

 

Because there's no chance in hell of getting you lynched before D4 anyway.

Also the possibility I could be wrong. I was wrong about Csarmi and I could be wrong about Pral.

(Not to mention Nomi and Cass...)

 

So I'm not going to waste my time arguing and casing and whatnot when there's still a chance you could be town.

 

[alannalynn]

 

 

I see an immediate difference between Cass already. She wasn't around trying to get her thoughts while being protected by her teammates that game. I think this is her town game.

Take into account that was in May and she has Cory mentoring her? Do you have any recent scum games? I literally haven't played ANY game with her since that one

 

Any recent scum games of my own?

 

Of Cass. Yours too if you have it and I'm up to looking. I know you linked them earlier probably but I'm in no mood to dig through ISOs for one link

[Celeste]

 

 

 

I see an immediate difference between Cass already. She wasn't around trying to get her thoughts while being protected by her teammates that game. I think this is her town game.

Take into account that was in May and she has Cory mentoring her? Do you have any recent scum games? I literally haven't played ANY game with her since that one

 

Any recent scum games of my own?

 

Of Cass. Yours too if you have it and I'm up to looking. I know you linked them earlier probably but I'm in no mood to dig through ISOs for one link

 

I haven't seen her scum before. As for me I have some links to my scum games. 

 

http://www.mafiauniverse.com/threads/964-The-Office-Mafia-Mashup

 

http://personalitycafe.com/mafia/690722-mafia-xlvii-murder-mansion-town-win.html

[wish-tree]

I'm here, on mobile. Just had cavity fillings done, so slow response time.

[Nolder]

Ok, Alanna, I gotta apologize here.

 

I made...or well I thought I made a post several days ago to Nomi. And Cass but mostly Nomi.

In it I apologized for being wrong about him and explained how I hate admitting I'm wrong which is why I wouldn't take him off my suspect list.

I didn't like how it sounded so I deleted it and wrote it again several times. I thought I gave up and eventually posted it.

I guess I didn't. >_>

 

So you see I was getting frustrated thinking like ok how can they not see the transition I made from Nomi/Cass to Shad/Celeste.

 

But it turns out I never made it. 

 

So uhh...yeah that's my bad.

[wish-tree]

I can go back and read Celeste posts, but I won't be able to multiquote.

[Nolder]

I did collect what posts I could out of my ISO that indicated the switch though.

[wish-tree]

Can you make the post now?

[wish-tree]

Awesome, thanks

[alannalynn]

Ok, Alanna, I gotta apologize here.

 

I made...or well I thought I made a post several days ago to Nomi. And Cass but mostly Nomi.

In it I apologized for being wrong about him and explained how I hate admitting I'm wrong which is why I wouldn't take him off my suspect list.

I didn't like how it sounded so I deleted it and wrote it again several times. I thought I gave up and eventually posted it.

I guess I didn't. >_>

 

So you see I was getting frustrated thinking like ok how can they not see the transition I made from Nomi/Cass to Shad/Celeste.

 

But it turns out I never made it. 

 

So uhh...yeah that's my bad.

*throws hands up in the air and storms out*

[alannalynn]

FFS Nolder. My stress levels. Rising.

[alannalynn]

I literally can't even right now