Ragnarok Game Thread - Game Over, Town Wins!

[Eldrick4221]

Actually I've been thinking. There maybe a way of working out who is Loki. Or whether action get muddled

 

If we know who people targeted, those that has results would be able to see if they actually targeted the person who they said, if it went to someone else, it could mean the original person targeted has some kind of redirect action.

 

Put a little differently (I'm not good explaining things)

 

If A targets B at night, then C gets the results showing that A actually targeted D. Because B had a redirect on them. Who has is likely to have a redirect...Loki.

This idea. It could work, if we all cooperate. Hopefully Mafia won't lie about their results. I don't see why they would. They need to find him too.

 

I said it before, but I will again.

 

N1. Targeted Oci. Got a tracker result.

N2. Targeted Mish. To see if I would still get a similar result. didn't get anything.

N3. Didn't submit a NA. Partially because NA's are all but useless right now. Partially to test a couple theories.

 

Would I still get a result even though I didn't submit an action? Does the shuffle take all players into account, or just the ones that have actions?

Result was I didn't get anything. If I had gotten a result anyway, it would have been something to look into.

[Eldrick4221]

Another idea is to test if Loki is triggered by targeting him. This would be tested by communally controlling who we target, as in all target the same person. I'm pretty sure all the outright harmful abilities (i.e. vig) are gone. I suggest we all target Mish tonight. think it's safe to say she isn't Loki. If our results are still scrambled, we all target someone else. By then we can determine if it's something Loki reflexively does by being targeted or not.

[Eldrick4221]

Another idea is to test if Loki is triggered by targeting him. This would be tested by communally controlling who we target, as in all target the same person. I'm pretty sure all the outright harmful abilities (i.e. vig) are gone. I suggest we all target Mish tonight. think it's safe to say she isn't Loki. If our results are still scrambled, we all target someone else. By then we can determine if it's something Loki reflexively does by being targeted or not.

Everyone please say if you are for or against this idea. I suggest quoting this and adding your name to the list, so we can keep track easily.

 

Eldrick - Yes

[Eldrick4221]

To those of you that still think I'm Loki, would I be helping figure out what he does if I was? I'm doing everything in my power to figure him out, so we can use the slew of NA's we apparently have floating around to wrap this game up nicely.

[Talya]

The problem we have is that no everyone will do this (Mafia no for one...unless they want to do this). So we can't know if the results are true or not.

 

There is no teason why Tina wouldn't get her result back, she has just as much chance of getting it as anyone else

[Eldrick4221]

My problem isn't with her getting results back. It's with her results matching who she targeted. Has this happened to anyone else?

[Eldrick4221]

Tina, I'm going ask you a very simple question.

 

Who is your strongest town read? Who is your strongest mafia read? And which are you more certain of?

I get what you are asking here, but I don't like it. We don't know the NA's are accurate. We don't know the cop results are matched with their intended targets. I wouldn't trust them until loki is gone.

[Eldrick4221]

What I'm suggesting that could be going on, which is why we shouldn't rely on NA's yet.

Player A is a backup cop

Player B is a tracker

Player C is town

Player D is mafia

 

Player A(cop) targets player D(mafia)

Player B(tracker) targets player C(town)

Actions and targets get shuffled and reassigned.

Player E gets the result is player A's action, and player B's target, resulting in "Player D is town", which is wrong, and false clears someone.

 

This is the concept I tried to bring up D2, because tracker doesn't make sense for my character, and my result didn't match who I targeted. This made me think everything is getting jumbled.

[Eldrick4221]

grammar fail

 

"gets the result THAT is"

[michellem]

I'm really horribly sorry for how I've been abscent since D2. My head is in a really bad place and I'm struggling to keep up and sort this. I'll be gone until this evening then I'll catch up.

 

But GOOD NEWS AT LAST today. Today I've applied for permanent disability. I've waited over 2 years to be allowed to apply. I'm so happy and so angsty at the same time!

[Eldrick4221]

Hope things go well for you Mish.

[Lenlo]

I was talking about Eld Talya.

 

I voyr no. It's a silly idea, and seeing as I think you are Loki, I don't wanna follow any ideas of yours for catching him.

 

The fact that I our still Theory crafting about him when we have now way to prove any of it and no info explaining his role continues to bug me. It's like the more you do this stuff to "catch Loki" the more it all seems like a front to me

[Lenlo]

I'm staying on Eld today. Him or Tina are the only two I will accept as lynch for the day.

[Eldrick4221]

That post is riddled with typos and it hurts my brain. I'm not looking for info to explain his role. I'm trying to figure out the dynamics of the game. For all we know it's not tied to his role. It could just be "things are jumbled while he is alive" and has nothing to do with if he's targeted or not.

 

But if we can definitively prove that if we don't target him, things don't go screwy, it's a step in the right direction.

 

If we all target the same person, and things still go weird, it means one of two things.

A) the person we targeted is loki

B) the weirdness is unaffected by loki being a target

 

Doing it twice and comparing the two ensures we are right about what's going on between the 2 options.

 

And if we all target the same person, and the results all come back as being that target, that answers it too.

 

Why are you so against this?

[Eldrick4221]

If we find out that it does indeed only happen when he's targeted, then we can systematically check people one at a time with our collective actions until it goes screwy, and then bam. We got ourselves a loki.

 

If it doesn't matter, and the actions stay messed up, we will be no worse off than what are now.

[Lenlo]

Oh god those typos.

 

I'm very sorry about those, posted it while waiting for the bus to campus

[Lenlo]

Except if we have to all target the same person a couple things happen.

1) mafia don't have to listen as they benefit more from him than we do.

2) it's an assumption/theory made.off.of nothing. Rather similar to what Wishleste did.

3)Checking one person per night is a very slow strategy that isn't worth it imo. Better to spend our days focusing on catching him then the inevitable debates of who to focus our actions on that day.

[Lenlo]

Oh and finally I'm against it cause its your idea and I don't think your town

[Eldrick4221]

Except if we have to all target the same person a couple things happen.

1) mafia don't have to listen as they benefit more from him than we do.

2) it's an assumption/theory made.off.of nothing. Rather similar to what Wishleste did.

3)Checking one person per night is a very slow strategy that isn't worth it imo. Better to spend our days focusing on catching him then the inevitable debates of who to focus our actions on that day.

1)The idea can be put on back burner, until we get rid of the mafia, if that's really an issue. I don't think it is. They need to find him too.

2) It's not. It's using logic to figure out a problem, by experimenting and checking the results. It's a theory with a way to effectively test it. It's nothing compared to wishleste's strung together assumptions trying to cast shade on someone, and I'm hurt you would even compare the two.

3) of course it is, but our actions currently have 0 reliability. I want to fix that. And until they are accurate, it doesn't matter what we do with them. Might as well use them to test sonething.

 

Of course, this could all be wasted effort if JS is loki. But I'm still preparing for him not being.

[Eldrick4221]

Oh and finally I'm against it cause its your idea and I don't think your town

Ok. Say you lynch me, and discover I'm not loki. Would you still dismiss the idea?

[Eldrick4221]

 

Oh and finally I'm against it cause its your idea and I don't think your town

Ok. Say you lynch me, and discover I'm not loki. Would you still dismiss the idea?

Cuz I'm fully prepared for that to happen, but I still wanna catch him, so I'm saying what I can before you take me down, if that is what happens.

[Talya]

That post is riddled with typos and it hurts my brain. I'm not looking for info to explain his role. I'm trying to figure out the dynamics of the game. For all we know it's not tied to his role. It could just be "things are jumbled while he is alive" and has nothing to do with if he's targeted or not.

 

But if we can definitively prove that if we don't target him, things don't go screwy, it's a step in the right direction.

 

If we all target the same person, and things still go weird, it means one of two things.

A) the person we targeted is loki

B) the weirdness is unaffected by loki being a target

 

Doing it twice and comparing the two ensures we are right about what's going on between the 2 options.

 

And if we all target the same person, and the results all come back as being that target, that answers it too.

 

Why are you so against this?

 

 

If we find out that it does indeed only happen when he's targeted, then we can systematically check people one at a time with our collective actions until it goes screwy, and then bam. We got ourselves a loki.

 

If it doesn't matter, and the actions stay messed up, we will be no worse off than what are now.

 

I think Lenlo has suggested why not.

 

We can't trust people doing this. We still may never know what causes the results we get. This would take forever, and I would rather get rid of Loki as soon as possible. I think we could actually solve this game really easily once he is gone.

 

So far it looks like Tina was the only one to get results tonight? Has everyone come back in after night?

 

Eld who is your top town and bottom wolf?

[Talya]

@ Mish - Good for you hun, hope it all works out for you <3

[Eldrick4221]

Top town is mish. Has been for a while now. Tress is a close second

 

Bottom wolf is Tab. I already wasn't impressed with her game, and then really didn't like how she handled her vote on verb

 

BFG is sliding down there with her lack of solving. She had a decent post recently, so that's something. But she's definitely my second pick for scum at this point.

[Lenlo]

If you flip town, I will go back and reconsider all of your arguments with the new knowledge.

 

So yes, I would reconsider the plan. I still think it's rather slow and not worth it. As for scum helping us, why would they? They get more of an advantage from PRs being useless then we do.