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Fate & Free Will - Find me quotes please!


Leatherleaf
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Hey everyone, I am writing an essay that is due on Tuesday about Fate and Free will in Fantasy novels (specifically, it's about Guy Gavriel Kay's Tigana, but I'm referring to other sources as well). I know there are quotes in WOT about the pattern, most people having control except ta'veren having less control, and such. If you don't mind helping me find those quotes, what books they are in, and what pages they are on, that would help me greatly and I would much appreciate it! Thanks for the help!

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It would have helped if you'd given us more than a day.. :biggrin:

 

In WoT, fate and freewill are tied up with the Pattern. There is a lot about that in EotW36. I'll see if I can dig out anything else.

 

http://encyclopaedia-wot.org/books/teotw/ch36.html

 

ETA:

 

TEotW is full of stuff about the Pattern, ta'verenism, and so on. Try:

 

CH10

CH36

CH38

CH42

CH43

CH46

CH47

CH52

 

TGH is also good. Try:

 

CH3

CH5

CH28

CH44

 

Also TDR:

CH2

CH12

CH21

CH33

CH50

 

Use IdealSeek to find others!

 

http://dposey.no-ip.com/IdealSeek/

Edited by FarShainMael
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That IdealSeek is pretty good.

 

Here's Rand and Loial's conversation about the Pattern (TEotW, Chp 36).

 

"Um, yes, well. Not exactly. You see, the Wheel of Time weaves the Pattern of the Ages, and the threads it uses are lives. It is not fixed, the Pattern, not always. If a man tries to change the direction of his life and the Pattern has room for it, the Wheel just weaves on and takes it in. There is always room for small changes, but sometimes the Pattern simply won’t accept a big change, no matter how hard you try. You understand?”

 

Rand nodded. “I could live on the farm or in Emond’s Field, and that would be a small change. If I wanted to be a king, though. . . .” He laughed, and Loial gave a grin that almost split his face in two. His teeth were white, and as broad as chisels.

 

“Yes, that’s it. But sometimes the change chooses you, or the Wheel chooses it for you. And sometimes the Wheel bends a life-thread, or several threads, in such a way that all the surrounding threads are forced to swirl around it, and those force other threads, and those still others, and on and on. That first bending to make the Web, that is ta’veren, and there is nothing you can do to change it, not until the Pattern itself changes. The Web—ta’maral’ailen, it’s called—can last for weeks, or for years. It can take in a town, or even the whole Pattern. Artur Hawkwing was ta’veren. So was Lews Therin Kinslayer, for that matter, I suppose.”

 

 

Yet no one knows the Great Pattern the Wheel weaves, or even the Pattern of an Age. We can only watch, and study, and hope.

-Moiraine, TEotW

 

Sometimes being ta’veren means the Pattern is forced to bend to you, and sometimes it means the Pattern forces you to the needed path. The Web can still be woven many ways, and some of those designs would be disastrous. For you, for the world.

- Moiraine on the nature of being ta'veren, TEotW

 

Just to re-iterate.

 

Loial shook his head. “Whether you hear it or not, it is still true. The Wheel of Time weaves the Pattern of the Age, using the lives of men for thread. And you three are ta’veren, centerpoints of the weaving.”

“No more, Loial.”

“For a time, the Wheel will bend the Pattern around you three, whatever you do. And whatever you do is more likely to be chosen by the Wheel than by you. Ta’veren pull history along behind them and shape the Pattern just by being, but the Wheel weaves ta’veren on a tighter line than other men. Wherever you go and whatever you do, until the Wheel chooses otherwise you will—”

- TGH

 

The Wheel weaves us all into the Pattern as it wills. You have less freedom about it than most, but by the Light, you can still face it on your feet.

- Lan, TGH

 

The Wheel weaves as the Wheel wills, and the Pattern provides what is needful... The Wheel weaves as the Wheel wills, and we are all woven into the Pattern.

- Two oft repeated phrases, these particular ones said by Verin in TGH

 

“The Wheel weaves as the Wheel wills,” Verin said placidly. “With ta’veren, what happens is what was meant to happen. It may be the Pattern demanded these extra days. The Pattern puts everything in its place precisely, and when we try to alter it, especially if ta’veren are involved, the weaving changes to put us back into the Pattern as we were meant to be.”

- Verin, TGH

 

The Pattern doesn’t much care what we want.

- Min, TGH

 

Remember, he is ta’veren, Siuan. He has no more control over his fate than a candle wick has over the flame

- Moiraine, TGH (referring to Rand)

 

 

“He’s ta’veren, my Lady, and you can never tell what will happen around a ta’veren. It’s always . . . interesting . . . when you travel with one of those. Mat has a tendency to find what he needs when he needs it. Sometimes before he knows he needs it.”

She stared at him, but he seemed serious. “He’s tied to the Pattern?” That was how the word would translate. “What is that supposed to mean?”

The old man’s blue eyes widened in astonishment. “You don’t know? But it’s said Artur Hawkwing was the strongest ta’verenanyone had ever seen, perhaps as strong as Rand al’Thor. I’d have thought you of all people would. . . . Well, if you don’t, you don’t.Ta’veren are people the Pattern shapes itself around, people who were spun out by the Pattern itself to maintain the proper course of the weaving, perhaps to correct flaws that were creeping in. One of the Aes Sedai could explain better than I.

- Thom talking to Tuon about Mat, CoT

 

 

 

Here's one about free will. It is taken from near the end of The Gathering Storm where Tam is talking to Rand about why he fights.

 

Tam laid a hand on Rand’s shoulder. “The choice isn’t always about what you do, son, but why you do it. When I was a soldier, there were some men who fought simply for the money. There were others who fought for loyalty—loyalty to their comrades, or to the crown, or to whatever. The soldier who dies for money and the soldier who dies for loyalty are both dead, but there’s adifference between them. One death meant something. The other didn’t.

 

I advise you to read the whole passage and not just this extract.

 

 

 

You get the idea.

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