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[MatBloodyCauthon]

I was looking at drawings online when I stumbled upon this

 

Asmodien - one forsaken with enough identities to make any counterintelligence spy impressed. It's anybody's guess whose side he's really on. Who was his dead wife that died alone while he was out having adventures and travelling the world being the hero? There is enough evidence from what he said to conclude that he is and was Jain Farstrider. But who else was he? Who was his wife? Is it possible that he might also have been Janduin and his wife Shaiel? Is he an ally or an enemy?

 

I was wondering if anyone could give this any merrit?

 

To my knowledge Asmodien died at the end of TFoH. Jain Farstrider doesn't come in until WH I believe under the alias of Noal. But Farstrider did leave Malkier when it was attacked and mentions an ogier stedding that he was at when the attack took place. Somebody warned the ogiers that the dark one was planning an attack on the Eye of the World. This happens 20 yrs before our story begins though. About the same time that Malkier was destroyed. So possibly a name to put to the man who warned against the death of the Eye of the World. But another thing the ogier said that the man who warned them was badly injured on the verge of death.

 

This was also something I found on the same page as before.

 

We know that Janduin met Luc in the Waste - and refused to fight him because Luc looked so much like Janduin's wife, Shaiel. It is believed that Luc killed him. It is likely that Janduin [Farstrider] made his way to the stedding to warn the Ogier about the Eye and they helped him and saved his life. Janduin/Farstrider/Asmodien left the Stedding healed and believing the other Forsaken believed him dead and would leave him alone - until Lanfear finds him and enlists his help. Lanfear has her own reasons for helping Rand - but so does Asmodien.

 

So from what this person is saying they believe that Jandiun, Asmodean, and Farstrider are one and the same person. It makes sense only I don't ever remember reading that Jandiun met Luc in the waste I was under the impression that Jandiun went to the Blight and decimated near enough to a hundred thousand evil things before he was finally killed. So does any of this have merrit or is it just someone who was expressing their opinions before all the info in the story was published.

 

But back on topic we all know that Galad Demandred is Rand Al'Thor's half brother sharing the same mother Tigrain. But Tigrain's brother was Luc so Luc is Galad and Rand's uncle. The way the story is unfolding it would seem that Luc is on the shadow's side. And then there is Lan. When Perrin faces Slayer in TAR he always makes sure that we know how striking a resemblance Slayer has to Lan. Also we know that Lan did have an older brother. So heres my question at this point, why would Lan the younger of the two and only a baby be givin the Sword of Malkier and be named the uncrowned diademed battle king when he has an older brother who is more elligable for the possition.

 

Anyways as we can see we have a couple of major family issues that need to be reconciled what are your thoughts on how that is to be achieved who will do it and where. Also if you have any info on the quotes I posted earlier in the topic would be appreciated.

 

The URL I found them at is - http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_tVHT8hcwrSU/SEnQVZ7TbGI/AAAAAAAAABU/SbT0D1fPWnQ/s400/rand%2B1.jpg&imgrefurl=http://gbookshelf.blogspot.com/2008_06_01_archive.html&usg=__grMBbguhIKH3FN3ButCffv4PXUY=&h=383&w=400&sz=31&hl=en&start=112&zoom=1&tbnid=DnJwJVQyELQ70M:&tbnh=119&tbnw=124&ei=Txl2TvypLJKztweDrum2DA&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dmyrdraal%2Bdrawings%26start%3D105%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DN%26tbm%3Disch&um=1&itbs=1

[Terez]

I was looking at drawings online when I stumbled upon this

 

Asmodien - one forsaken with enough identities to make any counterintelligence spy impressed. It's anybody's guess whose side he's really on. Who was his dead wife that died alone while he was out having adventures and travelling the world being the hero? There is enough evidence from what he said to conclude that he is and was Jain Farstrider. But who else was he? Who was his wife? Is it possible that he might also have been Janduin and his wife Shaiel? Is he an ally or an enemy?

 

I was wondering if anyone could give this any merrit?

No. This person is crazy. You should suggest they follow @TinkerPride on Twitter.

 

But back on topic we all know that Galad Demandred is Rand Al'Thor's half brother sharing the same mother Tigrain. But Tigrain's brother was Luc so Luc is Galad and Rand's uncle. The way the story is unfolding it would seem that Luc is on the shadow's side. And then there is Lan. When Perrin faces Slayer in TAR he always makes sure that we know how striking a resemblance Slayer has to Lan. Also we know that Lan did have an older brother. So heres my question at this point, why would Lan the younger of the two and only a baby be givin the Sword of Malkier and be named the uncrowned diademed battle king when he has an older brother who is more elligable for the possition.

Slayer is a combination of Rand's uncle Luc and Lan's cousin Isam. Agelmar tells a story about the latter at the end of TEOTW, and both are mentioned in the dark prophecy in TGH. Lan doesn't have any brothers.

[MatBloodyCauthon]

Slayer is a combination of Rand's uncle Luc and Lan's cousin Isam. Agelmar tells a story about the latter at the end of TEOTW, and both are mentioned in the dark prophecy in TGH. Lan doesn't have any brothers.

 

Oh my bad lol, I'm at work right now milkin cows didn't have the book on hand as a reference but I knew Lan had some family that was evil. But how could two different people at birth be one during our time period

[Feral]

Erm ok I'm a bit confused about how much you have straight. Slayer is a sort of combination of Isam (connected/related to Lan, can't remember how) and Luc. I don't remember Lan having a brother...

 

And no way is Asomodean/Farstrider/Janduin all the same person.

[Wantanswers]

Just crazy? In my opinion completely insane.

[ironisles]

RJ has stated that Asmo is Tango Uniform. And I quote:

 

This Forsaken is no more. It has ceased to be. It's expired and gone to meet its maker. This is a late Forsaken. It's a stiff. Bereft of life, it rests in peace. If you hadn't nailed it to the perch, it would be pushing up the daisies. It's rung down the curtain and joined the choir invisible. THIS IS AN EX-FORSAKEN.

[Feral]

Just crazy? In my opinion completely insane.

 

I know got to be the weirdest theory I've ever heard. Aside from anything else Asmodean was sealed away when Farstrider had most of his adventures and and Janduin was alive.

[MasterAblar]

It may be crazy, but if it was true, it would definitely make Asmodean the coolest forsaken of all in my opinion.

[Terez]

Just crazy? In my opinion completely insane.

 

I know got to be the weirdest theory I've ever heard. Aside from anything else Asmodean was sealed away when Farstrider had most of his adventures and and Janduin was alive.

There is a guy named Felix/Dida/TinkerPride who believes (or pretends to believe) that Valan Luca is:

 

1) A Tinker.

2) A Hero of the Horn (because he wears a cape).

3) The real Dragon Reborn.

4) Will be the third person at Ghenjei (outdated, I know).

5) Some other stuff, god I can't keep up with it.

 

He also believes (or pretends to believe) that Mat is He Who Comes With the Dawn (forget why), and that he will therefore have a threesome with Tuon and Aviendha. Or something. Rand is just a false Dragon, and Lanfear is not Cyndane.

 

All this because Verin was Black Ajah.

[MatBloodyCauthon]

yea I wasn't saying that it was true only trying to get others opinions on it.

 

How can Luc be Rand's Uncle, and Isam be Lan's cousin, and them be one and the same person I suppose it could happen but people would have noticed a resemblance or something, besides which Luc was Tigraines brother so it's quite physically impossible for them to be connected or the same person. But I see where you guy's are coming from with Lord Luc being in the Two Rivers when Perrin first encounters Slayer in TAR. and how they managed to have a wound in about the same place at the same time. It still doesn't make sense something is off. They are two seperate entities show me Luc and Slayer in the same scene at the same time cuz that is the only way I can see this working out.

[Terez]

Slayer is a combination of Rand's uncle Luc and Lan's cousin Isam. Agelmar tells a story about the latter at the end of TEOTW, and both are mentioned in the dark prophecy in TGH. Lan doesn't have any brothers.

 

Oh my bad lol, I'm at work right now milkin cows didn't have the book on hand as a reference but I knew Lan had some family that was evil. But how could two different people at birth be one during our time period

They weren't one at birth. The dark prophecy says 'Luc went to the Mountains of Dhoom / Isam waited in the high passes. / The hunt is now begun. The Shadow's hounds now course, and kill. / One did live, and one did die, but both are.'

 

Presumably Isam took Luc to Shayol Ghul where something special was done to them. We know that the Dark One has more power at Shayol Ghul and can do all sorts of weird things there, like Mindtrapping folks and whatever it was he did to Padan Fain.

 

That brings us to another example of (sort of) the same thing - Fain and Mordeth. If it had been anyone else stupid enough to escort Mordeth to the walls of Shadar Logoth, then that person would presumably be Mordeth now, but because Fain had been tampered with directly by the Dark One, he is now a strange combination of powers that are more or less polar opposites - the Dark One, and an evil that was specifically designed to combat the Dark One (partially based on things related to the Shadow).

 

Also, Min had a viewing of Rand and Moridin merging, which has been happening for some time now. (It was also foreshadowed in TEOTW 24, whenever you get your hands on a book.) They still have separate bodies, but their personalities are becoming less distinct.

[MatBloodyCauthon]

Slayer is a combination of Rand's uncle Luc and Lan's cousin Isam. Agelmar tells a story about the latter at the end of TEOTW, and both are mentioned in the dark prophecy in TGH. Lan doesn't have any brothers.

 

Oh my bad lol, I'm at work right now milkin cows didn't have the book on hand as a reference but I knew Lan had some family that was evil. But how could two different people at birth be one during our time period

They weren't one at birth. The dark prophecy says 'Luc went to the Mountains of Dhoom / Isam waited in the high passes. / The hunt is now begun. The Shadow's hounds now course, and kill. / One did live, and one did die, but both are.'

 

Presumably Isam took Luc to Shayol Ghul where something special was done to them. We know that the Dark One has more power at Shayol Ghul and can do all sorts of weird things there, like Mindtrapping folks and whatever it was he did to Padan Fain.

 

That brings us to another example of (sort of) the same thing - Fain and Mordeth. If it had been anyone else stupid enough to escort Mordeth to the walls of Shadar Logoth, then that person would presumably be Mordeth now, but because Fain had been tampered with directly by the Dark One, he is now a strange combination of powers that are more or less polar opposites - the Dark One, and an evil that was specifically designed to combat the Dark One (partially based on things related to the Shadow).

 

Also, Min had a viewing of Rand and Moridin merging, which has been happening for some time now. (It was also foreshadowed in TEOTW 24, whenever you get your hands on a book.) They still have separate bodies, but their personalities are becoming less distinct.

 

Okay that has some merrit I could see that. But still why is it Luc in the real world and Slayer in TAR

[Feral]

Just crazy? In my opinion completely insane.

 

I know got to be the weirdest theory I've ever heard. Aside from anything else Asmodean was sealed away when Farstrider had most of his adventures and and Janduin was alive.

There is a guy named Felix/Dida/TinkerPride who believes (or pretends to believe) that Valan Luca is:

 

1) A Tinker.

2) A Hero of the Horn (because he wears a cape).

3) The real Dragon Reborn.

4) Will be the third person at Ghenjei (outdated, I know).

5) Some other stuff, god I can't keep up with it.

 

He also believes (or pretends to believe) that Mat is He Who Comes With the Dawn (forget why), and that he will therefore have a threesome with Tuon and Aviendha. Or something. Rand is just a false Dragon, and Lanfear is not Cyndane.

 

All this because Verin was Black Ajah.

 

Yeah, I still think this one is weirder and less plausible lol. Oh gosh I'd love it if Luca turned out to be a Hero and ends up saving the world somehow.

[Terez]

Okay that has some merrit I could see that. But still why is it Luc in the real world and Slayer in TAR

It's not, necessarily. He can be either Luc or Isam wherever he is, but he can only change when he goes from Tel'aran'rhiod to the real world.

 

RJ's blog 4 October 2005 "ONE MORE TIME"

 

Slayer just chooses who he will be when he steps into or out of Tel’aran’rhiod. The stepping in and out is part of the mechanism for his change. He couldn’t do it in the middle of a street, say, not without the stepping in or out. Which might be a little noticeable, since he would vanish from sight for a perceptible time.

[MatBloodyCauthon]

Okay that has some merrit I could see that. But still why is it Luc in the real world and Slayer in TAR

It's not, necessarily. He can be either Luc or Isam wherever he is, but he can only change when he goes from Tel'aran'rhiod to the real world.

 

RJ's blog 4 October 2005 "ONE MORE TIME"

 

Slayer just chooses who he will be when he steps into or out of Tel’aran’rhiod. The stepping in and out is part of the mechanism for his change. He couldn’t do it in the middle of a street, say, not without the stepping in or out. Which might be a little noticeable, since he would vanish from sight for a perceptible time.

 

Kool thanx... So who do you think will have to face Slayer/Luc at or pre TG it looks like RJ has been setting Perrin up for this from the beginning

[Terez]

Kool thanx... So who do you think will have to face Slayer/Luc at or pre TG it looks like RJ has been setting Perrin up for this from the beginning

Yeah, Perrin seems likely, but I wouldn't discount Lan either. I think that Slayer, being the Dark One's assassin and imbued with the particular powers that he has, was created for one purpose above all others: to target Rand after his death in Tel'aran'rhiod. If Rand dies, and then he goes to the afterlife for heroes of the horn in Tel'aran'rhiod, and Slayer kills him again there, the death is permanent. So you can work Perrin into that, and you can work Lan into it if Lan is dead.

[Wantanswers]

Kool thanx... So who do you think will have to face Slayer/Luc at or pre TG it looks like RJ has been setting Perrin up for this from the beginning

Yeah, Perrin seems likely, but I wouldn't discount Lan either. I think that Slayer, being the Dark One's assassin and imbued with the particular powers that he has, was created for one purpose above all others: to target Rand after his death in Tel'aran'rhiod. If Rand dies, and then he goes to the afterlife for heroes of the horn in Tel'aran'rhiod, and Slayer kills him again there, the death is permanent. So you can work Perrin into that, and you can work Lan into it if Lan is dead.

There is an other option. In ToM Perrin told Galad that he obviously needed him. This could be to defeat Slayer.(Perrin is failed already at least two times.)

1. Is Slayer the Wolf mentioned in the Dark Prophecies?

2. Will Galad break that Wolf? Does that mean that Luc and Isam will be separated?

3. Is Isam the Broken Wolf, the One whom Death has known?

4. Is Luc the Broken Wolf, the One whom Death hasn't known?

5. Are the Midnight Towers the 7 Towers of Malkier?

If all these questions could be answered with yes, then Lan will surely kill Isam.

Lan is the Lord of the 7 Towers, so figurative he is the Midnight Towers.

 

This is not a theory, just a possibility, something to consider.

[Terez]

Going for the double-blood-on-the-rocks-that-doesn't-involve-Rand scenario?

[Wantanswers]

Going for the double-blood-on-the-rocks-that-doesn't-involve-Rand scenario?

I haven't found a good scenario about Rand's dead. There are to many options. I have already eliminated the idea that Moraine will kill him. Alivia will help Rand die. She will not help Moraine to kill him. Furthermore I don't believe in the body-swap theory.

I tend to think that Rand will kill himself with the help of Alivia.

[Terez]

Going for the double-blood-on-the-rocks-that-doesn't-involve-Rand scenario?

I haven't found a good scenario about Rand's dead.

I'm not talking about his death; I'm talking about 'his blood'. Totally different thing.

 

I have already eliminated the idea that Moraine will kill him.

No one cares.

[Wantanswers]

Then I don't understand, what you mean.

[Terez]

Some people think that 'his blood' refers to the blood of someone related to him. (Like Galad, or Luc.)

[Wantanswers]

Just Rand's blood on the rocks of Shayol Gull. My ideas are not always complicated.

But what does this have to do with the death of Isam, it will probably happen in Tarwin's Gap or perhaps in Malkier, not at Shayol Gull.