Rand's Newfound Ability/Power

[coolpool]

i like the idea that rand can now see into souls, like fain can see who are darkfriend.

 

But what i think is that the patern and the wheel likes balence, such as the taveren things when good and bad improbable things happened, and when the pattern is imbalence with shadow, it spins out counter elements (taverens). So if the DO is tilting the balence in his favour, and is allowing chosen (well mordin) to use the TP, isn't it almost the will of the wheel to want the creator to try and bring balence back the the wheel and isn't only logical to asume that if the DO has his own power, that the creator will have his own power, a divine power that can be used to resore balence back to the pattern; (mordin has the TP so to balence it out Rand needs the DP) so i think that the light in rands head is the DV from the creator...

 

i have just always seen the pattern as a balence between good and evil, right and wrong, light and shadow.. and whatever happens there is always an oposite to everything in the pattern to balence to things out..

[Ltsegarra]

I still think thatalot of people are misreading both "The Gathering Storm" and "Towers of Midnight". Rand is stated as having finally understood that the "never was Lews Therin voice in his head" it was attributed to the madness of the taint, during "The Gathering Storm". However, evidence offered during "The Tower of Midnight" suggested by Nynaeve leads us to think that now the Madness Rand is suffering is held in a sort of perfect balance. The description is used twice, first when Nynaeve cures one of the ashman from "seeing" fades. The ashamn understand after the cure that he was just seeing things. However, the extreme effort for the lowly Ashaman, is impossibly difficult for Nynaeve when she tries it on Rand. Much like the wounds in Rands side, the madness defies Nynaeve.

 

That being said, I would like to stress Rand is still "mad" and that there really is no Lews Therin in his head. Rand, however has tapped something Eternal through the madness. May e stretching this, Rand is not only able to influence the pattern but "read" it. That is read the past threads back to Lews Therin and possibly before it. If can Rand can read the pattern this can explain him being able to find dark friends and other anomalies.

 

Or, the whole super Rand episode could just be attributed to "punching up" the story and "artistic" value.

[jemron]

I still think thatalot of people are misreading both "The Gathering Storm" and "Towers of Midnight". Rand is stated as having finally understood that the "never was Lews Therin voice in his head" it was attributed to the madness of the taint, during "The Gathering Storm". However, evidence offered during "The Tower of Midnight" suggested by Nynaeve leads us to think that now the Madness Rand is suffering is held in a sort of perfect balance. The description is used twice, first when Nynaeve cures one of the ashman from "seeing" fades. The ashamn understand after the cure that he was just seeing things. However, the extreme effort for the lowly Ashaman, is impossibly difficult for Nynaeve when she tries it on Rand. Much like the wounds in Rands side, the madness defies Nynaeve.

 

That being said, I would like to stress Rand is still "mad" and that there really is no Lews Therin in his head. Rand, however has tapped something Eternal through the madness. May e stretching this, Rand is not only able to influence the pattern but "read" it. That is read the past threads back to Lews Therin and possibly before it. If can Rand can read the pattern this can explain him being able to find dark friends and other anomalies.

 

Or, the whole super Rand episode could just be attributed to "punching up" the story and "artistic" value.

 

I think you've misread it. Lews Therin was not a "real, other" person, I agree, but the life that Rand had lived as Lews Therin was "seeping into" Rand through memories. The memories that Rand had throughout the series before his integration with Lews Therin were real memories of real experiences that he himself had as Lews Therin in his previous life. The problem is that Rand thought Lews Therin (the voice in his head) was a DIFFERENT soul or individual, and he wasn't, as you said. The voice was Rand's attempt to cope with his stress and madness by putting a name and voice to that ball of memories that were seeping in.

 

After Rand's integration in VoG (TGS) he now has perfect remembrance of his life as Lews Therin, but the voice and "personality" that Rand had "given" to the Lews Therin in his head is now gone because Rand realized he was never "real" in the first place.

[Nooska]

I still think thatalot of people are misreading both "The Gathering Storm" and "Towers of Midnight". Rand is stated as having finally understood that the "never was Lews Therin voice in his head" it was attributed to the madness of the taint, during "The Gathering Storm". However, evidence offered during "The Tower of Midnight" suggested by Nynaeve leads us to think that now the Madness Rand is suffering is held in a sort of perfect balance. The description is used twice, first when Nynaeve cures one of the ashman from "seeing" fades. The ashamn understand after the cure that he was just seeing things. However, the extreme effort for the lowly Ashaman, is impossibly difficult for Nynaeve when she tries it on Rand. Much like the wounds in Rands side, the madness defies Nynaeve.

 

That being said, I would like to stress Rand is still "mad" and that there really is no Lews Therin in his head. Rand, however has tapped something Eternal through the madness. May e stretching this, Rand is not only able to influence the pattern but "read" it. That is read the past threads back to Lews Therin and possibly before it. If can Rand can read the pattern this can explain him being able to find dark friends and other anomalies.

 

Or, the whole super Rand episode could just be attributed to "punching up" the story and "artistic" value.

 

I think you've misread it. Lews Therin was not a "real, other" person, I agree, but the life that Rand had lived as Lews Therin was "seeping into" Rand through memories. The memories that Rand had throughout the series before his integration with Lews Therin were real memories of real experiences that he himself had as Lews Therin in his previous life. The problem is that Rand thought Lews Therin (the voice in his head) was a DIFFERENT soul or individual, and he wasn't, as you said. The voice was Rand's attempt to cope with his stress and madness by putting a name and voice to that ball of memories that were seeping in.After Rand's integration in VoG (TGS) he now has perfect remembrance of his life as Lews Therin, but the voice and "personality" that Rand had "given" to the Lews Therin in his head is now gone because Rand realized he was never "real" in the first place.

The bolded part is very much in dispute. I think everyone agrees that the key is that Rand accepted taht he and LTT were, are , and always will be the same person - that does not preclude more than one conciousness however.

[WTF]

I think that you should re read TSR (book 4) and pay extra atention to after the darkhound atack, try and find this Quote from lanfear

".......stonger, that a man can use..." (im quoting from memory so it may be a bit difrent but thats what i think it is)

it could explain rands Newfound Power

 

Yes there is another Sa Angreal but its unlikely Rand would gain it, throw the old one away to just take a different one, sure not as strong as the choedan kal but its also not mentioned in the prophecy, only Calandor is. Angreal appear to be different, probably because they are weaker but sa angreal appear to need to be larger to be able to give more power, I suppose the same would be for angreal but they are always made bigger than they need to be for their power. Anyway assuming this is what happens a Sa Angreal greater than Calandor would need to be larger than Calandor. Even the rod in the white tower is not small and its not a really strong Sa Angreal Anything near that sort of size would be noticed if Rand had it, he was noted always wearing the sword but not anything else.

After having a look threw the WoT FAQ i found that size doesn’t seem to play a part in the strength of an Angreal, the WoT FAQ doesn’t list size but i know that the ivory figurine that Moiraine has is the length of her hand and is listed as of average strength and the gold ring that Graendal found in Sammael's quarters in Illian is listed as a relatively strong angreal. Also I don’t think that the ivory bracelet is that large ether (but am not sure) but is almost a sa’angreal according to the snake, and that suggest that there is now real difference in how sa’angreal and angreal are made(because it’s Almost a sa’angreal), besides strength. so if the size of an angreal doesn’t affect its strength (much) then it shouldn’t affect the strength of a sa’angreal, although the Choedan Kal don’t appear into fit in this theory, perhaps it is the type of materials that the angreal is made of that affects the strength (different materials can increase the amount of power channelled more than others) and there wasn’t enough high quality materials for the Choedan Kal so they used large amounts low quality materials

[Guest jennalberry79]

After having finished ToM I still feel conflicted a bit on what power it is exactly that Rand is now using.

 

I do not think that what Rand has is a form of the TP. To date, every time that has been used there has been a type of darkness to it. It has always been associated with the DO or his favorite minions.

 

It is not the OP or a variation there of. When Rand met with the Borderland monarchs at Far Madding he commented that they were lucky to deal with the new him because the old him would have hit them with balefire. They doubted it because of the protection of The Guardian. His response:

 

“The Guardian blocks the One Power,” Rand whispered. “The One Power only.” Page 754

 

Up until that line I was leaning towards Rand being more comfortable and accepting of who and what he is and thus gaining a new strength from that. After that line I am now of the belief that it is a new power to counteract the TP that the DO seems to now be handing out. It is the yin to the TP yang. It is the counter balance, a concept that underlies the whole WoT.

[mossman87]

After having finished ToM I still feel conflicted a bit on what power it is exactly that Rand is now using.

 

I do not think that what Rand has is a form of the TP. To date, every time that has been used there has been a type of darkness to it. It has always been associated with the DO or his favorite minions.

 

It is not the OP or a variation there of. When Rand met with the Borderland monarchs at Far Madding he commented that they were lucky to deal with the new him because the old him would have hit them with balefire. They doubted it because of the protection of The Guardian. His response:

 

“The Guardian blocks the One Power,” Rand whispered. “The One Power only.” Page 754

 

Up until that line I was leaning towards Rand being more comfortable and accepting of who and what he is and thus gaining a new strength from that. After that line I am now of the belief that it is a new power to counteract the TP that the DO seems to now be handing out. It is the yin to the TP yang. It is the counter balance, a concept that underlies the whole WoT.

 

I just took that as him saying if they tried that before his moment on Dragonmount he would've balefired them with the TP as he was still Dark Rand.

[johthohar]

Yup. That topic has been beaten to death. He was talking about what he would have done before his epiphany. Not what he could or would do at that point in time. The passage you quoted was a reference to his access to the True Power.