Discussion.

[Roxinos]

In response to a study that concluded that violence in video games desensitizes people towards violence in real life by comparing the reaction people who play violent video games like "Duke Nuken, Carmageddon, Mortal Kombat, and Future Cop" and non-violent video games like "Glider Pro, 3D Pinball, 3D Munch Man and Tetra Madness" towards violence in various forms (those forms all being 3rd party like movies or TV) and it's subsequent rebuttal by a reader of the video game news blog "Joystiq" at www.joystiq.com, a person I know had this to say:

 

"just like slasher films desensitize violence and pornogrpahy desensitizes sex and abuse toward women.

 

nothing new.

 

so?"

 

 

He says that as if it's a proven fact that films "desensitize violence" and pornography "desensitizes sex and abuse toward women." Aside from his misuse of the term "desensitize" in both cases, the former case is not truly proven and the latter case is just ludicrous.

 

My main point is that what do you think about this guy saying "pornogrpahy desensitizes sex and abuse toward women"?

 

All information can be found here: http://roxinos.livejournal.com/110549.html as well as in the links provided therein.

[Twitchy]

*Not saying anything relevant to conversation because it on privy boards and the post was to long to pay attn to*

[Roxinos]

I can't believe I'm about to say this.

 

Don't spam Twitch. If you have nothing relevant to say, then don't say anything at all. Or at least say something witty and humorous so people can at least respond in tune with your post.

[lanfear]

The only problem Ive got with porn is that it makes some stupid guys think that women actually like being treated that way. There should be a warning at the beginning telling these morons that the women are paid to do this and probably have to get off their faces on drugs just to tolerate it, let alone pretend that they like it.

[elmindreda]

i think it does give men degrading image of women and yea i agree i think they should have things like that put on them because normally its like a last resort isnt it

[Roxinos]

I don't know a single guy who's stupid enough to actually believe that anything that goes on in a porno is real in any way. And I'm not just talking about friends, I'm talking about any guy I know.

 

You should really re-evaluate what you think makes those guys treat you that way. If a guy is treating a woman that way, the chances are, it's not because they saw a porno that depicted a man treating a woman that way. It's just their warped belief that they do like it and/or they're caught in the heat of the moment so they don't really pay attention to what they do.

[Roka]

You mean, if I get a job as a pizza delivery guy I wont deliver to hot mommas everytime and get to have sex with them (tip included)??!!!! WTF! They lied to me!!! KILL! *kills*

[Roxinos]

:shock:

 

*dies*

 

Of course they will Roka. That's the one exception. *nods nods*

[Mightelove]

good lord, Roka! If you delivered a pizza anywhere you'd get raped...whether you were delivering to a man or a woman!

 

<.<

>.>

 

 

Anyhoos, porn doesn't help with the way women are looked at. It may not CAUSE the stereotype, but it reinforces it to no end. It even reinforces the body type that most women don't have therefore reinforcing our low opinions of ourselves because we'll never look that way. Even at my skinniest I don't look like a porn star. I'm not tall enough, my legs aren't long enough, my boobs are big enough but they don't stand up straight enough nor are they perfectly proportioned enough, and, unfortunately, my brain is way too big. I, personally, don't care. I am who I am and it's unlikely to ever change. Even as imperfect as I am, I have been asked to be an exotic dancer and to be in adult films, but that's not something I could ever bring myself to do. I respect myself too much to allow strangers to drool all over me or use me as a whack off assistant. Women in pornography are typically cast as insipid, idiotic bozos bent on infedility or on jumping on the first penis that wags in her direction and bouncing around with her eyes closed with her super long fake eyelashes sticking out, her collagen injected lips hanging open, and moronic moans of ecstasy issuing forth from therein while her perfectly fake boobs refuse to so much as jiggle much less bounce. If that's what turns men on, if that's what men look at as sexy, then the rest of us poor schmucks are lost.

 

There's too many men out there that only look at a woman's image and not at what else she has to offer. The pornography industry doesn't assist in changing that. They want that to remain the same so they can continue to make money. So I doubt we'll ever see a porno where the man is turned on by how smart the woman is or what strong character she has or how talented she is in various things other than sex acts.

 

Which means I shall continue to not watch porn.

 

*nodnod*

[Bhaird]

Looks like we know what Rox's future career is heading towards...he'll lead a happy life of a shabby apartment with pizza box furniture as the decore....

 

*tosses a stale slice of pizza at Rox's face*

 

Well, porn was made to entertain, if anyone is stupid enough to take it as fact or real life is just a plain idiot and even with a warning in or on the porno, it wouldn't make much of a difference.

[Roxinos]

Exactly.

 

And Mighte, you're an exception to the rule and not the rule itself. I highly doubt porno is a source of women's inability to change anything about herself, that's just their own problem. Reinforced by the media. Pornography is not mainstream enough to reinforce the perspective women have of themselves.

 

Everytime I hear a woman who complains that she's too fat when she's really beautiful, I feel like killing her because she is fitting herself into the stereotype. And I can't believe I'm about to say this, but if more women were like you Mighte, this world would be a much better place.

 

And I agree with Bhaird.

[Mightelove]

*copies and pastes Rox's last post into the Shadowspawn Blackmail Book of Dhhhoooooooooommmm*

 

:twisted:

 

 

And, Bhaird, it isn't an inability to change. I can change all I want but, without drastic plastic surgery and an extremely distorted self image, I'll never look like a porn star. I'm sure there are plenty of women out there that do use that as an excuse as to why they are the way that they are and why they can't be what they want to be or get what they want or why they are dissatisfied with their lives. There are also plenty of women that realize that porn star women are freaks in the looks departments and want nothing to do with looking like that.

 

Subconsciously or consciously men must like porn stars that look like that otherwise the porn industry would either change or go out of business, eh? I doubt you'll ever see a guy reading the back of a porn movie saying something to the effect of, "Hey, this chick ain't that great looking but she's got a double doctorate and has won a Nobel Prize! WooHoo, get me some lube!!!!"

[Roxinos]

That's true, and untrue at the same time.

 

I mean the part referring to men.

 

Men's reasons for watching porn differs from man to man, just like everything else. While there might be a major portion of men who do find it attractive, that doesn't necessarily mean that they are stupid enough to limit themselves to only those. They see a woman in a porno and they say "Man, she's hot" and it's the unattainable, unnatural hotness that gets a guy off.

 

And then there are the guys who aren't really attracted to the women, but use porn anyway because it helps to have some frame of reference when you're doing the do.

 

There are also the guys who find them hot, and then expect that from the world and are disappointed when they find that there aren't really women out there that look like that. But that's the minority.

 

Oh yes, and as for my last point. Even men who find those women in porn (and by no means is every single woman in porno a plastic surgeons dream job) attractive see the obvious defects. We notice when a woman has a boob job. And we notice when they don't jiggle. And we notice when they're overly loud with their orgasms. The looks though, are what matter. It's really just for a quick fix. And the overly loud orgasms, do help for some guys. And for some guys they're just there for annoyance.

 

Porn is an industry filled with thousands of nooks and crannies that every single person fits into.

 

 

Oh yes, and *steals the Shadowspawn Blackmail Book of Dhhhoooooooooommmm and burns it*.

[bad company]

I agree with what's being said so far, what I find annoying is that people tend to try to label something such as violent video games or music as the cause when they don't take into account the effect of the individual.

I'm not going to lie I like porn as much as the next man, but the situations in them are rediculously obviously staged, extremely unlikely to happen in real life and any idiot who believes otherwise is extremely gullible.

The action of the minority is always used to label the majority and I should know I listen to mostly metal. For example we have the Columbine Massacre which was perpurtrated by two individuals who were likely to mentally unsound and noticably alienated, now they try to pin the blame on the music of Marilyn Manson and other artists of that nature.

This is a bullS.H.I.T view designed to deliberately stain an industry that mainstream tend to dislike due to often satanic arists or anti-pop conformitists. They don't fit into MTV so they must be wrong! Anyone see that flaw.

They didn't take into account the individual actions as individuals but that of Metal etc as a whole as the cause for this terrible incident because it gives them the perfect platform for a campaign against difference.

 

I listen to stuff like this and I don't go shooting up the school and if it was classical music they were listening to would they blame it on that, probably not.

[Mightelove]

'tis ok. I have several zillion copies all stashed away in various and sundry parts of the world.

 

 

I understand what you're saying but I am also giving you the women's point of view. If there was a little bit more diversity in porn it might not be so offensive. Instead porn with fat chicks or porn with ugly chicks is a joke.

 

*shrug*

 

And badco, they've moved on to blaming Columbine on antidepressants. *nodnod*

[Roxinos]

Agreed. Except for the part where you said, "They don't fit into MTV so they must be wrong!" MTV used to be a whole hell of a lot more diverse when it came to the music they played. They've always sucked, true. But only recently have they begun to focus more on the mainstream media and music.

 

Edit: Ah yes, and Mighte. You say that those two niches of porn are a joke, but I'm quite sure that the people who actually support those niches with their fetishes, aren't laughing. People actually do get off on that type of stuff. That's why there is a market for them. That's why they exist. Everything from grandma porn to BBW porn all support a certain group of people. Some larger than others.

[bad company]

MTV used to be diverse, but could you see grindcore metal and other extreme forms of metal on it.

Bands that appear on MTV tend to be the more media friendly bands such as Metallica which is one of my favorite bands up to the their self titled cd the last great Metallica cd. Now it's pop, r'n'b, hip-hop, mostly crap modern rock and rap. It's an unrealistic slice of the music scene that excludes often better technical bands that are produced in the Metal scene.

 

And mighte they do have porn like that but it's not in as wide a circulation as it's tailors to a smaller audience so they can get less for it.

[Roxinos]

As an answer to your question. Yes, you used to be able to see the more hardcore metal. There was an hour or two block occasionally, I don't know if it's still on, called "The Headbanger's Ball". It was just an hour or two of pure metal.

[bad company]

Do you thik that's a fair representation, when you have all the dribble the rest of the time and a short snipet of hardcore metal, that's most likely the reason that kids like mainstream bands such as Simple Plan instead of a more technical, more skilled metal band such as 40 below summer.

 

You can buy cd's called the headbangers ball.

[Roxinos]

I'm not doubting that MTV has always had it's main eye on the mainstream, but you can't blame them. People who love metal are the minority. I for one, think it's trash. Not because I'm more into more mainstream bands (I probably have a few things you've never heard of), but because that's just not my cup of tea. MTV sucks, true, but as a marketing giant, they're good at what they do. They play what they knows sells. And while metal may sell, it is by no means a major seller.

[Mightelove]

That was my point about the porn. To most people it's a joke, badco. I'm sure there are some guys out there that adore fat and/or ugly chicks but that is not the image that is put forth by the industry in most cases.

 

I, personally, wouldn't rely on MTV for music. People that only rely on music television or the radio in order to determine what music they will listen to are missing out on a lot of good music. It's not just TV and radio's fault. People are sheep. They follow whatever they think will make them most acceptable.

[Roxinos]

A third of the world are sheep. A third of the world will go against the current of the mainstream because they have a vendetta against the mainstream.

 

The last third will sit in between and pick and choose between both sides because they know that that's where they will get the best choice. Going against the mainstream is just as bad as flowing with it. Moderation.

 

Edit: Ah yes, and Mighte. When you referred to Bhaird a little bit ago, neither of us have any clue what you're talking about. He never said anything close to what you said.

[Mightelove]

I think it was in reference to him saying that anyone that took anything in porn seriously or as fact was an idiot. Hell, I am not even sure I read what he said right.

 

I need some damn sleep.

 

:evil:

[Roxinos]

Then go to bed, missy Mat's lady. *grins*

[bad company]

I'm in the third of mainstream and metal, I think it's disgusting when a band changes their style to become more media friendly and mainstream. It alienates a faithful fanbase to get a fanbase which they'll get more money but if they do shit get tossed out.

Metallica and Lostprophets are some bands that come to mind, Metallica's self titled was an awesome album not perfect but could listen all the way through, then they bring out Load which had some fantastic songs like Until it sleeps and King Nothing but as an album doenn't work and then Reload which just slips down further and finally the collosal mess of St. Anger. They removed a loyal fanbase for a temporary MTV generation fanbase. And Lostpropphets 2nd album was fantastic but I heard one of their new songs and it sound ordinary and emoish.

 

I think better bands would be able to come out if MTV could improve the equilibrium of mainstream and alternative market and promote a better view of music to the youth instead of oversaturating the market with singer want to be's Rappers and hip-hoppers. This will promote a better view of music and allow them to make a more informed decision on music.

 

Night mighte.