Do the affects of ta'varen wear off with time?

[GrandpaG]

Rand, Mat, and Perrin have come in contact with many, many people in their travels over the past couple of years.  When they are around, strange things happen because of the ta'varen affect.  When the move on, do things go back to normal?  Did all of the people who just had to get married when Rand was in town all get a divorce as soon as he left?  Or is it like a cold virus that takes a while to wear off?  Or is it permanent...once you get ta'varened you are changed for life?  I've thought many times that Elayne and Gawyn might have had much different lives if Rand had never fell off the wall.  Anybody know for sure how long the effects last?

[keith_rogers_irl]

I believe the general Concensus is that "For a time" the pattern will shape itself around them. I don't think the time is specified, just untill the need is fulfilled I suppose.

[Achmed]

I think Ta'veren isn't permaqnent - but its effects are.

 

Some examples...

 

Mat wins a bunch of money, cause he's ta'veren, which makes him lucky.  When he isn't ta'veren any longer he doesn't lose the money does he?  ;)

 

Perrin became Lord of the Two Rivers and took Alliandre's oath because of being Ta'veren.  That won't change.

 

I might be able to clarifya bit more.

 

I mean, just because it was a 1 in a million shot for something to happen doesn't mean that the status quo continuing (i.e. Perrin remaining Lord of the Two Rivers) is also a 1 in a million shot.

[Cadsuane]

Also, people sometimes die because of Rand's random ta'veren effects (like the marriages), and they wouldn't just come back to life. Being ta'veren changes the Pattern, it doesn't just wrinkle it.

[GrandpaG]

After Rand left the village the inn keeper was cleaning up.  It appeared that the marriage rush was over?

[Guest cwestervelt]

It had certainly died down and was starting to settle to normal.  It just took a little time to get all those Rand affected hitched.  There are only so many hours in a day.

[callandor]

i actually think that being ta'veren is permanent untill you die. it would be pretty bogus if it wore off after the last battle.

[Guest cwestervelt]

I believe you can stop being Ta'veren.  In the same way you are not born as a Ta'veren.  When the pattern no longer has need of you, you stop being one.

 

Actions that were triggered by your Ta'verenness will continue through to whatever the outcome would be.  The people that were caught up won't suddenly wake up as if from a dream or anything.

[Charlz Guybon]

Rand, Mat, and Perrin have come in contact with many, many people in their travels over the past couple of years.  When they are around, strange things happen because of the ta'varen affect.  When the move on, do things go back to normal?  Did all of the people who just had to get married when Rand was in town all get a divorce as soon as he left?  Or is it like a cold virus that takes a while to wear off?  Or is it permanent...once you get ta'varened you are changed for life?  I've thought many times that Elayne and Gawyn might have had much different lives if Rand had never fell off the wall.  Anybody know for sure how long the effects last?

 

Everything seems to go back to normal once he leaves. Of course people, stay married or dead and etc, but chance is no longer twisted there.

[Luckers]

Indeed, whilsts the effects remain (people remain dead or married or whatever) the effector fades (people are no longer getting married or dying all willynilly).

 

And yes, RJ did seem to imply that you are only Ta'veren as long as the pattern needs you to be.

[Lune]

They definitely wear off. I don't think it's even a long term effect. Ta'varen are like a kind of catalyst. They raise the chances of improbable things happening and twist things to work in their advantage, but only if they are present. A good example would be the Seafolk bargain(s).

 

Example One: When Rand is present during the beginning of the meeting, the Sea Folk (can't remember which one) finds herself making agreements and is surprised at what she says. Claustrophobia gets the better of him and Rand leaves. The moment he does, the Sea Folk realise they were being 'duped' by Ta'varen and proceed to deliver some bargaining pwnage upon the 'sneaky' AS.

 

Example Two: Same deal, in Ebou Dar. The AS again make use of their Ta'varen advantage by having Mat be involved in the meeting. Again the Sea Folk (Renaile) finds herself agreeing to a bargain before she can stop herself. Only to later declare "I believe I have just made a deal with ta'varen'

[Davram]

No one, not even Artur Hawkwing can be a Taveren forever.

[Guest cwestervelt]

They definitely wear off. I don't think it's even a long term effect. Ta'varen are like a kind of catalyst. They raise the chances of improbable things happening and twist things to work in their advantage, but only if they are present. A good example would be the Seafolk bargain(s).

 

Example One: When Rand is present during the beginning of the meeting, the Sea Folk (can't remember which one) finds herself making agreements and is surprised at what she says. Claustrophobia gets the better of him and Rand leaves. The moment he does, the Sea Folk realise they were being 'duped' by Ta'varen and proceed to deliver some bargaining pwnage upon the 'sneaky' AS.

 

Example Two: Same deal, in Ebou Dar. The AS again make use of their Ta'varen advantage by having Mat be involved in the meeting. Again the Sea Folk (Renaile) finds herself agreeing to a bargain before she can stop herself. Only to later declare "I believe I have just made a deal with ta'varen'

 

You're still siting a natural progression of events Rand set in motion.  Seafolk really hate being second best, especially at bargaining.  Thus the redoubled efforts to attempt to make up some of what they lost.

 

After the deal where Mat was present in Ebou Dar, the deal that was made still held, even with the Ta'veren comment.  The Seafolk might not have been pleased, but they didn't back out of it either.

[Child of Lir]

In TEoTW, when Loial explains to Rand what a "ta'veren" is, he says that the Pattern chooses people out for a time. Therefore, once their role for the Pattern has been played out, we should expect them to cease being "ta'veren".

 

As for the effects... many of the things that happen around the three of them are permanent, e.g. death, whilst others are subject to natural changes. As Loial explains it, a "ta'veren" alters the path of the threads around it - their lives change and then carry on from that new standpoint. After that, anything can happen to those people affected, just as it would have done had they not encountered a "ta'veren".

[GrandpaG]

Remember the "black hole" sucking in all of the dots of light that Min saw?  I think of that as ta'veren in the middle affecting all of the people around them.  Anyone outside the gravitational field would not be affected.  Once the dark hole moved on, the affect would follow it and no longer affect the people who were previously within range.  This would go along with what people have posted above here as far as I can tell?

[Charlz Guybon]

Remember the "black hole" sucking in all of the dots of light that Min saw?  I think of that as ta'veren in the middle affecting all of the people around them.  Anyone outside the gravitational field would not be affected.  Once the dark hole moved on, the affect would follow it and no longer affect the people who were previously within range.  This would go along with what people have posted above here as far as I can tell?

The lights represent the good guys and the Dark represents the Dark One, simple as that.