So... no intelligent opposition... whatsoever...? I'm just gonna have to put up with books upon books of the main characters being awesome? :(

Most of what you see are the main characters having to deal with dumbasses and people who won't fall in line. Sammael does some good damage when Rand and the Aiel fight the Shaido at Cairhien. But, yeah, the good guys get away with plenty.

What book does Ishamael appear again in? I want to read a book where the main characters are actually threatened by someone COMPETENT for once! It's beginning to piss me off how useless the Shadow are

Book 1 - when they meet Balzamon in their dreams, that's really Ish. But, Rand's first battle with him is over the skies of Falme at the end of book 2.

 

I know that's Ishy, and he's by FAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAR my favourite character so far, that's why I said when does he appear AGAIN? Not as Balzy

He only attacks - physically - Rand twice - End of Book 2, where they're both wounded by the other. End of Book 3 - where he's fried by Callandor. After that, we don't see him again until he's Moridin, I believe. He helps Rand out at Shadar Logoth when he's facing Sammael.

What book does Ishamael appear again in? I want to read a book where the main characters are actually threatened by someone COMPETENT for once! It's beginning to piss me off how useless the Shadow are

Book 1 - when they meet Balzamon in their dreams, that's really Ish. But, Rand's first battle with him is over the skies of Falme at the end of book 2.

I guess I'm just bitter that Bel'al is specificallysaid to be intelligent and cunning yet we don't really see it in action. It's a phenomenon called an informed ability. He took control of Tear, sure, but all of the Forsaken appear quite capable of attaining high positions in cities. I thought he specifically stood out above the rest. Guess I was wrong.

 

His ultimate strategy of "Getting Callandor by giving it to Rand then beating him and taking it from him" seemed a bit ill thought out for a supposedly cunning schemer

To be honest, with the exception of Moridin, most of the Forsaken don't seem all that smart (maybe Demandred, too). They just seem like a bunch of powerful egotistical grown kids usually ruled by their crotch and lust to be number one.

Then what was Bel'al's plan? Was his nickname THE NETWEAVER (meaning a patient and cunning schemer) just a bunch of garbage?!

Maybe, you're right. Maybe he put the compulsion in Rand's head to come and get Callandor. But, I thought Be'lal deciding to take Tear as his nation was the plan. He knew Rand would have to come for Callandor sooner or later, to fulfill the prophecies.

He wasn't anywhere near Rand when Rand started dreaming of Callandor. None of the Forsaken knew where he was, aside from maybe Lanfear, and we know Lanfear at the time didn't want Rand dead (the probable outcome of going to Tear) - she wanted him loving her.

 

I always took it to be born of the desperation of needing to know beyond any doubt whether he was in fact the Dragon Reborn.

Could be. I thought it was the Pattern moving him and his inexperience with the Power projected this powerful need of Callandor to other people in the area.

I have a question. Can anyone tell me what the references to fighting in the borderlands, particularly mention in Shinar was all about? I've heard it mentioned a few times post TGH in rereads about trouble in Shinar starting and mentions of lords riding against others, but it wasn't in reference to Taim and his stirring up the Saldeans. I've always meant to ask but keep forgetting. The only thing I can think of was maybe men didn't want to believe the Dragon had been reborn, but that seems just a little bit off. I never encountered an obvious reason for it.

I'm up to book 7 in my reread and don't remember an specific explanation being given. The only thing said is that the blight is quiet and maybe that's lead to the internal strife.

If I'm tough or crafty enough, I can have my cake and eat yours, too.

http://www.bbc.co.uk...cake_page.shtml

 

 

 

.........what was that about the inter-book void.......

I actually love this kind of stuff - sayings and traditions, where they come from and how they change. It's actually another reason why I like RJ's work. When I first read how the Aiel got around the whole never touching a sword thing - taking it literally - i thought it was absolutely brilliant, and so true to what people do.

You can look it up on wiki. For some reason, my work computer won't allow me to paste it here, but the answer is there - or an answer is there. It is wiki.

With the admition of guilt from a certain brown, and her ability to freely use compulsion, is not everyone's actions (that she has been in contact with) speculate, from the beginning?

 

Everyone has the ability to freely use compulsion. If they've the knowledge, skill and inclination, of course, and therein is your overall answer. You can speculate about anyone, and all it will bring you is nothing.

An interesting little aside - rereading book 7 - Lan comes to his new AS. She tells him to come to her and he doesn't. She compels him through the bond but says that she needed to do it with a light touch or he might realize it. I wonder how often the AS do that with their warders. Reading the books as a kid, I thought being a warder would be cool. Realizing that the bonding is not totally benign now, I think I'd pass.

 

And are you aware that Aes Sedai can drain the strength of their gaiden to sustain their own strength... up to and including taking it all--i.e. killing the gaiden.

I knew they could use their strength, didn't realize that they could take it all and kill them. Seems like a raw deal to me.

With the admition of guilt from a certain brown, and her ability to freely use compulsion, is not everyone's actions (that she has been in contact with) speculate, from the beginning?

 

Everyone has the ability to freely use compulsion. If they've the knowledge, skill and inclination, of course, and therein is your overall answer. You can speculate about anyone, and all it will bring you is nothing.

An interesting little aside - rereading book 7 - Lan comes to his new AS. She tells him to come to her and he doesn't. She compels him through the bond but says that she needed to do it with a light touch or he might realize it. I wonder how often the AS do that with their warders. Reading the books as a kid, I thought being a warder would be cool. Realizing that the bonding is not totally benign now, I think I'd pass.

I thought BS said there is a section in Hinderstrap that was written by Rj and he found it amusing that anyone points to it and says it is him just adding filler?

Nope, no quote like that. Hinderstrap and all of its zombie b-movie kitsch was 100% BS.

I take Sanderson would add only add things that the notes would allow. So, some portion of the scene/scenes would be from Robert Jordan.

 

can A bond B if B has bonded A?

There were past threads that speculated about this. As far as I am aware, neither author told one way or the other.

It would be interesting. And, if it is a possibility, I think the benefits far outweigh the detriments for both parties. Thanks for the answer, man.

can A bond B if B has bonded A?

Yeah, definitely.

Well, we saw Shaidar Haran do it with Moghedien, so we know it can be done. We don't know why he asked her to close her eyes; I doubt it's necessary for the mechanics, though, so horses not closing their eyes is absolutely irrelevant. More likely he didn't want her to see what he was doing.

this.

 

EDIT: I doubt fades would do it for a bunch of trollocs, though. So however the Trollocs got to Two Rivers, thats how the horses got their too.

I thought they were pretty certain they used the Ways. At least, that's what they guessed at some point later.

How long did it take Rand to answer Tam when questioned on what had spooked him? More than seconds is my guess. How far can a silent galloping horse travel in say 20 seconds to a minute (at a guess)? Especially when the viewer doesn't expect a disappearance act. Bare branched trees still provide cover. The Aiel can find cover in any landscape, a fold of land you wouldn't think a cat could hide in. Fades are certainly sneakier in my opinion.

It was maybe 30 seconds is my guess. There's no way to know. But, the writing gives the feeling that it was an unnatural act, from what I remember.

If I remember right, he saw it, looked away, look back, it was gone and so was its horse.

That's true but we never hear of a Fade horse slipping through shadows either. We only ever see Fades themselves do this.

 

Just wanted to add, we've even seen a Fade transport a human this way: Moghedien was hauled through the shadows by Shaidar Haran in ACOS. He ordered her to keep her eyes closed while he was doing it, for whatever reason.

 

In that scene Shadar Haran runs Moghedien at speed towards the presumed shadow near the wall of her cell. That indicates to me that a bit of momentum is required to "pass through". How does a Fade get a horse to run with it's eyes closed? I think that transporting others that way may be a talent of Shadar's but I also think we'll never find out.

 

Edited to add: my thoughts are that horseman Fades have to cross the land in a regular fashion (which includes the Ways and Portal Stones) and that they can only shadow slide on their own. Excepting Shadar Haran Super-Fade of course.

Maybe horses don't have to close their eyes, unlike humans.

This could open up new possibilities for how food and logistics are dealt with in the Blight. It takes some degree of sophistication to breed,raise, and feed warhorses. No way that raids into the Borderlands would provide enough horses to mount thousands and thousands of Fades.

 

To K.I.S.S., I'll just chalk this up as a bookism. Horses and fantasy go together like swords and fantasy. The bad guys need a set of wheels to get around also.

 

I think at one point, when we are at Shayol Ghul, we see that there are some shadow forgers that make the Fades' swords using souls. It seems reasonable that these forgers also can tame horses.

Either book 5 or 6 - you're right. Demandred is called to Shayol Ghul and witnesses some Borderlanders being taken to the forge. The last thing the forgers do to the swords is take a life with them.

 

Nope. Well, yes, but the forgers are mindless constructs who can't venture far from their caves and who's only purpose is to make those weapons.

Yeah, that's true. I see, you mean his comment about them also training horses? Right, apparently, they can't do that but maybe they have horse trainer constructs. Who knows?

This could open up new possibilities for how food and logistics are dealt with in the Blight. It takes some degree of sophistication to breed,raise, and feed warhorses. No way that raids into the Borderlands would provide enough horses to mount thousands and thousands of Fades.

 

To K.I.S.S., I'll just chalk this up as a bookism. Horses and fantasy go together like swords and fantasy. The bad guys need a set of wheels to get around also.

 

I think at one point, when we are at Shayol Ghul, we see that there are some shadow forgers that make the Fades' swords using souls. It seems reasonable that these forgers also can tame horses.

Either book 5 or 6 - you're right. Demandred is called to Shayol Ghul and witnesses some Borderlanders being taken to the forge. The last thing the forgers do to the swords is take a life with them.

The trollocs and fades stole them from the Rohirrim.

If there was no violence in AOL, pre-bore, then what were the Daishan known for? I mean, what made the Way of the Leaf so special in a world with little or no violence?

There was no war but that doesn't mean there was no violence. Maybe they just policed things very well. There's that scene where Rand walks through the ter'angreal where some man bumps into one of the Aiel and starts telling him to watch where he's walking until he realizes he's Aiel. My take when I read it was of the man being aggressive.

 

Good catch on the man bumping him. The BWB spoke about violence being nearly nonexistent. I just happened to read it last week, and I thought about that at the time, I mean I know nearly nonexistent and nonexistent are two different things, but when there's hardly any violence, having a group dedicated to nonviolence seems like they wouldn't be that special.

 

If there was no violence in AOL, pre-bore, then what were the Daishan known for? I mean, what made the Way of the Leaf so special in a world with little or no violence?

There was no war but that doesn't mean there was no violence. Maybe they just policed things very well. There's that scene where Rand walks through the ter'angreal where some man bumps into one of the Aiel and starts telling him to watch where he's walking until he realizes he's Aiel. My take when I read it was of the man being aggressive.

If there was no violence in AOL, pre-bore, then what were the Daishan known for? I mean, what made the Way of the Leaf so special in a world with little or no violence?

One other thing that just came to me:

We don't know when the Aiel took on the Way of the Leaf - it may have been after the DO was released and fighting began. They may have taken it on for the good of society as they seem to be the only humans involved with growing crops and such.

 

Nope they were already known for it before the bore was drilled.

I agree. When I read that part it stuck out, and I wonder if it was meant to by RJ. Do you know if the forsaken talk about the violence issue much from that time? I don't remember anything. Point being, RJ likes to show how things change from truth to legend. There's some mention of someone in book 4 - a woman - I think Tom is telling a story to kids on the boat from Ghealdan. Anyway, the story is described one way and Brigette comments on how it changed so much from the truth - she was there when it happened.

As for the second bit - there goes that theory ;)

If there was no violence in AOL, pre-bore, then what were the Daishan known for? I mean, what made the Way of the Leaf so special in a world with little or no violence?

There was no war but that doesn't mean there was no violence. Maybe they just policed things very well. There's that scene where Rand walks through the ter'angreal where some man bumps into one of the Aiel and starts telling him to watch where he's walking until he realizes he's Aiel. My take when I read it was of the man being aggressive.

If there was no violence in AOL, pre-bore, then what were the Daishan known for? I mean, what made the Way of the Leaf so special in a world with little or no violence?

One other thing that just came to me:

We don't know when the Aiel took on the Way of the Leaf - it may have been after the DO was released and fighting began. They may have taken it on for the good of society as they seem to be the only humans involved with growing crops and such.

If there was no violence in AOL, pre-bore, then what were the Daishan known for? I mean, what made the Way of the Leaf so special in a world with little or no violence?

There was no war but that doesn't mean there was no violence. Maybe they just policed things very well. There's that scene where Rand walks through the ter'angreal where some man bumps into one of the Aiel and starts telling him to watch where he's walking until he realizes he's Aiel. My take when I read it was of the man being aggressive.