MAFIA KART WII [BASIC] - Mafia Sweep

[alannalynn]

 

Did Liz just say this game is inactive? Liz... this is 35 pages in 24 hours. Please let some of us breathe.

I will say on my site that by now we would be 80 pages but we have 10ppp.

 

That's about right, we're 20ppp

 

I'm struggling to read through all these MQs though =/

[Lizabeth]

Did Liz just say this game is inactive? Liz... this is 35 pages in 24 hours. Please let some of us breathe.

I wasn't saying that the game was inactive per se. There are some of us who are high posters.

 

I'm saying that there are a lot of people I feel that I can't get a read on. It's not a criticism (for all of you, it is for some). I'm just saying it makes it hard for me to read people if I can't get a sense of their real time interactions with me or anyone else.

 

And I do believe that scum is playing well and/or lurking. Because you're right - 35 pages should be enough for me to get a strong read on the players who are active.

[alannalynn]

Once I catch up I can get some RT interaction with you, especially since I'm having trouble reading you with the Celeste-thing, so I need it too. I'm at page 20 now, so give me a little longer to catch up. I need to read about 14 more pages to be totally caught up

[alannalynn]

I killed the thread. Oops

[Clovdyx]

 

Did Liz just say this game is inactive? Liz... this is 35 pages in 24 hours. Please let some of us breathe.

I wasn't saying that the game was inactive per se. There are some of us who are high posters.

 

I'm saying that there are a lot of people I feel that I can't get a read on. It's not a criticism (for all of you, it is for some). I'm just saying it makes it hard for me to read people if I can't get a sense of their real time interactions with me or anyone else.

 

And I do believe that scum is playing well and/or lurking. Because you're right - 35 pages should be enough for me to get a strong read on the players who are active.

 

 

Who do you think is playing poorly?

[Lizabeth]

 

 

Did Liz just say this game is inactive? Liz... this is 35 pages in 24 hours. Please let some of us breathe.

I wasn't saying that the game was inactive per se. There are some of us who are high posters.

 

I'm saying that there are a lot of people I feel that I can't get a read on. It's not a criticism (for all of you, it is for some). I'm just saying it makes it hard for me to read people if I can't get a sense of their real time interactions with me or anyone else.

 

And I do believe that scum is playing well and/or lurking. Because you're right - 35 pages should be enough for me to get a strong read on the players who are active.

 

 

Who do you think is playing poorly?

 

I didn't say anyone was playing poorly. Just that I believe scum is playing well. Or not playing.

[alannalynn]

Will y'all both be around when I catch up, Clov, Liz? I'm on p24 atm, reading kind of slow so that I don't miss anything.

[Clovdyx]

Not going to bother quoting everything that stood out to me because I saw some of it was addressed while I was skimming on my phone at dinner...

 

 

I haven't read like the last several pages, since page 18, but what I thought of clov's posts (since clov asked) was that I empathized with his logic but felt I needed more detail. Like it is clear to me Seph was super serious, but I don't necessarily think that is scummy. Like it sort of depends on his state of mind, so right now I'd rather lynch celeste because I just did not get her responses and when that happens the person is 7/10 times a wolf.
 
[v]Celeste[/v]
 
So with that being said I am actually going to slank for today and def. some of tomorrow. XD

If you're town, I'd recommend that you move that vote.

If you're scum, I'd say you've found an easy target...

If Celeste is scum this game then she's taken her game to a whole 'nother level. She can be sneaky as scum, but I don't see her current play as being within her scum range (yet...she'll probably try to copy it after this game :P)

From the multiple conversations we've had on the topic, I honestly don't think she actually understands how I town read her, so I don't think she's actually pulling a fast one here. And it would be a dangerous scheme to try to pull the wool over my eyes in a way that's almost guaranteed to get her scum read by almost everyone else who doesn't know her well.

 

 

Talk to me about how you read her?  Because I'm pretty sure you're town here, and we see eye-to-eye on most things, but I'm having a hard time seeing how you can be THAT sure of her.  I'm not going to deny that you know Penny far better than I do, both as a person and a player.  I'm not going to deny that you likely have a much better grasp on her ranges than me.  If this was some sort of light read, maybe I could see it if you thought he was being genuine in her responses last night...but to basically have her as your top read?  

 

What am I missing?

 

 

 

In the meantime why are we even talking about the Liz/Celeste thing? Celeste seems fine to me. Just annoyed.

 

I get Townies tend to get annoyed more often them Scum but it doesnt mean Scum don't.

 

But that aside what do you think of her not addressing the read itsellf but just talking about past history?

 

I guess my problem here is that it wasn't a vote but a read.  People as either alignment will drop votes especially early for a variety of reasons, like jokes, reaction tests, pressure etc.  But Liz gave a Scum read based on nothing and Penny brushed it aside and doesn't address the read nor try to garner Liz reasoning for doing so.

 

 

I still don't see how Penny brushed it aside, given every thing that's followed after it, but I'm not going to beat the dead horse.  But I'm not sure why you feel that Penny needs to automatically react to any read somebody gives on her.

 

Also your point about the voting is...interesting.  

 

 

 

 

Her random vote switches.

 

None of my votes have been random this game. Except for the very first one. Which was really more of a reaction to a dare, so not really random at all, actually.

As a fellow ENFP you should know that what looks random is not always random...

Oh, and @Clov - I forgot to respond to your "stop dancing around" question.

1. I like to dance
2. I wasn't dancing. That was an honest answer. I'm always potentially serious in mafia. Sometimes I don't know how serious I am until I get a reaction

 

 

I know you like to dance  I like to rip people's faces off.

 

And you definitely avoided the question...or skirted around it, at least.  Because that wasn't a real answer honest or otherwise.  Were you voting her because you thought she was mafia, or at least likely mafia?  Or were you just trying to get things going?  

[Clovdyx]

 

 

 

Did Liz just say this game is inactive? Liz... this is 35 pages in 24 hours. Please let some of us breathe.

I wasn't saying that the game was inactive per se. There are some of us who are high posters.

 

I'm saying that there are a lot of people I feel that I can't get a read on. It's not a criticism (for all of you, it is for some). I'm just saying it makes it hard for me to read people if I can't get a sense of their real time interactions with me or anyone else.

 

And I do believe that scum is playing well and/or lurking. Because you're right - 35 pages should be enough for me to get a strong read on the players who are active.

 

 

Who do you think is playing poorly?

 

I didn't say anyone was playing poorly. Just that I believe scum is playing well. Or not playing.

 

 

That's the point.

[Clovdyx]

Did...did I break it?

[Lizabeth]

Will y'all both be around when I catch up, Clov, Liz? I'm on p24 atm, reading kind of slow so that I don't miss anything.

I'll probably head for bed around 11pm EST

[Clovdyx]

zander I was leaning town from tone. I wanted to wait until he came back until I posted about it. tbh I feel like I read thane better than most so deal with it. you can read into it however your freaking want to.

holy crap am I tired of freaking defending every little thing I say. 

I think I am just frustrated because I feel like I have a decent case against calder, and people just say lol calder... you haven't played with him. he does this.

 

Im sorry but how he is playing is not pro town, and until he shows it I am not going to stop. From what people tell me he plays to his own accord, even claiming mafia when he is town. 

 

I'm sorry but things like this only hurt the town, he hasn't given hardly any reads. If you all wanna lynch my for this I don't really care, just make sure your going to get something from my lynch.

 

...Was this to me?  Or somebody else?  Because it seems REALLY out of place regardless, and if you're talking to me...I'm pretty sure I said the exact opposite.  If this is towards somebody else, who?

 

I figure if he is so inclined he can elucidate everyone as to how he thinks/plays/interacts etc. I think that's better than me just saying things for him because he isn't here.

 

It would sort of be rude.

 

..........

 

1. Darthe

2. Hallia

3. Zander

6. Calder

7. alannalynn

8. Clovdyx

9. seph

10. Lizabeth

11. Celeste

12. Thane Vakarian

 

Thane and Seph are null but more town than not.

 

So rn, my best guess is laine, calder, and hallia.

 

That guess looks okayish. I disagree that Seph is more town than not and I wouldn't have Celeste as green, but beyond that, this is more or less where I'm at.  Not sure what Thane has  done to be more town than not, though.

[Clovdyx]

Liz, are you still around?  

[Lizabeth]

Not going to bother quoting everything that stood out to me because I saw some of it was addressed while I was skimming on my phone at dinner...

 

 

 

 

I haven't read like the last several pages, since page 18, but what I thought of clov's posts (since clov asked) was that I empathized with his logic but felt I needed more detail. Like it is clear to me Seph was super serious, but I don't necessarily think that is scummy. Like it sort of depends on his state of mind, so right now I'd rather lynch celeste because I just did not get her responses and when that happens the person is 7/10 times a wolf.

 

[v]Celeste[/v]

 

So with that being said I am actually going to slank for today and def. some of tomorrow. XD

If you're town, I'd recommend that you move that vote.

 

If you're scum, I'd say you've found an easy target...

 

If Celeste is scum this game then she's taken her game to a whole 'nother level. She can be sneaky as scum, but I don't see her current play as being within her scum range (yet...she'll probably try to copy it after this game :P)

 

From the multiple conversations we've had on the topic, I honestly don't think she actually understands how I town read her, so I don't think she's actually pulling a fast one here. And it would be a dangerous scheme to try to pull the wool over my eyes in a way that's almost guaranteed to get her scum read by almost everyone else who doesn't know her well.

 

 

Talk to me about how you read her?  Because I'm pretty sure you're town here, and we see eye-to-eye on most things, but I'm having a hard time seeing how you can be THAT sure of her.  I'm not going to deny that you know Penny far better than I do, both as a person and a player.  I'm not going to deny that you likely have a much better grasp on her ranges than me.  If this was some sort of light read, maybe I could see it if you thought he was being genuine in her responses last night...but to basically have her as your top read?  

 

What am I missing?

 

 

 

 

Her random vote switches.

None of my votes have been random this game. Except for the very first one. Which was really more of a reaction to a dare, so not really random at all, actually.

 

As a fellow ENFP you should know that what looks random is not always random...

 

Oh, and @Clov - I forgot to respond to your "stop dancing around" question.

 

1. I like to dance

2. I wasn't dancing. That was an honest answer. I'm always potentially serious in mafia. Sometimes I don't know how serious I am until I get a reaction

 

 

 

I know you like to dance  I like to rip people's faces off.

 

And you definitely avoided the question...or skirted around it, at least.  Because that wasn't a real answer honest or otherwise.  Were you voting her because you thought she was mafia, or at least likely mafia?  Or were you just trying to get things going?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Did Liz just say this game is inactive? Liz... this is 35 pages in 24 hours. Please let some of us breathe.

I wasn't saying that the game was inactive per se. There are some of us who are high posters.

 

I'm saying that there are a lot of people I feel that I can't get a read on. It's not a criticism (for all of you, it is for some). I'm just saying it makes it hard for me to read people if I can't get a sense of their real time interactions with me or anyone else.

 

And I do believe that scum is playing well and/or lurking. Because you're right - 35 pages should be enough for me to get a strong read on the players who are active.

 

 

Who do you think is playing poorly?

 

I didn't say anyone was playing poorly. Just that I believe scum is playing well. Or not playing.

 

 

That's the point.

 

 

Okay, is there any way to set the multiquote so that it doesn't quote all the previous multiquotes?

 

Anyway, I'll number my responses, so hopefully it's clear.

 

1. Lassie (and she knows this, so I hope she isn't offended by this) rarely makes sense to me with how she logics stuff. I used to misread her for it all the time because she says stuff that reads to my brain like things that no one would say unless they were mindset slipping as scum. But I've frequently been wrong. Doesn't mean I give her a free pass when she says things like that. It's why I called her out when she posted something that rang weird to my ears. But she's someone who can say the scummiest sounding things in the world and still be town.

 

So I tend to read her based on the genuineness of her emotional response. And I've seen this response from her before when she's town. I've seen her try to fake it when she was scum. It's not the same. And like I said, I haven't misread her alignment in any game I can think of in recent history, so I'll stand pretty confidently by my town read on her in this game.

 

2. Can't we dance while ripping people's faces off?

 

I was serious in what I said, though. When I push with multiple possibilities in mind. So yes, I thought/think there is the possibility that Hallia is mafia as much as there's the possibility that any of you are mafia. I won't know what's under the rock until I overturn it. Any one of my pushes may become more serious if I don't like what I find under the rock. Or if the rock refuses to budge.

 

3. Oh, if you're asking who I think is not playing and could potentially be mafia for it? I would say Zev is my highest suspect, because he's basically not showed up at all. (posting twice at the start of the Day, with one of those being a seemingly RVS vote is not what I call playing). Hallia is not as high on my suspicion list as she was because her tone when responding sounded exasperated townie enough...but I'm also not willing to give her a town pass for it until I see more or someone else convinces me that this is the town version of lurking Hallia. Thane is also not posting as much as I expected of town!Thane based on observing his play in your last game. Darthe was there, and then he was not. I don't know what I think of Darthe. I know he's posted fairly substantially but I feel like I have no real sense of him.

[Lizabeth]

Liz, are you still around?  

Yep...whatup?

[alannalynn]

 

Will y'all both be around when I catch up, Clov, Liz? I'm on p24 atm, reading kind of slow so that I don't miss anything.

I'll probably head for bed around 11pm EST

Ahhh dammit. Um can you concisely explain the Calder/Zander thing you have going on? I keep seeing it in spurts but I don't have a reference point to figure out what's going on exactly.

[alannalynn]

im just really confident in my reads for some reason. Idk.

lol

[Clovdyx]

 

Not going to bother quoting everything that stood out to me because I saw some of it was addressed while I was skimming on my phone at dinner...

 

 

 

 

I haven't read like the last several pages, since page 18, but what I thought of clov's posts (since clov asked) was that I empathized with his logic but felt I needed more detail. Like it is clear to me Seph was super serious, but I don't necessarily think that is scummy. Like it sort of depends on his state of mind, so right now I'd rather lynch celeste because I just did not get her responses and when that happens the person is 7/10 times a wolf.

 

[v]Celeste[/v]

 

So with that being said I am actually going to slank for today and def. some of tomorrow. XD

If you're town, I'd recommend that you move that vote.

 

If you're scum, I'd say you've found an easy target...

 

If Celeste is scum this game then she's taken her game to a whole 'nother level. She can be sneaky as scum, but I don't see her current play as being within her scum range (yet...she'll probably try to copy it after this game :P)

 

From the multiple conversations we've had on the topic, I honestly don't think she actually understands how I town read her, so I don't think she's actually pulling a fast one here. And it would be a dangerous scheme to try to pull the wool over my eyes in a way that's almost guaranteed to get her scum read by almost everyone else who doesn't know her well.

 

 

Talk to me about how you read her?  Because I'm pretty sure you're town here, and we see eye-to-eye on most things, but I'm having a hard time seeing how you can be THAT sure of her.  I'm not going to deny that you know Penny far better than I do, both as a person and a player.  I'm not going to deny that you likely have a much better grasp on her ranges than me.  If this was some sort of light read, maybe I could see it if you thought he was being genuine in her responses last night...but to basically have her as your top read?  

 

What am I missing?

 

 

 

 

Her random vote switches.

None of my votes have been random this game. Except for the very first one. Which was really more of a reaction to a dare, so not really random at all, actually.

 

As a fellow ENFP you should know that what looks random is not always random...

 

Oh, and @Clov - I forgot to respond to your "stop dancing around" question.

 

1. I like to dance

2. I wasn't dancing. That was an honest answer. I'm always potentially serious in mafia. Sometimes I don't know how serious I am until I get a reaction

 

 

 

I know you like to dance  I like to rip people's faces off.

 

And you definitely avoided the question...or skirted around it, at least.  Because that wasn't a real answer honest or otherwise.  Were you voting her because you thought she was mafia, or at least likely mafia?  Or were you just trying to get things going?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Did Liz just say this game is inactive? Liz... this is 35 pages in 24 hours. Please let some of us breathe.

I wasn't saying that the game was inactive per se. There are some of us who are high posters.

 

I'm saying that there are a lot of people I feel that I can't get a read on. It's not a criticism (for all of you, it is for some). I'm just saying it makes it hard for me to read people if I can't get a sense of their real time interactions with me or anyone else.

 

And I do believe that scum is playing well and/or lurking. Because you're right - 35 pages should be enough for me to get a strong read on the players who are active.

 

 

Who do you think is playing poorly?

 

I didn't say anyone was playing poorly. Just that I believe scum is playing well. Or not playing.

 

 

That's the point.

 

 

Okay, is there any way to set the multiquote so that it doesn't quote all the previous multiquotes?

 

Anyway, I'll number my responses, so hopefully it's clear.

 

1. Lassie (and she knows this, so I hope she isn't offended by this) rarely makes sense to me with how she logics stuff. I used to misread her for it all the time because she says stuff that reads to my brain like things that no one would say unless they were mindset slipping as scum. But I've frequently been wrong. Doesn't mean I give her a free pass when she says things like that. It's why I called her out when she posted something that rang weird to my ears. But she's someone who can say the scummiest sounding things in the world and still be town.

 

So I tend to read her based on the genuineness of her emotional response. And I've seen this response from her before when she's town. I've seen her try to fake it when she was scum. It's not the same. And like I said, I haven't misread her alignment in any game I can think of in recent history, so I'll stand pretty confidently by my town read on her in this game.

 

2. Can't we dance while ripping people's faces off?

 

I was serious in what I said, though. When I push with multiple possibilities in mind. So yes, I thought/think there is the possibility that Hallia is mafia as much as there's the possibility that any of you are mafia. I won't know what's under the rock until I overturn it. Any one of my pushes may become more serious if I don't like what I find under the rock. Or if the rock refuses to budge.

 

3. Oh, if you're asking who I think is not playing and could potentially be mafia for it? I would say Zev is my highest suspect, because he's basically not showed up at all. (posting twice at the start of the Day, with one of those being a seemingly RVS vote is not what I call playing). Hallia is not as high on my suspicion list as she was because her tone when responding sounded exasperated townie enough...but I'm also not willing to give her a town pass for it until I see more or someone else convinces me that this is the town version of lurking Hallia. Thane is also not posting as much as I expected of town!Thane based on observing his play in your last game. Darthe was there, and then he was not. I don't know what I think of Darthe. I know he's posted fairly substantially but I feel like I have no real sense of him.

 

 

Highlight the text you don't want to show up.  Hit "backspace".

 

1.  So is it safe to say your case for Penny being town is "she sounds bad, but she sounds honest"?

 

2.  That's still not an answer.  Either you voted her because you genuinely WANTED her lynched at that point, or you voted for <put whatever you want here>.  Pick one.  I don't need - or want - a paragraph long answer here.  This isn't a trick question or some sort of trap.  

 

3.  That's not at all what I was getting at.  You said the mafia is either the people who are playing well or not playing at all.  The way I see it, there are really only three groups of players

 

-People playing well

-People playing poorly

-People not playing.

 

If you don't have anybody in the middle group, you basically said "Mafia is either in the people playing or the people not playing."  I would bet anything you're right, but that doesn't make the statement mean anything.

[Lizabeth]

 

 

Will y'all both be around when I catch up, Clov, Liz? I'm on p24 atm, reading kind of slow so that I don't miss anything.

I'll probably head for bed around 11pm EST

 

Ahhh dammit. Um can you concisely explain the Calder/Zander thing you have going on? I keep seeing it in spurts but I don't have a reference point to figure out what's going on exactly.

 

Basically I don't understand Zander being so accepting of Calder ignoring my unexplained vote on him (Calder) while being all up in Celeste's grill about her supposedly not questioning me enough about my unexplained scum comment to her. To me Calder's lack of reaction is a bigger deal than Celeste's questioning and then choosing to move on from it. He's given an explanation that I still don't get, but I'm letting it rest...for now. I just think he's applying a double standard since a) he knows that Celeste and I have played together before and therefore have some kind of reference for determining how to go about reading each other (rightly or wrongly) and b) Calder has never played with me before, so really he doesn't have any frame of reference for interpreting my (seemingly) random vote on him and therefore I'd expect some questioning of Calder not questioning it.

[alannalynn]

@ Zander: concise reads list please. All these questions are hard to follow and I literally don't know what you're getting at.

[Clovdyx]

 

 

 

Will y'all both be around when I catch up, Clov, Liz? I'm on p24 atm, reading kind of slow so that I don't miss anything.

I'll probably head for bed around 11pm EST

 

Ahhh dammit. Um can you concisely explain the Calder/Zander thing you have going on? I keep seeing it in spurts but I don't have a reference point to figure out what's going on exactly.

 

Basically I don't understand Zander being so accepting of Calder ignoring my unexplained vote on him (Calder) while being all up in Celeste's grill about her supposedly not questioning me enough about my unexplained scum comment to her. To me Calder's lack of reaction is a bigger deal than Celeste's questioning and then choosing to move on from it. He's given an explanation that I still don't get, but I'm letting it rest...for now. I just think he's applying a double standard since a) he knows that Celeste and I have played together before and therefore have some kind of reference for determining how to go about reading each other (rightly or wrongly) and b) Calder has never played with me before, so really he doesn't have any frame of reference for interpreting my (seemingly) random vote on him and therefore I'd expect some questioning of Calder not questioning it.

 

 

Questioning from Zander to Calder?

[alannalynn]

 

 

 

 

Will y'all both be around when I catch up, Clov, Liz? I'm on p24 atm, reading kind of slow so that I don't miss anything.

I'll probably head for bed around 11pm EST

 

Ahhh dammit. Um can you concisely explain the Calder/Zander thing you have going on? I keep seeing it in spurts but I don't have a reference point to figure out what's going on exactly.

 

 

Basically I don't understand Zander being so accepting of Calder ignoring my unexplained vote on him (Calder) while being all up in Celeste's grill about her supposedly not questioning me enough about my unexplained scum comment to her. To me Calder's lack of reaction is a bigger deal than Celeste's questioning and then choosing to move on from it. He's given an explanation that I still don't get, but I'm letting it rest...for now. I just think he's applying a double standard since a) he knows that Celeste and I have played together before and therefore have some kind of reference for determining how to go about reading each other (rightly or wrongly) and b) Calder has never played with me before, so really he doesn't have any frame of reference for interpreting my (seemingly) random vote on him and therefore I'd expect some questioning of Calder not questioning it.

 

I've been unable to follow Zander's responses this game, but do you think it has anything to do with personality? As in, Calder seemingly doesn't care about the vote, but Penny was rather reactive and garnered more attention. Calder isn't really the type to get all bothered about one vote in the first place, so I'm not sure I'm seeing it as a big deal, personally. A vote is a vote, but you probably had a reason for it, what was it?

 

Also do you think that Zander is defending Calder in some way? Do you think Calder is the type that needs defending?

[alannalynn]

*I mean defending as in: Zander not getting on Calder whereas he got onto Celeste re: votes

[alannalynn]

Zander-Hally-Zev?

[Lizabeth]

@Clov - because I don't feel like editing through a whole lot of multiquotes (I know how to edit it after the fact, I was just hoping there was a way to be able to quote one post at a time rather than pulling up all the quotes that the person I want to respond to has responded to).

 

1. Yes.

 

2. *sigh* Ni....

 

It is an answer. Anyone I've voted for today (except for my initial RVS vote on whoever it was that basically dared us not to lynch him) was placed on someone I'd potentially be okay with lynching. Doesn't mean I'm going to insist on their lynch until I have more information that directs me one way or the other.

 

So was it serious in the sense that I was okay with it potentially leading to an actual lynch if I didn't like what arose from the push on her? Yes. Was I bound and determined to actually lynch her at that point without additional information? No.

 

3. Because I don't think that the middle group is particularly relevant to what I'm trying to say and I'm not going to start calling out people for poor play. I'm saying that I'm having a hard time reading who is mafia right now. At the risk of sounding arrogant, I usually can pick out at least two or three fairly strong scum reads by now, and all I have is a couple of strong town reads based mainly on emotional tone and a big pile of null. So I don't believe that the mafia players are active players who are leaving obvious breadcrumbs. Either that or it should be obvious and I'm just doing a particularly shitty job this game.