A Tale of Middle Earth: Game OVER

Askthepizzaguy · May 16, 2015

I'm trying to understand the sentence in bold. Would it not be in Town's interest to get your peeks in your reads list? Not necessarily at the start of Day, but at least throughout the day...??

I believe your claim then, as you have explained it... It's the only conclusion I can find after that.

You generally want to leave your peeks unknown to the wolves. Even they don't know you're a seer yet, so you want your peeks alive.

Stepping in to save them from the lynch was terrible, at that point, I felt like I was outed anyway.

So I just flat out claimed my two village peeks. Nothing more could be done to hide, and it would otherwise confuse the village.

Yes, but in terms of the village.. if you die and flip seer, the village has nothing to work with. That's what I mean... idk.. seems to me it would be a good thing to at least breadcrumb...

Right away I said Krak was 95% villager based on something he posted. That one would have been easy.

Thane I was going to breadcrumb later, it's hard to leave a believable one on him based on his still catching up, but I gave reasons for people to let him catch up before judging him.

Then, I straight defended him from being voted.

If those aren't my two peeks, I don't know who else they could be. I had you as villagery since day one, so it can't have been based on a peek.

EP is a mason, so it can't be him, either.

Askthepizzaguy · May 16, 2015

also calling it refusing to play is unfair, i do have a busy RL at the moment, and just can't keep up.

Then ask to be replaced.

no.

you just have to get used to me not being around that much.

And with this short interaction, i wonder why i bothered coming here during working hours.

Thane, focus on me.

You are going to be my Adaham this game, at least until I read you wolf.

Don't interact with the people who are downvoting your contributions so far. Find someone who you can interact more constructively with and if you can't find one, I'll volunteer for the time being.

When you get caught up on this monster, tell me a couple of wolves, and find me a villager I have not named yet. Or tell me why someone I accused is a villager.

Do this for great justice.

This is where I'm deliberately trying to get Thane to interact with me so I can give literally any bullspit reason to clear him without it being a peek.

I tried, guys. It's all in the thread.

Askthepizzaguy · May 16, 2015

It doesn't matter anyway- I can't even get one of my suspects lynched right now.

If I get lynched it will corroborate what I'm saying, if I get murdered it will also do the same.

My purpose right now is to get people to start reading Andrej for his wolf game thusfar.

Or tell me why I'm wrong about him. I'd like to learn something about Andrej, because he's all I ever think about tonight as I lay asleep, dreaming of dead wolves, or resting in permanent peace.

Sooh · May 16, 2015

I'm trying to understand the sentence in bold. Would it not be in Town's interest to get your peeks in your reads list? Not necessarily at the start of Day, but at least throughout the day...??

I believe your claim then, as you have explained it... It's the only conclusion I can find after that.

You generally want to leave your peeks unknown to the wolves. Even they don't know you're a seer yet, so you want your peeks alive.

Stepping in to save them from the lynch was terrible, at that point, I felt like I was outed anyway.

So I just flat out claimed my two village peeks. Nothing more could be done to hide, and it would otherwise confuse the village.

Yes, but in terms of the village.. if you die and flip seer, the village has nothing to work with. That's what I mean... idk.. seems to me it would be a good thing to at least breadcrumb...

Right away I said Krak was 95% villager based on something he posted. That one would have been easy.

Thane I was going to breadcrumb later, it's hard to leave a believable one on him based on his still catching up, but I gave reasons for people to let him catch up before judging him.

Then, I straight defended him from being voted.

If those aren't my two peeks, I don't know who else they could be. I had you as villagery since day one, so it can't have been based on a peek.

EP is a mason, so it can't be him, either.

That's just about exactly what I said earlier... I saw you doing it in practice. It was the way you spoke of the seer role later that confused me.

**snip**

Your claim is a very elaborate claim, and it does have its traces in your posts. The only thing I think you didn't mention about your claim at the start of day was that you had Thane as a peeked villager. It wasn't in your first reads. Not even as a breadcrumb. You did warm up to him throughout the day, so the breadcrumbing began, but leaving him out completely in that first reads list is strange. Of course it might be because Thane had done pretty much nothing up until that point in the game, so it was hard to justify him as a town read without giving away too much about your ability to peek, but yes...

**snip**

I deduced this all earlier when I wrote this. It was your post about how you see the seer role that confused me.

Askthepizzaguy · May 16, 2015

I'm not sure I understand your comments just then.

Is there anything I can clarify for you? Any questions you may have I will answer.

Sooh · May 16, 2015

I'm not sure I understand your comments just then.

Is there anything I can clarify for you? Any questions you may have I will answer.

It is more a game mechanical question I guess. It sounded to me like you were saying not to leave any hints as to your peeks at all because that would out both you and your peeks, but I guess that's not what you were saying after all since you were doing something completely different.

Askthepizzaguy · May 16, 2015

I'm not sure I understand your comments just then.

Is there anything I can clarify for you? Any questions you may have I will answer.

It is more a game mechanical question I guess. It sounded to me like you were saying not to leave any hints as to your peeks at all because that would out both you and your peeks, but I guess that's not what you were saying after all since you were doing something completely different.

The goal is indeed to leave a trail that leads people to believe your peeks are who they are, but in such a way that it only becomes clear after you die.

If you can avoid directly defending your peeks and just establish them as villagery, but not a peek, you can avoid outing yourself as a seer and also your peeks as the peeks until it is too late for the wolves.

You want to get deeper into the game before you have to claim, and any alive peeks you have are devastating.

But simply preventing mislynches and putting vote pressure on wolves is acceptable.

Finding wolves pushing your peeks hard based on absolutely nothing is easier to see when you know it's based on nothing, as well.

Krak was easy, I could turn what he said into a village self-clear using my experience alone.

Thane was a difficult one to peek. But I deliberately tried to engage him so I could also clear him. All you have to do is bait that person into giving reads, leans, arguments.

Then, clear them for it.

Simple, simple.

I've been around the block, I know how to seer.

Sooh · May 16, 2015

And that was the response I was looking for...

I might be a bit lost in translation on that one sentence before, but I doubt it matters.

Askthepizzaguy · May 16, 2015

Okay. So you're settled on me being a villager and telling the truth about my claim.

Would you please look at Andrej and tell me if he is a wolf, and if he is a wolf, who is his most likely wolf partner? Not a whole team, just top candidate for his partner.

You can do it after night falls if you prefer, but please do it before Night ends.

Eldrick4221 · May 16, 2015

OMG Tina votes without finishing the thread. Did that actually happen?

Caught up now.

Verb is obviously not mafia to me. Probably town. That 3rd party tinfoil I came up with today is very unlikely, but still something I felt needed to be mentioned.

Between the two claimed/proven powers, I'd rather have Pizza's.

Pizza claimed JoaT, but that doesn't mean he's town. He could be outright lying. He could be mafia with said claim, or part of it. We now have the following options:

Believe his claim, and that he is town. Keep him alive so he can continue using it.

Believe his claim, but not sure of his alignment. Keep him alive so he can prove himself.

Believe his claim, but not that he is town/Not believe his claim at all. Kill him to test what he said. If he flips what he's claiming, we have 2 living confirmed townies. If there is another protect role out there, we will go into tomorrow with a living confirmed townie.

I personally want to keep him around. [v]Verb[/v]

Askthepizzaguy · May 16, 2015

One thing I didn't consider very carefully is that dying and flipping village JOAT is not helpful in identifying me as even having a seer power.

Even I make boneheaded mistakes sometimes. This might have actually been the preferable outcome, now that I think on it.

Eldrick4221 · May 16, 2015

Now, regarding seers and revealing their peeks. Yes, telling the wolves who some townies on paints a target on them, but it also narrows the pool for townies to find scum. It is vital for seers to, at some point, reveal what they know.

Eldrick4221 · May 16, 2015

One thing I didn't consider very carefully is that dying and flipping village JOAT is not helpful in identifying me as even having a seer power.

Even I make boneheaded mistakes sometimes. This might have actually been the preferable outcome, now that I think on it.

I didn't know what you would flip. I was assuming that it would say what your trades were, and that was stupid of me.

Askthepizzaguy · May 16, 2015

If it said what my trades were, it still wouldn't be clear I used my seer power N1.

I almost played this really stupidly.

Thane Vakarian · May 16, 2015

so i am still confused about what happened just before deadline yesterday.

I don't think that Verbal needed to gladiate anybody. It was clear that i was going to be lynched, at least to me.

Gladiator between Verbal and Pizza is about the worst case scenario at the moment. Two townies, no wolves.

Krak and i would both be confirmed town, according to Pizza's claim.

copy/pasted:

1. Hally

2. Sooh - mentored by Corn
3. Alot
4. ~~Alanna~~ Aiel Heart
5. Dice
6. ~~John Snow~~ Yates 2.0

7. Thane
8. Verbal
9. Talya
10. Eldrick
11. Leelou

12. Sili - Beren, Town Vanilla Modkilled Day Two
13. Krak
14. Taborline
15. Andrej
16. Alannalynn

17. Tress - Tulkas, Town Vanilla Killed Night One
18. Zander - Elu Thingol, Town Mason Killed Night One
19. seph - mentored by Kaylee
20. Eternal Phoenix
21. TinaHel

22. Yates - Faramir, Town Forensic Investigator Lynched Day One
23. Cass/Monstr - Batassery

24. Pizzaguy

That narrows down the pool.

my opinion on the possibles, would be this:

Eternal Phoenix

Hally

~~John Snow~~ Yates 2.0

Sooh - mentored by Corn

Eldrick

Alannalynn
seph - mentored by Kaylee
TinaHel

~~Alanna~~ Aiel Heart
Dice

Cass/Monstr - Batassery (sorry Cass, i just can't read you)

Talya
Taborline

Alot

Andrej

Leelou

i don't know what the other players think about this, and basically, i don't even think that my opinion is appreciated at all in this game, but there you go.

Eldrick4221 · May 16, 2015

Why do you have Heart as light green? She has yet to contribute.

Thane Vakarian · May 16, 2015

call it a hunch.

Eldrick4221 · May 16, 2015

Actually, same goes for Taborline. I have them both as null because they haven't done anything one way or the other. Null could easily be hiding wolf, but how do you have a non-null read on either of them?

Eldrick4221 · May 16, 2015

Also, why are you excluding krak, because of pizza's claim, but not EP because of the mason claim?

Thane Vakarian · May 16, 2015

Actually, same goes for Taborline. I have them both as null because they haven't done anything one way or the other. Null could easily be hiding wolf, but how do you have a non-null read on either of them?

as i said, call it a hunch, gut feeling or something like that.

Also, why are you excluding krak, because of pizza's claim, but not EP because of the mason claim?

EP is top of my green list. Never going to lynch him. Honestly, i forgot about the mason thing.

Eldrick4221 · May 16, 2015

Until given a reason not to, I'm going to believe EP is a mason, and that Pizza viewed Krak and Thane as town.

Strong Town

EP, Krak, Thane, Verbal

Slight Town

AJ, Pizza

People I need to ISO and sort:

Hally, Sooh, Alot, Dice, Talya, Leelou, Laine, seph, Tina, Batass

People that haven't provided enough content to sort:

Taborline, Yates 2.0, Heart

At this point in the game, I don't have scum reads on anyone. I apparently don't handle big games well. I was expecting this game to be 14 people when I signed up for it.

I need to take another look at AJ as well. His playstyle was what I expected his town game to be from what I saw him do when he was town and I was scum. I got the same thing from Sili. for this reason mostly, I put them both as town, and that stuck with me. I was right about Sili. I might be wrong about AJ. Others have been scumreading him, and there may be something there. (Oh the dangers of meta)

Eldrick4221 · May 16, 2015

Actually, same goes for Taborline. I have them both as null because they haven't done anything one way or the other. Null could easily be hiding wolf, but how do you have a non-null read on either of them?

as i said, call it a hunch, gut feeling or something like that.

Also, why are you excluding krak, because of pizza's claim, but not EP because of the mason claim?

EP is top of my green list. Never going to lynch him. Honestly, i forgot about the mason thing.

Ok. Let me know if those hunches stay after they contribute.

Eldrick4221 · May 16, 2015

I realize my reads list is crappy. Please don't point it out. I have a lot of work to do.

For the record, I think there are 6 total mafia. Possibly 2 teams of 3. Being 24 total players, it makes sense.

I'm also hoping that one night they shoot each other. I'm so gonna laugh if that happens.

Askthepizzaguy · May 16, 2015

I make a point of valuing the contributions of players who feel like their voice is not heard, Thane.

While I have an Askthepizzaguy persona when I play mafia, I am the total opposite in real life.

I'm quiet and I don't speak up.

I identify with players in mafia who struggle to be heard. Please know I value your contributions regardless of whether or not you had been the peek.

I am listening, for what it is worth, for as long as that matters.

Eldrick4221 · May 16, 2015

Blah. i

I make a point of valuing the contributions of players who feel like their voice is not heard, Thane.

While I have an Askthepizzaguy persona when I play mafia, I am the total opposite in real life.

I'm quiet and I don't speak up.

I identify with players in mafia who struggle to be heard. Please know I value your contributions regardless of whether or not you had been the peek.

I am listening, for what it is worth, for as long as that matters.

+1

A Tale of Middle Earth: Game OVER

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