[Advanced] Revenge of the Marlfox

[hazelkrs1]

Okay so then where was that cautious townie spirit later on? She flip flopped on Berf after WKing him early on, then jumped into the Thane CFD and never really considered whether or not town was CFDing a townie even tho she had defended Thane as well early on

 

Basically all of Alanna's flip flops make no sense to me, there isn't enough progression in the thread to justify those flips. Seems like she was trying to WK townies at first then started changing her tune as deadline got closer and she could blame any votes or switches on "consolidation"

[Andrej]

Tbh I think a lot of players fall under that category considering how the EOD wagons formed. That Thane lynch happened ridiculously fast with a lot of poor reasons so picking wolves out of the line up is kinda muddied.

 

I'm finally done unpacking all my stuff into my new place so I'm gonna spend a little time reading through the start of D2 up to this point. Despot I think you're starting to suffer from some tunnel vision here bro. I glanced at your ISOs again earlier and while I can see some of the things you're pointing to irt Key/Alanna I think there's also some points that you're mis characterizing such as saying people are self concious because they announce they're going to be gone, etc. I personally do this all the time as either role and you even began the game saying you'd be rather absent. At best I think it's neutral.

[hazelkrs1]

It's not one of the more reliable tells, but I certainly have seen it be applicable

 

I mean, the reasoning behind it is solid, it's just that some people can be self-conscious as either alignment.

 

Wasn't a major point in my case, but if I see trends when looking at iso's I'll point them out.

[Andrej]

besides can't a roleblocker be town too... why can't a town roleblocker believe tom's claim and despot's and roleblock despot. :|

 

 

 

Yeah so I wasn't blowing smoke or anything. I legit shot at Tommy last night.

Des - tell me straight up this isn't a gambit. I swear unto God if you say anything like "LOL! JOKES!!" later I will lynch you and not care about divining your alignment. Swear it.

Not a gambit.

Only other possibility is that town RB decided to block me, and I don't even want to consider how dumb that would have been if that's the case.

99% Tommy is scum. Me getting blocked is icing on the cake.

I've seen town roleblockers, though, so... isn't it possible a town RB blocked Despo?

 

@Rags: I still haven't seen anything particularly scummy for Verb. I know you found his tone fake in some posts, but he sounds like the same usual Verb to me.

Alright so I went back to look over how things unfolded again in sequence. Here is where Alanna first suggested a Town RB could have blocked Despot. Seeing as how she was the 3rd person to mention this possibility, I don't really think it's an unnatural occurring thought. The idea had been floated and to me this reads like Alanna is trying to consider the possibility of it happening. Seem organic imo

 

 

 

I don't know I'll mull it all over for a while. There are certainly some thoughts to put together.

 

 I'm feeling the same. I want to think things through and give everyone a chance to weigh in before we move on a lynch. It does seem like lynching Tommy or Despo is the move to make today, we should get scum one way or another. 

 

Unless Despo is a townie lying to get Tommy lynched. Which, you know, is completely within the realm of possibility for him.

I liked this post reading through again as well. This strikes me how I saw Alanna playing in the Firefly game where she is kind of slow jumping to conclusions and is a more methodical player in her thought process. I also don't mind the last line even if it does come across a bit snippy, but in this circumstance I don't think it's unreasonable for her to express some annoyance at the situation.

 

 

 

 

 

Or, you know, Arsis is lying.

 

Or Despo is telling the truth and was blocked by a scum roleblocker. 4th option you conveniently left out.

I guess if Tommy is scum, then it's possible. I was thinking from the angle of Tommy telling the truth about being BP.

This was after her weird Town RB statement but the explanation is plausible imo.

 

Also, I think we can all see that there is potentially at least one person in this game who could be town and would block Despo. He's only said it a few times now 

This post further supports that. Again, I don't think her coming to this conclusion is entirely unnatural. Her thought process seems organic to me and she provides support to it with evidence ITT. Like I was saying earlier I don't think the information gained has a ton of validity because you purposefully muddled things up and left people searching for plausible explanations.

 

 

 

Alanna/sili what you two are setting up is a bit of a stretch. You two are due for some distancing because I'm getting bad juju from your interactions here.

 

What am I setting up? I'm not trying to set up anything. I'm trying to consider all options and see all sides of this so we don't mislynch someone. It's a slightly confusing situation, and I'm trying to figure out how these different roles could have interacted here.

I'm kinda surprised people can look at this post and not think Alanna is a villager.

 

 

Arsis, did you watch yourself watching Tommy? Maybe check whether you would?

Suggest that if you were blocked you'd see nothing, if you weren't you should have seen yourself if nobody else.

More I want to say, but gates closing

Saw this going through and had a serious ???? moment

[monstrman]

Since there is resistance, it makes it even better that Alanna/key wagons are the way to go. I think we'll get the most information out of piling onto these guys tbh

 

gogogogoglglglglglgl

[monstrman]

I can look at that post and not think alanna is a villager

 

because that's not a very telling post

 

It's two sentences and is nowhere near any amount of difficult for a mafia to make

[monstrman]

I really honestly think a lot of the scum is in the slankers tbh

[monstrman]

AND WHERE'S CORY? :(

[Andrej]

Key/Pral wagons are premo imo

 

I think resistance to the Alanna wagon is pro-village. She seems on her villager game from our last experience together and I think she's just being caught out in a bad situation because of Despot's conf bias and over confidence in his "trap" play.

 

Why do you think she's a wolf MonstrManbatman?

[Andrej]

I can look at that post and not think alanna is a villager

 

because that's not a very telling post

 

It's two sentences and is nowhere near any amount of difficult for a mafia to make

In a vacuum, sure.

 

But for Alanna I think it heavily applies to how she plays as a villager

[Sili Quirrels]

 

What I am anxious to see is desp take on Verbal.

 

That would be neat, and very revealing, considering this is probably what town desp would want to do - take anyone who was even slightly scummy to task.

Well since there's no way I'm town in your eyes, there's not much point to me doing that iso, eh?

 

 

It would be more revealing of Verbal's alignment, for me, and for those who think you're town maybe it's your chance to make a case for Verbal: Town/wolf?

 

I'm just surprised you haven't gone after him already. It makes me think he's wolfpack w/you.

[Sili Quirrels]

AND WHERE'S CORY? :(

in wolf qt chat.

[Sili Quirrels]

and before despothera asks me how i know that, i'm joking.

[hazelkrs1]

I can look at that post and not think alanna is a villager

 

because that's not a very telling post

 

It's two sentences and is nowhere near any amount of difficult for a mafia to make

This.

 

AJ your hardcore defense of Alanna does much less than impress me. The things you bolded that you said looked townie could be faked by most scummers, especially one as experienced as Alanna

[hazelkrs1]

and before despothera asks me how i know that, i'm joking.

I'm actually much, MUCH better at picking up in honor than you give me credit for

[hazelkrs1]

Picking up on humor* Yeesh AC

 

[Andrej]

I don't really care if it impresses you tbh. You're obviously going off the deep end here and what I'm trying to do is keep the focus on players who are actually likely to be wolves instead of falling into your Twilight Zone POV.

[Sili Quirrels]

it's more like i think your sense of humor involves fishing for slips

[hazelkrs1]

And I seriously don't get how Alanna's explanation looks plausible to you AJ.

 

I had just presented mechanically supported logic that would cast serious doubt on Tommy's alignment for just about anyone that isn't scum.

 

EVEN IF Alanna had such a big town read on him before that, she still has enough experience with him to know that he would be very wily as scum and could look townie even when he isn't.

 

So in what world does it make sense for Alanna as town to automatically assume Tommy was telling the truth there when looking at all possibilities?!?!?!?!

 

A normal townie reaction would be to do exactly what Yates did- weigh everything together, make sure the picture is as clear as it can be, then go with the most likely possibilities to consider- that either I was lying (as he mentioned, not very likely for me to do as scum there) or that Tommy was lying.

 

Even if Alanna was looking at it from the angle that Tommy was town, that still is reminiscent of TMI

 

Explain to me why Alanna's explanation is plausible AJ. Do it or I will start doubting your Survivor claim more and more- and come to think about it your hard defense of Alanna here makes no sense as a Survivor. Why should you care? Even if town mislynched her, toys still be gravy. Even if you want to help town win, you'd be focusing on your top suspect for scum, not hard defending someone who for all you know could be scum.

[hazelkrs1]

I don't really care if it impresses you tbh. You're obviously going off the deep end here and what I'm trying to do is keep the focus on players who are actually likely to be wolves instead of falling into your Twilight Zone POV.

Yeah yeah yeah keep discrediting me as "Ol Crazy Despot"

 

...

 

No really, keep doing that, makes me look like less of a threat to scum

 

 

But really broseph. Stop being so condescending- I'm not going off any deep end here, I'm presenting arguments with a clear logical base. Could I be wrong? Of course. Could I have confbias? Definitely.

 

But you're doing nothing to actually make me think I could be wrong here. So belittle less, use logic moar

[hazelkrs1]

it's more like i think your sense of humor involves fishing for slips

Nawh that's my super cereal scumhunting side. I can be sorta funny at times- promise!

 

[Sili Quirrels]

irt Alanna. You shouldn't take things out of context just to push someone. You also shouldn't put them in a vacuum without a personality.

 

Besides who's to say you weren't lying. You think everyone believes you automatically?

 

Pretty sure she accounted for tommy being wily. I know I did, and I still believed him over you.

[hazelkrs1]

irt Alanna. You shouldn't take things out of context just to push someone. You also shouldn't put them in a vacuum without a personality.

 

Besides who's to say you weren't lying. You think everyone believes you automatically?

 

Pretty sure she accounted for tommy being wily. I know I did, and I still believed him over you.

She didn't tho. According to her, she was looking at it from the angle that he was town. I don't think Alanna would do that as town, knowing how Tommy can be.

 

And I didn't take anything out of context. Show me where you think I did.

 

Oh wait you basically never back this sort of thing up with quotes or anything

 

[hazelkrs1]

Also- I'm not saying she should have believed me automatically. Far from it. I just don't understand why she was considering every possibility BUT Tommy being scum there.

[Andrej]

Dude she stated like several times that there were multiple possibilities of one of you/Arsis/Tom lying. Several times. Like I pointed out her thought process seems organic to me in that her conclusions jive with the reveal of information ITT.

 

AGAIN - I really just think you're going overboard with how much information you gained through your gambit. The fact remains that by doing things in the manner you did you just over complicated the situation. Also your point about her working under the assumption that Tom was a villager is just another example of how hard you're tunneling here dude. That's like saying anyone with a strong villager read has TMI. I'm not going to speak for Alanna here but I am willing to show why I think you are wrong because I said I was going to help the village. In the end, yeah, you're right I probably shouldn't care and if you would prefer I can go back to twiddling my thumbs and allow you to continue destroying yourself from the inside out - but even when I'm not part of the village I can't help but try to look out for its best interests.