A Song of Ice and Fire or The Sword of Truth?

[Khazul]

As you can pretty much guess by the title, I am currently trying to decide between those series of books. I am on the fence and looking for a little help from some who have read them. Thanks!

[hotpocket2006]

Ummmmmmm... Just to let you know, IMO, Sword of Truth is complete garbage. The first couple of books are okay, but then they just get repeated over and over and over again, just slightly changed. I think I made it to book 4 before I decided I had wasted my life. I fully intend to finish the series someday, I don't like not finishing stuff, but I probably know how it will end. Terry Goodkind is also a jerk. Go here and at least read the first page, it sums it up better than I can.

 

Anyway, even if I liked SoT, I would still suggest A Song of Ice and Fire (see name). It's a really ah-mazing series and it's very mature reading and it's not what I expected when I first started reading it. Just to warn you, it takes a few chapters to get into, at least for me. I started reading the first three chapters, didn't really like it and then set it down. I picked it up like 6 months later, kept reading, and has now changed the way I read and judge books. Plus it's being made into a television series

[Khazul]

Oh I see. I didn't realize that Goodkind was such.. an ass. Hah. I've heard it was similar to The Wheel of Time, and at first that interested me. But now I can see how easily that could be a bad thing. It sounds like I will be picking up A Song of Ice and Fire tomorrow.

PS - Does it have Dragons? :P

[hotpocket2006]

Um.... I don't want to spoil anything, but the 5th book is called A Dance with Dragons

[Khazul]

Lol. Have only four books been released at this point? I thought I read a SoIaF was supposed to be a trilogy?

[hotpocket2006]

lol I believe it was originally, but now it's going to be 7 books long, as of now. 4 of the 7 are out right now, and the 5th one should be out this year sometime *crosses fingers*

[Werthead]

Yeah, this is a bit like asking, "A sumptuous banquet or being repeatedly kicked in the balls by a man with steel-capped boots?" ;)

 

The only thing remotely in SoT's favour is that it is completed (kind of, as Goodkind's attempts to write in a different genre were a failure and he's now churning out new SoT books) whilst A SONG OF ICE AND FIRE isn't, although Book 5 will (finally!) be released in 2011.

 

Your opinion may also be influenced by the TV series situation. ASoIaF's TV adaptation is called GAME OF THRONES (the same as the first book) and will air in about three months, so if you prefer to read books before seeing them on TV it might be an idea to get cracking on the books ASAP ;)

[Ananta]

I just ordered the first book of ASoIaF. I watched "The Legend of the Seeker" from TV, and although Bridget Regan is completely fapworthy (and my god she is. Look me in the eyes and tell me you wouldn't tap dat or dat), the plot isn't that great. I know, books are better than series/movies, but they still give the general idea of what's going on.

 

 

So yeah, I went for A Song of Ice and Fire.

[Agelmar]

Speaking of fantasy novels by authors with radical conservative viewpoints, has anyone on here read Harald by David D. Friedman (Milton Friedman's son)?

[Elend]

Let me just say A Song of Ice and Fire is more mature, better plotted, has infinitely better characterization, a much more developed world, a more interesting magic system (from what we've seen) and... to top it all off... doesn't have nearly as much unnecessary sex, squick moments, or mass killings for the lulz.

 

Frankly, the choice is obvious. I'm not even sure Werthead's comparison is enough to do it justice. I'd prefer a kick in the balls to Goodkind, for instance. At least that fades away eventually. Goodkind scars you.

 

Oh, and its WoT similarity? Yeah, basically whole-sale ripping of WoT ideas to put into his books with a healthy dash of SM and rape. So it even fails at being derivative.

[rsahae]

I agree that song of ice and fire is better than sword of truth, but my opinion is, there's some darn good books in the SoT series too. There's also several very bad books. So while I would go with Martin first, I would recommend reading the first half of SoT later. Books 1-4 are solid, 5 is ok, and 6 is really good. And then it's a steep downhill after that.

[OptimusPrime]

Ive not read ASoIaF. I have read some Sword of Truth though.

 

I strongly recommend ASoIaF.

[Ozzie]

8/10 to the OP.

 

That's trollin' that knows it's target audience.

 

Choose between them? For what? The only book series you will ever read again? Next? Just pick one. This community, in general, hates The Sword of Truth and Terry Goodkind. Only a few random people who aren't super regulars (like myself) will tell you they enjoyed SoT.

 

Try asking this same question but change SoT with WoT at a SoT fansite. Watch the hate flow the other way.

 

All of the below is IMO.

 

SoT has some WoT elements. Of course it does. It's FANTASY. There have been "Orders" or "Magician's Guilds" since the beginning of fantasy. So Jordan took that idea and made it exclusively Female. WOW. A real Pioneer! Good vs. Evil? WOW. A real Pioneer! A main protagonist finding out new abilites in himself that scare him and may ostrizie him from friends/family/the-world? REVOLUTIONARY!

 

Jordan's biggest plus is that he can tell a multi-character epic story on a grandscale and have it make sense. His way of doing magic is also unique as well (Sanderson is normally pretty good about finding a unique way to do it as well). He has a unique way of making the whole thing work in his writing style.

 

Goodkind IS a jackass. No doubt whatsoever. To act like he didn't have the same elements as the WoT is blindful and rediculous. The correct answer to the question would have been "most fantasy has used these kind of elemnts before... it's how you present them that makes you unique." But he's a jackass. He doesn't think that way. He also get's WAY too preachy about his philosphy in the last few books.

 

Goodkind's biggest plus is he get's the personal stories right. I care about Richard and Kahlan. How they interact. I think he does a btter job of showing how 2 people who love each other interact (in a fantasy setting) better then the WoT series does, simply because it isn't the constant "You are male therefore stupid and I can't believe I put up with you, yet I love with all my heart, yet I am too egomanaical to actually just SAY SO" that everyone but Rand and his harem do in that series.

 

I own both the WoT and SoT series. Acting like you can't like one and not the other is quite trollish. Also, no, Legend of the Seeker didn't get much of anything right and cannot be used as a gague to determin if you'd like the books.

 

Oh and ASoIaF is VERY good. Just be prepared to get sucked into a series that may not end. We've been waiting 5 years for book 5 of 7. I am excited to see the HBO series too. I'm just warning you there is zero resolution in sight.

[hotpocket2006]

8/10 to the OP.That's trollin' that knows it's target audience.Choose between them? For what? The only book series you will ever read again? Next? Just pick one. This community, in general, hates The Sword of Truth and Terry Goodkind. Only a few random people who aren't super regulars (like myself) will tell you they enjoyed SoT.Try asking this same question but change SoT with WoT at a SoT fansite. Watch the hate flow the other way.All of the below is IMO.SoT has some WoT elements. Of course it does. It's FANTASY. There have been "Orders" or "Magician's Guilds" since the beginning of fantasy. So Jordan took that idea and made it exclusively Female. WOW. A real Pioneer! Good vs. Evil? WOW. A real Pioneer! A main protagonist finding out new abilites in himself that scare him and may ostrizie him from friends/family/the-world? REVOLUTIONARY! Jordan's biggest plus is that he can tell a multi-character epic story on a grandscale and have it make sense. His way of doing magic is also unique as well (Sanderson is normally pretty good about finding a unique way to do it as well). He has a unique way of making the whole thing work in his writing style. Goodkind IS a jackass. No doubt whatsoever. To act like he didn't have the same elements as the WoT is blindful and rediculous. The correct answer to the question would have been "most fantasy has used these kind of elemnts before... it's how you present them that makes you unique." But he's a jackass. He doesn't think that way. He also get's WAY too preachy about his philosphy in the last few books.Goodkind's biggest plus is he get's the personal stories right. I care about Richard and Kahlan. How they interact. I think he does a btter job of showing how 2 people who love each other interact (in a fantasy setting) better then the WoT series does, simply because it isn't the constant "You are male therefore stupid and I can't believe I put up with you, yet I love with all my heart, yet I am too egomanaical to actually just SAY SO" that everyone but Rand and his harem do in that series. I own both the WoT and SoT series. Acting like you can't like one and not the other is quite trollish. Also, no, Legend of the Seeker didn't get much of anything right and cannot be used as a gague to determin if you'd like the books.Oh and ASoIaF is VERY good. Just be prepared to get sucked into a series that may not end. We've been waiting 5 years for book 5 of 7. I am excited to see the HBO series too. I'm just warning you there is zero resolution in sight.

 

There's nothing trollish about anything in this thread. I read SoT before I had even started the WoT series, I didn't like it then and I still don't like. He should've ended with the first book, because I enjoyed that one and that's about where it ends. Good for you that you like SoT. Other people have a right to their opinion, and that's what the OP wanted. You, I believe, are the one being trollish.

 

also:

 

At his booksigning in Pasadena yesterday, GRRM confirmed that the announcement would have been about ADWD if it hadn't been for his illness. He indicates he is just weeks away from delivering the final manuscript to the publishers.

 

So yeah, this year, assuming something calamitous doesn't happen.

[Ozzie]

No ma'am/sir. No trollin from me. I also would point out that I never said anyone couldn't have an opinion, nor did I rip someone for having one.

 

I said, correctly, that the mass majority of this community dislike greatly the SoT series. I mean the first response used the word garbage for goodness sakes. I also pointed out that you would get a similar yet less angry response from a SoT fansite.

 

I then proceded to give my opinion on the authors.

 

The op has been around since 9 of 09. I give them credit for at least lurking on these boards. Anyone that ever reads "book series" type posts for that long should understand what mentiong SoT or Goodkind does to this community. Hence, trolling. If I'm wrong, ok, I'll apologize.

 

On Martin, I have been waiting the full 5 years for this book. With 2 more to go I may just wait till he finishes it. I believe ADwD is coming soon. It's the others coming in the next 5 I have no faith in. :)

 

Edit: lol, I didn't even notice it was you who posted first.

[Guest paceves]

I'm new here...this is my first post. I just finished reading A Game of Thrones and started the second book (Clash of Kings I think) yesterday. I read the Sword of Truth series a few years ago. From a literary standpoint, Martin is light years ahead of Goodkind. There is truly no comparison. To me, it was the difference between a master craftsman and a green apprentice. However, I will not finish the second Martin book. I'm done. Maybe I'm too naive, or simple-minded. Maybe I lack depth or understanding. Martin brings his characters to life....the good ones are very good and I found myself wanting to be like them, only to watch them go down in flames time and time again. The first few times, it was a clever twist....we all like to be surprised....but after a while it became depressing....I guess it was the difference between being surprised and crushed. Basically, the message I got was "This character is exceedingly good, and look what that got him/her!" It was draining. Several times I was in denial....disbelieving...."Did that really just happen?" Goodkind's strength is his portrayal of relationships and his ability to take his characters through tragedy, and even failure, and bring them to a place of redemption on the other side. Some of Goodkind's books were definitely dark, but in a different way. He didn't plunge you into eternal darkness....you had to stay for a while sometimes, but there was always at least the hope of a new day....Martin will have none of that.

 

Like I said, Martin is a fabulous writer, but he is just too cynical for me. I prefer the "fantasy" in the fantasy genre. If I want to be depressed I'll simply turn on the TV. Good luck to you. Hopefully you'll have a better experience than I did.

 

:)

[Mr Ares]

I'd prefer a kick in the balls to Goodkind, for instance. At least that fades away eventually. Goodkind scars you.

See, I've read the first book and had no desire to read on, but now... well, scars are such pretty things.

 

 

SoT has some WoT elements. Of course it does. It's FANTASY.

When people claim about Sot having plagirised WoT, they tend to be talking about a number of points, quite specific ones that aren't common in fantasy. As I say, I haven't read beyond the first book, so much of this is from memories of times this debate has come up in the past, but one example is the a'dam and Goodkind having his own version - collars to control magic users are not ten a penny in fantasy series, so while RJ might not have invented the idea, and while that alone could easily be coincidence, these similarities taken altogether distinctly give the impression that one of these guys was borrowing from the other. And RJ did it before TG, so... Of course, it would take someone with greater knowledge of the series to truly pursue this argument, I'm simply objecting to a perceived strawman.

 

As to ASoIaF v SoT, I have to say ASoIaF is better. I haven't read the second SoT book onwards for two main reasons: the horrible reviews the later books tend to get, and the simple fact that I wasn't hugely impressed with Wizard's First Rule. I wouldn't call it horrifically bad, it's certainly not the worst book I've ever read, but it wasn't as brilliant as AGoT. I can think of no respect in which I would consider WFR superior to AGoT. Characterisation, plotting, prose, worldbuilding, in every respect Martin comes out better. I found Ned and Cat a far more believable couple than Richard and Kahlan. In fact, I can think of numerous examples of the first book in a fantasy series that surpass WFR for quality, and gave me a greater desire to read more books by that author: The Darkness That Comes Before(book 1 of Prince of Nothing trilogy, R. Scott Bakker), The Year of Our War (Steph Swainston, no official series title but often called the Castle series), Perdido Street Station (China Mieville, first of his books set in Bas Lag, no official series title again), Heroes Die (Acts of Caine, Matthew Stover), The Blade Itself (First law trilogy, Joe Abercrombie), The Colour of Magic (Discworld, Terry Pratchett), Gardens of the Moon (Malazan Book of the Fallen, Steven Erikson), The Final Empire (Mistborn, Brandon Sanderson. I won't mention WoK here because I'm only part way through), Titus Groan (Gormenghast, Mervyn Peake), Shadow of the Torturer (Book of the New Sun, Gene Wolfe). I would suggest that one takes the opportunity to try some of these series before Goodkind (although which would depend on personal taste).

 

On WFR, I would say that it did feel somewhat odd - like the book was trying to tell a story of Good against Evil, when really it should have been trying to tell one of Evil against Evil, or one of shades of grey. The Confessors felt like they should really be bad guys, but were portrayed as victims of Rahl, for example.

[Rufae]

Like I said, Martin is a fabulous writer, but he is just too cynical for me. I prefer the "fantasy" in the fantasy genre. If I want to be depressed I'll simply turn on the TV. Good luck to you. Hopefully you'll have a better experience than I did.

 

 

 

This my only strong knock against Martin. He really likes building a character up only to be utterly destroyed later. I am really hoping that things turn in the coming books. The only "good" character that has been able to rise up so far has been Danny. It also has me really worried about the future for Jaimie.

 

That is probably why it takes him over 5 years to write a book now, he is so depressed over what happens in them.

 

Other than this, Martin is good.

 

P.S. - Things really get bad in book 3, Storm of Swords. If you are having trouble after book 1, then you REALLY will be troubled by book 3.

[Dbob]

Yeah, I got through half of WFR, before I put it down. There was just nothing special about it. Someone upthread said it, it's kind of meh. TG is a pompous ass, but that probably wouldn't matter if he was a genius. Which he's not.

 

Much like GRRM, has been leading us all on for years with no book. I won't go in to that saga, but suffice it to say that as a fan, he's pushing it with me.

 

However SoIaF, is frikkin' brilliant. Yes it's dark (I too hope that we're just going through the dark, and at the end there will be light - but then, I also have this terrible suspicion that at the end, Danny will be the only one standing on a pile of steaming corpses,) yes the protagonists fall like flies, but you know, people die in war, bad things happen, and it's always kinda tedious when in a book where you have a world racked by war, and no one dies but the faceless.

 

One of the great things about SoIaF is that you really get to hating some of the characters, then GRRM turns them on you and you start to see their point of view.

 

I also had those moment in that series where I was thinking "did that just really happen?" which is a great thing, for all of us veteran fantasy readers that's quite a feat to pull off.

 

Plus GRRM handles his prose with a deft, invisible hand. There is no pretension, no rough edges. From the first book to the latest, you may have issues with where the story takes you, but you never have to have issues with the skill of the author.