The Creator's prison

[Barid Bel Medar]

You can write 1000 pages and it would still be wrong.

 

The OP is neutral. The creator created it, probably, but it has no inherant "Light" in it. Its just like fuel in a car. The force that drives the Wheel of Time.

 

The TP is the DO's essance. Pure evil. It is not the same, although it is similar.

 

I can admit that the creator made it, and it comes from him, but it is not the power of good.

 

Who said anything about the One Power being good? Yes, the True Source is neutral but it is still an opposite of the True Power. The Shadar Logoth power is an opposite of the True Power, but that is also evil. Ive always thought a theme of the series being that both good and evil are necessary. Partly that and Moridins words to Rand in TGS are what makes me think the Pattern is a shield that will die without something to imprison.

 

A Crown of Swords book tour 21 June 1996, Charleston - Brian Ritchie reporting

The universe is driven by saidin and saidar working against each other. They will not end up as the Light Power.

 

I dont know how you can get anything different from the Quote. Its as plain as day. Neutral power.

 

There may be some "Light Power" but it is not the OP.

 

I dont know how you can expect someone to take anything seriously from a vague quote with no link. Not that I am accusing you of making it up, but I could easily make a quote look like that and put some randomers name on it. Not to mention that interview quotes should provide exact wordings from horses mouths, otherwise it is too easily flawed by interpreters possibly flawed interpretation.

 

it is from the theoryland quote database, go look it up. I have not changed it. I understand that it could be interpreted that way, so no offence taken. I shall supply links or a reference from now on. BUt seriously, it is in no way vague, and there isnt anything to interpret wrong. Its perfectly clear. I think its arguement for arguements sake. Terez would have verified it before putting it up.

 

here is the link if you do not know. https://docs.google.com/View?docID=dcjspjqg_59g3crchdk&revision=_latest

 

another quote

 

AOL Chat #1 - 27 June 1996

 

Shosh001 asks: Mr. Jordan, you've outdone yourself with A Crown of Swords. My question concerns the True Power. How is it distinguishable from the One Power?

RJ: It's fairly self-evident from the book. What can be done with the True Power is very similar to what can be done with the One Power. Except that where the One Power is drawn from the True Source and is the force that drives the Wheel of Time and powers the universe, the so-called True Power is drawn from the Dark One. There are limits in the same ways there are limits to the One Power. It would be very long if I went into it too much, but some of those limits and costs of drawing on the Dark One are shown in A Crown of Swords.

 

It doesnt mention anything about the Creator, although it could be that the TS is the creators essance, but there is nothing really to suggest it, and alot to suggest different.

 

I dont see how they can be opposites either. TS is neutral, TP is evil. ?

 

SL and TP make sense, they are opposite evils.

 

But how is neutral opposite evil?

 

Unless the TP is "taking sides", the opposite of neutrality.

 

But I agree, the TS is created by the Creator. But that is as far as it goes. the creator built the Power station and left it to run.

 

Edit:

 

I am wondering about this aswell

 

Who said anything about the One Power being good? Yes, the True Source is neutral but it is still an opposite of the True Power. The Shadar Logoth power is an opposite of the True Power, but that is also evil. Ive always thought a theme of the series being that both good and evil are necessary

 

I dont fully understand.

 

You first agree that the OP is neutral. Then you say its a theme about good and evil being necessary?

 

If the OP is neutral, it wouldnt be a good v evil?

 

It would be Neutral v Evil.

[OptimusPrime]

it is from the theoryland quote database, go look it up. I have not changed it. I understand that it could be interpreted that way, so no offence taken. I shall supply links or a reference from now on. BUt seriously, it is in no way vague, and there isnt anything to interpret wrong. Its perfectly clear. I think its arguement for arguements sake. Terez would have verified it before putting it up.

 

here is the link if you do not know. https://docs.google.com/View?docID=dcjspjqg_59g3crchdk&revision=_latest

 

So what I did to find the exact quote was Ctrl+F, right, I found the quote, and it is one of the only parts of the post that doesnt have an RJ: OP is not the Light Power. So Im not buying that, because the randomer reporting didnt put exact words. Call me nitpicky, or a Wheel of Time fan, they mean the same thing with enough Time.

 

I am wondering about this aswell

 

 

Quote

Who said anything about the One Power being good? Yes, the True Source is neutral but it is still an opposite of the True Power. The Shadar Logoth power is an opposite of the True Power, but that is also evil. Ive always thought a theme of the series being that both good and evil are necessary

 

 

I dont fully understand.

 

You first agree that the OP is neutral. Then you say its a theme about good and evil being necessary?

 

If the OP is neutral, it wouldnt be a good v evil?

 

It would be Neutral v Evil.

 

Yes, I say the One Power is neutral and that the events of the series IMO portray that both good and evil are necessary.

 

That is because in a neutral world, there have to be good and evil for there to be a neutrality for dont there. The neutral force of the Pattern deems that both good and evil are necessary. If that isnt a neutral saying then Ishamael just came out of my ass upstairs.

[Barid Bel Medar]

it is from the theoryland quote database, go look it up. I have not changed it. I understand that it could be interpreted that way, so no offence taken. I shall supply links or a reference from now on. BUt seriously, it is in no way vague, and there isnt anything to interpret wrong. Its perfectly clear. I think its arguement for arguements sake. Terez would have verified it before putting it up.

 

here is the link if you do not know. https://docs.google.com/View?docID=dcjspjqg_59g3crchdk&revision=_latest

 

So what I did to find the exact quote was Ctrl+F, right, I found the quote, and it is one of the only parts of the post that doesnt have an RJ: OP is not the Light Power. So Im not buying that, because the randomer reporting didnt put exact words. Call me nitpicky, or a Wheel of Time fan, they mean the same thing with enough Time.

 

I am wondering about this aswell

 

 

Quote

Who said anything about the One Power being good? Yes, the True Source is neutral but it is still an opposite of the True Power. The Shadar Logoth power is an opposite of the True Power, but that is also evil. Ive always thought a theme of the series being that both good and evil are necessary

 

 

I dont fully understand.

 

You first agree that the OP is neutral. Then you say its a theme about good and evil being necessary?

 

If the OP is neutral, it wouldnt be a good v evil?

 

It would be Neutral v Evil.

 

Yes, I say the One Power is neutral and that the events of the series IMO portray that both good and evil are necessary.

 

That is because in a neutral world, there have to be good and evil for there to be a neutrality for dont there. The neutral force of the Pattern deems that both good and evil are necessary. If that isnt a neutral saying then Ishamael just came out of my ass upstairs.

 

Thats extremely nitpicking, I will have to just dismiss that part, sorry, but its graspping for straws taht dont exist.

 

So the OP determines both good and evil are necessary? Fair enough. I still dont see how that makes it the TP's opposite.

 

Im sorry, but it doesnt make any sense to me. I dont think there can be any argument either way.

 

I say lets agree to disagree.

[OptimusPrime]

No problemmo

[Barid Bel Medar]

No problemmo

 

Oh, I just realised this sounds a bit bad.

 

Thats extremely nitpicking, I will have to just dismiss that part, sorry, but its graspping for straws taht dont exist.

 

All I meant was that how can I argue against that? I mean, I cant prove it, so yeah. haha.

 

And I just think that there is no point getting into a debate about it, we have each given our opinions, thats all we can do. Dont want to have a long argument that changes nothing.

[OptimusPrime]

No worries dude no hard feelings

[Morsker]

Fallon Blood book signing 12 October 1996, Joseph-Beth Booksellers, Cincinnati, OH - Michael Martin reporting

 

Re: the Creator's "Inability" To Act On His Creation...Having encountered a similar "theology" in Donaldson's Covenant series, I have been quite curious why the Creator can't act on His own world. It didn't seem to make sense, except as a plot device. RJ answered this question. His thesis was this: A perfect Creator should create a perfect creation. To act, miraculously or no, on this world, would be tantamount to acknowleding imperfection in Himself. So, when humanity screwed things up, they've been left on their own to "patch" things up.

I really like this quote so I'm still thinking about it.

 

I wanted to point out that it's significantly different from Christianity. We already knew RJ didn't feel the same need C. S. Lewis and Tolkein did, to make his fictional deity identical with the God of his own religion. But I think it's worth dwelling on the differences, because whether we believe or not, we're so familiar with God as a concept that we can assume the Creator is like God, or based on God, when he's not. I know I used to think this myself. I thought that because the WoT is presented as our world, and RJ was Christian, that the Creator was the Christian God. This is wrong though.

 

The Creator never sent prophets, endorsed a religion, performed a miracle, or went through the Incarnation. He may be good and powerful, but he's not all-good; he has a vain streak regarding his perfection. And he's not all-powerful; the Dark One is his rival. We might be tempted to think that "of course" the Dark One can't be the Creator's equal, or "of course" something else, but really we have to go by what's in the books, not our intuition, because WoT isn't our world. The physics doesn't work like our world either; stars never burn out, and the universe continues forever in spite of entropy.

[Mr_Fahrenheit]

Maybe the True Power can be used to seal the hole in the bore. After all the dark one cannot taint himself can he? Since rand can use the TP due to his linkage with Morridin he can use the true power. Is there a reason the one power can't be used this way?

[Barid Bel Medar]

Maybe the True Power can be used to seal the hole in the bore. After all the dark one cannot taint himself can he? Since rand can use the TP due to his linkage with Morridin he can use the true power. Is there a reason the one power can't be used this way?

 

The main problem with this is the DO controls who uses the True Power. It is basically his essance. I dont think he can be used against himself. As soon as the DO knows Rand is using the TP he will just cut it off. Even if it is through the link with MOridin, the DO can still cut it off. He wouldnt have any second thoughts about cutting Moridin off. Basically all he would have to do is flick the "off switch".