A New Verinism--Tomas.

[Dida]

So, ok, this may be reaching at straws, but something occurred to me when doing the write up for the DMDB Very Helpful Verin listing--specifically, Verin's behaviour was scoured prior to tGS for actions that were out of the ordinary (aka Verinisms). After tGS, though, we've not really paid attention to new abnormalities--oh people discuss her notes to Mat, but the spotlight on her seems to have faded.

 

Yet she does say some very weird things about her Warder, Tomas.

 

    The Horn of Valere I suspect has a very good chance of being the topic, with which Verin Sedai gave Tomas an offer to back against fight the Shadow in his last hour of life.  Tomas's last actions will directly aid in fulfilling the 'Prophecy of the Horn', and to fighting the Shadow successfully.  

 

 

   

   In 'the Great Hunt', Verin left behind her warder Tomas (darkfriend) to gallop after Perrin, Mat, Rand and Ingtar (darkfriend).  When I first read that scene 17-18 years ago, it always seemed an odd outlier, why?  Well, now because of 'The Gathering Storm' book we know that Tomas and Verin both were darkfriends.  So Verin left Tomas clueless for then, because of Tomas' prior Darkfriend Oaths and because she did not want to have to kill him.  She knew she could possibly trust a darkfriend in only his last hour of life.

 

   There is I think another reason, why Tomas is likely dead before Verin meets Egwene al'Vere in the White Tower (tGS).  I suspect Verin placed a binding weave on the 'Horn of Valare' when both she and Siuan stashed it away secretly. That same 'binding weave' and combination with Tomas' warder bond to Verin, would roughly confirm to her that Tomas was following her orders.  Binding weaves hold to silver & gold very well (tEotW book).  Those orders I suspect include moving the Horn of Valare into Caemlyn and possibly delivering one or more messages to Elayne and/or other individuals who Verin trusts, to past on to Mat.  Why? In case, Mat does not open Verin's previous letter given to him in person directly.  Verin knows Mat might not open her original letter, based on his prior attitude and demeanor in Murandy with the Band of Red Hand.  Verin knows that Mat is in Caemlyn, so I believe Verin moved the Horn of Valare to Caemlyn using her warder Tomas.  

 

 

  One can narrow down Tomas native homeland, by his name actually: Tomas.  Caraline  Damodred once created an Andoran pseudonym for Rand al'Thor called "Tomas Trakand", who supposedly was a cousin from Andor to cover-up his origins and to protect him from Toram Riatin (aCoS, Chapter 35 - Rand pov).   To truly fool Toram Riatin, that name had to be a common first name from Andor, otherwise Caraline's attempt is for not.  

 

 Tomas' family or his family is from parts around the Caemlyn region, and that region is where he died in his last hour.        

 

 

 A candidate for a message:  I do suspect that one of Verin Sedai's personal agents was the Second Librarian Milam Harnder in the Royal Palace library of Caemlyn.  The same man, who did not show up to meet Demira Eriff near the New City (LoC,Chapter 46).  Elayne's own First Maid, believes Milam Harnder to be an agent for the Brown Ajah, which he is too. Milam Harnder is also sending messages to White Tower, so his ultimately loyalty is in question still. Maybe Tomas gave Milam Harnder a message to pass to Elayne or Mat, for Mat hands ultimately?  Yet Verin was of the Brown Ajah, Black Ajah, and fighting in secret for the side of the Light.  

 

 

  Verin's own words to Mat Cauthon below, give a good deal of clues, I suspect into Tomas last hour of his life.  

 

 

Source: The Gathering Storm, book 12, Chapter "The Death of Tuon" - Mat point of view, with Verin Sedai, Tomas, Thom, and the Band of Red.

 

 

  "Perhaps. Perhaps not. First, we should negotiate my price for taking you to Andor.  I assume you want to reach Caemlyn?

 

  "Price?" Mat said.  "But you think the Pattern forced you here!  Why demand a price of me?"

 

  "Because," she said, raising a finger, "while I waited to find you--I honestly didn't know if it would be you or young Perrin--I realized that there were several things I could provide you that no other could." She reached into a pocket of her dress, pulling out several pieces of paper. One was the picture of Mat.  "You didn't ask where I got this."

 

...(skipped a few paragraphs)

 

 "Well, let us simply agree that you are in great, great danger.  I suggest that you be very careful during the next few weeks."

 

  "I'm always careful," Mat said.

 

 "Well, be more so," she said. "Go into hiding. Don't take chances. You will be essential before this is through."

 

   First, Verin tells Mat he is in grave danger from the Shadow. She obviously wants him to survive and to aid him. That is unique information, for Mat, the degree of the danger.  

 

   Second, Verin implies that she has unique knowledge and item(s) that can help Mat. Yet she does not verbally tell him about the Horn of Valere (tGS). Meaning some how Verin HAS to break through to Mat, and push the Horn of Valere into his hands again.  

 

   Third, only Verin and Siuan knew where the Horn of Valere was hidden. Except can Verin trust that Siuan can get access to the Horn of Valere, if it was hidden somewhere in Tar Valon, in the midst of a Siege?  Did Verin even know that Siuan was alive in 'The Gathering Storm'?  I believe Verin did not 'know' that Siuan have survived, let alone had been healed by Nynaeve.    

 

  Fourth, Verin knows the Last Battle is coming up soon (KoD). She knows that one important  part of the coming war, is to get the Horn into Mat's possession for the Light to have a chance.  Tomas is Verin's mechanism for do this, that is his part in fighting the Shadow.  Tomas setup Mat to gain the Horn of Valere in Caemlyn.  Verin knows that Mat wants nothing to be with Aes Sedai and probably would not willing want to go to Tar Valon himself.  So Tomas does what Mat does not want to, and cannot safely do himself (e.g.- Mesaana): move the Horn of Valere, out of Tar Valon, and places it in Caemlyn where Mat is now.

 

 

 

'Prophecy of the Horn'

 

Source: The Great Hunt, book 2, Chapter 5 "The Shadow in Shienar" - Moiraine point of view with Verin Sedai, Siuan alone in Fal Dara.[/i]

 

 

“The Horn of Valere, made to call dead heroes back from the grave. And prophecy said it would only be found just in time for the Last Battle.”

 

...(skipped paragraphs)

 

Moiraine nodded. Agelmar was familiar with the Prophecy of the Horn; most who fought the Dark One were. “ ‘Let whosoever sounds me think not of glory, but only of salvation.’ ”

 

“Salvation.” The Amyrlin laughed bitterly. “From the look in Agelmar’s eyes, he didn’t know whether he was giving away salvation or rejecting the condemnation of his own soul. He only knew he had to be rid of it before it burned him up. He has tried to keep it secret, but he says there are rumors in the keep already. I do not feel his temptation, yet the Horn still makes my skin crawl. He will have to take it back into his strongroom until I leave. I could not sleep with it even in the next room.” She rubbed frown lines from her forehead and sighed. “And it was not to be found until just before the Last Battle. Can it be that close? I thought, hoped, we would have more time.”

 

[farthammer]

 

I find it highly unlikely that the Dark One had anything to do with the wording of the oaths sworn by Black Ajah members.  The Oath Rod was rediscovered by 3rd Age Aes Sedai between the Trolloc Wars and the War of a Hundred Years.  In other words, when Ishamael was 'asleep'.  There have been Darkfriends among the Aes Sedai since the Trolloc Wars Ishamael once said.  Thus, it follows that the Black Ajah had at least some members when the Oath Rod was rediscovered and the Three Oaths introduced.  

 

I have a hard time seeing any particular case more likely than the next but I can see your point.  Your post actually makes me wonder if the oath she swore when joining the BA was modified by Verin in such a subtle way no one picked up on the loophole.  That'd strike me as a fairly AS thing to do.  Verin is also so old she may have even had enough time to climb the ranks to then make that modification a permanent one.

 

The loophole also makes it possible to interrogate any BA found.  Just give them some Verin Poison first.

[CUBAREY]

Exactly! That was just what I thought when I read Luckers' post that Verin might simply have lied about Tomas. It is possible that she set him up like Lan to have his bond passed to someone else, and whatever his task then or her motives about it, it would make perfect sense not to tell Egwene. Even though she trusts her, she obviously doesn't trust her with everything, like the letter she gave to Mat. An hour would have been enough to tell about it, so it looks like she's got things in motion after her death that we will still find out, it seems.

 

Except she could have easily sidestepped the issue with Egwene without having to lie. Why is it so hard to belive that Tomas may have prefered to die at the same time as Verin and that Verin would have honored his wish?

[farthammer]

It isn't necessarily.  If Verin is telling the truth then they both sought to avoid death, to the point they'd consider becoming or remaining darkfriends.  It is believable that with time and old age that they'd finally accept death.  But up until now neither were quite ready.

[MikeRiley]

So Tomas does what Mat does not want to, and cannot safely do himself (e.g.- Mesaana): move the Horn of Valere, out of Tar Valon, and places it in Caemlyn where Mat is now.

 

Tomas could have done this without having to die first, though. I assume he Traveled to Caemlyn so if that binder was also meant to be lethal to the person who picked it up then that might explain this, but then we would have to be able to explain why Verin would place such a weave on it knowing just who was meant to take it. The Black Ajah did not know the Horn was in Tar Valon or else it would have been relocated immediately to Shayol Ghul as was intended in The Great Hunt.

[OptimusPrime]

Dida, I am impressed. Very well thought out and reasonable.

 

So Tomas does what Mat does not want to, and cannot safely do himself (e.g.- Mesaana): move the Horn of Valere, out of Tar Valon, and places it in Caemlyn where Mat is now.

 

Tomas could have done this without having to die first, though. I assume he Traveled to Caemlyn so if that binder was also meant to be lethal to the person who picked it up then that might explain this, but then we would have to be able to explain why Verin would place such a weave on it knowing just who was meant to take it. The Black Ajah did not know the Horn was in Tar Valon or else it would have been relocated immediately to Shayol Ghul as was intended in The Great Hunt.

 

Thing is, Verin probably kept the Horns location even from Tomas until recently. She said herself that it needed to be found right before the end, she herself considers the timing of it all to be important enough; why would Tomas need to know where it is until it was time?

[Charlz Guybon]

It's not so solid as that. We know that when he was completely and physically free it was for durations of around forty years. When these forty year cycles happened is less certain however--we know, for instance, that he was free to command the Trolloc Wars, and then free to create and organise the Black Ajah less then four hundred years later.

 

Huh? I thought the Black Ajah was founded during the Trolloc Wars, where does this "four hundred years later" come from?

[Luckers]

The Black Ajah was created just after the Trolloc Wars. The Wars themselves went on for over three hundred years. So if he was free just prior to the beginning of the Wars, and just after their ceasation, its just under four hundred years between the two periods of freedom.

[Charlz Guybon]

The Black Ajah was created just after the Trolloc Wars. The Wars themselves went on for over three hundred years. So if he was free just prior to the beginning of the Wars, and just after their ceasation, its just under four hundred years between the two periods of freedom.

I know you're almost always right about these things, but can I have a citation, because that's directly contrary to how I remember it.  ???