Verin (Full Book Spoilers)

[WolfDragonFox]

Removed. Rude.

[Luckers]

Ok, this is in sight of my request for niceness, and with you people editing your post still out of control. I considered locking it but until the board is unlocked thats limiting discussion, so I'm gonna apply what worked in the Channeler Strength thread and edit everything objectionable on the last page. Not even gonna read through--if I see agressive words its gone.

 

I did ask quite nicely. Verin, people. That is what this thread is about.

[cleantoe]

Ok, this is in sight of my request for niceness, and with you people editing your post still out of control. I considered locking it but until the board is unlocked thats limiting discussion, so I'm gonna apply what worked in the Channeler Strength thread and edit everything objectionable on the last page. Not even gonna read through--if I see agressive words its gone.

 

I did ask quite nicely. Verin, people. That is what this thread is about.

 

You have edited this post at least three times in the last 18 minutes. That is all. ;)

[Luckers]

I was angry and therefore blunt. I still am quite angry. Less blunt though.

[JakeBarnes]

I think I remember a 'Purple Ajah' theory from a couple years ago.  I guess Verin sort of proved that.

[MauricXe]

I wonder if the Creator will shield her soul from the Dark One.  Hopefully, he doesn't steal her soul and torture her and/or make her serve him.

[Sharaman]

Don't you think it would be fun if GLoD resurrected Verin, mindtrapped her and made her serve Moridin?

She'd have to find more inventive ways to weasel around. 

[Vulgir]

I wish you could make a Rude Removed thread, i want to see all the spiteful banter i missed while i was up to my eyes in red wine and christmass cookies.

[Thews Lerin]

It's pointless, not unbecoming. We be WoT fans you silly newbie. Inane debate is what we do; it's who we are.

 

Seriously though, it's not your place to tell people what to discuss. That's my job. And since I'm in on this inane little discussion, that's not gonna happen.

 

Abuse of power? I think so!

 

Wait... what?

 

I think so too. Apparently, rude is in the eye of the moderator.  ;) As BS said in his interview, might does not make right.

 

On the subject of Verin - When Egwene said that she saw Verin's soul and it was white, she couldn't literally SEE Verin's soul. She was trying to be comforting. Verin made certain oaths to the DO (she doesn't elaborate) and nothing she did has removed those oaths. She got around them, but didn't remove them. As a result, the DO has control of her soul post-death, just as he did with the various Chosen who weren't balefired.

BS said that we haven't seen the last of Verin. Perhaps it's just because we still have some time between her meetin with Mat and her death to catch up on... perhaps she will be transmigrated.

I like the cour'souvra idea mentioned above because the DO wouldn't go to the trouble of giving her a new body just to let her run around and cause more trouble. I don't think he'd bother unless he wanted to punish her and/or make an example out of her.

 

Just my two coppers, but hey, I'm another "silly newbie" so feel free to pick my ideas apart.

[WolfDragonFox]

I guess I don't really know why I was edited Luckers since I don't recall it but I'll stand behind your decision to do so since I know that stuff was getting nuts between them. 

 

And Thews Lerin, don't use that post he made about my comment since he and I clarified it was a joke, find another example to get your point across.  Luckers a pretty darn good moderator and lets most things fly freely.  That got outta hand and its over and edited so lets all move forward and talk about Verin some more since she is a super hero.

 

BTW JakeBarnes, I don't remember the purple ajah theory being about an ajah of double agents, if i'm wrong on that sorry.  I def could be.

[JakeBarnes]

It wasn't about double agents, it was an ajah dedicated to serving the pattern.  This would, however, include double agents.

 

From the FAQ:

Second Foundation Ajah Theory (aka Purple Ajah Theory)

Theory: Verin is a member of a secret society whose members preserve ancient knowledge for humanity's need at the Last Battle. The existence of the BA shows that it is possible for a secret group to exist in the Tower-- if there is a group dedicated to evil, why not a group dedicated to good?

[cleantoe]

I guess I don't really know why I was edited Luckers since I don't recall it but I'll stand behind your decision to do so since I know that stuff was getting nuts between them. 

 

And Thews Lerin, don't use that post he made about my comment since he and I clarified it was a joke, find another example to get your point across.  Luckers a pretty darn good moderator and lets most things fly freely.  That got outta hand and its over and edited so lets all move forward and talk about Verin some more since she is a super hero.

 

BTW JakeBarnes, I don't remember the purple ajah theory being about an ajah of double agents, if i'm wrong on that sorry.  I def could be.

 

I saw what you wrote before it was edited out. Although I can't recall specifically what it was about, I remember it wasn't anything offensive.

 

But Luckers was on the warpath and was editing out anything that even sniffed aggressive, so your post was a casualty of war (friendly-fire).

[WolfDragonFox]

Yeah I figured so cleantoe...and Jake, thanks for the PA clarification.  I was never much into that theory thats why I didn't know about it so much. 

[Sharaman]

Luckers edited out my last post as well, made days ago even though it had nothing to do with ETE and Thews Lerin scrapping with each other. So you're not the only collateral damage, WDF.

Verin seems to have been the one and only member of the PA.

 

[Vulgir]

Well technically, i would say shes  a "Gray Friend"  and say that she and her warder were the only 2 "Grey Friends" Thus far.

 

(3 if you count Ingtar)

[WolfDragonFox]

Ingtar really shouldn't be counted though I like the thought that he might be since he did change in the end, but I would say this was Rand's Ta'varen chance manipulation that touched on the small part of Ingtar that wanted to redeem himself and turn back to the light...so if it happened w/o Rand, Perrin, or Mat around I would say yes to his membership of the Grey Friends club Vulgir since I love that scene so much.

[Eht Slat Meit]

Ingtar really shouldn't be counted though I like the thought that he might be since he did change in the end, but I would say this was Rand's Ta'varen chance manipulation that touched on the small part of Ingtar that wanted to redeem himself and turn back to the light...so if it happened w/o Rand, Perrin, or Mat around I would say yes to his membership of the Grey Friends club Vulgir since I love that scene so much.

 

Actually, I'd have to disagree on this one - like the others, Ingtar got a radical kick in the face to what he thinks he knows about himself from traveling through the Portal Stones. Quoting Leigh Butler, since I can't find the exact text:

^{Ingtar tells Rand he is the better man. It was salvation Ingtar was thinking of, to sound the Horn and ride against Shayol Ghul; surely that would enough to redeem him. Rand sags back, anguished, and tells Ingtar that he thinks all you need to do to come back to the Light is to want to do it. Ingtar flinches, and says that he lived other lives while they were trapped by the Portal Stone, and in every one, he never escaped, never did what he swore he would do, but Rand was ready to give it up to save a friend. There must be a price paid, Ingtar says; perhaps he can pay it here.}

 

Ingtar has the benefit of not being bound to Shai'tan like channelers are with Oaths, but what he does is as much an act of seeking redemption as Verin giving Egewene the Book, with the main difference being that Verin spent her whole life making up for her decision. He realizes that the Horn isn't the key, but saving the others.

 

I wouldn't be surprised if we see one or both of them at the Last Battle. Redemption or not, there's a price to be paid.

[WolfDragonFox]

Ah yes the portal stones incident...so much great content in this series, I forgot for a moment, thanks for the reminder, I know agree and absolutely count Ingtar as a Grey friend.

[thewalrus777]

Ah yes the portal stones incident...so much great content in this series, I forgot for a moment, thanks for the reminder, I know agree and absolutely count Ingtar as a Grey friend.

 

The Grey friends, are an example of how someone who has fell so far into the Shadow, can be brought back to the light. No matter what someone has done in their past the can repent. Verin was never BA in her heart. She did what she did to try and better the world for it. Huzzzah, to the beginning of the Grey Friends network. Proving redemption is NOT impossible.

 

Well impossible for Fain and the Forsaken...

[Luckers]

I guess I don't really know why I was edited Luckers since I don't recall it but I'll stand behind your decision to do so since I know that stuff was getting nuts between them. 

 

As I recall you were telling people to drop the 'crap'. Nice sentiments, too harshly worded.

 

Everything even slightly harsh went.

[JakeBarnes]

'Grey Friend', I kind of like that.  Luckers, give it the DM stamp of approval.

[Luckers]

I have an instinctive Australian hate of the word 'Grey'.

 

What about dark-curious?

[thewalrus777]

I have an instinctive Australian hate of the word 'Grey'.

 

What about dark-curious?

 

That sounds really naughty! ;)

[JakeBarnes]

I have an instinctive Australian hate of the word 'Grey'.

 

 

Maybe I'm just ignorant of Aussie culture, but what does this mean?

 

 

[Luckers]

I was marked down for spelling things 'Gray'. That be American. So despite the fact that that's how its spelt in the books we were writing reports on we lost marks on it.

 

My english teacher was a Nazi.