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DRAGONMOUNT

A WHEEL OF TIME COMMUNITY

muddasssir

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Posts posted by muddasssir

  1. There are three things that Egwene’s supporters have never bothered to answer or if they have, they glossed over it as if it does not matter. First, Rand will have to break the seals on the DO’s prison we know it since book 6 LoC. Remember an old philosopher by the name of Herid Fel who was killed by the Gholam for he was about t explain something to Rand. His note was something like and I am quoting from memory if someone can find the exact quote that will be very kind. “Chaos and strife weakens the seals. While peace and harmony strengthen them, you have to clear the rubble before you can rebuild, will explain when I see you next do not bring the girl too pretty and distracts me.” There was something else there that I am not able to bring out of my memory again the actual quote will be appreciated. But, the point is that is when Min started taking interest in those books. She along with Rand is the only other person who knows that Heid Fel had figured it out and that is why shadow had him killed. Therefore, unlike egwene’s off screen preparation for the last battle we have a solid foreshadowing that Rand has to break the seals. Second, Amyrilin and Aes-Sedai were held in awe, fear or respect. World has since changed. They are no longer the biggest, meanest or the most powerful dog in the yard. There are plenty of other channelers and since Dumai’s well and aes Sedai becoming Da’stang at the hand of wise ones they do not command the same respect as they once did. In fact, if you take a look you will find that tower’s influence is reducing with every day. As for respect among wise ones, do you really think that they are going to listen to Egwene if it comes to a conflict between her and Rand? You might be prescient but from what we have read to date even being very polite, it is improbable. Tear and Illian barely came, border landers have sworn to Rand and Ebou dari king is with Rand. That just leave Andor with Egwene as Mayene, Ghealdan and white cloaks are sworn to Perrin who we can safely say is with Rand. She is really as powerful as president of U.S.A. Third, again nobody bothered to answer that we hear in avi’s journey through glass columns that White tower has fallen. In that meeting of elders someone tells it just before Aiel decide to return to waste. Hostilities broke out after about twenty years of dragon’s peace. With queen of Andor an Aes sedai and close friend and she being the leader of forces of light. Why are Seanchan just traipsing through the Rand land. What was the most powerful and the best Amyrilin ever was doing for twenty years if Seanchan just walked through. Especially, if you remember that Seanchan damane cannot link. Pleas or once answer with facts rather than innuendos and hunches.

  2. Ok people, Luckers is going to be really angry with me but so be it. I practically started the Egwene hate threads at DM as well as wotmania. I started the first thread with the title of,” characters you hate most on the side of light” and my vote was for Egwene, Gawyn and Faile.

     

    I have given it a lot of thought and as I said before, I do try to be neutral. Than how come do I still hate Egwene? Well I will try to understand and answer this question and I do not believe that any of the “smart people” who love Egwene are going to change their opinion however well I present my case. This is just an attempt to make all of us unreasonable people who hate Egwene from stop doing it.

     

    One last thing before I present my case. I absolutely love RJ and his writing style. That is what makes this story what it is. We love these characters, hate these characters, laugh with them, cry with them, laugh at them and even feel that they are laughing at us. Fred Saberhagen said about this series, a very gifted writer can make readers want to believe that what they are reading is true and makes him or her wish that this is true and it is actually happening somewhere and side of light is going to win. The famous line that all orbit paperbacks carried, “solid than a steel blade and glowing with true magic“, of course follows it. I completely agree with Fred here, this story does wake up that small child inside of me and want me to believe in something larger than ourselves and that power of good will prevail over evil.

     

    All of us have followed this series and we have watched as each character evolved and grew. They took up their mantles and became as we see them. Why we hate Egwene? Well, if you have followed the story from start as I am sure, you would have. You will realize that egwene was this little chit of a girl, a little obnoxious brat who liked to butt in where she was not wanted and thought too highly of herself. I can quote a million examples and I am sure that someone would have already quoted them alredy and most of you know it by heart by now and it would serve no purpose except repeating. Nevertheless, if you take a look at the series you would see that has been pretty much the pattern. We have a character that is a pure waste of space and we see how it evolves into someone brilliant.

     

    I mean look at Mat, for first three books, he was pathetic and at the current point in story I can safely say that he is one of the favorite characters of the series with more than 80% of the fans. I apologize to all people who cannot stand him but if they cannot stand him, I wonder why are still reading the series. It is not just Mat look at all the main characters take Nynaeve, she was an obnoxious little bitch too full of herself. Take Rand, way he grows into his role. Moiraine, we all love her now but she frustrated us no end with all her mysterious cool. This has been pretty much a norm with this story. People grow and evolve they change with time and become better. Then why do we not give the same benefit to Egwene?

     

    Well, there are two parts to Egwene’s story, one is before she went to Salidar and second is when she becomes Amyrilin. This is the point where people started liking Egwene or to start voicing their liking of Egwene more vociferously as now they felt they have something to fight with. What she had done to that point can be generously called nothing to write home about. I mean look at all the main characters you will see that by the end of book 6 they have all come a long way and done stuff. While if you look at Egwene up to that point what she achieved is;

    • Butting her head in where she was not wanted becoming a burden and flirting with Aram (tEotW)
    • Becoming a Damane (tGH)
    • Getting captured by BA having to be rescued by Mat and then treat him as shit (tDR)
    • Doing nothing except twiddling her thumbs (tSR)
    • Getting her rare side whipped at the hand of Lanfear and doing nothing (tFoH)
    • Becoming an Amyrilin for no quality of her own and trying to manipulate Mat(LoC)

     

    On the other hand, if you take a look at other main characters, Rand fights and defeats 4 or 5 forsaken takes Tear, gets Aiel to follow him, Conquers Andor and become a ruler. Perrin becomes a wolf brother, defeats trollocs in two rivers and fights at dumai’s well. Mat kills Couladin forms the band of red hand and becomes a general. Nynaeve takes on a forsaken beats her twice, captures her and heals stilling. While Egwene is earning ji and incurring toh. Even after that, you see other characters continue to grow while she does nothing and then all of sudden in book 10 RJ decided that it is high time that Egwene’s character should develop and voila, we have miracles happening right, left and center. Again, we have had this argument a million times. How she out maneuvers people, who literally have centuries of more experience than she does and how she does about faces.

     

    Therefore, what happened is that she was not allowed to have the same space and time to grow and evolve that other had. However, she had to reach a certain point in story for all the arcs to merge and reach the conclusion. Therefore, her arc gets hurried and haphazard. Which in turn means that we have a character that has not been written well. They left her until too late and then did not grow her well. Well, it means writers are at fault but what happens is that we have refused to believe that these are characters in a book and that also a fantasy book. Therefore, we have these big fights defending and hating Egwene.

     

    Having said that if you take a closer look you will find that all the people who are defending Egwene are the people who defend Tor in everything, may that be splits or delays. They have appointed themselves the guardian saints of Tor. I have no problem with them if they say that we like this character because writer wants us to like it. Problem is that they try to defend what cannot be defended. They try to raise an argument out of pure conjecture as someone posted she is preparing off screen. I mean seriously? How do you know that, I mean if this is the level of arguments I do not want to discuss that.

     

    I guess I have antagonized everyone enough, so as far as I am concerned, here is the clincher. Everyone is setting great store in Aviendha’s vision that she had in glass columns. There is a scene in it where someone comes in and says White tower has fallen. If you look at the timeline, you will see it has to be within hundred years of last battle. Therefore, Egwene should be the Amyrilin and even if she was not she had twenty years of peace until the hostilities break out. What was she doing throughout this period if Seanchan were having a walk in a park of it? She is a sworn enemy of Seanchan. Why did not she do something about it? RJ and now BS have been telling us through out that she is an incompetent little bitch but you would just not listen to them.

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