I've been away, several issues not the least of which a de-laminating tyre causing 1000's in damage to my X5. Paying work restarting, the boss away for 6 weeks and a desperate need to invest more time on my own writing. I've had a quick perusal of a few messages here and it's clear this thread is going nowhere. My final statement, anyone who has read the books and believes the TV series is an acceptable adaptation of the books is NOT a fan of the books and is in desperate need of psychological evaluation. The books are awesome ! The show is barely average ! EVERY person who has influence over the scripting of the show needs to be PUBLICLY FLOGGED ! It's that simple ! Ciao for now.

It's not me trying to have it both ways. You are not reading or not understanding. I really don't feel like dumbing it down this far. In fact I don't have time now I'm back at work. I'll do it later, maybe. Oh WTF is "the motte and bailey game" ?????

You need to go back and slowly read the original posts. Keep them in context and then read my responses. Don't try and read between my lines, there is nothing there, I type upfront nothing hidden. Slow down, preferably stop, the knee jerk reactions. read only what I type, don't put words or thoughts that are not there in my mouth/typing. I'm reading what you are typing and responding to that. Please do the same for me.

At no stage did I say that. READ what is written. Again READ what is written and refresh what you think you know about the suit in 2015. You are clearly confused about it.

Wow it is clearly you who does not know what they are on about here. Of course there is a written agreement, regardless of the form it takes. What you think they just shook hands do you? Again wrong, I thought you knew what the suit was about. It was regards whether or not she new about the production or not. She said she did not they said of course you did. The fact that the production was utter garbage did not come in to it. ( read my reply above again after this and tell me there was no contract).

I must question this myself. I would expect the last thing Amazon "wants" to do is divide the fan base. A large consolidated fan base has the potential to bring more viewers, just what Amazon wants.

So wrong it's funny. As I've pointed out I doubt Harriet could get herself removed from the project even if she wanted to. The producers love her name attached to the project and would even if she never did a single seconds work on it. Can't fault her for joining in in the first place. It's Amazon, they've done good work in the past.

Wow so naive. I'd day she is contractually bound. What is shown on paper often varies wildly from what a project ultimately winds up being. Dune (1984) can act as an example again here. David Lynch was the director of this movie and left quite a bit of shot footage on the cutting room floor. He was pleased with the released version. Some time later (well after the successful release) the producers re-edited the movie and put a lot of what Lynch had cut back in. The producers had the gall to call it the directors cut. Lynch had told them he removed those scenes to improve the flow, continuity and watch-ability of the movie. He was so incensed he insisted his name not be included in the credits. If you are unfortunate enough to watch the "Directors Cut" of Dune (1984) you will quickly realise Lynch was right to do so. It's a dreadful version with the smooth flow and pace of the original completely lost. Did you watch the interview on you tube. I'm pretty sure you know about the 2015 law suit. The law suit alone negates your argument here. Sorry you've lost me with this. How is this relavent to what I said? Before anyone jumps in. Harriet, if she wanted to, can not get he name removed from the show as a consultant unless the producers agree. Almost any word spoken from her mouth whilst on set could be argued as her consulting, " I like that costume" would be enough. Legally she did consult so there is no legal argument to force removal of her name. It could be argued that there is a legal requirement her name must be included. I apologise for the formatting of the replay, It's clear I've had issues with this post, it would be great if a person could delete and start again. The software does not appear to support that.

My point is I find nothing to support claims that Harriet likes what the series has done to the books! Find me one Harriet quote made after the shows release in 2021 that supports this claim. You will almost certainly not find one in either direction as it's clear she is being "legally" careful. Possibly due to the 2015 debacle during which she was sued directly. If she had only good things to say she would be saying them. I've never heard of anyone getting jumped on or sued for saying positive things about someone else's work.

Hmmm. Simple I thought. They are platitudes. A tactical response. Meaningless words to sidetrack an awkward question. Non specific, diversionary and placating.

Watching the interview again, the interviewer states she submitted her questions to Harriet before time. It's not hard to see both of them dance around the TV series. The only direct question, asked in jest and as an after thought, about the TV series was "can you tell us when season 2 is coming out".

As for the YouTube video interview I especially like Harriet's response when asked what she thought was the overall message or her favourite theme or themes from the books. "Good and Evil always fighting. Always going to rule the world."

I disagree and would suggest that Harriet had her husbands books in her mind when speaking. Also this is a quote from a 2023 live stream. In 2019 these platitudes were spoken by the show runner; Showrunner Rafe Judkins has repeatedly praised McDougal's helpful involvement in the series, saying that she's been a "hugely helpful support".[1] On her involvement in the series, Judkins said:[2] If you can't see that for what it is then ..... This is while it's being filmed. I haven't found anything from Harriet, directly related to the series, since the completion of season one. Just to clarify Harriet's 2023 quote has no context from the source I garnered it from. We do not know what prompted this quote.

I just now found this. What a great lady.

Interesting. When I Googled; "What does Harriet McDougal think of The Wheel of Time TV series" I got; What does Harriet McDougal think of The Wheel of Time show? My feeling is that television is a different medium from the written word, and what happens on the screen is as different from what happens in the book as swimming is from walking. They're very different.

Again I disagree, I quite enjoyed it and was looking forward to seeing more. No TV or movie has ever inspired me to seek out the books. Curiosity about the differences brought me to listen to A Song of Ice and Fire. Which brought disappointment when I went looking for an audio book version of book 6 in that series, only to find that the printed version had not even been written yet. Ho hum, pull your finger out George !!!

Funny neither am I by you not being.

As I've clearly indicated I believe the series can be filmed without deviating as far as this series has. I won't write my first thoughts for this response. Yes I know about the repartitions in the books. As someone listening to them for the second time, one after the other it's only mildly annoying but completely understandable. Clearly the series does not have to do that, there are other means. Yeah completely in the dark with what you are on about here. Point 3 was; "3. Accounts for filming constraints (time, money, actor availability, CGI capabilities, sets etc.) " My response was; 3: GoT managed it. Why not this mob? (CGI in this era has only cost as a restraint) GoT as in Game of Thrones. My answer stands and eliminates the point. If another company (HBO) can "Accounts for filming constraints (time, money, actor availability, CGI capabilities, sets etc.) ". Then why not Amazon! You not read so good much ay! Dune (1984) was used as an example of how you can successfully film internal monologues. Nothing more. If it can be done once it can be done again. Not understanding that is clearly your problem, not a problem I have. I also quite enjoyed Dune (1984) as I do the remake. Hmm again an issue with reading... or maybe comprehension. I did not "just say" be closer to the books. What I said was; 5: Edit and script the books. It's accepted that a lot of pages will not be filmed and/or heavily compressed. Game of Thrones cleverly amalgamated several "less major" characters into one and it worked fine there because they were careful and clever. I often wonder what we would be watching if HBO had TWoT. Well that seals it, if you are right, any show who's audience is 95% casual viewer is going to be canned for sure. As for Carvil he is a good actor, not great just good. But that, again, was not my point.

Yeah.. Nah. Disagree with everything you said, except I too have not read the source material for SaB.

Agreed.

I believe this is were we truly realise that two different people can read the same thing and draw different conclusions. IMHO Perrin is NEVER guilt ridden in the books. He has some guilt over the death of a couple of Whitecloaks but only some. His defining characteristics are humble, frightened, considered thought and physical presence. He is scared about his wolf powers and that he may forget himself and be trapped in the "dreams". He uses the Whitecloak deaths as a crotch later in book 4 as an aid to justify his secret plan to free Emond's Field from the pathological zealots by surrendering himself to them. He clearly has some guilt but it hardly "defines" him. His other characteristics define him far more than his mild guilt. One thing is VERY clear, in the books Perrin is not the sniveling, cowed, sad sack he is in the series. He has smiled once in the series, whilst Egwene danced with the tinkers, that's 2 seasons and one smile. A moment when he forgot himself amongst the music and celebration. He is not the same person as in the books.

1: Is a bland question with almost infinite answers but my mine would be to "Stick Closer To The Books!" 2: The very annoying "previously on..." covers a lot of this, but I for one, on complex story lines, re-watch previous seasons before the new. I know I'm not the only one. 3: GoT managed it. Why not this mob? (CGI in this era has only cost as a restraint) 4: This one is easy, I've never understood why people believe "internal monologues" can not be filmed, check out Dune (1984). Good acting, clever editing and sound. 5: Edit and script the books. It's accepted that a lot of pages will not be filmed and/or heavily compressed. Game of Thrones cleverly amalgamated several "less major" characters into one and it worked fine there because they were careful and clever. I often wonder what we would be watching if HBO had TWoT. Do they really expect to stretch this out over 12 years. For the human characters the books span only a few years. Poor Maisey Williams had her chest heavily strapped towards the end of GoT. We have already had one major character re=cast. If you think "The Witcher" will be as good with the loss of Henry Cavill, I suggest thinking harder. TWoT will be lucky to have a season 4 at this rate. If they can axe "Shadow and Bone" they can axe anything, good story, good acting, good scripts and excellent production value and it still got axed.

This example might been even better. Would anyone say these events/stories are the same. Some people here clearly would. The white settlement of North America. The Spanish invasion of South America. The English settlement of Australia. The Movie Avatar. These all have the same underlying story, except for Avatar, at the end, where the natives actually win. A group of humans travel great distance to settle a remote land. Once there they enforce there will and beliefs upon the less technically advanced natives. Fighting and bloodshed ensues.

As I've intimated before I'll give a clearer example, I hope. 2 people leave on trip from A to Z both people travel through the same 24 places in between, they do not travel together, both arrive at Z with one having enjoyed the journey and the other hating it. I would not say they both had the same holiday. But you would. I say they didn't because the journey through all those points is what matters. What happened to each of them and how. The way events unfolded for each makes each one have their own story and they are completely different even though they both visited the same 26 points. I like the journey in the books and see little resemblance to it in the series. Aside from the metaphorical 26 points.

Woh, Gilt ridden. Perrin is NOT gilt ridden in the books. He is cautious and deliberate of thought in the books, mildly fearful of his size and strength when he was younger and that has an influence on him now but not guilt ridden. I ask this, what in the first 4 books has he to have guilt for.