3 minutes ago, EmreY said:

 

And that may be a problem.  It may be difficult to accept / seen as too easy (for those that didn't read thousands of words to get to the Battle at Maradon) that Rand has become so powerful.  Not to mention that he apparently gives off a spiritual light that causes darkfriends to claw their eyes out.

 

And for those who are upset at the level of power/control demonstrated by the five at Tarwin's Gap, I have dredged up this old thread https://dragonmount.com/forums/topic/59591-why-did-rj-turn-the-channeling-system-on-its-head/ where the same criticisms are levelled at RJ.

 

.

with the excuses being considerably more elaborate than any yet given in this thread:

 

 

Not only had the argument regarding the end of the rigorous magic system been made before, it has been levelled at the author of that system.  Time to untwist our knickers, I think.

I haven't gotten my knickers in a twist since 1995. Dark days, darker nights.

But yes for the love of heck can we chill the holy fridge out? 

8 hours ago, KakitaOCU said:

  

I wasn't putting it out as a perfectly reasonable power comparison.

The argument made was that it was completely over the top to have five linked women which included Nynaeve and Egwene devastate at max 10k trollocs.  When I pointed out that it was just raw lightning someone else insisted it was wrong because it approached Rand.  I pointed out that Rand shows an astronomically higher level of control and power despite also killing only 10k trollocs in a given scene.

 

 

No, I genuinely thought flat out saying One person's show of power was far more complicated and difficult to do than another's flat out said I thought one person was stronger.  I flat out said what Rand did was harder to do than what Amalisa with her circle did.  There was no ambiguity.  It wasn't until you said I was being vague that it even occurred to me to think someone read "What Rand did is more complex and harder than what Amalisa did" as something other than "Rand is stronger."

 

  

Who said it missed no trollocs?  It broke their line, tons could have retreated.   All we know is it killed a ton and stopped the attack.

Who said it hit no bystanders, I wouldn't be surprised if it killed anyone who was still alive in the gap.  Avoiding the city is broad control of aiming it forward, not the same as actually directing it at targets.  The were out in front of the city and then built the storm in front of them.
 

 

When being driven by Callandor and just raining lightning he does.  But the person I'm debating with is comparing Ep 8 to what Rand does at the Manor or Maradon.  The argument being that it cheapens what Rand did, where as my argument is that Rand is showing ridiculous levels of control and power at those points.

 

  

If she knew Nynaeve's strength or Egwenes and either of them were capable of channeling, sure.  But Nynaeve was MIA at that point and Egwene hadn't even gottern her basic little crash course yet.  

Also Moiraine is a full Aes Sedai with the Oaths and knowing she may have to answer for it in the Tower. I don't think Amalisa considered those things at all.

14 hours ago, KakitaOCU said:

Conceit that they're not full Aes Sedai?  Same reason as in the books.
 

 

Sorry, I wasn't aware I wasn't forwarding a direct opinion.  Rand is stronger than Nynaeve+Egwene.  What he did may have been a similar level of total destruction but the control and precision shows significantly more power.

Also, he doesn't almost burn out and die in the process. They were linked and almost died. He will do it on his own and just be like "no problem".

14 hours ago, Raal Gurniss said:

Ahh….But why not keep such around to form circles? I mean they could have higher numbers to boost their ranks and not a force anywhere could stand against them…..

That is part of the Aes Sedai arrogance that is going to be shown more and more, by my guess anyway. We will be shown how stupid and prideful they are. They go around saying men did all this bad, but then they will do it too, and it will take our EF5 to highlight the hypocrisy and reset the balance. I believe that's where the show is going.

1 hour ago, KakitaOCU said:

They actually gave us a gauge to read strength in the series.  Best example for Moraine is her vs Logain in Ep 4.  She has a single, fairly thick line of Saidar flowing to her.  I'd judge about half a foot up to a foot diameter.

Now check the fight at the end of Ep 8,  The two nameless ones have maybe wrist thick single strands, Amalisa seems to have 2 about the same.  Putting those 4 together would be comparable to Moraine, though you're welcome to debate since we don't fully understand what the threads signify.

Meanwhile Egwene has 3 threads comparable to Moraine and Nynaeve has 5.  Which at face value puts the two of them together at being somewhere between 4 and 8 times more powerful.  

 

I like you. You should stop by for coffee/tea/cocoa and book talks. 

1 hour ago, Skipp said:

 

Showing the relationship between Rand and Egwene.  It is going to be a lot more impactful when they realize that they are not for each other.

 

The relationship between Lan and Nynaeve is so much more fleshed out in the show.  Part of this is because we don't see everything only through Rand.

 

I adored the confrontation between Rand and the DO in the show more than the way it is shown in the book as it parallels the ending of the series nicely.

 

I prefer the Tinkers in the show compared to the books.  I think the show did a much better job of making the Way of the Leaf enticing.  Aram is a much more enjoyable character in the show.

 

I think making the Whitecloaks more of a threat for the show is going to work out well.  I loved every scene with Valda and am hoping to see more of Bornhald.

 

This is what I can think off of the top of my head this morning.

 

So far for me the best change is the lack of RJs spanking fetish. 

5 minutes ago, KakitaOCU said:

No, she says "you're not from the two rivers" and Nynaeve doesn't respond with details.   Which means she could still be TR adjacent and able to be descended from Manetheren (or not, we don't know).  Or maybe she's just not from Emond's Field and Moraine is trying to see if she'll slip any extra info.

Just because we don't KNOW an answer doesn't make it a contradiction or a plot hole.  Not until the series is complete.

Now, if at the end that's never explained, then I'd grant weak writing, but considering we're able to find multiple solutions to the issue without much effort and we're on season 1 of a theoretical 8, it's not unexpected to have gaps in our knowledge.

Yes and also a young looking woman has been cast as her Mother, so it looks like a flashback is going to filmed so we can WAFO soo enough.

It is fun to have, but you have to know how ?‍♀️??

Since Nynaeve can channel it's likely one of her parents had the ability as well, whether they were aware of it or not. I see a 3-4 year old, small for her age Nynaeve being hidden by her young and desperate parents, maybe already injured or something. Her mother knows this is it. Her last words to her daughter are more than just words, and the words along with the touch of the one power make a pretty big impression. It's something that comes to her when she is afraid or struggling because of her mother's great want for her to remember and feel comforted by it .

Even without magic sometimes moments of intense trauma can cause you to remember unlikely things. 

15 hours ago, Gothic Flame said:

No no... I recall watching that show myself and I thought he was damn good looking. (Me=straight guy) However, I was 9 when that show premiered and Melissa Sue Anderson was um...interesting looking. 

Imagine if we had had internet forums and groups when that stuff was The Thing????

Back in my day we could watch 4 shows. Sesame street, Bonanza, Little House on the Prairie, and Jonny Carson. That was it !! And we liked it!

No.... that's not really true. I think my mom was just into Michael Landon? Gross? Definitely gross.

Sesame Street, though? Top notch television my friends.

I remember when the first televised interracial kiss on Star Trek and how much everyone freaked out about it. ??????? Because of the Agenda ??

I was already a mom when Ellen DeGeneres first came out as gay irl and on her sitcom, and it was almost immediately cancelled. That was the Gay Agenda. ? 

Sorry. Love you all so much.... You have no idea how interesting this is for me.

My ridiculous, never going to happen but highly amusing to consider is Willie Nelson as Thom. Omg I'm a genius stuck in the wrong timeline!! ???????

3 hours ago, RextheDog said:

regarding this SN issue.

 

is there a call for her to show the abusive texts....wouldnt it be prudent to show it actually happened, i have a lot of distrust for celebrity claims....(slightly different, but still)....this is not victim blaming, but in order to legitimise the claim you should show evidence.

 

i dont feel i need to point out my opinion on internet abuse, but i also feel just by claiming 'ive been abused and its all men' is a really dangerous claim to make....

 

as a male, i wouldnt want to be painted as an abusive sexist just because i didnt like a womens work and let her know on social media

 

at the minimum if death threats have been made she should file an official complaint and hand over the evidence to the authorities, theres no point in calling that a futile effort, lots of things that brave oppressed people have done in the history of mankind seemed futile as a stand alone action, but were the beginning of change.

 

 

If it is honest to say a thing (such as "all of my abusers are men" and it is 100% true in mine and many other cases) then to whom exactly is the statement dangerous? The abuser? The abused? The innocent bystander? Please explain. 

7 hours ago, EmreY said:

 

I suspect that people have been making excuses for their behaviour for as long as the human race has had the wits to do so.  I certainly can't remember the legendary time you mention.  Have you recently accessed memories of prior lives?

I am just a weird old lady,  but this is true in my experience.  I've been paying attention for a long time 

2 hours ago, TheSmurf said:

One of the Kin? 

I can't remember names rn because it has been some time since a re-read, but wasn't there one who was always complaining and stuff? Perfect 

9 hours ago, DaddyFinn said:

Head canon is head canon so can't dismiss anyone who doesn't like the casting based on appearance. 

Yeah, in my head cannon Min was like a young Winona Ryder, but but less ...whiney...I guess, especially the big brown eyes. I see Min as someone who is always aware that her emotions show on her face and is nearly always trying to hide them. You need someone who can act with their face and their eyes a lot better than the fairy tale lady. Zoë Robins has that skill. The lady who was Sasha on Walking Dead. Winona Ryder and Claire Danes. The lady playing Siuan is gooooood. I've never seen Kae Alexander in anything else, but so far I think they are doing pretty good, even though they don't match my head canon at all. ?

Just for fun we should try to find spots for Winona and Claire ?? 

Claire Danes is tall and a ballet dancer. Imagine her as a Maiden of the Spear?

Help with Winona.... ?‍♀️?

11 hours ago, Ballistyx said:

Just watched Ep8, and was devastated not to see Ginnifer Goodwin as Min ?
Cute, cheeky, petite. Kae Alexander may somewhat grow into the character I expected, but after 8 episodes, I'm getting used to having my expectations dashed.

I am so happy that this did not happen. This woman is a terrible actress. 

Just now, Ryrin said:

What? Discussions on the show should only include people that agree with you? 
 

Having a brain includes the ability to think critically. 

Not at all. But a mature discussion does not involve  one side talking about a variety of things and the other side coming in and just going "No . Wrong. Bad. Hate. How can you possibly be having any fun at all?" I'm not wrong because I like the show. It is obviously subjective. 

I like a lot about the show. I love parts of it. I cringed at Moiraine having a tell. That was dumb. 

On 1/6/2022 at 8:14 AM, Truthteller said:

I mean come on, the show runner has been taunting fans who don’t like the show, and this has been picked up by his defenders, with terms like “book cloak” and or calling the critics of the show dark friends.  It isn’t even subtext.  
 

And the defences are not plausible, since they start from the assumption that the criticisms are extrinsically motivated.  This is quite ironic, since the changes to the series themselves have been driven by extrinsic motivations.

 

The thread trying to predict what is going to happen next is a great example.  How could anyone predict what will happen next when there are no rules and the source material has been jettisoned?  

But a lot of people are definitely making predictions and having fun. It isn't impossible, obviously.  As to how, I just use my IMAGINATION  and also my BRAIN. It isn't hard. 

The problem is so many come in here with negative opinions and treat other people like poop if they have positive opinions. 

So basically a buncha y'all don't have the right kinds of brains and imagination to have fun with this and you're mad at the happy people about it. Heckin ridiculous. 

Just make a thread called "people who are not happy with the show vent here" and let the rest of us have fun? 

I am trying to hard to have some heckin FUN.

56 minutes ago, TheSmurf said:

For some reason I'm reading that as something Geralt would say ?

I thought of "I said you could ask, not that I'd answer." With that little smile and spark in her eye as she walks away. 

5 hours ago, Guire said:

So men or women as partners are less important than a generic sisterhood of women.  I have never thought any man in life was more important than my wife of 28 years.  I may not understand her at times but she even above my children is the center of my adult life.  I have cried many times during random moments in TV or movies.  I know that what I have experienced is touching some emotional thread in my brain that I can't fully understand or logically access.  I don't deny that power but also don't think it is indicative of some universal truth.

Maybe not universal, but keep in mind that not everyone has good, long, stable relationships. In fact, a fair amount do not. I think the feeling might be common enough that many if not most women would understand what I mean, even if they have a really good realtionship or marriage with a man. 

10 minutes ago, Guire said:

No.  Not at all.  But I know that a soldier wrote the book series.  I first read this series in southern Iraq in 1991.  At the time my dad was dying in army hospital from cancer related to agent orange. I loved the characters and mythologizing of march to war and how the reality was more gray and ugly.  That people were good and bad and complicated.  That the world could always surprise you with it's complexity and beauty while being different than you could imagine.  All my life has been aspiring to be strong not hard in the face of heart breaking reality.  So I wanted to see my old friends be brought to life and beloved on screen.  My wife and daughter have watched series, think it is fine, and have no interest in discussing or rewatching.  Rafe made ok TV.  Glad it is special to you.

Well, I have no idea what it feels like to be a man or a soldier. I couldn't begin to guess. 

But I am a woman and have been for quite a while, and that line from their ceremony, specifically what it means to Nynaeve in her particular situation, hit me like an emotional brick and I have a few times now on my rewatches paused the show and cried about it for a while. 

I think it is interesting ??

On 1/6/2022 at 6:46 PM, Blackbyrd said:

 

Definitely a solid review. Regarding spectacle I'll again say that I would much rather have all the overdone spectacle at the start of the series rather than at the end like in Game- the later seasons being enjoyable but overtly reliant on 'oh damn that looks cool' effects. To be more narrow though, there is a certain amount of spectacle for the sake of spectacle that can be allowed. For instance in ep 8 the tidal wave is totally spectacle for spectacle but it can work as it doesn't necessarily have to viewed as a literal thing rather a moment of symbology- which can be a cool effect on screen. However, you couple that with the whole Nynaeve near-death experience and suddenly you have two spectacle for spectacles within moments of each other. So even if the Nynaeve death fake out was a cool effect (it wasn't really) it likely never could have stood up next to another big time cool, over the top effect to end the season. One of those areas where picking your spots on the somewhat cheesy/screenish over the top stuff is worth thinking about. Again though- much rather see this at the start than at the end.

 

I think it's also important to address the Nynaeve Supernova phenomenon. Was them killing like 10k trollocs good? No. As the review states it somewhat undermines the Trollocs that they can do that without a Sa or the Eye at this point in time. However, the idea that 5 woman channelers are an uber powerful is a good effect and especially regarding Nynaeve and I defintely don't mind that she got those immediate power visuals in the 1st season

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Nynaeve has incredible feats throughout the books. If one were to call Rand the Luke Skywalker of WoT then Nynaeve very much was Leia- however a Leia that was much more fully realized than the OG trilogy Leia. In the show we know Rand is the DR, we know Perrin is gonna get wolfie, and we expect Mat to get the memories- which all help explain away some of their power spike. That never actually happens in the books that well in regards to Nynaeve. She's just kinda prodigious with the power. Not that it really gets explained in the show that well either, but to show that she has this crazy amount of power/talent from the get go definitely works for me considering what she'll be doing throughout the series. 

 

Yes exactly. We have seen Nynaeve explode with vast power, but she hasn't done ANY careful or intentional weaves. She has stumbled through and survived by the ta'veren stuff going on at this point she has power and pride but no learning or skill in controlling the power. And I think TG fight will be a major trauma for both her  and Egwene. 

It reminds me of the time I drove my Dad's car to my friend's house 12 miles away on country roads and made it home fine. I hadn't been taught. I just accidentally didn't die. It didn't mean I was a good driver or even "knew how" to drive. 

2 hours ago, Guire said:

For lovers of the show I have been a good soldier.  I have a ridiculous amount of commute for my 2 full time jobs on mostly flat empty rural highway.  I have rewatched all episodes except last at least 10 times on different TVs, laptops and phones.  I am doing my  part to get series continued.  I have also rewatched Witcher season 1 and GoT season 1 in last couple months.  I intermixed rewatch of Witcher and WoT this week up to 4th episodes.

 

Not having to reorient my head to  time jumps on rewatch of Witcher  has made it  better entertainment.  It feels very much like a TV show but a really enjoyable one.   Many of the characters are unlikable but still fun to watch. 

 

WoTprime on rewatch has stayed pretty meh.  I think the choices to front female characters would have worked better if one of boys was just cut to give more character development to Nyn or Egwene in a more interesting way.  Also if we are going all in on White Tower we needed way more WT internal politics with better character development and thought about what makes WT entertaining.  Scenes in Witcher Hogwarts was fun and intriguing.  Having Liandrins posse just follow and glower without talking was creepy.  I loved Alanna, Karene, and Maigan.  Show me what the WT is about and how it relates to Mo and Lan's quest.  Dump the YA TV romance games and equal representaion Lan butt show and give me a female dominated political drama if that is the game.  I might have loved that.  Trying to stay with book beats without developing males just made season one muddled.  The mild twitter shout out misandry was just kind of the off flavor in a dish you can't quit place but makes your mouth keep puckering.  Right now Season one felt just like a TV show.  OK but not special.  I rewatched some Agents of Shield also.  Yea kind of had same feel.  Glimpses of greatness that never got past internal inconsistencies and muddled writing.

 

Also after mass rewatches the women circle trial gets silly.  Mountain river early spring cliff toss is kind of too much.  You can still see snow pack on mountains; that water would be shockingly cold.  Why would village need an initiation with that high of a death chance?  Most tribal coming of age ceremonies are reflective of community needs.  We have no modern medicine, you have to endure these cuts or bee stings because weak people will hurt our community survival chances so we shun you from gene pool.  WTH is happening in Two Rivers that requires Navy SEAL level of initiation only for women?  And why would you be always alone except for girl power circle.  Do they not have romantic partners that become the women's confidants and support system?  The whole thing on rewatch felt more NXIVM sorority than bedrock of healthy community ritual.  

 

Lots of shows have dramatically improved after 1 or 2 seasons.   Who knows where WoTprime is gonna take us? 

Do you know what it feels like to be a woman? 

16 hours ago, Cauthonfan4 said:

Okay but at the rate they are going, when Rand is supposed to wipe out a trolloc horde on his own later in the series outside maradon, it's literally going to be small potatoes that he pulled it off instead of "hey its like he went hugely above and beyond".

 

Or Nynaeve and Egwene will he like really messed up over what happened, Nynaeve gets her block and Egwene has trauma AND 3 people are dead. Dude they were burning alive from the inside. 

Rand can do this on his own, without burning, frown a little and do some motions and the bad guys go down more quickly. "Hmmm...." He says in his adorable accent. "That wasn't THAT hard."

2 minutes ago, Gothic Flame said:

Books?

Show?

Anyone?

???? Sorry but kind of not sorry I guess. It's a bit of a tangent but it does have something to do with the lens through which some people view the show. Otherwise I wouldn't be hearing about an Agenda all the time. 

How about this? I am gonna take MY BALLS and go home. This on top of the slurs I saw here the other day is enough. Some of you are fighting the good fight and I salute you.