[Standard] Cory vs. Bad Dietary Habits & Laziness Mafia, Mafia Sweep

[hazelkrs1]

Next prediction is that somehow town decides to mislynch us, making me win the LVP race for sure.

 

Pretty sure Pray has that one in the bag

 

And trust me, while I DEF would LOVE to keep beating you up and making you feel terrible, this isn't really on you at all. So cheer up I guess

[csarmi]

@Despo - he lead three mislynches bro... now I probably realized why and how - deadline rush activity is very different here than he's used to. And lynching Pral... emm.

[hazelkrs1]

So come morning there's gonna be 4 scum and 5 town I suppose. We can't make any more mistakes. Can we do it?

 

 

If I survive (which I might since me dying would sign Darthe's death warrant), as long as town listens to me then we should

 

No more derping

[csarmi]

I should have stayed up and defend Pral. Meh.

 

I actually couldn't have. Really need my rest.

 

Anyway... where are we now?

[csarmi]

I want everyone to list their scumteam ASAP, before Pral takes his shot.

 

YATES - SCUMTEAM?

 

DARTHE - SCUMTEAM?

 

MONSTR - SCUMTEAM?

 

KRAK - SCUMTEAM?

 

TG - SCUMTEAM?

 

ARSIS - SCUMTEAM?

 

HALLIA - SCUMTEAM?

 

SALAMI - SCUMTEAM?

 

DES - SCUMTEAM?

 

DICE - SCUMTEAM?

 

PUPPETS - SCUMTEAM?

 

this should have happened before taking the shot

[csarmi]

Hally can you come up on skype?

[hazelkrs1]

@Despo - he lead three mislynches bro... now I probably realized why and how - deadline rush activity is very different here than he's used to. And lynching Pral... emm.

 

He didn't really LEAD any of them dude...

 

This is why you SHOULD feel crummy for ever suspecting Tommy

 

Cause if THAT is your reasoning, then *shudder*

 

VOS got himself lynched D1 pretty much, but if anyone led that lynch then it was me and Slender

 

TI got themselves lynched, and if anything Tommy was fighting to be their advocate, continuously reasoning with them and trying to work out if they could be town. If anyone "led" their lynch it would be me pretty much

 

Pray basically got himself lynched, by his lolbad EOD this past phase, and generally meh play earlier in the game. Tom AGAIN was trying to reason with him and see if he was town derping or scum, and Pray decided to flail all over himself. If anyone "led" that lynch... it was still Pray (and possibly Slendy from the grave). Heck, Tom even at first said Pray might have been cop viewed, then turned around and said that prob wasn't the case but that Arsis was viewed town

 

THAT WAS A GIANT SIGN POINTING TO TOMMY'S TOWNINESS

 

You only think Tom led any of those lynches because he is a much more vocal player than most. But he didn't "lead" any of them

[csarmi]

From what I read Pray was obvi-town last evening.

 

BUt whatever... i was asleep and no one would have listened to me anyway.

[hazelkrs1]

I want everyone to list their scumteam ASAP, before Pral takes his shot.

 

DARTHE - SCUMTEAM?

 

 

To be fair my main tinfoils on Des were early game and dumb and my main late game ones happen to be that the early game ones still can't be ruled out and that he is being derp.  I think his play this game has been clean by and large.  I also retain the opinion that if one of Tommy/Yates/Des isn't scum I'll be shocked.  

 

Scum teams?

 

TG, Arsis, Hallami, One of my top list (Des fits best here)

TG, Manbat, Yates, ??? (possible but less likely)

Tommy, Yates, Arsis, Krak (amazingly bad luck for town if so

 

Most scenarios really don't make a ton of sense unless we get to look at a post game storm of luck interwoven with skill and good NA prediction.

 

SCUMCLAIM^^^

[hazelkrs1]

That's seriously the wolfiest response that could EVER be made to such a direct townie question

[csarmi]

@Despo - well my idea was that he'll stick around when deadline is and keep cross-examining people until someone looks bad enough under it to safely lynch without his hands being even dirty (someone town)

 

He did it to me D1 (almost passed through), and we could say he did it D2 and D3. What I didn't take into account (or couldn't) how much Tommy isn't used to deadline rush activity being all different here. People are not used to this kind of realtime pressure and quick rushing and stuff.

[hazelkrs1]

From what I read Pray was obvi-town last evening.

 

BUt whatever... i was asleep and no one would have listened to me anyway.

 

Pray certainly wasn't obvtown, but he was very likely to be town

 

And you prob shot your credibility by continuously tinfoiling against Tommy every time you showed up, without good reason

[hazelkrs1]

@Despo - well my idea was that he'll stick around when deadline is and keep cross-examining people until someone looks bad enough under it to safely lynch without his hands being even dirty (someone town)

 

He did it to me D1 (almost passed through), and we could say he did it D2 and D3. What I didn't take into account (or couldn't) how much Tommy isn't used to deadline rush activity being all different here. People are not used to this kind of realtime pressure and quick rushing and stuff.

 

He does that kind of thing in absolutely every game he plays in, you have played with him enough times to know that is absolutely null for him

 

More importantly you have to look at HOW he is questioning people, and it was fairly clear what his town motivations were each time he was

[csarmi]

OMG my credibility is shot whatever I shall do now?

 

I don't care about no credibility - i wanna lynch the scum.

 

You got credibility, then lead the lynches and we'll join.

[csarmi]

 

@Despo - well my idea was that he'll stick around when deadline is and keep cross-examining people until someone looks bad enough under it to safely lynch without his hands being even dirty (someone town)

 

He did it to me D1 (almost passed through), and we could say he did it D2 and D3. What I didn't take into account (or couldn't) how much Tommy isn't used to deadline rush activity being all different here. People are not used to this kind of realtime pressure and quick rushing and stuff.

 

He does that kind of thing in absolutely every game he plays in, you have played with him enough times to know that is absolutely null for him

 

More importantly you have to look at HOW he is questioning people, and it was fairly clear what his town motivations were each time he was

 

 

Yea well his questioning of me didn't look town.

 

Anyway, we should stop talking about dead people. I go back to sleep on my mattresses TomTom.

[hazelkrs1]

Also if he was scum he could easily have spun it so that it looked like people WEREN'T holding up well under pressure, yet many times he would clear people or let off after seeing their reaction

 

But w/e, he's dead, you were wrong, let's move on

[csarmi]

Des, FWIW it probably didn't help my reads that all the deadline rushes were in my night and i couldnt see them from inside.

[csarmi]

Also if he was scum he could easily have spun it so that it looked like people WEREN'T holding up well under pressure, yet many times he would clear people or let off after seeing their reaction

 

But w/e, he's dead, you were wrong, let's move on

 

agreed

I'll learn from this. But Tom is so tricky... I'll never be able to read him. LOL

 

Tommy you're great. You'll always have your place on one of my mattresses.

[hazelkrs1]

How many scum does everyone think are in the following group?

 

Arsis 

Yates

Halligedon

Tomstress

Sickpuppets

 

I wonder if Darthe really spewed this entire group as town lol

 

Going back to see more of Darthe's take on Yates this game

[hazelkrs1]

I suspect scum between TG (or rather the slot he replaced, got nada on him yet) and Laya, scum between that initial group of five I posted about and scum in krak, dice and des.

 

Prob two scum in that list I made.  Could be in the krak/dice/des trio.  

 

Jesus Christ stuff like this is sooooooo wolfy

 

Tom you should feel bad for not jumping on Darthe immediately after posts like this

 

(going through posts I had pulled to respond to earlier but never had time for)

[hazelkrs1]

well i spose SOMEONE had to have you as number one tom.

 

 

 

 

lol

 

 

I think Pral's a better lynch than Krak. All of Krak's posts have been pretty null to me and his reaction to me claiming was pretty bad.

 

H8 that posts like these make me wanna keep tinfoiling on Dice/SP being scum

 

Dice just keeps saying "Lol I can't help but suspect you" to either Tommy or me all game, and SP wanted to push Pray lynch over Krak's (somewhat understandable given Pray's awful vote on him) but is using such fail logic all game

 

 

BTW, planning to shoot Yates if I am lynched.

Okay.

 

[v]Pral[/v]

 

 

Can't help but keep thinking Yates is just doing EXACTLY what he would do as town, to look good. With posts like this.

 

But Pray... why so low confidence? You're the greates vig i know. Surely you can find a scum to take down with you? 

 

 

 

So if Pray is telling the truth, we lynch him and he shoots town, game is lost, right?

If Pray is telling the truth, we lost the game by signing up to play.

 

Scum kill.

Poisoner kill.

Saint kill.

 

3 Town kills in one night = gg.

 

 

Also worried that Yates could be scum since Darthe was also recently pushing the concept of this being a "troll" game

[hazelkrs1]

Ya I really don't like that because it's basically holding the town hostage tbh

 

But I still think I'd prefer a krak lynch

 

Ugh I can't decide

 

At first glance this looked like genuine town indecision, but in hindsight I think Manbat was just trying to nudge the Pray train without getting his hands dirty

 

 

TG I don't mind you covering all bases but this is likely the least productive thing you could be doing right now.

 

I'm voting Pral and don't need to redo the cop spew analysis.  We kill Pral, he shoots Yates, I say we get at least 1 scum.  I don't see what else is currently relevant besides determining possible teammates.

 

Scumteam Pral/Yates + Darthe + SP + Dice?

 

 

TG several times supports the cop spew analysis me and Tom did, and yet each time tries to say that we came to the conclusion that Pray was viewed guilty.... even tho that's patently false (Arsis was likely viewed inno) and uses that for justification for voting Pray

 

Also think him putting Darthe in that scum group at the end is a lazy distancing attempt- just before this TG found out Darthe allegedly protected Krak N2, yet TG doesn't question the absurdity of that decision, and then puts him in his suspects list? There is no progression here to follow, no townie mindset that can be connected to him putting Darthe there, and considering how much TG was questioning SP and Dice about their mason claims YOU'D THINK he would also be questioning the Doc stuff that much more if he legit suspected it was a fake claim

 

 

TG any commentary on Pral? You said not scum with Yatea but that's all you said.

 

Yes, Des is my top town read and you're somewhat town.  The analysis you both did on cop spew was solid.  The claim since convinces me that we need to lynch Pral today.  Either he is scum and he could be lying, or he is town and he gets a shot off.  If we don't lynch him today he ends up beign a possible nightkill and we lose the +EV of a town shot.

 

 

Besides this just generally being a terrible post because of the idea being pushed in it ("Quick! Let's mislynch him before scum get the chance to NK him!"), he continues to push the dumb cop spew thing and also the bolded is just bs. If Pray was scum there he was OBVIOUSLY lying to try and save his skin, if he was a scum vengeful killer he would have just accepted his lynch and shot me, likely. Don't think town!TG would have acted like it was possible he was scum but not lying there.

 

 

Dice accused someone of being scummy early for accusing SP. I think AJ maybe. Saw it while looking for Pral quotes.

 

TG I think your behavior right now is scummy. Looks like a bus.

 

If Pral flips scum you think that means what for SP's Mason claim?

 

So my behavior looks scummy contingent upon your read on Pral?  As for the mason claim, I don't know yet as I need to go back and look at any interactions with Pral and Dice/SP, but I want more out of Dice and SP independently.

 

 

Ugh. Tommy is talking about how scummy TG is looking lately, and TG asks him if it's contingent on his read on Pray.

 

Wow.

 

 

TG CONFIRMED

 

 

Whoa whoa what? It is not worth it to trade a town lynch for a shot that MIGHT hit scum. It *IS* far better for Pral to get night killed -- he's not an important PR.

 

Pral and Yates are both on my scum possible teams, and Pral looks like the best lynch for today given cop-spew analysis.  Especially given that Pral would likely be lying about his claim if he is scum. 

 

However, on the off chance Pral is town, at least we get a town-directed shot out of the deal. 

 

 

Never seen town!TG say anything like "____ and ____ are both on my scum possible teams". Ever. Also pushes the weaksauce "cop spew" thing again, and says Pray would likely be lying about his claim if scum

 

[hazelkrs1]

 

Why will i try to get NK and losing a free shot at scum, which is quite probable at later stages of the game . You are the one not making any sense.

Because if you miss that's two townies dead. If you get NK'd you play to your wincon and protect more important roles and we don't waste time arguing over you. You've been a scum lean all game.

 

This is basic. I refuse to believe you don't understand this.

 

 

 

 

 

No, it is easier to get scum later stages of game and am confident of hitting. Claiming early and sacrificing the kill makes absolutely no sense. That's akin to vig sacrificing himself.

No. It's not. YOU HAVE TO DIE TO USE IT.

 

Do you not understand? That is a TOWN LYNCH. THAT IS HOW SCUM WINS GAMES.

If it happens, it is an extremely useful power at LyLo. Obviously would make sense to sacrifice it.

 

 

Just wanna say Pray, Tommy was COMPLETELY right in this argument here. The only way your ability could be "useful" was if a townie was getting mislynched... and it's really not even that useful at all at lylo, definitely not "extremely" so. Even if you hit right and get scum... the next day you're right back at lylo.

 

And then there's always the possibility that you miss and hit town.... which is exactly what happened.

 

DERP

 

 

But that's not what you said. You said:

"If we don't lynch him today he ends up beign a possible nightkill and we lose the +EV of a town shot."

 

Implying you DONT want scum to night kill him even though that would be the BEST scenario.

 

You might be right on this.  I was thinking that currently we are at 12 left, presumably 4 scum.  We lynch Pral today and if he is scum, a NK tonight puts us at 10/3 tomorrow.

If Pral is actually town, he shoots Yates, and we likely hit scum in the two putting us at 9/3 tomorrow. 

But in your scenario of 2 townies dead that puts us at 9/4 and MyLo.  Having Pral be a potential NK given the WIFOM it introduces to scum for his possible lynch later is probably more +EV than a town-directed shot now. 

 

 

TG tries to use math spec and buzzwords to cover his retreat here

 

 

Do you guys see this? If Pral is somehow town then TG is scum and spewed Yates town. TG has been scummy as HELL since he popped in.

Fair enough.

 

[unvote]

 

[v]TG[/v]

 

 

 

I also like the flavor claim.

 

^These actually look pretty good for Yates I'd say

[hazelkrs1]

 

Why will i try to get NK and losing a free shot at scum, which is quite probable at later stages of the game . You are the one not making any sense.

Because if you miss that's two townies dead. If you get NK'd you play to your wincon and protect more important roles and we don't waste time arguing over you. You've been a scum lean all game.

 

This is basic. I refuse to believe you don't understand this.

 

 

 

 

 

No, it is easier to get scum later stages of game and am confident of hitting. Claiming early and sacrificing the kill makes absolutely no sense. That's akin to vig sacrificing himself.

No. It's not. YOU HAVE TO DIE TO USE IT.

 

Do you not understand? That is a TOWN LYNCH. THAT IS HOW SCUM WINS GAMES.

If it happens, it is an extremely useful power at LyLo. Obviously would make sense to sacrifice it.

 

 

Just wanna say Pray, Tommy was COMPLETELY right in this argument here. The only way your ability could be "useful" was if a townie was getting mislynched... and it's really not even that useful at all at lylo, definitely not "extremely" so. Even if you hit right and get scum... the next day you're right back at lylo.

 

And then there's always the possibility that you miss and hit town.... which is exactly what happened.

 

DERP

 

 

But that's not what you said. You said:

"If we don't lynch him today he ends up beign a possible nightkill and we lose the +EV of a town shot."

 

Implying you DONT want scum to night kill him even though that would be the BEST scenario.

 

You might be right on this.  I was thinking that currently we are at 12 left, presumably 4 scum.  We lynch Pral today and if he is scum, a NK tonight puts us at 10/3 tomorrow.

If Pral is actually town, he shoots Yates, and we likely hit scum in the two putting us at 9/3 tomorrow. 

But in your scenario of 2 townies dead that puts us at 9/4 and MyLo.  Having Pral be a potential NK given the WIFOM it introduces to scum for his possible lynch later is probably more +EV than a town-directed shot now. 

 

 

TG tries to use math spec and buzzwords to cover his retreat here

 

 

Do you guys see this? If Pral is somehow town then TG is scum and spewed Yates town. TG has been scummy as HELL since he popped in.

Fair enough.

 

[unvote]

 

[v]TG[/v]

 

 

 

I also like the flavor claim.

 

^These actually look pretty good for Yates I'd say

[hazelkrs1]

 

Do you guys see this? If Pral is somehow town then TG is scum and spewed Yates town. TG has been scummy as HELL since he popped in.

 

Yea. So isn't it beter to lynch Pral? If he flips scum, good for us. If he flips town, he can just shoot TG with the sure knowledge of having his shot right?

 

If your conclusion is correct that is.

 

 

Bleurgh

 

Csarmi earlier: "Man, Pray was obvitown to me last night, wish I had been around to convince everyone of that"

 

WHELP

 

Not saying this makes Csarmi scum, just a bleurghface

 

 

Did Des track Darthe to visiting Krak N2? Or was it Darthe claiming it alone?

I find it funnier that your first reaction to this "news" wasn't "why would he doctor protect Krak on N2?!"

 

 

THIS

 

 

Holy crap is that dumb. You're not even discussing the same thing.

 

That argument was about what Pral SHOULD have done.

 

Now it's about what WE should do given what's happened.

 

It's very apparent to me based on POE alone that one of you is scum if not both. In the last hour you have become much more likely scum than Yates. Shooting you would be better than shooting Yates ~always. Am I wrong about that? If you were me what would you think?

 

Yes, you're wrong because I'm town.  Or you're just lying because you're scum.

 

But, if I were you I'd be either desperately trying to get me shot right now if you're scum or seriously concerned on me right now because I admit that I missed a few things being gone yesterday and skimming through the ~30 pages of catchup.

 

 

Bleurgh on tone. MAJOR MAJOR tone fails here

 

 

Anyway TG is lock scum, he is full on frozen in this discussion. None of the usual town!TG punch.

 

Let's lynch him.

Are you scum? You've been spearheading multiple town lynches and now, when Pral is caught dead-to-rights by cop spew you're trying to get people to move off the lynch??  I know you can be wrong about me (look at the Avengers game when you tried to get me killed) but I don't expect you to be wrong over and over and over again in a game. 

 

 

Again with the cop spew crap, and then all of a sudden realizing he's not holding up well under Tompressure so tries casting aspersion on him instead

 

 

So you think Pral is lock scum to you now? I thought it was one of him or Yates? Where's this cop spew bit coming from?

 

Copspew analysis comes from you and Des, posts like this from you.  Or do you suddenly not believe what you posted earlier today? 

 

But, we have a lot of claims out and zero caught scum.  What are the odds that at least one of the claims is false?  Pral is claiming a weak PR that he likely played just wrong for the role.   Darthe's claim with his previous behavior stank, so I don't know if I buy it.  SP and Dice suddenly claim masons after the cop is killed, so I disagree with you about the timing of the claim looking good.  If Pral flips scum, then the odds of Darthe, SP and Dice fake claiming goes down significantly and I'll change my reads.  It's then more likely that Manbat is back to scum even with his recent posting, and Yates and Krak stay on the scum list.

 

 

Quoted this mainly for emphasis- looks bad for Manbat (since TG is basically saying Manbat's recent posts look good)

 

Also dumb how TG says Pray flipping scum would make the claims from Darthe, DP, and Dice more believable... even tho earlier he listed that as his exact scum team combo (Pray, Darthe, SP, Dice)

 

As if you needed moar confirmation of TG's scumminess

 

 

Uh... my analysis concluded that Slender viewed Arsis as town. Pral might be scum because slender was pushing him and was killed for that but he wasn't Viewed scum from what I can tell.

 

Part of the issue is neither you nor Pral have even tried to talk to each other today. You no opinion of what he's posted today?

 

Fair point.  I've basically written him off as scum and today's lynch so I haven't bothered given that you were engaging him and asking the same questions I would ask re: scum team.    

 

@Pral - Tommy asked for your top 4 scum.  Who do you view as scum team and why?  Anybody lock town for you? 

 

 

"Oh yeah, I should prob try looking townie and engaging people directly like I normally do instead of lobbing out weak ideas and tinfoiling nonsense at everyone in particular! That will help me look townie again!"

 

Also, Arsis mentioned this but what do you think of your Saint claim not jiving with the typical role definition of controlling the kill?  Or did you just slip?

 

Bolded comes from town!TG 0 times out of 1000000 in this context

 

If he felt the claim was bs, he would just say so, he wouldn't ask someone if they slipped like that

 

Posturing at it's finest, ladies and gentlemen