[Advanced] Red Wedding Mafia - Post Game, MakersMark

[Red2111]

Tommy - todya is LYLO, this means that the scum is more likely to push a fast lynch today than any other day in this game, because they have the most to lose.

 

i dont get what you dont understand abotu my logic.  clearing Dice via the vote today is based mainly on the fact that Dawn is voting for him; becuase consitantly her vote has been the most scummiest.

 

 

infact look at the events surrounding Dawn in this game

 

- only pops in when her name is mentioned or is getting pressure (which speaks of being poked on a QT thread)

- she votes are the most scummiest in the game, she's always spread out fromt eh wagon, and the lack of putting a vote on Leelou with a finder outting Leelou is highly suspicious.

- everyone lists her as the most likely scum, yet a wagon on her NEVER gains traction.  EVER.

 

a wagon that is hard to get traction on or never gets traction is 90% of the time a wagon on a scum.

 

 

this is why i'd prefer a vote for her today.  because i think she's a guarenteed scum.

 

 

but since i can't get that vote, i look at who she is voting and how that wagon has acted.

 

 

she's voting for Dice.  now, if the scum haven't all cast their vote on Dice's wagon thent hey would have hammered him by now; because tbh at LYLO why woudl the scum start a wagon on one of their own.

 

so the only logical thing to believe her, based on Dawns vote is that all 3 scum are on Dice's wagon.  which again, limits the remaing scum to between Tommy, X, and Cloud.  each of you having an equal chance at being scum or town.

 

 

the only difference is the interaction of Tommy and Cloud on this lynch; and youre reaction when a new wagon was started.  the fact you want a fast lynch at LYLO is not townie at all.

 

 

now if you'd be willing to vote Dawn, i'd be happy to move my vote back to her, as she is my prefer lynch as i'd rather lynch someoen i'm almost positve is scum rather than somone i think is scum.

[Tommyrod]

Let me put it another way:

 

I know your approach is most likely incorrect because I am town and I have reason to believe that all three people on the wagon with me have town equity.

 

Dawn could be scum, but she had a similarly terribad and non participatory town game in the recently ended twilight mafia game. Go look at it.

 

I believe X is town because he hasn't been pushing an agenda; that's hard to explain but he would be more helpful if he was scum, I think. He seems to be in his own little world. He also agrees with me, which doesn't hurt.

 

Cloud had one of the initial suspicions on VerbTina and Verb offered him up as a lynch. That's super ballsy if they are scum scum. He also sounds like he believes what he's saying when he makes cases on players.

 

So if ANY of these three are town, that means there's at least 2/4 townies on this lynch, making it much more likely that Dice is scum based on wagonmetrics.

[Red2111]

 to put it in short terms

 

 

Dawns is 99% likely to be scum

 

Dawn's vote clears Dice.

 

Krak and Len are cleared by not hammering Dice.

 

 

which leaves Tommy, Cloud and X as the last remaining suspects to sort out.

 

 

Tommy and Cloud give a 50/50 chance of hitting scum imo, but imo Dawn gives a near 100% chance.  which is why i think Dawn should be lynched, given we're at LYLO

 

 

edit - i dont care about her meta in a different game.  this is not the twilight game and meta is a piss poor reason to vote or not vote someone imo.

 

her actions in THIS game paint her as scum.  thats all i care about and all i'll factor in.

[Tommyrod]

I edited my post because I submitted it by accident. Take a look.

[Tommyrod]

You are concluding that Dice is clear because Dawn is scum. Why?

 

What if:

 

-It's the other way around?

-She is busing to make it to endgame?

 

Now your theory falls apart. You need more well rounded reasoning, you can't rely on just ONE crux in a game like this.

[Xthrax]

 

 

damn

 

 

well played nyn

 

 

##vote Tommy

Oi. We're at MyLo now. You don't get to vote for me, especially not without discussion. If you're hard claiming scum, have a fun time; otherwise you don't get to congratulate the dead person on her efforts after she concluded I'm town and then vote for me. We will deal with you later. For now we need to discuss Red, Dawn, and Cloud.

 

I believe that Krak and Lenlo are town and that's where I'm starting for today.

 

 

A) you dont get to tell me what to do.

 

B)She can have her opinion ans i can think she was wrong

 

C) I notice that twice in this post you are telling people what to do.

 

and D) im convinced you are scum. the ONLY way my vote is moving is to lynch megaloud if a train on you does not build. Then it will be right back on you the next day.

 

A) Dude, it is Lylo. So as I understand it, mafia could win it with one vote. I understand that you don't like anyone telling you what to do. But if everyone just blindly start lynching this game could be lost. Also, I don't understand the cause for the rage.

 

B)Your point of view.

 

C)Again, refer A

 

D) Also you could be open to considering all possibilities.

 

It really seems like you are desperate here to get Tommy lynched, trying to refute everything that disagrees with it.

 

@RED  bought up to speed?  Cory was the Cop and had scum views on Leelou/hally and Verbilina

 

Verb claimed busdriver but was in fact Rolestopper.

 

Tommy and megaloud want me lynched because i called them mafia and have been jawing back and forth with Tommy all night because he said the rolestopper could not stop doc protects. He lied i pointed it out we argued. I did make a screwup, it wouldnt have stopped crayjays viewing as i thought it would, but basically my argument is that Tommy was twisting the description of the role.

 

In the meantime jack revealed he was Doc and that he had played the worst doc game ever    he protected noone but himself.  I both believed and agreed with him. Tommy conned Len into hammering him.

 

Tommy has now foreshadowed my claiming both VT and PR. He has done this, i believe, so that no matter what i claim there is already a bias against it.

 

nevertheless i am Raynald Westerling and am indeed VT 

 

Obviously i believe Tommy should be lynched. If not him then megaloud. I am not making a huge song and dance to defend myself. Its simple  wanna lose the game?? then lynch me. cause when mafia kill tonight its over. Wanna win? lynch tommy or megaloud.

Basically your case on Tommy boils down to the fact that he ISO'd you and you think that is scummy. 

 

Why do you think Megacloud is scummy? To me it appears that Tommy did raise some points on you, while yours is that one insensible statement.

 

And don't try to push the rolestopper argument as evidence for someone as scummy. That is just null. It boils down to how someone interprets a role. If you haven't encountered the role, you might not have a clear idea on what it is. On first seeing it after Verbalina's lynch, I thought it was a rolestopper. But then went to read about it and was mistaken. That seems very suspicious since you are trying to push something that is not alignment indicative.

 

Also AtE?

 

 

So your defense is... "oops?"

 

No comment on the breadth of spew implicating you (yet the same doesn't exist for me)?

 

No consideration of what Krak said regarding Cloud having fairly clearing interactions with VerbTina, nor Verb trying to get Cloud lynched as a Hail Mary ploy?

 

No concern for Cory also clearing me for my own interactions with Tina?

 

None of that matters, right?

 

And somehow you're spinning your blatant scumslip last night into being my fault for not recognizing Jack was gonna flip town... XD

 

lets see

 

len can you make ure sister do the right thing all the time?  Not my problem what she was i can only give you what darthe gave me

 

It was pretty obvious he was town. Mafia would have come up with a better series of actions

 

oh cory cleared you. yet his other head AJ thought the same as me. I notice you discount that.   and lets make it VERY clear that they had not VIEWED you. 

 

Oh it was pretty obvious to you as town? Tell if you had a doc role, would you protect the cop or yourself when the cop has revealed themselves? What he did was pretty anti-town behaviour. That was enough to convince everyone he can in no way be town.

 

Let me also point here that they hadn't viewed you. You seem to discount that.

 

 

 

 

So your defense is... "oops?"

 

No comment on the breadth of spew implicating you (yet the same doesn't exist for me)?

 

No consideration of what Krak said regarding Cloud having fairly clearing interactions with VerbTina, nor Verb trying to get Cloud lynched as a Hail Mary ploy?

 

No concern for Cory also clearing me for my own interactions with Tina?

 

None of that matters, right?

 

And somehow you're spinning your blatant scumslip last night into being my fault for not recognizing Jack was gonna flip town... XD

lets see

 

len can you make ure sister do the right thing all the time? Not my problem what she was i can only give you what darthe gave me

 

It was pretty obvious he was town. Mafia would have come up with a better series of actions

 

oh cory cleared you. yet his other head AJ thought the same as me. I notice you discount that. and lets make it VERY clear that they had not VIEWED you.

Claim a scum character? NP! "Not my fault I was randed scum!"

 

It was obvious Jack was town, yet six people voted him! "There must be six scum!"

 

Cory has infinitely more experience than AJ at reading me. I thought he had peeked me for a while because he was so sure of it, but I guess I was oozing towniness or something.

 

You suddenly started calling me scum after calling me town prior to that. Why? Because I ISO'd your 15 posts. Why does that make me scum? Because "scum Tommy does that." No further explanation. The essence of OMGUS. You've doubled down on that since then without much further explanation.

 

You're conveniently ignoring all the scum soft distancing that greatly implicates you. Not your fault, right? Damn those soft pushing teammates of yours!

 

 

Character is on Darthe  I get what i get.

 

And AJ has a lot more experience reading me then corey does and he said i was town. Dont think Corey ever accused me of being scum either but one of the cops did accuse you

 

You let me spot you as scum and i will call you scum. Your biggest problem is that i can spot you and you know it

 

No comment on the Jack point?  Also do you have any other reason than tom ISO-ing you to call him scummy?

 

 

 

Official Vote Count:

 

Jack (6/6): Megaloud, Dawn, Tommy, Nyancat, X, Len

MegaLoud (1/6): Jack, Dice

 

Not Voting (2/10):

Krak, Red

 

 

@Darthe   you are missing the link for this on your end of day post

 

@all  Take a look at the people voting Jack. Three of them, megacloud, tommy and x I have on my scum list and have openly said so. Then you have Dawn who lots of people have said is scummy but a train never got going on. Nyancat we know was town. Len got conned. Im pretty certain he is town.

 

As i said it was far too dysfuntional a claim and explanation to be a mafia setup. No mafia team would have someone fake claim doc and say they protected only themselves with all the claims we had had

 

Me and Tommy for ISO-ing you. That I understand. Megacloud why? What is your opinion on Dawn?

 

and what scum distancing? that tina left me off a list?  Notice i asked why i was left off.

 

what else you got?  low posts?  take a look at Amega. He AND cloud had 4.9% according to Darthes post  id bet 4% of that was done by cloud.

 

Next?

No one ever quoted low posts dude. This is beyond pushing the envelope. There were other reasons such as Leelou's behaviour towards both you and Zanube.

 

lmao  you rely on the fact that cory can read you yet even cory has said im really good at picking you when you are scum.

 

list of reasons.

 

that ISOing of players is something ive noticed you do late game when scum

 

Cory claims and you start throwing cr*p everywhere hoping something will stick.

 

You twist things.

 

You try to rely on half of a dead cops FEEL  feel  not view  of you. Convienently ignoring that the other half of said cop felt you were scum and that i was town. Coincidentally the cop YOU rely on never said i was scum iirc.

 

Cloud just falls perfectly in line with everything you say. he doesn't even give a hint of him going a different way

Cory has said that you are great at noticing Tommy as scum. I'm definitely sure that it confirms Tommy as scum. You are really reaching here.

 

Throwing crap everywhere to see if it would stick. Really? That desperate? 

 

You are trying to rely on the dead cops other half's feel of you to clear yourself. 

 

 

Cloud - that was quite an abrupt about face.  Want to comment on why you suddenly think I'm scum after defending me for a few days?

 

Cause he is on the scum team with tommy. Why else?

 

Why do you think he is scummy?

 

Darthe i think you should check the mafia team....the may need a change of pants lol

Ok, this is just plain dissing. 

 

Basically-this just is scummy play.

 

Firstly my previous case and response to it.

Secondly calling Tommy scummy cause he ISo'd. I want to ask-does this seem scummy to anyone else.

Trying to reach extremely. Blatant desperate statements.

Blaming Tommy for trying to clear himself for doing something, he himself was doing.

[Tommyrod]

Hell yeah. Get 'em X!

[Red2111]

I believe X is town because he hasn't been pushing an agenda; that's hard to explain but he would be more helpful if he was scum, I think. He seems to be in his own little world. He also agrees with me, which doesn't hurt.

 

Cloud had one of the initial suspicions on VerbTina and Verb offered him up as a lynch. That's super ballsy if they are scum scum. He also sounds like he believes what he's saying when he makes cases on players.

 

So if ANY of these three are town, that means there's at least 2/4 townies on this lynch, making it much more likely that Dice is scum based on wagonmetrics.

 

 

bold - factoring in agreeing with you or disagreeing with you as a base line for scumminess or towniness is bad practice and leaves you open to being manipulated.  if i was scum and i wanted to keep on your goood side, all i woudl have to do is play you by stroking your ego.  its sets you up to be played like a pawn.  and "rolling with the flow" is a scum tactic.

 

underlined - ballsy or not, its called distancing.  i've done it myself, picked a fight and even cased my scum mates on thread to give myself town cred.  you dont measure them by the case, but by how much effort they put into the case.

 

Italics - but your discounting that we're at LYLO and the scum win if we mislynch.  which makes the scum more brazen about working cooperatively on thread to get a townie lynched and are not going to spread out their votes if they think they can get a townie lynched.  Scum would only vote a scum mate at LYLO reluctantly, Dawns vote was not reluctant.

 

hence why i'm placing so much value in Dawn's vote, enough to clear a player and so much emphasis on your's and clouds tem work in getting Dice lynched and bulling people off Tommy's wagon.

[Tommyrod]

Red, I'm working under the assumption you are town due to scum spew -- which you called WIFOM, lol. Means you wouldn't be clear either, ya dingus!

 

Dice has pigeonholed himself into a scum read on me that he has never sufficiently explained. He flipped his read on me when I ISO'd his posts and then he's been accusing me of twisting words; the fact that he's relying on the rolestopper argument is extremely telling because that was a complete non-versation. He misunderstood how the role worked, and somehow that makes me scum? I don't even understand what point he's trying to make, which is terrible if it's meant to be one of his main bullet points against me.

 

I just played as scum in the Twilight game and mislynched Dawn for the win. She was town and similarly unhelpful and self centric, which is what gives me pause on lynching her despite her general uselessness in this game. If you aren't willing to go back and skim that game, then I hope you will at least account for my worry that she actually is town (which supports my thinking that Dice is scum).

 

Keep considering more information, don't put all your vote eggs in one logic basket.

[Tommyrod]

 

 

I believe X is town because he hasn't been pushing an agenda; that's hard to explain but he would be more helpful if he was scum, I think. He seems to be in his own little world. He also agrees with me, which doesn't hurt.

 

Cloud had one of the initial suspicions on VerbTina and Verb offered him up as a lynch. That's super ballsy if they are scum scum. He also sounds like he believes what he's saying when he makes cases on players.

 

So if ANY of these three are town, that means there's at least 2/4 townies on this lynch, making it much more likely that Dice is scum based on wagonmetrics.

 

bold - factoring in agreeing with you or disagreeing with you as a base line for scumminess or towniness is bad practice and leaves you open to being manipulated. if i was scum and i wanted to keep on your goood side, all i woudl have to do is play you by stroking your ego. its sets you up to be played like a pawn. and "rolling with the flow" is a scum tactic.

 

underlined - ballsy or not, its called distancing. i've done it myself, picked a fight and even cased my scum mates on thread to give myself town cred. you dont measure them by the case, but by how much effort they put into the case.

 

Italics - but your discounting that we're at LYLO and the scum win if we mislynch. which makes the scum more brazen about working cooperatively on thread to get a townie lynched and are not going to spread out their votes if they think they can get a townie lynched. Scum would only vote a scum mate at LYLO reluctantly, Dawns vote was not reluctant.

 

hence why i'm placing so much value in Dawn's vote, enough to clear a player and so much emphasis on your's and clouds tem work in getting Dice lynched and bulling people off Tommy's wagon.

And what happens when it turns out you were exactly wrong and it costs us the game? Will you hold that stubborn "try to solve the game based on one belief" habit or will you charge forward, unfettered?

 

You're really frustrating to work with right now. I was following your conclusions until you said "Dawn is lock scum, so Dice is lock clear" while ignoring all the information you had apparently been collecting. It's bad play.

[Xthrax]

okay - heres the finale VC's for each day, and the latest one for today. 

 

green = confirm townie

 

red = confirm scum

 

 

 

Official Bloody Vote Count:

Crayjay (1/10): Dice

Mistress (9/10): NyanCat, Red, X, Jack, Desbat, Mistress, Nol, Zanube, Dawn

Red (7/10): Dawn, Tommy, Yates, Verbalina, Krak, Len, Cloud

Mynd (2/10): CrayJay, Halleeloujah

Tommy(1/10): Megaloud

 

Not Voting (1/19):

 Mynd

 

Does anyone see any corrections that need be made before the scene is posted?  You'll have about ten minutes to speak up or this is considered cannon.

 

 

ummm @Darthe - da faq is up with that vote count dude.  you have Cloud and Dawn voting twice??  i recall Dawn switch to Mishstress (had to vote multi times to do it though)  and i think Cloud came in right before deadline to move the Megaloud vote back to me.

 

 

 

 

Official Vote Count:

Mynd (9/9): NyanCat, Jack, X, Tommy, Megaloud, Halleeloujah, Verbalina, Len, Andrej

Jack (2/9): Yates, Dawn

 

Not Voting (5/16):

Krak, Dice, Red, Zanube, Mynd

 

 

 

 

Official Vote Count (Of Doom):

Halleeloujah (8/8): MegaLoud, NyanCat, CrayJay, Verbalina, Jack, Tommy, Krak, X

CrayJay (1/8): Dawn

Len (1/8): Halleleloujah

 

Non-voters (of doom) 3/13:

Len, Dice, Red

 

 

 

 

Official Vote Count:

 

Jack (6/6): Megaloud, Dawn, Tommy, Nyancat, X, Len

MegaLoud (1/6): Jack, Dice

 

Not Voting (2/10):

Krak, Red

 

 

 

 

Official Vote Count:

 

Tommy (2/5): Dice, Krak

Dawn (1/5): Red

Dice (4/5): Cloud, Dawn, X, Tommy

 

Not Voting (1/8):

 

Lenlo

 

35 hours til Night

 

 

 

alright - so based on the vote counts alone and the a-typical scum behavior of distancing from team mates vs trying to look town.  this is what i have.

 

 

D1 - they would have spread their votes out.  this means that the Mishtress vote gives us the most info, as one or two scum are there.  which means that our two wagons today, on probabality alone, should be between X and Dawn  as this gives us the highest chance of hitting scum blindly imo.

 

given i was a PR claim at the point of this lynch, chances are high i have atleast 1 more scum on my lynch.  

 

Dices vote makes him suspect as well.

 

 

D2 - we have two confirmed on Mynds lynch.  this pretty much singles out Dawn's vote as scum, based on the fact that scum will always have more town on a lynch than scum until LYLO (or a finders claim).  tha chances are also high that one of the non-voters is scum, and its 50/50 where the last scum is (gut says on Mynds lynch though)

 

onca again, this highlights both Dice and Dawn.

 

 

D3 -  we have a scum lynched via finders claim.  this means that scum would consolodate most of their votes on the team mates lynch to use it to look townie (hence Verbs vote).  they woudln't put them all on there, for fear of a vote analyzer ability.

 

this means that atleast one more scum is on Leelou's lynch, and atleast one more scum is not.  this lynch acutlaly gives the least amount of info imo

 

Dawns vote once again sticks out.  why didn't she vote Leelou if the finder had outted leelou at this time?

 

 

D4 - 3 scummies left at this point.  again, they wouldn't consolidate all the votes on one lynch  once again, Dawn and Dices votes stick out the most.  the last is 50/50 between Jack or not voting.

 

 

D5 - this is the most helpful and informative lynch.  we are at LYLO, so scum are more likely to pull thier votes to rush a lynch and throw caution to the wind.  this helps us get a good feel for correctly pinning a persons alignement, based on interaction alone.  and by doing this, use a process of elimination on the previous vote counts to narrow down the scum list.

 

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

basing this souly off the previous VC's and interaction today, i'm cmming up with the following logic.

 

known - i'm town.

 

98% probability of being scum - Dawn.

 

Known - Dawns vote is on Dice.  dice is at L-1.  given a highly likely scum is voting for him and he's not hammered yet, theres a high probability that all scum votes are currently on Dice.

 

this defacto clears Dice, Lenlo, & Krak.

 

 

 

New pool of high porbability scum suspects for VC analysis - Tommy, Cloud, & X

 

 

VC analysis results - non conclusive; new suspects all voted together.

 

D5 analysis of context - X is acting the same as in D1 and D2; Tommy and Cloud appear to be acting as a team to get votes off Tommy and to get Dice Lynched.

 

Results - 65% probability of Tommy and Cloud being scum.

 

 

suggested action -

 

 

Lynch Dawn, Tommy and Cloud

 

 

 

##UNVOTE

 

##VOTE TOMMY

 

 

 

i'd prefer to test myself with lynching Dawn to vet my analysis of the VC's, but Tommy is just as good at this point.

 

Firstly Day-1 VC analysis. You say that scum will be there in both wagons. Why are you just concentrating on Mishtress?

 

Day-2. If scum will have more town on a lynch than scum until lylo-how does it single out Dawn's vote.

 

Day-4. How does Dawn's & Dice's vote stick out?

 

Also known-that is just you saying it.

 

How did you come up with that probability?

 

How does it clear them? You haven't even mentioned Tommy and Cloud before. 

 

Also your analysis is non-conclusive and you still have definite result? Wow.

 

Dawn was 98%. So going according to logic, why are you voting for someone who is in the 2% pool with 4 other people?

[Xthrax]

Tommy - todya is LYLO, this means that the scum is more likely to push a fast lynch today than any other day in this game, because they have the most to lose.

 

i dont get what you dont understand abotu my logic.  clearing Dice via the vote today is based mainly on the fact that Dawn is voting for him; becuase consitantly her vote has been the most scummiest.

 

 

infact look at the events surrounding Dawn in this game

 

- only pops in when her name is mentioned or is getting pressure (which speaks of being poked on a QT thread)

- she votes are the most scummiest in the game, she's always spread out fromt eh wagon, and the lack of putting a vote on Leelou with a finder outting Leelou is highly suspicious.

- everyone lists her as the most likely scum, yet a wagon on her NEVER gains traction.  EVER.

 

a wagon that is hard to get traction on or never gets traction is 90% of the time a wagon on a scum.

 

 

this is why i'd prefer a vote for her today.  because i think she's a guarenteed scum.

 

 

but since i can't get that vote, i look at who she is voting and how that wagon has acted.

 

 

she's voting for Dice.  now, if the scum haven't all cast their vote on Dice's wagon thent hey would have hammered him by now; because tbh at LYLO why woudl the scum start a wagon on one of their own.

 

so the only logical thing to believe her, based on Dawns vote is that all 3 scum are on Dice's wagon.  which again, limits the remaing scum to between Tommy, X, and Cloud.  each of you having an equal chance at being scum or town.

 

 

the only difference is the interaction of Tommy and Cloud on this lynch; and youre reaction when a new wagon was started.  the fact you want a fast lynch at LYLO is not townie at all.

 

 

now if you'd be willing to vote Dawn, i'd be happy to move my vote back to her, as she is my prefer lynch as i'd rather lynch someoen i'm almost positve is scum rather than somone i think is scum.

How has her vote been the most scummiest? Acc. to you Dice is cleared by her vote. Why don't you consider bussing?

 

You prefer to vote for Dawn-Why are you then voting for Tommy?

 

Why do you need someone to vote with you? Can't you vote on your own? Seems very hesitant to take the first step.

[Tommyrod]

I'll agree with what X just said. Red, you're skipping too many logical steps and 99% of the game using the VC approach you just produced. It's scummy to filter down your vote in that manner; it looks like you're fitting evidence to your existing conclusions rather than the other way around. So... please don't do that.

[Xthrax]

 to put it in short terms

 

 

Dawns is 99% likely to be scum

 

Dawn's vote clears Dice.

 

Krak and Len are cleared by not hammering Dice.

 

 

which leaves Tommy, Cloud and X as the last remaining suspects to sort out.

 

 

Tommy and Cloud give a 50/50 chance of hitting scum imo, but imo Dawn gives a near 100% chance.  which is why i think Dawn should be lynched, given we're at LYLO

 

 

edit - i dont care about her meta in a different game.  this is not the twilight game and meta is a piss poor reason to vote or not vote someone imo.

 

her actions in THIS game paint her as scum.  thats all i care about and all i'll factor in.

Also again-not considering that they could be bussing? If Dawn is 99% scum for you, why the hell aren't you voting her? You say we are at Lylo, then take the action if you think she is more scummy? This is majorly pinging right now

[Tommyrod]

X: I'm buying what you're selling. I'm waiting for her to come around, but if she doesn't, then the scum team might be precisely Dice/Krak/Red. All three require a congressional library worth's of casework on Dice to consider him as a suspect despite his shady play, yet are willing to vote me for vague things like "twisty tone" or understanding how a rolestopper works or being adjacent to their actual scum read (this one really throws me for a loop).

[Tommyrod]

I'm trying to be patient, but yeah. It's a bit much to swallow.

[Xthrax]

 

I believe X is town because he hasn't been pushing an agenda; that's hard to explain but he would be more helpful if he was scum, I think. He seems to be in his own little world. He also agrees with me, which doesn't hurt.

 

Cloud had one of the initial suspicions on VerbTina and Verb offered him up as a lynch. That's super ballsy if they are scum scum. He also sounds like he believes what he's saying when he makes cases on players.

 

So if ANY of these three are town, that means there's at least 2/4 townies on this lynch, making it much more likely that Dice is scum based on wagonmetrics.

 

 

bold - factoring in agreeing with you or disagreeing with you as a base line for scumminess or towniness is bad practice and leaves you open to being manipulated.  if i was scum and i wanted to keep on your goood side, all i woudl have to do is play you by stroking your ego.  its sets you up to be played like a pawn.  and "rolling with the flow" is a scum tactic.

 

underlined - ballsy or not, its called distancing.  i've done it myself, picked a fight and even cased my scum mates on thread to give myself town cred.  you dont measure them by the case, but by how much effort they put into the case.

 

Italics - but your discounting that we're at LYLO and the scum win if we mislynch.  which makes the scum more brazen about working cooperatively on thread to get a townie lynched and are not going to spread out their votes if they think they can get a townie lynched.  Scum would only vote a scum mate at LYLO reluctantly, Dawns vote was not reluctant.

 

hence why i'm placing so much value in Dawn's vote, enough to clear a player and so much emphasis on your's and clouds tem work in getting Dice lynched and bulling people off Tommy's wagon.

 

bold-so bottomline, what is your comment?

 

undelined-distancing or bussing yes. Consider that dawn was doing it with Dice?

 

Then vote Dawn? You are telling that if Tommy will vote with you you will move your vote.. Why do you need him to hold your hand?

[Xthrax]

X: I'm buying what you're selling. I'm waiting for her to come around, but if she doesn't, then the scum team might be precisely Dice/Krak/Red. All three require a congressional library worth's of casework on Dice to consider him as a suspect despite his shady play, yet are willing to vote me for vague things like "twisty tone" or understanding how a rolestopper works or being adjacent to their actual scum read (this one really throws me for a loop).

You're buying? Whew, I was gonna go bankrupt.

 

On a serious note though, serious logic gaps. Red is pinging heavily. I have 4 people on my list now. Dice, Red, Dawn and you. Krak seems ok to me.

[Tommyrod]

I'm a bit confused; am I still one of your scum suspects?

[Xthrax]

I'm a bit confused; am I still one of your scum suspects?

Kind of yeah. your initial seriousness kinda made me suspicious. Your behaviour now seems ok. But I can't leave anyone behind 

[Tommyrod]

Initial seriousness?

[Xthrax]

At Hallelouigah's lynch. You seemed frantic

[Tommyrod]

I have silly moods sometimes, it's kind of a running gag between me and Cory. I also told him I am scum -- but I was joking :P

[Tommyrod]

Anyway, what I'm getting at is that you and I are mindmelding lately, so if you could do me the honor of bumping me up to probable town status, I would appreciate that and it will make this game easier to solve.

[Xthrax]

We'll see tommy.