Game Over - Insane Mafia Game. Page 94

[Belal-Mafia]

I think the Balthamel-case is a classical case of someone changing his mind.

 

If that is forbidden...

 

I find this very supsicious, I'm doing a read through (with notes yay!  Write up coming erm..soonish) at the moment but thus far Mesanna has seemed to like voting for people who seem to make contradictory stament, but when presented with an actual one here she defends it?  another point on the first day Messana asks for a number to choose a person to lynch (think about that for a second if you will) which is supplied by  guess who...Baltamel

 

I'm not going to vote right now, but Mesaana is looking decidedly mafiaish at the moment

 

 

FWIW, you're not the only one who sees a connection between Balthamel and Mesaana, or who finds Mesaana suspicious. 

 

 

[Graendal-Mafia]

After doing my catch up reading from this weekend, I have to say I'm still not happy with the no kill vote of day one. At the moment though, after reading the reviews and going over the actions of day 2, I am going to [glow=red,2,300]unvote[/glow] and change my vote to [glow=red,2,300]Graendal[/glow]. Day 1 you were fairly quiet and jumped onto the no kill bandwagon very quickly. Then during day 2 first you wanted everyone to name our two top candidates we think are mafia, and then you placed a random vote on Aginor and demanding an explaination. After you recieved your explaination from Aginor you stated:

 

well, Rahvin seems to think he have enough on you to vote for you. doesnt mean I think I do, but then, I dont really have enough to not vote for you either. but i'll [glow=white,2,300]unvote[/glow] for now. but only because I dont have time to think atm..

 

This all just seems a little off and mafiaish to me. It almost seems like you saw a bandwagon with reasoning starting and quickly removed the vote.

 

firstly, about day one, it really was because I 1. was busy, hence the lack of activity 2. I voted no kill because I didnt want to place a random vote on someone I wasnt sure about, and that I thought Be'lal had good reasons for it. plus, I wasnt sure if I was going to be around much the next days. so it was a mix of the two really. if I had been around more, I might have had time to concider my vote more closely. 

 

about day two and my suggestions and voting for Aginor... hmm, i'm not really sure what to say here that I havent really said before. so i'll let it be.

 

so yeah,  of course I cant really prove my lack of time to be on here without revealing who I am, so i'm not going to. so i'm pretty srue that this wont make you take your vote off me, but at least i've defended myself as much as I can at this time.

 

and I think Balthamel looks more suspicious than Mesaana, but she sure got my attention with her comment about changing minds.. but i'm keeping my vote on Balthamel.

[Guest Moghedien-Mafia]

In the interest of moving forward, because I don't have a month and a half worth of attention span, I am going to change my vote back to [glow=red,2,300]Graendal[/glow]. And if the game doesn't get moving, I am going to back out. If this seems a bit pissy, well, I have a three hour night class in just a few hours and this game is ridiculously long...

 

 

I understand thinking and rereads, but honestly! There are times you need to move on a whim.

 

[Arangar-Mafia]

[glow=red,2,300]Unvote Cyndane Vote Graendal[/glow] 

[Belal-Mafia]

Vote count:

 

Be'lal (2) - Balthamel, Ishamael

Graendal (6) - Aginor, Mesaana, Lanfear, Sammael, Moghedien, Aran'gar

Balthamel (4) - Be'lal, Moridin, Halima, Graendal

Demandred (1) - Asmodean

Aginor (1) - Rahvin

 

With 16 players, nine votes to lynch

[Barmacral]

Ok, it is generally agreed upon by most here that this day is too long. I did warn time limits, and now's the time to set it. Tomorrow at 5pm day 2 ends unless the vote completes before then.

[Graendal-Mafia]

I really am innocent guys  :P

 

and how many hours away is 5 pm?

[Guest Cyndane-Mafia]

Well, Graendal seems to have a Bandwagoning going on.  I, however, will vote [glow=red,2,300]Balthamel[/glow] because he seems more suspicious to me atm.

[Guest Cyndane-Mafia]

Just saw Barm and Greandals posts.  I'm keeping my vote on Balthamel.  Just because there is a time limit don't mean we need to rush this.  We still have some time.  So think before you act.  ;)

[Ishamael-Mafia]

 

I'm on the bandwagon simply to move things along and the case against Graendal is as firm as any of the others. Unvote Be'lal, vote [glow=red,2,300]Graendal[/glow]

[Barmacral]

Approximately 24 hours from now.

[Asmodean-Mafia]

Hmmmm. I know i said i wouldn't change however I dont like the way this is going, at the moment I baltamel is much higher on my twichy evil mafia list, for previously stated reasons however Graendal has not yet, that I can remeber twiched any alarm bells so to keep the choice in this and stop a run away bandwagon on Graendal I vote [glow=red,2,300]Baltamel[/glow]. Remember guys, 24 hours is time enough for 2 or 3 votes to be placed on whoever so there really is no need to rush right this moment.

[Belal-Mafia]

Vote count:

 

Be'lal (1) - Balthamel

Graendal (7) - Aginor, Mesaana, Lanfear, Sammael, Moghedien, Aran'gar, Ishamael

Balthamel (6) - Be'lal, Moridin, Halima, Graendal, Cyndane, Asmodean

Aginor (1) - Rahvin

 

With 16 players, nine votes to lynch

 

Rahvin and Demandred need to vote for either Balthamel or Graendal.  Balthamel will obviously join the Graendal bandwagon as soon as he sees what's going on today.

 

Is anyone on either lynch open to switching?  I'll say flat out that I'm not - I think Balthamel's been very suspicious, and I see some other information to gather from his lynch, which I'll explain after night falls and we've lynched someone (I don't want the info to effect how people act, as it will taint things).

 

[Balthamel-Mafia]

Self preservation is a powerful force. [glow=red,2,300]Graendal[/glow]

 

Thank you for you defense Messana, I know you are right, however if I die either today or tonight and you find out that I am innocent, don't take this as a proof of Messana's innocence. Although I have a hunch that she is innocent beyond what she has said.

 

I realise we are very close to a lynch here, so I would ask that if either of us get to 8 votes that they are allowed one final post. We don't want to kill any roled innocents.

[Guest Moridin-Mafia]

I'm not jumping ship. Three more votes for Balthamel or one more for Graendal. We have time to consider this properly, so those of you voting Graendal simply for the sake of getting a lynch in before then ... either candidate could go at this stage, which gives us an oppurtunity to still make the best decision possible. Graendal or Balthamel. I think it's Balthamel who we need to kill and I'm not budging. Some of the things that Graendal has done have been suspicious, but Balthamel has been on my radar since day one. I think we need to dissect the Mesaana/Balthamel relationship as well, see if there really is anything there.

[Balthamel-Mafia]

*sigh*

 

I have been told, that there is one other person who knows my alignment who is not a cop. I suspect it is Messana as she is sticky up for me more then usual, but who knows she may just genuinely believe in em..

[Guest Moridin-Mafia]

That's pretty darn ambiguous. Are we going to get this every time we try to lynch someone? And why wait till now to reveal this? I'm not budging until I hear more. I realise that you may be unable to give it. That would just be too bad.

[Balthamel-Mafia]

Your right. I won't talk about it.

 

Can I just ask what evidence there is for a relationship? I mean she defended me, but other then that I have not mentioned her at all, apart from saying that it doesn't prove anything about her innocence?

 

Haven't I? I cannot be bothered combing through all my posts...

[Ishamael-Mafia]

I won’t have much time to post over the next few days, but I’ll check in when I can. Everyone seems to be a bit over cautious, and while I understand that they are trying not to get killed, they are also not adding to the game by not posting. So far a few of us have built cases, Mesaana doing the best job yet. Why don’t some of the inactive players jump in and do the same? I for one, do no think it’s necessary to come up with thirty-nine different reasons to vote or unvote somebody before we go to the next lynch. I have to agree with Moggy, almost sixty pages is way to long to have only made it as far as we have.  Let’s get on with it! 

[Guest Moridin-Mafia]

Aaaand ... neither can I. Let's just continue with our lives and wait on the not-lazy people. I didn't keep many notes and I don't have those with me anyway.

 

So, on to the Mesaana connection and implied role claim.

 

I say either you're either evil and trying to keep it ambiguous so no one can counter claim, or if you're not willing to reveal to save your skin, it can't be that crucial to our victory.

As for quasi-confirming the Mesaana connection ... this close to the chopping block I don't think you'd put a fellow mafia on the spot like that. You could be taking advantage of the perceived connection between you to bring her down after you're revealed as evil, or you could be a symp trying to distract our suspicions by claiming a connection and then coming up innocent.

 

And then there's the possibility that you're telling the truth, or as much of it as you can. And I'm sorry, but I can't and won't turn around based on a quasi-reveal. There's too many doors left open. If you leave no option to test your information, as it is with a cop reveal, if there is no mechanism to expose false claimers by counter claims and other means, then there is no choice but to act as though the claim is false, because to suspect you and let you go free based on a claim that no one has the oppurtunity to disprove is irresponsible.

[Guest Cyndane-Mafia]

Basically, people are repeating me.  Don't rush, think it out, we have enough time.

 

I truly think that Balthamel is the way to go.  If he's innocent, obviously I'm going to have to do some rethinking.

 

Really, this is just check-in before bed.  Night all.

[Guest Moghedien-Mafia]

Just got in from my class. I still agree with where I voted. I only unvoted because of the LOA. No regrets as it was already thought out.

[Balthamel-Mafia]

Dude if i turned out to be evil, then no matter what I say Messana would be on the chopping block, as she went out of her way to say Balth is innocent. I mean really this "connection" was totally intiated by her, how could I possible tar her with my supposed guilt.

 

If anything it shows confidence and guts to stand up for someone that others thing she is guilty.

 

Having said that she maybe mafia who is trying to associate with an innocent who is about to be killed (and have his alignment revealed). I dunno...

 

Counter-Claim?!? What makes you think there is only one doc/cop? Thats a REALLY bad assumption, in another game there were two cops...What if someone claims cop, some else says no wait I"M A COP, then the townies lynch one and the mafia kills the other? Thats a terrible scenario....

 

What do Rahvin and Demmy think?

[Belal-Mafia]

OK, out with it:

 

Balthamel:

 

Pros - 1) deeply suspicious (odd activity day 1, which he then lied about day two and acted inconsistently as well; lying about prior acts is something an innocent would not do).  2) Seems to have a connection with Mesaana, and a guilty verdict on Balthamel will really raise my antennae on her.  Yes, he called attention to the connection in his last post, so if he's evil he may be hoping to kill off a helpful player through guilt by association - but the connection had been noted beforehand and its equally likely that he's using reverse psychology. 3) The bandwagon on Graendal picked up steam just as Balthamel's lynch was becoming more likely and mine less (making Graendal the new lynch du jour).  If he's guilty, we look at the votes that fueled the Graendal alternative at the key moment: Sammael, Moghedien, Aran'gar, Ishamael.  Moghedien is least suspicious of the 4 for at least having voted Graendal before the LOA.  Since Sammael and Ishamael were already on my suspicious list, along with Mesaana, a guilty verdict on Balthamel makes the next day's lynch one of those 3 (I'm leaning towards Sammael, myself); 4) If innocent, reasons for suspecting Mesaana and Sammael drop a bit; no reason to suspect Moghedien at all.

 

Cons - he could be innocent.  If so, he seems like a fairly measured, logical guy, which is a loss for us. 

 

Graendal:

 

Pros - 1) Somewhat suspicious behavior (voting randomly then asking for a defense and unvoting, asking for "top two"s from everybody - I say "somewhat" suspicious because I can see an innocent possibly playing this way, and at least she hasn't lied about anything [that we've caught, anyway]) 2) If she's guilty, there are somewhat suspicious links to the people who jumped on the Balthamel bandwagon towards the end, when it became clear that it was her or Balthamel.

 

Cons - could be innocent.  If she is, we don't learn much.

 

My take:

 

Lynching Balthamel gives us the most info whether he is guilty or innocent.  If Balthamel comes up innocent, we lynch Graendal tomorrow and see where we stand.  If Balthamel is guilty, we lynch Sam/Ish/Mes.

 

I don't think lynching Graendal is the smart play, but if the vote does swing that way and she's innocent, we'd better damn well lynch Balthamel the next day.

[Demandred-Mafia]

I'm currently reading through both Graendal's and Balthamel's posts, and I'll post my decision after.