Game Over - Insane Mafia Game. Page 94

[Guest Moghedien-Mafia]

He did answer with a yes.

 

Yes I did, and I fully intend to keep that vote there, until he is; lynched, nightfall or proof of an Evil is found.

 

If I wanted to start a bandwagon, I would pull up some good reasons to vote for someone and vote for said person. OR I would agree with someone else's good reasons and vote for the person. It all depends on how it is playing out. With him saying he didn't see your vote, I would assume that the former is his choice, but there wasn't much to go on, so he spur of the moment voted it. Not random, but the next step up, pretty much.

[Guest Mesaana-Mafia]

Well, I don't believe anyone would honestly answer this question with a "yes". So Asmo's lying. Glad you get my reasoning. Sweet dreams!!!

[Guest Moghedien-Mafia]

I just said I would. If the person I felt needed to be voted was already voted.

[Guest Cyndane-Mafia]

I think that that is the point.  Asmo first said that he didn't notice Mesaanas vote.  Then he said that he wanted to start a bandwagon.

 

I think that's what Mesaanas trying to explain.

[Guest Cyndane-Mafia]

What's up with me being the only one around today?  :-\

[Guest Moridin-Mafia]

And she thinks I use thin reasoning ...

 

Look, I get what you're saying, but I think you're operating on a different definition of bandwagon voting than Asmo and, for that matter, myself.

 

If Asmo very specifically wanted to start a bandwagon on Demandred, he would vote for Demandred and hope that other people did the same. One vote does not constitute a bandwagon, but you can still hope to start one. The only way to start a bandwagon on a specific player is to vote for them.

 

You are thinking of a bandwagon in the sense of jumping on a person with a few votes in the hopes of starting a trend. It is one definition of bandwagonning. It is the 'classical' definition. But it doesn't allow for trying to take out a specific player, like Asmo seems to want to. You show up and vote for someone who already looks to be gathering votes. What Asmo appears to be doing is clinging persistently to one player in the hopes that a bandwagon will later develop. This still constitutes a desire to start a bandwagon. I don't see this as a lie in any way, shape or form.

 

However, if he wants to see Demandred dance any time soon, maybe he should restate his case instead of hoping other people pick it up? Maybe with quotes? And helpful illustrations?

 

It seems that Mesaana is making a career out of interpreting people rather aggressively. This, my dear, is one of the things making me suspicious of you.

[Guest Moridin-Mafia]

I'm here too, let's have a picnic!

 

Also Mesaana, a mafioso would totally use irony. Your reason for unvoting is as flimsy as your reason for voting in the first place. Maybe you sensed the tide of opinion shifting? Maybe you just realised how stupid it sounded? Either way, it doesn't seem like your heart was really in the Asmo vote in the first place. I get the impression that you're sitting there waiting for something, anything, from any player, that you can make out to be positive proof of guilt before rationality catches up with you and slows or aborts the lynch train. Stop putting sensationalism before substance, my dear.

[Guest Cyndane-Mafia]

Hehe.  Thanks for showing up, Moridin.  I was getting rather bored.

 

[glow=red,2,300]Be'lal[/glow]

 

However, my vote is liable to change.  I think that the Be'lal=good/Be'lal=evil question should be answered.  It needs to be answered of everyone, but finding out if Be'lal is evil or innocent can give us clues from the whole "No Kill" situation.

[Balthamel-Mafia]

It is very annoying that 90% of the actvitity goes on here when I am sleeping.

 

Assumption 1:

There is atleast one poper healer in this game

 

Fact 1:

Semy died, after being "outed" as a healer

 

Assumption 2:

Semy knew she would be targetted and chose to protect herself, if she was indeed a doc.

 

Results?

 

Semy was not a healer and she knew it (maybe she lied just to stop herself getting lynched)

Semy was not a healer but she didn't know it. (Some 50% role, or just Barmy messing with us)

Semy was a healer and didn't protect herself (Very Stupid and unlikely)

There is some kinda of killer who can kill people under protection (Unlikly as it would be WAY too powerful, even if it was just a one shot.

 

Conlusion;

 

It is unlikely Semy didn't heal herself, or the killers had some sort of anti-doc weapon, IMHO. There fore I doubt whether Semy was a 100% true doc, therefore I reckon there is another doc out there, some where...

 

And that is the key question, cause if the cop gets a guilty should he reveal? What are the chances of there being more protection out there?

 

I don't think the cop should reveal yet but its something to think about...

 

Secondly, I like Messana, 'cause she is smart enough to know I am innocent.

 

Thirdly, Be'lal did something that was very stupid. He is ethier guilty or a bad townie, either way he is someone we can afford to lose.

 

Fourthly, the reason I unvoted on the no-kill was because I just couldn't be bothered arguing with you, seeing as it was going that way anyway...

 

*sigh*

[Guest Moridin-Mafia]

Bel'al did something very stupid? He suggested a course of action, and a number of people followed it. The course of action made sense at the time, or they wouldn't have voted as they did. At least I hope not. If you thought it was stupid at the time, you should never have supported it. I've said I'll hold off on lynching Bel'al because when someone is active in the way he has been it is better to act with some degree of certainty before you top them. I don't feel I have that degree of certainty. However, if this day drags on long enough I might agree with you. He is still on my suspect list. I just believe there are better ways to find out if he is guilty without killing him. Ways that leave him alive, for instance.

[Guest Moghedien-Mafia]

I think that that is the point.  Asmo first said that he didn't notice Mesaanas vote.  Then he said that he wanted to start a bandwagon.

 

I think that's what Mesaanas trying to explain.

 

I also said the answer could be the opposite. I think I understand what he's saying, I just don't think he has good reasoning. Er, what Moridin said, which is pretty much what I said before, just more indepth.

 

I don't think Be'lal has done anything to look any more guilty than several of our players. All he did was propose a gamble that spiced things up. Especially when the deal went South. Let's face it. Win some, lose some. But if no one ever spiced up the action, most of us would not keep coming back to play.

[Guest Cyndane-Mafia]

I think I understand you now.

 

True, but I'm going to keep my vote on Be'lal for now.  I hate voing and then unvoting and just digging myself a hole for needless suspicion.

[Belal-Mafia]

Bel'al did something very stupid? [glow=blue,2,300]He suggested a course of action, and a number of people followed it. The course of action made sense at the time, or they wouldn't have voted as they did. At least I hope not. If you thought it was stupid at the time, you should never have supported it.[/glow] I've said I'll hold off on lynching Bel'al because when someone is active in the way he has been it is better to act with some degree of certainty before you top them. I don't feel I have that degree of certainty. However, if this day drags on long enough I might agree with you. He is still on my suspect list. I just believe there are better ways to find out if he is guilty without killing him. Ways that leave him alive, for instance.

 

Exactly.  This has been bothering me about Balthamel from the beginning, and I think I just figured out why.  He started off by coming out strongly against a no-lynch . . . and then just faded into the background, made no arguments against it, and even unvoted me.  Not that I didn't appreciate it - but it made no sense.  The more I think about it, the more it looks to me like overly-obvious bad-mafia signaling: "I'm not mafia, look how strongly I was against a no kill that helped the mafia" - except it was more show than substance.

 

And, since Mesaana has at least been helpful with the cases I'm willing to keep her around a bit longer, even if I still have Mesaana at the top of my suspicious list.

 

So . . . [glow=red,2,300]unvote: Mesaana.  vote: Balthamel[/glow]

[Guest Cyndane-Mafia]

One more thing before I "hit the hay"

 

The above post of mine is not the only reason for me to keep my vote on Be'lal, just a little something I noticed people are taking notice of me.  Yeah.  I need to get to sleep.  I can't think straight when I'm tired.  Night all.

 

I'll try to check in in the morning, but then I won't be around until around 2:30pm my time.

[Belal-Mafia]

Hehe.  Thanks for showing up, Moridin.  I was getting rather bored.

 

[glow=red,2,300]Be'lal[/glow]

 

However, my vote is liable to change.  I think that the Be'lal=good/Be'lal=evil question should be answered.  It needs to be answered of everyone, but finding out if Be'lal is evil or innocent can give us clues from the whole "No Kill" situation.

 

If I thought that were true, I'd vote for myself to give the team the worthwhile info . . . but it just isn't.  Assume I'm innocent, for the moment - coroner confirmed, and all that.  Tell me - what does that tell you, other than that I made a play and it backfired?

 

BTW, I'll say it now: since we still have an even number of players, there will come a time when a no-lynch is the smart play: endgame.  At the point where two more innocent deaths ends the game (a wrong lynch + nightkill) it makes sense to let the day go without a lynch so that when you are guessing about who is evil you pick from a smaller player pool (and therefore have a better chance of getting it right)

 

I know there's no chance in the world that I last to endgame, so I figured I'd better put it out there now while I still could.

[Guest Moghedien-Mafia]

BTW, I'll say it now: since we still have an even number of players, there will come a time when a no-lynch is the smart play: endgame.  At the point where two more innocent deaths ends the game (a wrong lynch + nightkill) it makes sense to let the day go without a lynch so that when you are guessing about who is evil you pick from a smaller player pool (and therefore have a better chance of getting it right)

 

I know there's no chance in the world that I last to endgame, so I figured I'd better put it out there now while I still could.

 

This is assuming there is not another incident. But it is definately great to keep in mind.

[Balthamel-Mafia]

That is the ONLY time when no lynches are a good idea.

 

On the first night, they are always a bad idea. What new infomation did we gain? Nothing!?

 

You are not the only suspisious one Be'lal, I would suspect anyone who followed you on the bandwagan, but you started it and that makes you suspect number 1.

 

I unvoted because it was clear that every had been sucked into a no-lynch and I couldn't be bothered arguing. If I was mafia wouldn't I have held the moral high-ground for the entire day, or if I was going to give in I would of voted for a no lynch to speed it up.

 

The more I think about the more it looks like signalling that I AM A TOWNIE, because I disagreed with a scummish move, and that it looks like you are evil 'cause you supported it!

 

Be'lal you are making WAY to many assumptions about this game.

 

How do you know there are only 1 mafia? What if there is 2 or 3? What if there is a SK? What if a doc saves someone? What if mafia kill each other? What if there are turn coats, or recruitable members?

 

Your simple 2 deaths a day/night idea is simplistic to the point of... This isn't newbie mafia, expected the unexpected and don't plan your all game play on the idea of 3 mafia + 1 doc + 1 cop.

 

'Cause if I was the mod I would go out of my way to make the game have as many twists and turns as possible!?!?

 

I once played a WoT mafia game where Rand could end up on 3 different sides, Forsaken Mafia, Lanfear's Lover or Townie!

 

I vote [glow=red,2,300]Be'lal[/glow] again for being either very wrong or very evil.

 

[Lanfear-Mafia]

Ok, firstly, apologies for not posting much yesterday.  I was around, but didn't feel I had that much to add to what was being said.  Secondly, I'm going to [glow=red,2,300]unvote Aran'gar[/glow], because the only reason I had was for inactivity, and that question has been answered, regardless of interpretation, and if Real Life issues are involved then that's another explanation as well.  Make of this what you will.

 

However, we do need to move on.  I don't like the idea of lynching someone who has been instrumental in the game, either in decisions or actions, but we may have to in order to get some information.  Otherwise, this could be the longest day two in mafia history.

 

As to who to vote for, well...  I'll take each of the people already voted for and look at the options.

 

Be'lal.  I voted to go to night without a lynch because it seemed like the best way to move on, and I could even see the logic to it.  I did, however, have my misgivings - I didn't like the fact that we'd be losing the chance, however slim, to lynch a mafia.  Right now, to my mind, it seems like one way of advancing would be to lynch Be'lal, to satisfy the communal curiosity about his motives. 

 

Cyndane.  As far as I can see, Cyndane has been a fairly active player, although part of it has lacked substance.  She's changed her votes around a bit, and she at one point said that I was fairly high on her suspect list, although that was a while ago.  Aside from that, she hasn't really done anything that stands out, in my opinion.

 

Demandred.  I'm not sure on the exact reasons Asmodean voted for Demandred.  On day one it was because he was laying low.  On day two, he votes for Demandred again, only doesn't give a reason this time.  This does seem suspicious to my mind, although if he was wanting to get a bandwagon going and didn't really care about the reasons - just a hunch - well...  I don't know what to think on this one.

 

Aginor.  I can see Rahvin's logic in thinking that one of the mafia would be hiding somewhere in a bandwagon to push for the no lynch.  Out of Rahvin's list of suspects, he picks Aginor, saying that "he (Aginor) believes they should have taken out Be'lal yesterday, when he actually voted to go to night with no lynch."  That does seem suspicious, too, but I had no hunches about Aginor, so I didn't look closer at him.  Perhaps that's a mistake on my part - I don't know.  Right now, he doesn't seem like a big target for lynching, although a doubt is there.

 

Graendal.  I thought her random voting whimsical (yes, I'm still using that word), and that she was one of my suspects.  She still is, to an extent, although the fact that she's on a semi LOA makes it difficult to vote for her when she can't answer any allegations.  Aginor votes for her on the grounds that she's looking more and more evil, although could it be in retaliation as well for her earlier random vote for him?  I'm not sure.  He also says that he finds her suggestion that everyone name two suspects very suspicious.  Again, she's still one of my suspects, but with the situation as it is...

 

Balthamel.  I don't know what to think about Balthamel.  A lot of what he says makes sense, but a few of the things he's done seem to contradict - although he did give an explanation for that (the vehement argument against the no lynch, and his explanation about unvoting - regardless of how it's interpreted).  Balthamel is another one that I haven't had any hunches about, although I'm going to look more closely at what everyone's posted to see if I can glean anything with these facts in mind.

 

I don't know what to think now.  Unless I find someone else who seems more suspicious (and at this point, I've been over the gamethread so many times I'm in danger of knowing it word for word), then I might end up voting for one of the people already voted for to get things moving. 

 

This is my first attempt at this sort of thing (reviews of fellow players, according to my opinions), and I've never tried to hide how new I am to these games.  That's not necessarily an excuse, merely an explanation.  Either way, I'll give my vote later on today.

[Lanfear-Mafia]

However, we do need to move on.  I don't like the idea of lynching someone who has been instrumental in the game, either in decisions or actions, but we may have to in order to get some information.  Otherwise, this could be the longest day two in mafia history.

 

Ok, I just noticed that this could be taken any number of ways, and thought I'd better explain.  By saying instrumental to the game in decisions and actions, I meant those who suggest we do things - the proactive people who try to get things moving or those who take the time to write up reviews of their fellow players and suchlike - regardless of motive, in both cases -  rather than sitting back and letting everyone else do the work.  People who are active, and helpfully so, give us more clues than those who lay low, or that's what I've found out so far.

[Guest Mesaana-Mafia]

I'm here too, let's have a picnic!

 

Also Mesaana, a mafioso would totally use irony. Your reason for unvoting is as flimsy as your reason for voting in the first place. Maybe you sensed the tide of opinion shifting? Maybe you just realised how stupid it sounded? Either way, it doesn't seem like your heart was really in the Asmo vote in the first place. I get the impression that you're sitting there waiting for something, anything, from any player, that you can make out to be positive proof of guilt before rationality catches up with you and slows or aborts the lynch train. Stop putting sensationalism before substance, my dear.

 

Opinion was not shifting: 2 people agreed, 1 did not. And I stand by all I said. I still believe Asmodean couldn't honestly think about starting a bandwagon on someone without vote, while 10 other players had votes; and that the use of irony is a reason for an unvote.

[Ishamael-Mafia]

 

How do you know there are only 1 mafia? What if there is 2 or 3? What if there is a SK? What if a doc saves someone? What if mafia kill each other? What if there are turn coats, or recruitable members?

 

 

 

I am catching up on posts and saw this. I did not see where a 1 mafia game thoery had been posted. Is this just an example of a thoery or was it suggested? I don't have time to look right now and I'll be in and out while traveling. (No, not that kind of travelling! I'll be stuck in a car.)

[Guest Mesaana-Mafia]

it's about one mafia-team.

 

and he is quite late with making these remarks.

[Guest Rahvin-Mafia]

I think we can speculate till we are all blue in the face, it makes it even harder as we have no role reveals when someone dies.

 

I still think thta going for a 'No Vote' on day one would be very risky for an evil to do. Though if Be'lal is who I think he is it wouldn't be the first time for such a brash move, but he hasn't set anything up here, so I'm just having trouble seeing it.

 

Thats why I think looking at others maybe just as good.

 

 

[Guest Mesaana-Mafia]

First of all: after rereading my cases, I'm gonna replace my vote on [glow=red,2,300]Graendal[/glow]. She is, for now, in no danger of being lynched before her LOA is over.

 

Vote count:

Be'lal (5) - Balthamel, Sammael, Ishamael, Cyndane, Balthamel

 

Cyndane (2) - Moghedien, Aran'gar

Graendal (2) - Aginor, Mesaana

 

Balthamel(1) - Be'lal

Demandred (1) - Asmodean

Aginor (1) - Rahvin

 

8 votes to lynch. And I see there's 4 people who haven't voted yet: Asmodean, Halima (where is she?), Graendal (on LOA), and Demandred.

[Balthamel-Mafia]

You counted me twice.

 

Those people who haven't voted and are hiding, should vote now or else we should consider lynching them...