Thanks for the replies.  I do think it's the site linked by ilovezam, the url looks familiar.  I'll take a peek at the compendium.  Ty for the help.

Hello,

I have tried to find a resource that I used back during my last reread in 2013.  It was a list of all the characters, but it had every reference to each character listed (for example- every appearance of Matt, what book, chapters, with summary.)  I have been trying to search for it, but with the TV series, I can't seem to find it.  I'm not even sure if it exists.  If it does, would someone be kind enough to link it?  Thank you.

Is the Wheel in any sense sentient / self-aware / able to predict events?

 

RJ said it's not sentient; more like a supercomputer.

 

So it would have data inputs from people and events in the world, process them, output some actions, like spinning out ta'veren on the basis of indications/predictions from its program. OK, fine. Thanks.

 

 

So the Wheel is a Micro$oft product...

So why si the DO even trying?  It'll implode eventually...

The one thing that everyone overlooks regarding Logain and Siuan/Leanne is that they are essential weaves in the pattern currently and have all been or will be (which regarding what we know about the patttern might be the same) highly influenced by ta'veran.  They could not kill themselves if they wanted too.  Therefore, using them as a crux to the argument that stilling/gentling is a fate note worse than death is inaccurate.  They very likely could not kill themselves if they wanted to.  (Which Logain very clearly did.)

With regard to the Sea Folk being greedy, they are not being greedy. They are helping their own society to the fullest. How is that greedy?

Trying to get everything you can out of a bargain being made for their assistance in using a device that will fix the weather and stop them being wiped out isn't greedy? Simply saving the lives of their people isn't enough, they need more, and that isn't greedy?

 

It is clearly stated time and again the the books from many POV that gentling/stilling/burning out is a fate far worse than death.

I wonder if Setalle Anan agrees with that? Or Siuan?

So in fact, the Sea Folk are far more gentle and ethical when it comes to their treatment of male channelers, while the Aes Sedai knowinlgy lead male channelers to the worse fate known to their organization.

No. They remove a threat. They do so in the way that is least harmful. If those who have been Gentled later commit suicide, that is their choice. If they decide life is worth living and go on to live rich and fulfilling lives, so much the better. The only option the Sea Folk men have is death.

 

Regarding the rest of the converstaion, another key point as to why Aes Sedai and the White Tower have so much animosity towards them and they are fun so foolishly is that everything about their heirarchy is based on strength. Further, this strength in the OP is used to make Aes Sedai greater than all non-channelers in Randland, even kings and queens. They use this inborn position as the sole placement factor in their society.

Hence why it is a fate worse than death to AS. It may be bad in its own right, but to an AS it is worse because they are defined by their ability to channel, and strength in the Power. It is also why they get rid of those who are burnt out. They don't like the reminder that it could happen to them.

You ahve taken my points out of context and argued them.  This is a typical tactic of laywers who don't have the law on their side.

The discussion regarding the Sea folk athem not being greedy was about channelers respect to THEIR OWN scociety.

With regard to stilling, that is a theme that RJ goes on and on about throughout the books, very often time in first POV of channelers. 

And yes, I do believe that letting someone live in suffering until they kill themselves is far more cruel than if they are simply put out of their msiery in the first place.

And now further, the context of my entire discussion is not nit picking points separate from the whole, but rather that Aes Sedai function the most poorly in their society as compared to other societies with free channelers:  the Sea Fol and Wise Ones.  Despite your out of context arguements, my point is still valid.

The real life examples are accurate for two resons, first they are not fates absolutely worse than death (as is evidenced by the discussion following Aviendha holding open the collapsing waygate and leading to becoming first sisters with Elayne iirc) and second, because the book examples are decisions forced on another.

With regard to the Sea Folk being greedy, they are not being greedy.  They are helping their own society to the fullest.  How is that greedy? They do not interact with Randland except on the barest terms.

Besides, how come that the Atha'an Miere and practically everyone else can handle male channelers so marvelously well? Answer me that.

Do they really deal with them any better than anyone else? They murder them. At least the Aes Sedai try to save lives. Plus, given that the Sea Folk spend most of their time aboard ships, and ships are a more restrictive environment with fewer places to hide than a city, for example, it is hardly surprising if it is easier to find channeling men.

Regarding the rest of the converstaion, another key point as to why Aes Sedai and the White Tower have so much animosity towards them and they are fun so foolishly is that everything about their heirarchy is based on strength, within the White Tower and out.  This is retarded, as inborn strength does not qualify one to be anything of value with regard to human to human interaction.  Further, this strength in the OP is used to make Aes Sedai greater than all non-channelers in Randland, even kings and queens.  They use this inborn position as the sole placement factor in their society.  Imagine if we were talking about height for example, a society which bases power on the ability (or lack there of) to be tall....  Even rulers by firth right need to show merit in their endevours.

The Sea Folk and the Wise Ones on the other hand are not instantaneously the highest in their society because of inborn gifts.  If they attain it, iti s because of merit, but along the way, non-channelers are their superiors with social standing: the Sailmistress on a ship and other non-channeling Wise Ones (even even clan chiefs to a certain extent.)

Edit:  Aes Sedai also use the ignorance, fear and segregation of non-channelers as their primary tool of control.  Of course that will breed hate and contempt in their society.  The Sea Folk and Wise Ones work together within their society providing continual benefit to all those around them.

Other than my above post regarding Aes Sedai leadership qualifications (only strength in wsilding hte power) I find their general stance in the world foolish. 

They think so highly of themselves, as if they are great servents in teh world and bring so much good, "guide" those ignorant fools for the benefit of humanity, fight the Shadow, yadda yadda.

But what I see is a group of people trying (and failing) at nothing more than perpetuation of a time and power long past.  They themselves know it's a farce, many oustide the tower know it as well, yet they do nothing but perpetuate.  They reasons to not try anything new or to create new, they cite their history of perpetuation as validation of their perpetuation.  It's asinine.  All those who do more (like Siuan and Moraine) find themselves outside the Tower and all those who have done more recently are oustide the Tower (Like Egwene, Elayne, Nynaeve, etc.)  Yet, even those like Siuanwho fight the Tower cannot cannot make the leap to understanding that the fault IS the Tower.

It's like Egwene's stance after beoming the Amyrlin.  She forsakes Rand and others on whom the fate of the entire world rides because the "Tower" is all that matters.  Very foolish indeed.