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A WHEEL OF TIME COMMUNITY

9kindsofidiot

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About 9kindsofidiot

  • Birthday 11/17/1981
  1. what exactly is the shouting for? The feeling heavy bit is good because the body Rand carried was heavy. The Shouting may be Rand willing himself to awaken or him and Moridin fighting for control of the only usable body left to both of them. Feeling heavy would be Rand settling into Moridin's body or coming out of TAR and into reality. Or both.
  2. I like this theory Thanks! I've had a few more thoughts. There is still the question of how Rand knows how to do it. But I've done more research and found where Perrin figures out how to duplicate how Slayer jumps between TAR and reality (page 615). All Perrin has to do is "awaken" to return to reality. It is likely LTT would have known that half of it. And Rand possibly figured out the body swap part through the Aelfinn question and the link between him and Moridin. His whispering about that very question indicates he was definitely thinking about it at that time. To put it simly, he has to awaken his soul from Moridin's side of the link. I have a feeling the "Shouting" and Rand feeling heavy is a clue to all of this. I also think this provides more evidence, albeit circumstantial, for the Aiel woman (Nakomi) to be the Creator's proxy. There is some indication her visit to Aviendha in TOM happened in TAR (channeling without the True Souce, disappearing without sound). And the wording "her form retreated" and not "she walked away" at the end suggests that scene was in TAR as well. Also, with Rand performing the body swap, it can be stated more definitely that the Creator took no action in the world. All he/she did was coach Rand and Aviendha and they both figured out the rest.
  3. I haven't had the chance to read this whole topic, so I'm sorry if someone has already brought this up. I've been thinking about the body swap and how it might have occurred. With the Horn being sounded at Shayol Ghul, TAR and reality became one. In fact, even before it was sounded from Perrin's perspective we see Rand/Moridin/Nynaeve/Moiraine in TAR and reality from Thom's view confirming the thinness of the Pattern there. I'm not saying the Horn had anything to do with it, but I can't rule it out. In any case, the key is the blending of TAR and reality. With the Bore sealed moments before the swap occurs, this blending should have been receding. This is where I think the Horn was needed to help keep that link until the swap could be completed. We have seen it possible with Slayer when he steps out of TAR into reality he has the opportunity to switch souls. So as Rand climbs out of the Pit the Aiel woman says "Yes, that's good. That is what you need to do" (AMOL, pg 892), Rand is performing the soul swapping as she disappears (her form retreated) because Rand is leaving TAR for Moridin's body and vice versa.
  4. I took another stab at a timeline (PDF attached for readability). AMOL can be read more or less sequentially. The only story behind is the Black Tower and it doesn't throw things off too much. Thanks again to the chapter/POV information at http://encyclopaedia-wot.org. amol.pdf
  5. My first attempt at this is at http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/71766-tgs-and-tom-combined-timeline/?view=findpost&p=2377817. I was working on an second version in December, but haven't made much progress since then. I'm not sure it changes much except for the Black Tower plotline. With those chapters interspersed with the TGS and TOM chapters, the rest of AMOL would end up more or less sequential.
  6. As I understand it, there are at least two reasons. First, you don't sleep when in TAR in the flesh, but the lack of sleep accumulates as sort of a sleep debt that you must repay afterwards, bringing you very close to death. Second, and more importantly, if you die when in TAR in the flesh, you are burned from the Pattern and can't be spun back in. This is why I believe the practice is referred to as "evil", much like most reactions to the use of balefire. I have 2 problems with this even though it is explicitly stated in AMOL (and possibly in previous books) that entering in the flesh and then dying would burn your thread from the Pattern. Wasn't Moridin's goal with siding with the DO to not be reincarnated ever again? Why couldn't he just enter TAR and have someone kill him? Bam, problem solved. There were certainly enough candidates who wanted him dead amongst the Forsaken. Also, it is generally assumed that all 3 battles between Rand and Ishamael occurred in TAR albeit in early bookisms. Since Rand chased Ishamael there at the end of TDR, couldn't it be argued they were both there in the flesh. If so, how was Ishamael brought back as Moridin when Rand finally killed him?
  7. Something that bugged me, but it probably doesn't count as a mistake. Wouldn't it be difficult for the Aes Sedai to be on the Sharan front instead of the Trolloc front at the ford? I know they were sent there to counter the channelers, but Sharans aren't Shadowspawn and I doubt all of them were Darkfriends or Turned. Wouldn't the Oaths prevent them from doing much about the Sharan army? Also, I may have imagined it considering no else has brought it up and I'm still searching for the quote, but I could swear I remember someone (either Mat or Perrin) thinking Rand had sent Min to the Seanchan shortly after the battle began. At the time, I thought of the daily Memory and she would show up as Tuon's new Truthspeaker. But later (Chapter 27) she ends up being a messenger for Bryne to Mat and meeting the Empress for the first time then. Anyone else notice this or was I reading way too fast and projecting my theories? Anyway, I'll keep searching.
  8. If the attack was the last mention, it has indeed been a long time since the seal's whereabouts have been mentioned. I just reread the Prologue again last night and it mentioned during Aviendha's scene that Rand went to Tear to retrieve something. That seems more likely to be the seals than what he retrieved in TOM before Maradon (which has been speculated to have been an angreal or a Well of some type).
  9. Anyone remember when the last time the seals were mentioned. Does Rand have the Seals with him as of FoM? Is that what he went to retrieve in TOM chapter 15? Does Egwene know where they are and if not, how does she hope to stop Rand?
  10. Long-time lurker here. Thought I might share with everyone the rough timeline I put together this weekend that intermixes the chapters of the past 2 books. I was preparing for another reread and really wanted to do this one as close chronologically as possible. (The Plot thread graphs from http://encyclopaedia-wot.org/books/index.html came in very helpful, btw). Since I haven't read them in a while, I'm sure there will be some mistakes and references you can't catch from just the chapter threads. But I've searched the site and the web and couldn't find anything like it so far. I have nothing but understanding for Team Jordan's need to build and suspend tension so the books can stand on their own. This is honestly just a personal desire of mine to read the threads in order as much as possible in preparation for AMOL. I'm posting it here so anyone else who has the same desire doesn't have to duplicate my work (not that it took that long). Rand and Egwene's plots were pretty much in sync. It was fitting Mat and Perrin's that gave me the most trouble. I tried to keep from splitting up chapters and I think I did a decent job of it. There are only two such chapters: TGS-17 and TOM-P which I have noted below. I also tried to keep threads in contiguous chapters as much as possible instead of jumping around as the books did. As I go through my reread based on this I will try to revise it as necessary. I'm a busy guy so it may take a while though, hence why I'm starting these about 6 months out. I welcome pointers from anyone else who is going through a reread as well though. Enjoy! TGS-Pro TGS-1 TGS-2 TGS-3 TGS-4 TGS-5 TGS-6 TGS-7 TGS-8 TGS-9 TGS-17 * don't read Perrin thread yet TGS-21 TGS-19 TGS-20 TGS-10 TGS-11 TGS-12 TGS-13 TGS-14 TGS-15 TGS-16 TGS-17 * Perrin thread only TOM-Pro * don't read Forsaken thread yet TOM-2 TOM-4 TOM-6 TOM-7 TOM-10 TGS-18 TGS-22 TGS-23 TGS-24 TGS-25 TGS-26 TGS-27 TGS-28 TGS-29 TGS-30 TGS-31 TGS-32 TGS-33 TGS-34 TGS-35 TGS-36 TGS-37 TOM-39 TOM-16 TOM-18 TOM-21 TOM-Pro * Forsaken thread only TOM-8 TOM-9 TOM-11 TOM-17 TOM-19 TOM-22 TOM-23 TOM-24 TOM-26 TOM-28 TGS-38 TGS-39 TGS-40 TGS-41 TGS-42 TGS-43 TGS-44 TGS-45 TGS-46 TGS-47 TGS-48 TGS-49 TGS-50 TOM-29 TOM-30 TOM-31 TGS-Epi TOM-1 TOM-3 TOM-5 TOM-12 TOM-13 TOM-14 TOM-15 TOM-20 TOM-25 TOM-27 TOM-33 TOM-34 TOM-35 TOM-36 TOM-37 TOM-38 TOM-40 TOM-41 TOM-42 TOM-43 TOM-32 TOM-44 TOM-45 TOM-46 TOM-47 TOM-48 TOM-49 TOM-50 TOM-51 TOM-52 TOM-53 TOM-54 TOM-55 TOM-56 TOM-57 TOM-Epi
  11. Not sure if this has been brought up yet. I've only had time to read the first 10 or so pages of this thread. I know the death of Mat (Rahvin by lightning in book 5) has been discussed a lot and may be disqualified. However, a detail regarding his death may not have been talked about much. If Mat has died, doesn't that mean he is no longer tied to the Horn? This possibly relates to Elayne and Nynaeve's need walk as well. They could have been dropped in that storeroom because the Horn is located there and must be secured again (i.e., re-tied to Mat).
  12. It was my understanding (although I've only read the chapter once) that the deathgates weren't used to transport the trollocs somewhere, but rather as a razor to cut through hundreds of them at a time. I seem to remember them having to burn piles of trolloc pieces. Am I totally off my rocker?
  13. What about Perrin's struggle with the axe and the hammer or talking with wolves? What about Mat's struggle with his memories or his not wanting to be a hero? This must be conveyed and done well to keep with the flow of the storylines. I should point out to the bean counters above this adds minutes that don't show up in the books to help explain things to the audience. How would you go about explaining the fear invoked by the knowledge that Moiraine is Aes Sedai and Lan is a Warder? You have to get the whole picture of why this it is such a tough decision for Rand to make and why Thom is reticent to encourage him. I believe this distrust is a central theme early on.
  14. Two words why it would be a bad idea, live-action or anime/3d. Inner monologues. Did anyone see either 1984 version of Dune? And one of the reasons LoTR was successful is because they avoided much of the dialogue (inner and outer) for the most part. IMO, WoT cannot be done without inner thoughts and it would hurt the pace of a movie to add the much needed dialogue. I think you would lose a lot of the audience.
  15. There are accounts that a mysterious evil man appeared every 40 years or so. The most well known instance was one of Artur Hawkwings' aide who convinced Artur that all Aes Sedai were evil and then had him send an army across the Aryth Ocean. I believe there are also conversations from the Black sisters in tSR or tFoH that Ishy came to them 40 years ago. I may be imaging this one though, but I'm pretty sure Ishy founded the Black Ajah.
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