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DRAGONMOUNT

A WHEEL OF TIME COMMUNITY

InfinLuminous

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  1. I think it can be difficult because RJ wasn't 100% consistent with his statements on the topic. Which is fine - he's certainly entitled to have his thoughts on the matter evolve over time since it's his story. "The Buddy Christ. Now that's not the sanctioned term we're using for the symbol, just something we've been kicking around the office, but look at it. Doesn't it... pop?"
  2. "So Nakomi was essentially a buddy jesus showing up to give the world (the readers anyway) a big thumbs up?" Good Dogma reference. Well played. sir. But basically, yes. Personally, I find it meaningful that even though the Creator will not directly get involved and change events, that doesn't mean he has forgot about the world or doesn't want humankind to succeed in stopping the DO from remaking all creation.
  3. "One interesting thing I saw Dom post over at TL is the possibility of a Nakomi/Tigraine/Calian link:" Flimsy. Giving birth to someone important does not make one a Hero of the Horn. The other Heroes are all legends in their own right. Doesn't fit.
  4. "it just makes Nakomi literally pointless" It serves to show the Creator's concern for its creation, which is consistent with how the Creator was used in The Eye of the World and AMoL. "Well, you could argue that words of encouragement are an active role, especially since its going to cause decisions to be made that radically change the future." It was what Aviendha saw in Rhuidean that might radically alter the future, not the meeting with Nakomi. Avi was already on her way there when she met Nakomi.
  5. "If its an avatar, she makes RJ a liar and is literally deus ex machina." Not really, though. RJ had already established a passive role for the Creator when the Creator spoke on two separate occasions. As Nakomi, all the Creator really does is give some words of encouragement to Aviendha, but doesn't in any way change the course of events. Ditto with her appearing when Rand was accomplishing the body swap with Moridin. All she does is confirm that what Rand is already doing is the correct thing. If Nakomi were Tigraine or a Jenn, there is no way she would know that what Rand was doing was body-swapping with Moridin. The Creator is the only thing that fits.
  6. It's clear that Fain did not die until the end of AMoL. The text of the novel makes it clear that Fain died when Mat plunged the dagger into him, NOT in any earlier book.
  7. I can understand the criticism of SoT (although I think a lot of it has to do with the author's philosophical leanings), and I would only ever rate Goodkind as average at his absolute best, but let's not pretend that several of RJ's WoT books were mostly TERRIBLE. Books 7-10 as a whole are embarrassingly bad, and even book 11, while it STARTED to get things back on track, was painful to get through. As for "copying" RJ, no one in the industry takes that claim seriously, just people who have decided they personally hate Goodkind because of either (1) his worldview, or (2) the fact that he's a jerk. Some people have small minds and can't separate the artist from the art.
  8. But based upon RJ's quotes, the Dragon could fight for the Shadow and it doesn't even matter in the grand scheme of things. The DO's prison is still sealed anew by someone else. Kind of destroys the importance of the Dragon. I suspect RJ didn't even really have a grasp in his own world, which is incredibly disappointing.
  9. I find Jordan's quotes very troubling. If the Dragon has gone over to the Shadow before (and thus the Shadow claims a "lesser" victory but not a complete victory), then that means someone had to stop both the Dark One AND the turned-Dragon to avoid the Dark One breaking free completely. If that is the case, then the Dragon almost seems superfluous in the grand scheme of things. The Dragon is obviously not the only person capable of preventing the Dark One from breaking free and sealing him away again. Someone (or a group of people) is capable of not only re-sealing the DO, but defeating an evil Dragon while doing it!! Jordan's quotes render the Dragon/CoL almost meaningless.
  10. If the Dragon was defeated or "broke bad" in previous turnings of the Wheel as Jordan suggests in Suttree's quote above, this would mean that someone else (or a group of people) would need to stop the DO from breaking free in those turnings, since we know the DO has never broken free. If that is the case, then is the Dragon really even necessary? The more I've thought about the mythology of the series and Jordan's quotes, the more I think that Jordan really had clear idea of the details of the mythology.
  11. It's unclear how much Elan remembers from the past turning of the Wheel. He claims to have knowledge in the early books, but his musings in The Path of Daggers suggest that he does not remember the details.
  12. You know, if it is true that each time the Dragon has the opportunity to kill the DO but decided not to in order to maintain balance, then I have to believe that the DO realizes this. And if the DO does realize this, he certainly talks a big game with Rand, even knowing that he continuously fails in his attempts to break free. Deep down, the DO must be incredibly frustrated and feel kind of silly trash-talking the Dragon during each turning of the Wheel.
  13. I mean, I think the Lan/Nynaeve ting has a lot to do with Nynaeve being super hot. Think about it. Rand, Perrin and Mat don't realize it as much because they were apparently disciplined by her growing up, but even they say she is pretty. Lan was used to hanging around ageless faces all day, then all of a sudden he meets this young, fiery, 20-something girl with long, dark hair? Lan knew what was up.
  14. Don't know where you are getting 4 years. That's not what I see in Steven Cooper's timeline. He has The Eye of the World starting in early 998 NE and has The Gathering Storm ending in mid-1000 NE. A little less than two and half years at that point. ToM was mostly concurrent with The Gathering Storm, and in any event there is no way that a year and half was covered by ToM and aMoL. Realistically, jack of shadows has it right when saying 2-3 years, and this is backed up by Cooper's timeline.
  15. I think your personal attacks are a bit much, don't you? I will kindly ask that you refrain from calling me a liar or confusing me with other posters that you apparently have disagreed with in the past. "1. Burden of proof lies on your side I'm not saying it again and your attempts at obfuscation in order to avoid an honest debate are reaching absurd lengths." I am trying to have an honest debate, but only one side is actually willing to try. For several threads I have been discussing why the voice being the Creator lends support to the Nakomi=Avatar theory. That's evidence and support. You can not like it, but you have to deal with it. Just saying "I don't believe the voice is the Creator" isn't good enough. Explain why. If the voice is not the Creator, then who is it? Are you seriously arguing that the voice is no one? It doesn't really exist? A fever dream from Rand? Seriously, put your cards on the table so that we can have an honest discussion about it. What do you think the voice was? "4. You've done zero to prove the voice actually is the Creator. It's not up to the other side to do anything here. One again burden of proof lies squarely with you." An entity spoke to Rand in The Eye of the World and A Memory of Light. We have all read the text from those books. From the context it is clear that the entity was not the Dark One. Nothing else fits aside from the Creator. Who do you think the voice was? "In fact the Peter quote says nothing about Luckers theory." Luckers claimed that Nakomi was theory fodder from Brandon. In attempting to support that theory, you claimed that Brandon admitted that Nakomi was "all Brandon." Peter chimed in to make it clear that you were misrepresenting what Brandon said. Clearly related to Luckers theory since that was EXACTLY the topic being discussed when Peter decided to weigh in (an ununusal occurrence in and of itself). Are you suggesting that Peter did not know what was being discussed? He just randomly popped in, read a single post and then decided to kneecap you? That's ludicrous.
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