Jump to content

DRAGONMOUNT

A WHEEL OF TIME COMMUNITY

GregDietzFla

Member
  • Posts

    57
  • Joined

  • Last visited

GregDietzFla's Achievements

Community Regular

Community Regular (8/16)

  • First Post
  • Collaborator
  • Conversation Starter
  • Week One Done
  • One Month Later

Recent Badges

  1. Morridin doesn't want Rand to die, because if he did, then like all other Heroes of the Horn, he would go to TAR and he would have access to all of his souls memories from all of his former lives.(Birgitte could remember all her past lives right?) If he doesn't die, he only gets LTT's memories and LTT failed to seal the bore(He could only patch it). But if he died, then he would remember how he did it the last time around, and just do that again. I think thats what the Finns meant by "To live you must Die."
  2. Well anyone who went over to the shadow before Aginor, could not possibly be 13x13 seeing as how there were no mydrall before Aginor created them. And i dont think he did that til after he went to the shadow. Anyone after him would be fair game IMO. EDIT: Realizes someone beat me to it. Sorry...
  3. I would imagine that they would have occupied the palace, just not sat on the Lion Throne, until the sucession was complete. But in all honesty if another claimant had arrived before Elayne, they would have been stuck outside the walls, as they would have been a rival to the will of the Dragon. Keep in mind Caemlyn was under the control of Ravhin, until Rand killed him, then under Rands control.
  4. why would DF Aiel attack the regular Aiel?? Just because we haven't heard of them yet is not a valid argument. My argument that they are is that it is too good of an opportunity for Ishy to pass up, and he has shown himself skilled at laying the groundwork for groups of the shadow. Why would he pass up the gift of every aiel born with the spark??
  5. IIRC, it was supposedly created late in the War of Power, after most of the tech infrastructure fell apart or was destroyed. It definitely was not part of the mass production era of the AoL though, and most likely the Prophecy of the Dragon was given around the time that it was created, or maybe a little after it was created. Which would mean that it was simply created to be a very powerful sa-angreal, not specifically for the DR to use. Most likely the DR part came about after the sword. Around 1000 AS at the start of the series, something like 940 or 950 IIRC. When the Tower splits, they mention that about 1/3 are in the WT, 1/3 are in Salidar, and 1/3 decided to sit out the troubles. Around that time they are also talking about close to 300 AS in Salidar. And I think that when Seonid and Masuri find out about how many Shaido WO's are channeling in Malden, IIRC one of them said something like "half of the White Tower from one clan" expressing shock at how many Aiel Wilders there were. And we were told that there were around 400-500 WO with Sevanna. As far as Aes Sedai that aren't useless, I like the 4 you mentioned and also, Verin, Merana (didn't like her at first, but after the WO's 'apprenticed' her for a while, she became a lot less useless), Daigan, Vandene and Aldeleas (sp). Granted 4 of those 5 are now dead, but I think they still count as examples. ah, but since they r now dead the ratio would fall back to less than 1 in a 100. Thanks for clarifying the numbers, that helps a lot. EDIT: likes the green, who after the seanchan attack basically laughs at her own title as marshal general or whatever it is. Think she is still useless, but i like her cause she knows it too...
  6. It's doubtful he would even remember her face. He doesn't have to. Seanchan attack WT, Bode is leashed. Egwene tells Mat that his sis has been leashed and is now damane(Most unlikely part of whole theory), then Mat borrows a two rivers man from perrin and tells him, point out my sister when you see her so i know who to save. Honestly, im just trying to find a reason to get to see mat whoop on the Ever Victorious Army. So he crosses his own wife to assist a sister he cannot even remember? This seems highly doubtful. Also I don't see Mat entering a military conflict with the Seanchan since he through his marriage will be given a high noble station. Mat in 10 years from now will probably walk around with a shaved head and highly embroidered armor. When Tuon leaves his company in KOD, Mat says the next time we meet will most likely be on opposite sides of the battle field. Also he gets angry with Aludra (in his head at least) for showing the Deathwatch gaurd too much when they fight together, indicating that they will in fact fight again. And i seriously doubt that somebody who has enough self respect to not want to be a lord (like mat) will end up walking around with a shaved head and such. For him, going to war with the seanchan does not equal crossing his wife. Nor do i think that Tuon would see it that way since thats probally what every other prince of the ravens has done (tuon saying it would be nice to have a p.o.r. that didn't try to kill her) Simple answer to your first question, yes. or are you saying that he would allow her to remain damane?? that i doubt more than him acting the lord.
  7. It's doubtful he would even remember her face. He doesn't have to. Seanchan attack WT, Bode is leashed. Egwene tells Mat that his sis has been leashed and is now damane(Most unlikely part of whole theory), then Mat borrows a two rivers man from perrin and tells him, point out my sister when you see her so i know who to save. Honestly, im just trying to find a reason to get to see mat whoop on the Ever Victorious Army.
  8. An argument that completely ignores the simple fact that Rand wasn't there, he had no control over Andor when Elayne came, and she took control from a power vacuum, she wasn't handed it by Rand. Therefore in no sense is it accurate to say he gave it to her. In neither legal nor practical terms did he have it. He had abandoned Caemlyn. Months of hard fighting, which would be an utterly pyrrhic victory as Rand would have to destroy a powerful nation, thus weakening the Light for TG. Practically, he can't do that even if he wants to. If he smashes the Light, he loses. Rand's actual strength is limited by such considerations. He didn't annex the land, it remains Andoran. He just put a bunch of people on an unoccupied farm. True, she might not be in any position to enforce her will over Taim, but that has nothing to do with Rand, and everything to do with Taim's power. 1. Rand never 'abandoned' Caemlyn. Bashere and Rhuarc are still there (with their respective armies) when Elayne begins her fight for the throne. Ya Rand didn't sit there the entire time, but in no way did he abandon it. 2.So you are saying that it would take months for the Aiel to destroy whatever Andoran army came? That is laughable. Not to mention that should Rand have wanted the throne of Andor, he most likely would have found support from about half the houses (Armymilla and her lot), maybe enough to gain the throne. 3. While 'technically' the BT is still in Andor, that is mostly because it is surrounded by Andor, and read back to my, laws mean nothing without ability to enforce, so in reality the BT is the BT, not Andor. And for all that anyone (except Logain) knows, Taim serves Rand so yes it has something to do with Rand. Andor has no ability to enforce its laws on the BT solely due to Taim, nothing to do with Rand. I don't think the Aiel are magic, capable of tracking down and destroying all resistance in weeks. If a big army took the field, they might well be able to rout it. But those soldiers who survive can still cause problems. And Elayne took power from a power vacuum. Caemlyn was not held by Rand or his lieutenants. Even if it was, the fact that he didn't hold more than the capital surely means he didn't conquer the country? When Elayne arrived in Caemlyn, the regent there was Dyelin, ruling in Elayne's name. Not Rand, nor one of his lieutenants, nor anyone ruling in Rand's name. So Rand didn't hold Caemlyn, Dyelin did in Elayne's name. Rand didn't hold the rest of Andor, various nobles did, with a power vacuum as there was no overall control. So how can Rand be considered to have given Elayne the throne? Or the city? Or anything? By the way, to whom it may concern, Regent: person appointed to administer state during minority, absence or incapacity of monarch. Use of it to mean ruler is archaic. Elayne is not the regent of Andor, she is the Queen of Andor. Rand was regent after killing Rahvin and before he left the country. Dyelin was regent before Elayne's return. Neither was the ruler, they were acting in that capacity during the ruler's absence. To put it another way, you keep using that word. I don't think it means what you think it means. OK, so long story short, she can't impose her rule on the BT(Still don't see how it could have NOTHING to do with Rand when Taim is his man, but thats just semantics). As for the aiel, i think the quote earlier when Dyelin says she will come against him, would make it pretty easy for the aiel to find them. All they have to do is wait for them to come. I don't think that the aiel are magic, yet any threat posed to the city of Caemlyn would be dealt with swiftly. They don't have to hunt down anybody. Rand's intention was to not conquer Andor, and so made no attempt to solidify the entire country. Dyelin ruled in Rand's 'absence' because he believed she was the only one who would rule in Elayne's name. Hence him giving Elayne the throne, aka appointing someone to rule in her name. (dont tell me he didn't appoint her, because he allowed her to rule) That he didn't rule all of Andor is true, but that doesn't mean he didn't 'hold' Caemlyn. He can be considered to have given her the throne and the city by the fact that a. he outed Ravhin, b. secured and pacified the city., and c. named a temporary ruler to administor the city until her return. P.s. Dyelin ruled in Elayne's name, because to have named her steward of the dragon would have been admitting that it was a conquered land and he would then have been forced to give the aiel their fifth. Not to mention that Elayne herself remarks that she is mad at Rand for conquering Caemlyn, saying he has no right, but then thinking to herself enough might made right, which is my entire point. Rand 'conquered' Caemlyn and there was no force capable or willing to evict him from the city. Also an argument for how he gave her the throne. As a student of history, i am well aware what the word regent means, and in no way did i ever say that elayne was regent. Also how was Dyelin the Regent for Elayne, since she had not yet been crowned queen, and according to your definition a regent must administer the state in the name of a monarch?In fact by your definition the only way Dyelin could have been Elayne's regent was if Elayne gained the throne when Rand said it was hers(aka him giving her the throne)?
  9. back to the original topic, i would feel sorry for anybody that put a leash on Mat's sis. He is the best general in the world, has a personal army, and is also the inventor of the modern cannon. I'd say he would get her back whatever it took... Which might include destroying the Seanchan government, (but sparing his lovely wife, of course). Actually now that i say that, i kind of hope they leash her, just to get to see mat slap the shit out of them again. And doesn't he say that the next time he will see tuon will be on opposite sides of a battle field? Foreshadowing maybe.
  10. That's funny. It's like (Guaire) Amalasan + Alsalam (king of Arad Doman). Yea, those 2 names where always too close for me... Maybe they are one in the same.:) Why do you think he 'needs' them. The AS think that Rand will need them, but he doesn't . It was originally thought by the characters (Moiraine, Bashere, others...) that he needed the WT, but now that he has AS sworn to him, the only one that he 'needed' was Cadsuane. Now, he doesn't need her, but in his own mind he 'needs' Nynaeve, because she is one of the only women he trusts to link with him to use Callandor, but otherwise there is no mention of Rand 'needing' the WT at all. This is definitely not a view supported by the WT, but what those witches women think is virtually pointless and useless. If there were more than 1 in 100 that are more than useless then he might need them, but the WT as we have seen it (and as an institution) is useless unless you want to bully people, and I think Rand can bully enough people by himself. I dont think he does need them, i assumed that that was the general consensus (apparently i assumed wrong). Im not sure why i put quotes around the need, if thats what made you think that i thought that he needed them. Also, another question, If callandor is flawed, because it lacks a buffer that most sa'angreal have, allowing the taint to run wild. Why, now that theres no taint, would he still have to link? You didn't put need in quotes, I did just for reference. Blame it on having raised a teenager who thought that everything from a cell phone to designer jeans were a 'need' not just a want. Sorry if it came across as overly forceful. The characters think it's flawed in that way, but personally, I think that the flaw is really just that it doesn't buffer a man against channeling too much saidin. If that is the major flaw, then using it in a circle would bypass the flaw because a circle provides its own built-in buffer against drawing too much. I think there are a couple of reasons why Callandor has been described with more than the one flaw. One of those is simply the opinion of the women who were to see to its safekeeping (the same ones we see in Rand's Ruidean vision). A circle of 2 (1 man/1 woman) means a man must control it, while a circle of 3 (1 man/ 2 women) requires a woman to control them. The women that we last see having possession of the Crystal Sword could have easily written whatever it was that Cadsuane read that told her it required a circle of 3, and as for why they would lie...well the Breaking had already started so it's easy to think that they would want the world that remained to think that the only way a man could use the sa'angreal was by a linking that would allow a woman to have full control. edit: I don't know, 1 of 100 seems about right, I can think of 9 AS that I don't hate and that aren't useless by the time ToM is finished. Well, at least 7 or 8. You didn't come across as overly forceful, but just forceful enough. :). Ah that would make more sense. Just seemed wierd to me that the sa'angreal intended for the DR couldn't actually be used by him (safely). Do we know when it was created?? I would imagine the AOL, in which case, why did they forget the buffer? P.s. Ah, wait, how many AS are there? Im not really an AS fan because they mostly annoy me, so the ones i can think of that aren't useless... Nyn, Moraine, Cadsuane, Pevara... help me out here. i know im forgetting some, but thats prolly cuz it 6 in the morning here...
  11. They were in Andor, but not in Caemlyn. They later left. Rand abandoned it. The Aiel would not be able to sunjugate Andor easily. I believe the total number men Andor could muster significantly outnumbered the Aiel. Yeah, they might support Rand but don't think for one minute they wouldn't still scheme. Look at what happened in Tear and Cairhien. Rand's not the most beloved of conquerors. The BT is still on Andoran land. Okay...Darlin "serves" Rand as well, yet he is still very much independent. 1. They left when Elayne assumed control, because Rand meant the throne for her, and she was there to take it, and because she asked them to and they acquiesed. Also they stayed and watched the battle, Rhuarc confused as to why Elayne won't use his spears and his comment on who cares where the warriors come from, you use what you can... So while not actively inside the walls of Caemlyn, still there to ensure Rand's command is followed through on, not leaving until summoned by the Dragon i believe. 2. Yes they are outnumbered, however most andoran soldiers would have been used to plowing a field, whereas the aiel are consistenly considered the deadliest fighting force on the continent. I still don't know where you are getting the idea that the Andoran's were a match for the aiel? They defeated the combined force of the westlands with 4 clans pretty soundly and easily IIRC, yet you don't think that 1 clan could take 1/2 of Andor's army? Also Rhuarc is portrayed as equal (or almost) to a great captain. 2b.) Yes they would scheme, as did Tear and Cairhien. However i dont see what that has to do with anything, scheme all you want, what good did it do Tear or Cairhien? It gave Rand a headache a few times. Other than that he seems to have little trouble with them. Yes some rebelled, as would some of the Andoran houses, but what came of those rebellions? And it is rare the conqueror that is loved. However, one who is feared is obeyed just as readily, if not more. Scheme all you want, it will do them no good. The throne was Elayne's the moment Rand killed Ravhin, whether she likes it or not. 3. No. The Black Tower is on Black Tower land, it just happens to be located in the middle of Andor. What would make you consider them still part of Andor? For all of Elayne's talk that they are still subject to Andoran laws, she herself knows that they are not. They don't pay taxes. She exerts 0 control over anything that takes place there. They are NOT subject to the throne of Andor. And by the way, Darlin is far from independent. Even though he is now king of Tear, he is still steward of the Lord Dragon, as is Dobraine. He goes where Rand says and does what Rand says. I agree. very well put. Nice catch on the use of Royal coffers for the academy, forgot about that. Im kind of surprised that this point is even being argued. I though it was pretty obvious that he conquered it when the aiel wanted their fifth. Aiel only take the fifth in places that they conquer. Elayne is lucky Rand didn't give it to them. The only reason that Elayne sits on the throne is because she is Rand's girlfriend...
  12. That's funny. It's like (Guaire) Amalasan + Alsalam (king of Arad Doman). Yea, those 2 names where always too close for me... Maybe they are one in the same.:) Why do you think he 'needs' them. The AS think that Rand will need them, but he doesn't . It was originally thought by the characters (Moiraine, Bashere, others...) that he needed the WT, but now that he has AS sworn to him, the only one that he 'needed' was Cadsuane. Now, he doesn't need her, but in his own mind he 'needs' Nynaeve, because she is one of the only women he trusts to link with him to use Callandor, but otherwise there is no mention of Rand 'needing' the WT at all. This is definitely not a view supported by the WT, but what those witches women think is virtually pointless and useless. If there were more than 1 in 100 that are more than useless then he might need them, but the WT as we have seen it (and as an institution) is useless unless you want to bully people, and I think Rand can bully enough people by himself. I dont think he does need them, i assumed that that was the general consensus (apparently i assumed wrong). Im not sure why i put quotes around the need, if thats what made you think that i thought that he needed them. Also, another question, If callandor is flawed, because it lacks a buffer that most sa'angreal have, allowing the taint to run wild. Why, now that theres no taint, would he still have to link? EDIT: I will add that i agree that the WT is useless, and thinks that 1 in 100 being more than useless is giving them too much credit.
  13. An argument that completely ignores the simple fact that Rand wasn't there, he had no control over Andor when Elayne came, and she took control from a power vacuum, she wasn't handed it by Rand. Therefore in no sense is it accurate to say he gave it to her. In neither legal nor practical terms did he have it. He had abandoned Caemlyn. Months of hard fighting, which would be an utterly pyrrhic victory as Rand would have to destroy a powerful nation, thus weakening the Light for TG. Practically, he can't do that even if he wants to. If he smashes the Light, he loses. Rand's actual strength is limited by such considerations. He didn't annex the land, it remains Andoran. He just put a bunch of people on an unoccupied farm. True, she might not be in any position to enforce her will over Taim, but that has nothing to do with Rand, and everything to do with Taim's power. 1. Rand never 'abandoned' Caemlyn. Bashere and Rhuarc are still there (with their respective armies) when Elayne begins her fight for the throne. Ya Rand didn't sit there the entire time, but in no way did he abandon it. 2.So you are saying that it would take months for the Aiel to destroy whatever Andoran army came? That is laughable. Not to mention that should Rand have wanted the throne of Andor, he most likely would have found support from about half the houses (Armymilla and her lot), maybe enough to gain the throne. 3. While 'technically' the BT is still in Andor, that is mostly because it is surrounded by Andor, and read back to my, laws mean nothing without ability to enforce, so in reality the BT is the BT, not Andor. And for all that anyone (except Logain) knows, Taim serves Rand so yes it has something to do with Rand.
  14. I second that, Really? @Aybara, if you read any part of the thread, you would realize that most of the argument on it is about the DS, so yea we got that. Thanks. The Amasalam thing is interesting, but i dont think it is too likely. Although that would be sweet, Moridin shows up with every false dragon since the breaking (I include Logain, my pet theory is he is a darkfriend... I know its prolly not true, but i can hope)including Stonebow, Darksbane, etc... and we learn that the WT has epically screwed up everytime when dealing with a false dragon. It would totally fit with the vision i have of the competency of the WT... (Not a big fan of AS if you cant tell... a.k.a. i think they are completely worthless.) BTW why does Rand "need" them. He has the Wise Ones. I know it would be nice to have them on your side, but it's not necessary, and never was. I think that's why he ignores them for the entire series.
  15. I agree, but i think it was also more than that. He doesn't just want to seal up the dark one (thats all he is personally going to do) but he also cares about the people of the world. Lights best chance for surviving the war that will come (Once rand seals up the DO, the trollocs and Forsaken aren't just going to stop), so their best chance for survival is to have them all together, hand over command to Mat, and keep their seperate armies from being destroyed one by one by trollocs. Mostly though, he wants them all gathered to give command to Mat (best shot at defeating Demandred?) cause he won't personally lead him.
×
×
  • Create New...