The Wise Man's Fear, Patrick Rothfuss. What an amazing story teller, I can't remember the last time I was so engrossed in a book.

Faile. All other votes are WRONG.

What about buying used from the Amazon market place or something similar? It's nice to support local bookshops when you can, but that's not always possible or practical. Not sure what country you're all in but in the UK I always get my books from Playtrade (like the Amazon Marketplace) and it's so cheap. I got a copy of Shadowmarch, the first book of Tad Williams' latest series, for about £1.80, included postage.

And I wouldn't mind seeing more criticisms along the lines of - "The trials the characters face need to have more of an impact. Rand doesn't even care that he lost a hand so its not really a big deal." Instead all you hear is "People NEED to DIE!!" As if characters dying instantly increases the quality of the story being told.

 

I'm not saying that characters shouldn't ever die or that it can't be used to great effect in the story. I'm just saying its not the only way to create tension and its not some necessary and positive story telling device that will make a story always better.

 

Also, I like most of these characters. I'm not going to be particularly happy (not saying angry at the author, just sad) if characters I like end up dead. I'm certainly not going to root for it. To me the scene with Rand almost killing Min was just as effective in creating tension and a sense of danger as someone dying would have been.

 

If there is another way to cause tension without using deaths, RJ did not know what it was. There really is no tension in this series, and it makes it seem a little "kiddie". I mean, Harry Potter was written for children and people die. When you read parts you've never read before, you know that anybody can die anytime. With WoT...

 

 

The search for the bowl of winds

 

Was long and boring. You knew the whole time everything would turn out OK, and nobody was going to get killed.

 

Graendal tryin to bag Perrin,

 

Is stupid, because you already know ahead of time no matter what Graendal tries, it will end in failure, and Perrin will be just fine.

 

Rand's kidnapping,

 

Was also boring, because just like all the kidnappings that came before and after, you knew he would be rescued and nobody important would be lost during the rescue.

 

Perrin rescuing Faile;

 

Was stupid for several reasons, the #1 reason being it took 3 frickin books, and the whole time you knew that Perrin would rescue Faile, you just didn't know how or when he would hurry up and get it over with.

 

 

 

Don't get me wrong, there were some tense parts, and some excitement, but it is missing an element. When you read a good book, part of the excitement is that you don't know how it's going to end. When you read a kids book and can see the ending coming from halfway through the book, that's not really entertaining for adults. I only recently had a child, so have just gotten back into reading children's books but there it is. When you are reading the WoT for the first time, and you get to about book 4, you have it figured out. Nobody is going to get hurt in this fight of good vs evil.

 

 

I actually really don't like it when characters die in books. Especially with Steve King, he makes you love them so much, and then abruptly kills them. I thought the first 4 books of aSoFaI were obnoxious due to the amount of deaths (and gore and profanity for profanity's sake). But I tell you, I'm reading the new one, and I haven't been this hungry for a story in a long long time. I want to know what's going to happen, and each chapter is exciting, because it could be that character's last chapter. When GRRM's character falls in the river, you pretty much consider him a gonner. When he gets rescued, it's a total surprise! When Nyn fell in the river, I just rolled my eyes and wondered who was going to fish her out. I already knew how that was going to end, with Nyn safe and sound.

 

 

I guess there is a fine line between too many deaths and not enough deaths. No deaths is boring (in a story like this one, the age old battle of good vs evil). If the WoT was a football game, at the end of the game the score would be good guys 100, bad guys 0, the good guys would have no dirt on their uniform... and the crowd would be snoozing peacefully in the stands. (If you're not American, feel free to replace the phrase "football game" with the phrase "football match")...

Well speak for yourself, but I certainly didn't 'know' any of those things were going to happen. Faile is one of my favourite characters and I was sure she was going to die for three books, so I certainly feel Robert Jordon couldn't have made it any more tense for me.

As for Rand's kidnap scene, I never thought he would die, but for me that whole Dumai's Wells scene was full of drama and tension. I was horrified when I first read it, especially the part where the Shaido get literally ripped to piece by the Asha'man.

The whole lack of death thing I've posted about before, in this thread I think, so I won't say it again. But it should be said that there is a good deal of deaths on the 'light' side. Most of them may be side characters, so it of course very much depends on your opinion on those characters whether or not they affected you. For me, some of the character deaths have been quite tragic. But I echo what others have said about death not being needed to create tension.

Hooper (Richard Dreyfuss) is the guy with glasses who is tying the barrels. Quint (Robert Shaw)is the guy with the harpoon gun.

I was just making a small joke about Hooper instead of Hopper is all.

D'oh! I spelled his name wrong, got it. See, I'm both slow and probably mildly dyslexic. (Or just a bad speller.)

I bet Quint was reallly pissed...

 

I....don't know what that is.

 

Watch

http://www.youtube.c...feature=related

Well that was very entertaining but it's only left me more confused! I'm sure I'm missing something obvious here but I don't know what it is.

They killed Hooper. Bastards deserved it.

 

I bet Quint was reallly pissed...

I....don't know what that is.

Why is there so much fear of and revulsion for the Dragon? Not Rand al'Thor but the man prophesied to save the world .. the man who bound the Dark One and the Forsaken in a prison for three millenium? Why is the Dragon's Fang a symbol of ... whatever it is a symbol of? I never quite got this. I mean, he will break nations and all that sounds bad, but if he's saving them from the Dark One... It's like accusing the sun of causing skin cancer (best I could come up with on short notice haha).

Because his recklessness when sealing the Dark One led to sadin being tainted which caused the Breaking of the World. Everyone pretty much lays the blame for all that at the Dragon's feet.

And while you don't think New Spring is a part of the series, everybody else does.

Not everyone!

What? How is New Spring not a part of the series? It's set in the WoTverse, deals with events central to the main series and contains many of the same characters. I fail to see how it doesn't count.

I'm sure Mr Ares could explain this much more eloquently than me, but while the New Spring story is certainly connected to the main series, it isn't necessary to it. Al least, it's not necessary for us to read about it. It provides useful but not vital background information, hence the name prequel. The Hobbit is set in Middle Earth, and contains events and characters central to The Lord of the Rings, but that doesn't make it part of The Lord of the Rings.

UncleButcher, come now. Just because this great artistry is beyond you, there is no need for such mockery.

sigh...I know, I'm in way over my head here.

the key difference (obviously) being my lack of capitalization / punctuation = 100% intentional...the WoT errors 100% unintentional. everything I write on here is exactly the way I want it to look. thus they are not "errors" (as they are not made in err) and I think you know this well. lol think of my writing style as a statement on anti-conformity / individuality (on an aesthetic level) vs. herd-mentality / doing what you're told for no reason. besides you can't compare the platforms of a message board on the internet and a major fantasy series. of course I would do it the 'proper' way for a WoT book however this isn't that so I will use my own style (the point of which is to break said rules in order to be more genuine and convey tones they simply don't allow. the subtlety and artistry of it is probably lost on you!) if I left it to you you would probably have commas in my sentences every fifth word >:| probably do away with my smileys as well

They killed Hooper. Bastards deserved it.

I love how strong she is, how she stands up for herself and defends those she cares about. I love her bold nose and her Saldaean hot temper (and hot dances). I loved how she dealt with Perrin when he was being a complete tit in the Stone during The Shadow Rising. I love her determined she is. I love how she dealt with Masema. I love how she helped Perrin become a strong leader.

So yeah, she is awesome to the bone. I'm fairly sure only the Creator and Rand stand above her.

No, she does it for the Light. It may not be pretty, but she's working her backside off for the Light.

Faile is simply awesome. Only the Creator stands above her. Maybe.

Funny enough, yes. Though I actually chose the names before there 'personalities' came out. Sad thing is, only Graendal is alive now. Foreshadowing?

When your brother buys you four chickens for your birthday and you name them Egwene, Messana, Nynaeve and Graendal.

Yes, that's true but her comment about not wanting to go to him without honour made me think perhaps they had not.

That's what I thought, in Winter's Heart right? Don't think they actually spoke in The Gathering Storm did they?

Not an important question but when was Aviendha last with Rand, as in speak to him?