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DRAGONMOUNT

A WHEEL OF TIME COMMUNITY

James Tham

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Everything posted by James Tham

  1. I know it isn't what the OP asked, but I havea always wondered if stilling someone who has been turned would cure them since things like the 3 oaths, the warder-bond (including its associated grief) cease when someone is stilled. Though in the case of the grief via the warder bond it does return when healed (Siuan), but not the 3 oaths. Anyway, random thoughts.
  2. The little fat man? I cant think of any reference to it being anything more than a average angreal. while BS seem to think that the acrobat angreal moiraine and lanfear had are different, i think he made a mistake. if they are identical, you could make an inference (while not conclusive) that the fat man provided a fair amount of strength to able to allow rand to fend of lanfear (with an angreal close to be a sa'angreal.)
  3. Theoryland's databse of interview has this entry: INTERVIEW: Nov 21st, 1998 TPOD Signing Report - John Novak (Paraphrased) ROBERT JORDANMoiraine lost her list sometime between New Spring and The Eye of the World. By the opening of the story, all she could remember was that there had been a name from the Two Rivers. FOOTNOTEThe novel version of New Spring had not been released at this time. The Legends version included a mention of Kari, which RJ decided to remove in the novel version because of the confusion: ["Kari al'Thor. From Andor? Husband Tamlin, Second Captain of he Illianer Companions, took discharge." That pair might have gone anywhere in the world and there was doubt she had had a child at all.]
  4. Interesting point. He learned his healing "weaving" with his fingers and that would form part of his weave
  5. Thought the keeper will have no say regarding a new amyrlin as it is the hall's decision
  6. A lot of things become clearer with that info. The scene with AS shielding Semi. I vaguely remember thinking BS may have been wrong in the scene when Cadsuane thought that 2 sisters should normally be enough to hold a shield (at that point Daigian was 1 of the 3 holding the shield). Sure there was all that talk about links making things more focus and whats not, but it still sounded ludicrous at that time. On that new scale (grain salt & all) it sounds fairly comfortable for 2 Daigian's to hold a shield over any female forsaken. I know I am randomly dribbling. But a lot of random things start to click in place.
  7. I like it. I still don't find this satisfactory. I can accept that from incarnation to incarnation they may / may not be able to channel if we assume the DNA opens/close the conduit to the OP. But it still seems that strength is from the soul based on transmigration and the Dragon. I can understand where you are coming from regarding the Dragon having the same strength in incarnations he can channel. Taking Birgitte as an example, in almost or perhaps all incarnations, she is an amazing archer but that is her "hero" story. I'm not sure if the Dragon's story requires him to be the most powerful male channeller in every incarnation he turns up as the Dragon. Granted we know very little about AoL, the Dragon merely only needed to be as strong as required to get the seals on. Strength was irrelevant in getting to his position in his 2nd. In the 3rd age, his strength certainly helped keep forsaken from assassinating him - but he also had callandor and the fat man very early as a deterrent. As a side, I find characters like Sorilea, Alise, (to a lesser extent) Androl and (even lesser extent) Egwene interesting. They aren't the most powerful in their respective groups (certainly Egwene is pretty high up in an organisation that over-values strength), but they lead it due to other factors.
  8. very interesting. Did not realised moraine was so significantly de powered I am now more curious what the threshold from angreal to Sa'angreal is - it implies that bracelet gave moraine more than 53 times her strength based on that later chart It makes a lot more sense with more levels below daigian. Wonder if this mean meilyn is at least 2 levels above Elaida Thanks fionwe
  9. Apparently not. Terez says Cadsuane, the Wondergirls, etc. are marked as 21+x. Its clear the 21 level list was specifically used to figure out Aes Sedai relationships. Cadsuane was never going to be in the deference game anyway, so she was not in that list. Any idea if Meilyn and Kerene is marked as 21+x? I always found it puzzling Cadsuane said it was a sharp drop from their strength to Siuan/Moiraine/Romanda/Lelaine/Elaida's strength.
  10. I know RJ did mention about channeling being a combination of the soul and DNA - but I never quite find the DNA explanation quite satisfactory. Transmigration seems to allow a new body retain the soul's former strength - it seems to suggest that strength is from the soul. Otherwise the the transmigrated people would have new strength (And it would seem implausible that the DO actually found bodies with identical strength). In Aran'gar case, I can't see how DNA would allow a female body to channel saidin. That particular transmigration suggests that channelling has to be completely from the soul. I suppose you can make a case for the DO splicing DNA from a man into a woman to give her body that trait. Thinking about that: That was a perfect opportunity for a scene with Osan'gar creating a pretty frankenstein that can use saidin.
  11. James Tham

    Warders

    There was one other same gender bonding in amol
  12. Straight guy - saldaea (on the farms, not as a soldier) Straight gal - andor Gay guy - tear Gay gal - far madding
  13. I would infer alivia is less skilled than verin even in combat. Unfortunately, we do not get to see their respective battles in full to get a more conclusive answer. Verin‘s circle drove off graendal (who possess a minor angreal), and verin had the harder task of protecting 3 in her circle (and failed to keep the weakst alive). Alivia had a paralis net and angreal and came out quite mangled But at the end of the day combat is as such skill as it is luck. Otherwise we will have to conclude graendal is better than cyndane and mog.
  14. My point was that the power granted over a warder [via the bond weave] is irrelevant when you have to trust a channeller not to use things like compulsion - which is far more effective, and does not leave the channeller open to any consequences felt empathically. We know that wilder sparkers tend to learn 2 different things - one is a form of compulsion. Now, I do not think they are necessarily evil. However, to be honest, I do not know how anyone can be made to forget such a weave. Verin believes the WT is successful in getting rid of it. However, Liandrin certainly remembers her trick (and yes, we may argue that she is evil and therefore would have kept it or re-create it). Verin was able to re-create a weak compulsion. Even if we assume the WT is amazingly successful in getting rid of compulsion and Verin & Liandrin are unusual cases - I think the Blue Ajah fear weave comes pretty close to form of compulsion (even if it may not be as effective). As far as we know, a weave that grants an empathic link, an ability to share strength, increase vitality and endurance [limited dream immunity to the shadow?] only exist in the warder bond. However, the fact that it opens a warder up to compulsion to their AS is moot if any AS potentially have the ability to take control anyway. Even if the weave itself does not come with the side effect of being open to the Warder-bond-compulsion, a warder will still have to trust their AS not to use the real compulsion (or trust they do not know it) - which imo is a foolish thing to trust. Once we got to see compulsion on-screen, I had always wondered why it was never added to the oaths. Perhaps it was due to the warder-bond this was never added. Anyway, I am rambling.
  15. I understand your point about nobody should have that kind of power over another person in principle. However, in RJ's world a channeller does not even require a bond to have that kind of power over people. Compulsion does not require the channeller to have an empathic link (which we know gets AS edgy if they do not shield their thoughts from their warders) to their victim. If anyone were to ask me if I were willing to meet someone with the power to take my will and memory away (or incinerate me to ash on the spot - though a knife/gun can give similar results) - I will do my very best to flee. Honestly, I do not know how non-channellers in the WoT manage their nerves.
  16. I guess I got the idea of repetition from Birgitte and Gaidal's "story" in their turning of the wheel. Archer & fighter who hates each other at first sight and then fall in love - spun into different variation with that theme - including a quiet life. However, Birgitte did say she almost always hates Gaidal on first sight and almost always reborn with Gaidal - so perhaps you are right - it isn't set in stone.
  17. While there are parallels - if she were truly Eldrene reborn, and that is her lot to be spun out in the wheel over and over again, then she is really unfortunate: to have to die avenging her husband by over-drawing each life (that assumes that is her repeated "story" in the turning of the wheel)
  18. Though as Suttree asked above: What did you think her course of action should have been then? I am curious too.
  19. Pretty certain WO were only in the circle with that Asha'man and none of the AS linked.
  20. I thought it was a rather silly weave, perhaps if I ever reread the book it will make more sense but at the time I thought it was rather silly. But remember that as the wheel turns that weave shall be rediscovered so you don't have to feel bad. I didn't think it needed a name - or if it was to be given one, it should be posthumous. Didn't think the weave itself was silly though. It was either that, or Egwene picking up an iron shield (can't be a sword I guess due to 2nd oath - though iron shield probably would be near impossible to carry) with air - hurl it at Taim - turn it into cuendillar - and shield bash Taim to death through the balefire. Less glamorous though ^^
  21. There were off-screen gay clerks fired by that Grey Amyrlin who had more than a touch of Red in New Spring - which Moiraine found the grounds for their removal absurd
  22. There is a thematic one viewing the present age lovers of Rand as cycles of the moon (Aviendha - maiden, Elayne - Woman/Mother, Min - Hag and channelling slow their aging to match Rand as a channeller), and the former lover Lanfear also as that of the moon. 13depository blog may have a write up of it if you search. But I fear it would not be about blowing stuff up though....
  23. Moiraine's angreal is at the threshold of being a sa'angreal. We do not know the fat man strength. It may be possible to infer, if we ignore BS statement that Moiraine angreal is not the same as the one Lanfear use, that the fat man is of sufficiently comparable strength for Rand to hold off Lanfear for a time. We do not have any given mathematical formula as to how it work, so I would say "exponential" may or may not be correct. And we return to the title of your thread. The 3 angreal found in Ebou Dar, the weakest, presumably allowed someone of Elayne/Avi strength to hold double their ability (based on Avi & Elayne's conversation). The in-between one allowed someone of Elayne/Avi strenght to hold double that of Nynaeve (and Nynaeve will do even better using it). I do not remember any description as to the relative strength with Nynaeve's angreal only that it is "stronger" (and "much stronger" than Cadsuane's Angreal, which allowed Cadsuane to hold at least equal to double that of the Link formed by Merise and Elza). If we assume a static multiplicative increase (and I emphasize that this may not be the author's intent), then Moiraine's angreal is out of the other 4 angreal's league.
  24. Aren't those the same situation? In any case most of the Kin are useless in battle, and a lot of them have pathetic channelling ability. You think it's best for them, along with angreal buffed Nyneave and Elayne to take on dozens of damane, who unlike the Kin are trained as weapons, and hundreds of soldiers, with the all too real posibility that the strike force would be reinforced? The Seanchan could easily surround them with their superior mobility. Elayne and Nyneave's superior strength would mean nothing when they would be outnumbered to such an extent. Sure they might kill a bunch of Seanchan, but at the cost of either their lives or their freedom. Retreat was the smart option. The thirteen strongest of them were clearly exhausted. Elayne was exhausted to the point a Damane who should not have the strength to shield her, manages to. In any case, the Damane is always an interesting thing. There is a lot of pity for the Damane and it is difficult to try and neutralise Damane than kill them. Even in the battle of the WT Egwene only manages to capture 10, and instructs Adelorna that it is easier to kill than capture. You also have to take into account Tower Law and Custom. AS do not mete out summary justice. They are forbidden by law to gentle men who can channel without trial in the tower. They always try to bring BA back for trial. Personally I think the Laws and Custom makes it a lot more interesting.
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