World's End Mafia - town wins comprehensively

[BFG]

 

Tina

 

null-mafia

 

TLDR: Ugh, the worst thing is the vote thing that Pizza brought up, but given her recognition of voting 'patterns' early game I'm wondering if it's more likely to be subconscious from town rather than from mafia. She's done 'work' for herself, not under pressure. But I'm not seeing sustained interest in solving yet. she's not spending time in thread talking to people (but I don't remember this from PF either, so it's not necessarily scummy). Her responses to people seem fine, but generally /meh I don't have the experience to know if she ramps up or not in later phases and know that she's been lynched Day 1 as town before and sussed, if not lynched as mafia day 1. No idea which this is.

 

And as much as I hate to say it, there are people I feel significantly better about than Tina, and that plays into this read

 

 

 

Can't remember a lot from her and sort of feel she's been POE'd into being suspicious rather than anything else. Possibly odd approach to Cory.

 

 

Votes Dice (joke) seems relaxed on thread early. Happy to be playing, but wary of the catch-up involved (I don't think this ever gets mentioned again which is a slight bonus)

 

On reread I like her post on Lenlo, I like that she's looking at his actions and not jumping on the mechanics talk with the rest of us. I also don't hate the early read on Dice, or the way it's given.

 

Responds to Cory directly saying he's wrong and she'll probe it (hopefully)

 

Doesn't like Pizzas comment about her given that he followed her onto Lenlo...

 

Doesn't understand Shad's comment about no NK? And I'm pretty sure she follows this up a couple of times

 

Responds to Lenlo and holds her position

 

I need to look at this with context on reread (which probably won't happen before deadline). She responds to someone asking why 'Lenlo pushing Dice as a suspect without voting' would be scummy with 'because she's seen mafia do that. That's an obvious reply that I love and will make me look sideways at whoever asked it. She doesn't like Pizza's tunnel.

 

From that initial list she seems to have Zander as town, Cory as maybe town, Dice as town, uneasy about Sooh and everyone else is some sort of null, unsure, need to ISO.

 

ISO's Sooh and doesn't like that she's null on so many players, this is consistent with her reasoning for not liking me this game

 

ISO's Besie and doesn't like how she's going with the flow

 

Leaves me in my own category XD

 

Nolder's null

 

There's the unvote off Lenlo, while finding Soon scummy and not having looked further into Lenlo/Pizza which reads oddly. It's a little WIFOMy but given Tina's preoccupation with votes and nudges early game, I think she'd be more self aware if mafia, but I don't think I'd be happy to clear her for this.

 

There are a number of people who seem to be reading Tina based off how she 'normally' reads them, I don't know what to make of this, part of me is doing the same wrt how she's acting towards Cory, but I don't really like the argument.

 

Znder reacts to her post on me and Besie saying there are people he thinks are scummier. I didn't really understand this at the time and I don't now, especially given that he 'likes' Nolder list for lack of consensus

 

Shad feels into the game and not trying to 'make' things scummy, leans town

 

Still hasn't read Lenlo-Pizza

 

Concludes:

 

Town: Tina, Cory, Sander, Dice (from early posts)

Null-town: Shad

Null: Nikon, BFG, Nolder

Null-mafia: Besie

Mafia: Sooh, Lenlo, Pizza

 

Given she still hasn't re-read Pizza/Lenlo I'm not sure how to feel about her putting them in her worst category.

 

"Right now I think Lenlo's posts are more scummy and Pizza's behaviour is more scummy" don't hate this though.

 

Responds to Lenlo expanding on her thoughts on him and Lenlo. Doesn't understand Pizza's reasoning on her, sort of understands his thoughts on Shad.

 

Votes Pizza for bad reasoning on her

 

Asks Sooh if her vote on Tina is OMGUS?

 

She responds to my 'list' sort of neutrally. My reasons for Tina being at the bottom are fairly poor and I'd expect a more argumentative response to it. I can't say it's meta based off one game, but the reasons for lynching her in PF were awful-none existent (with hindsight) and I'm not seeing that same response here.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I would like as many people as possible to do the following for me:

 

In order from likeliest town -> scum list the follow four players:

 

Tina

Nikon

Shad

Pizza

Tina

Shad/Nikon

Pizza

 

Tina can you explain the positioning of Shad/Nikon on this list?

 

Sooh (in particular) and Dice can you explain/expand your reasons for voting Tina here. Dice, what's missing? Sooh I genuinely can't remember your reason for voting :/

 

 

I said this to cory too    whats missing is the Tina angle questions where u gotta look at it for a minute to figure them out.

 

I guess I don't really know what you mean by that :(

[Cory Caboose]

Tina as town sometimes does things that make you do a double-take and wonder why she did it. Then you try to see it from her POV and realize what it was. Dice is right that is a valid take on her villager play.

 

IE she walks to the beat of her own drum and doesn't care too much how it's perceived.

[Cory Caboose]

That's why I keep saying the word "safe" about how's she has played so far and why it bothers me so much.

[Askthepizzaguy]

The deadline for night falls at approximately 4pm local time for me tomorrow.

 

@ Pralaya, I want to use the full time. There's 100+ pages of re-reading ahead of me, and it's especially important of me to put in the work because I control a lynch by myself it would seem. So please do not anticipate a hammer.

 

Town also benefits from the additional time to read what happened today and get fully caught up on the thread.

 

@ My team

 

If I decide to shoot at a deep wolf candidate tonight instead of my top POE candidate, and I hit a villager, I apologize in advance to my team. I'll fully explain my thinking before I do it, and accept 100% of the blame if it is incorrect. A hero shot that defeats a wolf that was consensus villager will be far more useful to my team than a more obvious wolf who probably would have been the D2 lynch.

 

But, if I am not pretty confident it's a plausible shot, I shoot my top red candidate for POE assistance to my team.

[BFG]

 

It's not a part of Nikon's alignment, it just is something probably easy to focus on as a wolf.

 

What bothers me is the vote. I don't understand his spatial relation to the thread. He's on page 50, he's not sure about Lenlo/Pizza.

 

The game is on page 90 and there's a Pizza wagon at ~4 votes.

 

He cites his reads up to 50 (which are mixed) and then votes Pizza and he's gone.

 

And yes it seems sort of obvious and someone can go "TWTBAW!"

 

But I don't think like that, and BFG seems to indicate that Nikon's wolfy as a wolf.

 

And what he did was wolfy af.

 

http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/88995-advanced-once-upon-a-time-mafia-game-over-town-wins/page-1

 

Game was 70 odd pages long in total

 

 

From a quick ISO he was slow to start, offered several lists, updated them, but there wasn't much depth to them. He was pretty scummy, pointed people to possible town PR, it looks like somebody called him out for a scummy vote. He was never really 'involved' BUT it should be noted that the game state in general was vastly different then as well, so his posts may not have stood out as much as they would now.

 

In short I suspect conf bias had a lot to do with my thinking him really scummy, but he did do legitimately scummy things as well (and yes I bussed (sorry))

[BFG]

That's why I keep saying the word "safe" about how's she has played so far and why it bothers me so much.

Ok, thanks

[Cory Caboose]

So Tina is the wolf I let get away yesterday. Was digging at Ragnarok because her pushing of Sooh reminded me of her case on Leelou in that game and clarified.

 

Mostly a fake case built on "OMGUS" and needle reasoning. She's not afraid to case as scum, but this is what she pursues.

 

Read and compare:

 

 

Did an iso of Leelou and will try to do my best to say why I think she is mafia. It´s nothing new (at least not much) but since it doesn´t seem to be clear. 

 

 

1. Leelou voted Cory because he said mafia might have had a qt for days. When Verb asks if it was a possible TMI she agreed. It´s a week vote. She agrees with that later when she says she was just trolling him.

 

2. Then she unvotes him after asking Verb if Cory is town or not. 

 

3. She said she wanted to clear Cory early. 

 

4. Later she said to me that she unvoted him because she has figured out how to read Cory.

 

So it was a week vote from the beginning. She says she has now figured out how to read Cory but in fact she relied on Verb reading him. And then she cleared him. That easy. (I don´t think was even a good read since Cory has acted that way earlier as non town but I´m not sure Leelou played that game.)It sounded fake from the beginning to the end.  

 

 

After this she followed Cory on Pral because she dislikes inactives. Her vote stayed because his list was meh and later she disliked that he wasn´t voting. Many voted Pral so I can´t hold this against her.

 

But she mentioned being happy voting me as well. When Cory asked what she thought of me she said that she had just been skimming but something felt off about me. Since I was the only one focusing on me it really looks like an omgus. 

 

Today she says that she dislikes that I don´t vote her and that I just arbitrary decided she is scum. Which is not true. Has she focused on anyone else today, someone that hasn´t suspected her? No. 

 

 

 

 

I actually really dislike that Tina isn't voting me. The fact that she has me so far down on her list is bothering me. I haven't seen her to do anything in regards to discerning my alignment. It's like she just arbitrarily decided I'm scum. I'm not seeing her #solve. I love that she's seen nothing to change her mind, well I haven't had the chance to post anything of substance yet since end of day yesterday. She also failed to answer Key's question directed towards her regarding my calling her out as OMGUS. She's not circling back and following up.

Only person I've had time to ISO yet and it's not looking good. Tina, care to actually ask me questions that mean anything or follow up on the ones you have?

I'd like to hear this too. Leelou is one of the people that fell between the cracks on my read. I can't remember anything she said. Why are you scum reading her? And, if she's a scum read of yours, why aren't you pushing her?

 

 

To Leeloou - Read my old post why I thought you were scummy. You have done nothing after that have made me change my mind. You followed Cory on Pral really easy but kept it open that you might vote Verb as well. 

 

The reason that I didn´t aswer Key´s post was that I forgot it. I consider it omgus since you haven´t question many people at all but me, who has you as one of my reds. 

 

I have only one vote and that vote is on Oci, who I feel is even scummier than you. But I´m definitely willing to vote you if others would like to go in that way. 

 

Eldrick - I don´t really push people unless I have a very good case. I state my reason for why I think what about people. That´s often how I play, especially lately when I often post catch up posts. I think this is the second time you have cheered someone on when questioning me. (First time was Celeste or Wish, I think.) What do you think about me?

 

Why I suspect Leelou:

 

 

 

 

 

@Tina - I'll answer you in depth when I get a chance to ISO her. Right now, slightly uneasy which means she's most likely town. 

 

 

@Tina - do you want my thoughts too, or specifically only Cory?

Regardless, I am going to gice them to you  .

Need more from Verb, but it's the weekend, so that will have to wait.

I like Lee's play so far. I mentioned it earlier, but she's involved and not jumping on easy bait, imo.

Tal seemed slightly wolfy to me when I stopped reading before. I'll have to see if she's said anything new that sticks outm

 

Of course! Should have written Cory/Key. I don´t agree about Leelou, and does she ever jump on easy baits? 

 

Not a fan of Tina's vote. I think Ocicat is a hella easy target.

 

Easy in what way?

 

@tina - why did you vote me in the first place? 

 

It was just my first vote. On page 1 I think. 

 

 

Got a little time to make this post.
 
In the past I have been able to read Sili well but I haven´t played with him in a long time. From the start he looked town, jumping all around. Then I was starting to think that he was setting up platforms for future lynches. But then I really liked his vote on Ocicat. I think post 342 was good and also that he questioned Celeste. I didn´t like Ocicat´s answer. I will +1 Sili´s reasons and 
 
[unvote]
 
[v] Ocicat [/v]
 
 
 
 
 

Something about Leelou-Verbal-CoryKey-Talya seems strange. 
 
1. Cory mentions mafia could have had four days to chat. I don´t think that shows any alignment.
2. Leelou votes him for possible tmi. That seemed like a weak vote.
3. Then Cory gets annoyed and, after getting permission from Kivam, says that he and Key has shared a qt for four days.
4. Leelou then asks Verbal what he thinks about that. Not strange that he asks him of his oppinion but...
5. Verbal then says that (basically) annoyed Cory is town. And then Leelou unvote and say that she wanted to clear Cory early. 
 
I thought the vote in itself was weak but she is now townreading Cory because of this. It seems like a bit too easy. 
 
But then we have Talya that didn´t want Leelou to vote or mention anything so that Cory could have revealed more (?? I think that is what she means.) She says that this doesn´t look good for Leelou. What does this mean? That she thinks Cory was mafia and Leelou too? Leelou thinks Talya jumped on it too quick. Talya said that she did so because Leelou never gave a reason to begin with. (But when she did, she didn´t think Leelou should have mentioned it.) 
 
Cory: what do you think about Leelou, Verbal and Talya?
Leelou: what do you think about Talya?
Talya: What do you think about Leelou? 
Verb: What do you think about Leelou and Talya? 
 
I usually don´t ask questions like this but it seems like it was a "knot" that has been left unsolved. (At least to me.)
 
 
 
Sooh looks town to me so far. I think she answered Snow good when he questioned her in the beginning.

To clarify, I thought if Leelou was thinking Cory was setting people up, letting him run with and catch him at it would have been better. By her saying what she was voting for means she would never know...so defeated the object of what she was thinking.

At present not sure on Leelou, she didn't get too flustered over me talking to her. The way she pulled the vote off Cory could be taken a number of ways. The thing I did like was her interaction with Verb, and his interaction with her...so at the moment slight town read

 

 

Okay. So you thought she was town at the time and didn´t act well. I get it now. 

 

 

 

uhuh.  

 

 

From what I conjecture already, OCicat is one who lurks and keeps notes and irregularly comments. When he does comment, it's often tangential or queer.

 

Because he is a heteroclitic player, according to you, should I conclude he is not be compelled to respond to pressure? And even though he pushed JS over something really minute, does he not find other topics worthy of being noted? Or, if his vote was made to garner a response, why not follow up on said response and continue to engage the thread?

 

I checked his account. I know he is around.

 

If he is not responding to pressure how is one supposed to read him based on an inexistent reaction?

 

 

For the record I HATE when people do this. It means nothing!  People use it saying "he posted here.."  So?? people post in threads other then mafia some even have responsibilitys to do so. 

 

Other people like me leave the DM window open and go to bed so it will show im online but im not active.

 

Also sometimes a player doesnt post because they have nothing to say! Thats not lurking imo they could be totally upto date  its just not interacting. if they only pop in at OPPORTUNE times for them then THATS lurking.

 

And someone tell me what the Red possibly tells you about alignment? Cause either Town or Scum or 3rd party could do this.

 

 

 

Also because people wanna start posting post counts again Im about to make a point of how that doesnt mean much either

 

 

Thanks, Dice! 

 

I didn't realize until writing it out how much not having a read on Tina's slot bothered me

 

I can usually clear her like 10-12 posts when she is a villager and she can attest to this

 

She has posted, she did make a post with CONTENT, and I still really have no sense of ease with her

 

That's probably a really bad sign

 

Yes, I can defenitely attest to this. I don´t think you have ever been wrong about me. I´m sorry but I won´t give you much to work with today either. Rl has not been nice to me this weekend and I need to go to bed. Actually, I should already be in bed. But my rl problems should be better tomorrow afternoon and I will be back then. 

 

Is it a good time to confess I killed a cat today >.>

 

Poor you! And poor cat!

 

 

 

 

I´ve just skimmed the thread enough to quote the posts that interested me or involved me in some way. About Leelou: what felt really wrong about it all was that she voted Cory over something like that and then unvoted with a "wanted to townread you early". It felt really fake to me - both the vote and the way she cleared Cory. I know that she trust Verbal, but still it doesn´t look good to me. I also don´t agree with Verbal that Cory being emo (not the word he choose but something like that) is a town tell. It has been a long time since I played with Cory but I remember one our first game that we played together where he was third party and went pretty emo for a while.

 

For the record - I have Cory/Key as town right now, but I didn´t by this time in the game. 

 

 

I´ll continue with Oci tomorrow. I still haven´t seen anything really good from him yet. 

 

If you have any questions I will be here for like 8 more minutes. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Also from that game:

 

Cory - I hope you will be able to town read me soon. 

 

 

 

 

[Cory Caboose]

Tina

Nikon
???

 

Shad?

Nolder?

Dice?

[BFG]

 

Voting is something I need to work on, but I vote if I want to lynch somebody, the switch that lets people vote to pressure hasn't been made in my brain yet.

Reply

 

Yeah, I know. This is so minor, not really trying to criticize you for it or say what you're doing is wrong, because you can and should play how you want to play. Basically I'm just trying to convince you of my position on this one. Sometimes I vote in a way I don't want to, or don't think is the strongest move, because teamwork slash "the tally situation" combine to force me to do so. It's outside your comfort zone, and I won't badger you about it. But I think we would have gained more info today had Tina's wagon been closer to hammer to make it at least a little bit likely that someone besides me dies D1. Mafia do well when the outcome of the lynch is not in doubt.

 

It would have helped you learn more about someone you weren't sure about. You can always move that vote later, and specifically request that no one hammers while you are away. Would be a good compromise?

 

Just suggestion from (probable) teammate, you decide if it's a good idea for future stuffs.

 

Can't really argue that. It is by far the weakest part of my game as either alignment :/

[BFG]

Tina

Nikon

???

 

Shad?

Nolder?

Dice?

There's one specific thing bugging me about Dice, but start Day 2 ~should clear it up

 

I think that looks about right to me.

[Zander?]

Tina ISO Pt 1

 

 

 

Here! Haven´t played for months so I feel a bit rusty. 

 

That doesn´t stop me from voting Dice though. :D

 

[v] Dice [/v]

 

 

Hi Besie! I don´t think I have played with you before. 

 

First post jumps in with I assume is a joke vote.  Not sure if thats common for her or not? If someone knows please lmk.

 

 

I´m soon going to bed but just wanted to let you know that I´m feeling so happy right now. I´ll probably get some kind of anxiety attack tomorrow when there are 20 pages of spam but right now I got this great fealing. Almost like when I started to play. Ah... 

 

Talks up her WIM but as we can tell that certainly tapers off as this game has progressed.

 

 

After reading the thread my main focus is on Lenlo. 

 

Your... what?

 

If we lynch a towny there are most likely 3 scum left in a game of 11 players. Pick a name out of a hat you have a 3 out of 11 chance of hitting a scum. Its probability dude. I dont know what math your working with.

 

Also your reasoning is lacking any kind of logic. Your reason for saying we shouldnt keep two VCs is "We are unlikely to find mafia bar slips or luck until N3" while completely ignoring the perk of controlling their NK, the major action scum gets each night. Yeah so maybe we NK another townie, we still eliminated a scum prospect rather than letting the scum NK an obv town. Your thinking purely in townies. Im thinking in overall quality/respective townieness of each individual person lynched/NKed.

 

As for Dices vote on me "Zander you are off the hook for annoying me", so is that all you had going for Zander lynch? Is that all you thought about him? Pretty weak in retrospect. Vote on me, accusing me of coming into thread looking for any little person to jump on, but im not voting you? Im not pushing you? I havnt cased you I havnt even said I think your scum or town. I have done nothing to you that could be called "Looking for an excuse to jump on someone", yet your gunning for it? Pretty weak dont you think?

 

Have I caught over dramatic scum D1?

 

@BFG I didnt mean to suggest we should actively try and lynch a townie on D1. I was still brainstorming how we could use this games mechanics to our advantage and was spouting ideas, trying to think how we could maintain control of the NK. As for the overreaction talk, that was to two different posts of his. 

 

Dice im trying to tell if. If we assume that the vote is scums NK, then whether we keep a second VC or not a townie WILL DIE EACH NIGHT. If we keep a consensus vote though there is atleast a CHANCE that a scum die. I will take a chance rather than guarantee a town death.

 

Your logic assumes that scum has a NK, which a townie should have no idea about. Its why I asked Pral if scum have a NK or if the majority vote each night operates as that.

 

So you are saying that Dice is mafia then? This is interesting in two ways:

 

1. You asked Pral a question about the nk in the thread once he had gone. You knew we would not get an answer in some time. But then you assume that there are no ordinary nk´s and base your ideas on that as if it was true. That made me think that you had tmi. 

 

2. If you think that Dice is mafia (like I take it), then it´s weird that you are not voting him. 

 

Alright. I disagree but thats your opinion. Id like a quote when you get the chance so I can see exactly what you mean cause if thats all you got its still weak as I have said in many games that I am bad at reading you and dont see what others do when they call you town.

 

Thing is though, your not voting me for that one point. You voted me when I told you your opinion on the 2nd VC was poorly backed up/explained. You got annoyed at me and voted me. then you come back with this later. Im gonna need an actual case before I take your vote on me seriously. I hope you understand.

 

The way you seem to point out Dice as mafia (without saying it explicity) and then saying it´s just observations and ask him to understand that you don´t like his case makes me think of a mafia that doesn´t dare to follow through. 

 

As for Dice, I think he is town. I think he has been overreacting but the way he is been active and started to get serious gives me that feeling. 

 

[unvote]

 

[v] Lenlo [/v]

 

 

The whole Dice part of her read on Len is extremely weak imo.

 

I´m here and I will give some short comments before falling asleep. 

 

Cory - this time you are wrong about me. I know you read me extremely well but not this time. I hope I can prove it to you. You are kind of null right now.

 

Pretty sure Cory posted something from a Scum game of hers that she did something like this.

 

 

I am also all caught up, but I have to stop playing for a while.

 

See you in many hours.

 

Current lean

 

Askthepizzaguy (Oh hai! I put myself at the top of my own list again!)
Dice +11 ** Some counterindicators/worries about deepwolfin, but feel even stronger about Dice's opening in general than last game which was a solid townread
Cory +9 Villagery af
Zander +9 so many null posts because you're you. Still, it's nice to see you're villaging again.
BFG +3 Looking better than last game. :)
BlomBesie +1 I need more time to read you.
Nikon +0 Nothing bad, think you're town but I can't base that on much yet.
Nolder 0 <--------Most of Nolder's stuff is within the past several posts and I haven't sat and mulled them yet. Preliminary: Looks good! Probably above Besie!
Tina -1 Early bad stuff (2 posts) mitigated a bit, possible distancing from Lenlo in progress. But, hey, looking better.

Shad -1 POE and didn't like his opener post. Should be null but it's not null.
Sooh -6 Nulls and questionable posts and outright weirdness. I need more villageriness.
Lenlo -18 He's at about 95% of where BFG was last game already. It's all been bad, every one. I stopped giving him scum points at a certain point because there was little point.
 

 

I have no idea what these numbers means but I don´t like your comment about me. You just followed me on Lenlo but think I might be distancing. It seems really weird to me. 

 

 

PIZZA FOLLOWED YOU ONTO LENLO???!!!

 

Distancing comment is interesting in lieu of Pizza flipping Town.  What was weird about it Tina?

 

 

 

 

Pg 12

After reading the thread my main focus is on Lenlo. 

 

Your... what?

 

If we lynch a towny there are most likely 3 scum left in a game of 11 players. Pick a name out of a hat you have a 3 out of 11 chance of hitting a scum. Its probability dude. I dont know what math your working with.

 

Also your reasoning is lacking any kind of logic. Your reason for saying we shouldnt keep two VCs is "We are unlikely to find mafia bar slips or luck until N3" while completely ignoring the perk of controlling their NK, the major action scum gets each night. Yeah so maybe we NK another townie, we still eliminated a scum prospect rather than letting the scum NK an obv town. Your thinking purely in townies. Im thinking in overall quality/respective townieness of each individual person lynched/NKed.

 

As for Dices vote on me "Zander you are off the hook for annoying me", so is that all you had going for Zander lynch? Is that all you thought about him? Pretty weak in retrospect. Vote on me, accusing me of coming into thread looking for any little person to jump on, but im not voting you? Im not pushing you? I havnt cased you I havnt even said I think your scum or town. I have done nothing to you that could be called "Looking for an excuse to jump on someone", yet your gunning for it? Pretty weak dont you think?

 

Have I caught over dramatic scum D1?

 

@BFG I didnt mean to suggest we should actively try and lynch a townie on D1. I was still brainstorming how we could use this games mechanics to our advantage and was spouting ideas, trying to think how we could maintain control of the NK. As for the overreaction talk, that was to two different posts of his. 

 

Dice im trying to tell if. If we assume that the vote is scums NK, then whether we keep a second VC or not a townie WILL DIE EACH NIGHT. If we keep a consensus vote though there is atleast a CHANCE that a scum die. I will take a chance rather than guarantee a town death.

 

Your logic assumes that scum has a NK, which a townie should have no idea about. Its why I asked Pral if scum have a NK or if the majority vote each night operates as that.

 

So you are saying that Dice is mafia then? This is interesting in two ways:

 

1. You asked Pral a question about the nk in the thread once he had gone. You knew we would not get an answer in some time. But then you assume that there are no ordinary nk´s and base your ideas on that as if it was true. That made me think that you had tmi. 

 

2. If you think that Dice is mafia (like I take it), then it´s weird that you are not voting him. 

 

Alright. I disagree but thats your opinion. Id like a quote when you get the chance so I can see exactly what you mean cause if thats all you got its still weak as I have said in many games that I am bad at reading you and dont see what others do when they call you town.

 

Thing is though, your not voting me for that one point. You voted me when I told you your opinion on the 2nd VC was poorly backed up/explained. You got annoyed at me and voted me. then you come back with this later. Im gonna need an actual case before I take your vote on me seriously. I hope you understand.

 

The way you seem to point out Dice as mafia (without saying it explicity) and then saying it´s just observations and ask him to understand that you don´t like his case makes me think of a mafia that doesn´t dare to follow through. 

 

As for Dice, I think he is town. I think he has been overreacting but the way he is been active and started to get serious gives me that feeling. 

 

[unvote]

 

[v] Lenlo [/v]

1) I dont know how long it will take Pral to get back to me, so your flat out making things up here. I dont know Prals schedule. I dont even know what timezone I live in. As for the NK I already explained why I thought there was no scum NK. If there was, thats 3 kills a cycle. With 12 players, not counting any vigs, town goes to LyLo on D3. N3 technically I guess, but still. That would be ridiculous. 

 

2) That was an actual question to other people, is this overreactive scum? There is no game with Dice where I have correctly read him without sheeping someone else. So while I think he scum here, I wanted others opinions on it. We have time.

 

3) For the follow through, its actually me trying to understand him and talk with him. I dont like shouting other people out of the thread/game, I prefer talking with them. I have always done this.

 

1. He posted that he was going to bed. I don´t want to discuss any numbers but it´s weird that you ask the mod a question and then just assume that you have the answer anyway. 

 

2. And I still think it´s scummy to hint that Dice is scummy without following through.

 

3. Okay... don´t remember how you use to play. But I refer to 2. 

 

 

1. ??? I dont get it

 

2.  Weak

 

3.  Refer to 2.

[Nolder]

What BFG said applies to several people and it's annoying from a villager POV but indicative of a good game.

When people are null/scummy only by virtue of POE and not necessarily because you found they did anything scummy that means wolves are playing a good game.

Or village is being lazy and missing all the tells. That's an option too but I don't think that's what's happening here.

[Cory Caboose]

 

 

I´m here and I will give some short comments before falling asleep. 

 

Cory - this time you are wrong about me. I know you read me extremely well but not this time. I hope I can prove it to you. You are kind of null right now.

 

 

Pretty sure Cory posted something from a Scum game of hers that she did something like this.

 

I remember vividly her posting something like that as scum. I was either in the game and about to die or in the game and dead already and she was saying it to combat people saying I had read her as scum before I died. I thought it was Ragnarok but I can't find the actual post.

 

I found something similar looking now but it's still not that exact same thing. Going to needle my brain and see if maybe it was a different game.

[Zander?]

Tina ISO Pt 2

 

 

Good morning! I´m here and I will put a little more time into the game this morning. I think I want to do an iso on a few people. I have read the whole thread but that doesn´t mean that I remember much. I started to take notes but that fell after page 15. lol 

 

Here are my initial thoughts:

 

First - who is voting who? It feels like there are few people voting and those who did unvoted. 

 

I couldn´t read everything in the back and forth between Lenlo and Pizza but I think I got the major parts (because they were stated again and again and again...) First to Lenlo - I did not agree with Pizza. I was the second vote on your train, before Pizza. Second - my thoughts about it now:

 

* my reason for voting Lenlo was that it felt like he was trying to accuse Dice without actually doing it. Like he didn´t dare to vote him but still wanted to make him look scummy. Someone asked me (Shad? Zander?) why that would make him mafia. I have seen that many time, where mafia don´t want to take responsibility for leading someones lynch or being afraid of definite statements. 

 

I think this was Pizza´s first reason for voting Lenlo too and in that we agree(d). But I didn´t like the way he went after Lenlo and said that everything Lenlo said was scummy. He was obviously tunnelling Lenlo. I´m not sure what I feel about his unvote because I don´t think I really understand the reason for it. Need to read it again.

 

I liked Lenlo´s post #812 and now I need to figure out if I want to unvote him or not. I´ll see as I re-read some stuff. 

 

 

Even though I have a problem with Zander´s amount of posting I think he looks really good. 

 

Cory - don´t know but haven´t seen anything scummy. I kind of liked some of his posts toward Pizza but they haven´t really been about this game but more a meta-talk about how to approach mafia. I see that he posted a new list while I´m writing this so I will check it out.

 

BFG - she is asking a lot of questions, which she does as both alignments. She posts a lot, which is a good sign since I know that she has been afraid of posting too much as mafia earlier. (This is from at least half a year ago so I don´t know how it is now.) I still don´t think I have seen any results of the answers she has been given. Yesterday she just ended with "I´ll wait and see what Tina says when she comes back". (Which seems to be built on Cory´s suspicioun of me.) Well, now I´m back so I hope that I could get some clear statements about everyone. 

 

Nikon - isn´t here.

 

Shad - he posted a lot but he got mixed up with Zander-Lenlo-Pizza in my head so I don´t really remember his thoughts.

 

Nolder - Is laying low. Answers when questioned. Nothing so far.

 

Besie - I see that many of you think she is town but I haven´t payed attention to her so far (sorry Besie). Will need to iso.

 

Sooh - didn´t get good vibes from her earlier. I think it was about Lenlo. She had a bad feeling about Lenlo, then wanted to clear him, then liked what I and other said about him and then... I don´t know what she has written after that. Need to iso as well.

 

Who did I forget? 

 

Meh.

 

I neither like nor hate the comment of the vote count,  Null.

 

You couldn't read everything involving the person youre voting and a person you hinted at as distancing from your vote?  Like how does that even make any sense at all?  And hmmm for someone who asked about the vote count you seem pretty aware of it....

 

Sill firing out Much Ado About Nothing on her reasoning for voting Len...And as far as her "mafia" doing this or not doing that is pretty assumptive at best imo.

 

Again for someone who states they didnt follow it you have a fair grasp of it.  Also feels like a little fence sitting.

 

What about that one post was willing to make you change your mind on Len Tina?

 

That's all you have to say on the person (ME) that is the top poster in the game?  Figured there' would be something you wanted to comment on at least,

 

Here you start to get "bad vibes" from Sooh concerning Len.  Im not exactly following your reason (prolly cause im not all that bright lololololol) can you explain this to me please.

[BFG]

What BFG said applies to several people and it's annoying from a villager POV but indicative of a good game.

When people are null/scummy only by virtue of POE and not necessarily because you found they did anything scummy that means wolves are playing a good game.

Or village is being lazy and missing all the tells. That's an option too but I don't think that's what's happening here.

What I said when?

[Nolder]

 

What BFG said applies to several people and it's annoying from a villager POV but indicative of a good game.

When people are null/scummy only by virtue of POE and not necessarily because you found they did anything scummy that means wolves are playing a good game.

Or village is being lazy and missing all the tells. That's an option too but I don't think that's what's happening here.

What I said when?

 

 

 

 

http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/topic/96361-worlds-end-mafia-n1-the-old-familiar/page-97?do=findComment&comment=3584335

 

Post 1924

 

"Cory is a townie

Nolder is a townie

Zander is a townie

Pizza is a townie

Besie is a townie

BFG is a townie

Lenlo is a townie

Dice is a townie

 

That's why Tina is a scum."

 

(quoted portion)

 

Deepwolf candidates from that list?

 

 

 

 

Cory- early game enthusiasm of the specific sort I needed, plus the sabotage comment. Why that's always townie is because if Cory is a scum, he knows for a fact that I'm not a scum, and his first reaction to me threatening to shoot Zander because he's not villaging properly is to call it sabotage. That's not what a scumbag says there. Even if Zander is his partner. There's no way Cory-scum dissuades me from that shot, ever, even if Zander was his partner, especially not by using that reasoning. That's not a scum reason for trying to chastise that behavior, it's always townie and it is currently the reason why he's voting for me, and I understand that, because that behavior (my threatening Zander in that precise manner) is seen by Cory to be anti-town, and if there's doubt in Cory's mind about me, he's going to lynch the anti-town behavior.

 

Cory is wrong because Anti-town behavior is not scum behavior, it's against the town team in his opinion and mine, but in MY POSITION, I cannot allow myself to be the lynch and I have to attempt to persuade Zander not to lynch me, and I can't because he stonewalled me and stopped asking me solving questions. He asked a couple when he was catching up but when he was fully caught up, which is what I was waiting for, he did not pursue any further questions, and there's not a damned thing I can possibly do as his teammate to change his mind, he needs to see the flip first. That's bad for the reasons I told to his face, and he's letting me down.

 

It wasn't an idle threat but it was me doing what I could to affect the outcome.

 

My questions about his alignment because he was active but not pressing his suspects that hard disappeared in his later posts. The tack he's taken on me is so much more dangerous and straightforward than so many options he had available to him as a scumbag in his position of being town-read so much with an easy D1 lynch in his pocket.

 

Nolder's leans list looks outdated to me due to missing information, the kind you'd get from coming from a position of not being in the know and trying to get to the same page everyone else is. That kind of piecemeal information leans list is harder to fake as a scum and it rarely occurs to a scum to have such a list.

 

Zander has a responsibility to the scum team and should in no way be afraid of pretending to ask me solving questions, but it's possible(?).... it's less likely when the alternative is I shoot him tonight. He's letting me down in a big way by hiding in fear of the big scary pizza monster by saying to me that he's afraid if he asks me questions it might change my mind, so he's gotta kill me because I'm a wolf lean. Killing pizza without a fair trial when you've got me on the witness stand and you're allowed to ask me questions is bad prosecution, period. That lesson needs to be learned for future games. He didn't budge from his position under threat, which he really should have if he's a townie, but almost undoubtedly would have budged if he were scum. I had questions about his alignment from his poor prosecution which read differently from the last game, but he's got balls of steel or is deliberately sabotaging his scum team today by not prosecuting me properly and therefore being en prise for no reason when he was being universally town-read again, even by the person he was trying to lynch.

 

I'm a townie because that's what I rolled. And I demonstrated that all round. It's not being listened to because big scary pizza monster might live for one more day. Thanks for the compliment but this is a self-inflicted wound. I towned and it wasn't exactly what it was in the previous game, and I'm being lynched, as I predicted, by Cory, for that exact reason that I predicted.

 

I am aware of how people react to my posts and I still made them.

 

Besie was a town lean, but I think there's little or no risk for Besie to put me at L-1, because she's not under a ton of suspicion. I don't know Besie, so this one is a little harder to say is a lock. But I'd not shoot her tonight if I died. If Besie instead lynches Tina and Tina is a scum, Besie can be blue until final 3.

 

I have repeatedly and in detail explained why Lenlo looked so godawful to me and that reversed, and it's very specific and very strong. And it's not bullshit. And it's really unlikely to be wrong.

 

Dice is voting where the PoE should be. Dice can be the deepwolf, but he's not going to survive the whole game if he lynches his not-deep wolves day one and then is never the murder or the retaliatory night lynch. I also went over Dice before and I'll do it again.

 

Sooh is voting where the PoE should be. I still don't trust her because her leans and votes have been opposite to mine most of the game. Lean on Lenlo started wrong and ended up right too quickly, imo. Seems reluctant to lynch Shad. If Tina is town and Shad is scum you must lynch Sooh. Sooh voting where the PoE should be isn't clearing for her the way it is for Dice because she's also under suspicion and she doesn't have a lot of choice, if she lynches me today she always dies.

 

Nikon is null-POE. I don't trust him, but I need more time to read him.

 

Shad is bad for the reasons that are subtle but have been noticed by not just me.

 

Tina is bad because of that hard unvote and no real pushing. Lenlo was going to look bizarre early game for what he was doing, that was an easy thing for a wolf to attack. Tina's suspects weren't getting pushed and her vote also vanished from Lenlo when the wagon didn't look like it was going that way.

 

I can and did thoroughly and at length explain my unvote, and it's never a reason that comes from Pizza-scum.

 

Tina's was never explained and makes no sense from a villaging perspective.

 

 

From the cited post.

 

Which aspects of my thinking were wrong?

 

Don't just sheep me. I gave my reads. Which ones are the most solid? Which ones would you pick at and go no, pizza.... that's wrong because raisins.

 

I didn't get to BFG because I was spitting this out on the fly. I have her as a town lean.

 

I want input because follow the leader is how scums hide. It's like when a mason or detective claims and then everyone follows that person. Right or wrong it's easy for scum to hide there.

 

So in particular, my top suspects, my nulls, and yes even my villagers, should be telling me where I'm wrong, and where the scums are.

 

I may still do my own thing if I am convinced I did a good job with my reads.

Cory is extremely likely town. There are several things I look for on his mafia game, and I haven't seen any. He's hit a town tell that I haven't seen him fake in 2? years of watching him play, I can elaborate if and when its necessary, but I don't think it is right now.

 

Zander is likely town, but I don't read him well period. At the moment he's my deep wolf candidate.

 

Besie is likely town. Still haven't ISO'd her, but specifically as mafia almost all her reads were associated and I haven't seen anything like that. She was extremely apologetic for Zander, but that might be specific to them being hydr'd together. I also really like her reaction to what she thought I said earlier.

 

Sooh is likely town. I can't explain it well, I've felt in sync with her pretty much all game, there were early game moments when I felt she wasn't watching what she was saying. I can't say I read her well, we haven't played many games together and I've never played with her when she was mafia.

 

Lenlo is likely town. His response to your argument chiefly, his approach to the game mechanics. He does suffer from being absent recently

 

Dice is likely town. I still can't be confident on this one and I cannot describe how much that frustrates me. Dice should be my strongest read in every game, this game he isn't. He's someone I'll be ISOing tonight.

 

 

 

 

 

That leaves me with Nolder, Tina, Nikon and Shad. I can't say I find any particularly scummy and that bothers me.

 

I'm probably going to spend some time looking at them tonight.

 

Bluntly I don't really see what Tina's done that's so scummy, although I'd like her to answer my question from her ISO earlier.

 

Nikon is worrying, I can see that catch up coming from either alignment, but the vote is 'off'

 

Shad is also tricky, he's had 3 games as mafia and acted differently in each. Bluntly, although I couldn't say anything at the time the chief reason I 'caught' him in Grimmm was because of how differently he was acting between that game and Matrix, lol.

 

Nolder, the chief thing in is favour is his non-consensus list, but I think he can do that as either alignment.

 

 

 

Sorry, at this point the above isn't much use. I need to reread and ISO. I'm probably going to carry on with ISO's tonight and will reread at the start of Day 2.

 

[Zander?]

Tina ISO Pt 3

 

 

Oh, I forgot Dice and Nikon.

 

Nikon - well, he hasn´t been here.

 

Dice - I´ll go with my initial feelings because I haven´t seen much of him since.

 

Now to re-read. 

 

Well that explains a lot....lolololololol

 

Please touch on Dice for me,

 

 

No, before I re-read - does anyone know the vc? Did Lenlo vote Pizza?

 

First of 5 consecutive posts concerning the vote count,

 

 

Now I read Pizza´s unvote post again and my question is: Do you unvote Lenlo because he is fighting back? Is that the reason? 

 

Fighting back??  Pretty sure the whole back and forth in almost its entirety was a fight imo.

 

 

Won´t be able to give this more time right now so I´ll post what I got so far. I decided not to focus on Pizza - Lenlo at first but those with less content.

 

Nikon: whether he is town or mafia I feel sorry for him for having to catch up 48 pages. There is no way to see if he is town or mafia yet. 

 

Sooh: 

 

+ 

tried to explain how she saw the Dice - Zander argument without trying to make it into a bigger deal than it was

have clear town reads on Cory and BFG = takes a stand (even though I don´t think she explains her read on BFG).

 

-

* she is very vague about most players. 

* her back and forth on Lenlo is strange. It seems like she happend to go against the stream and then trying to correct herself so she could follow it instead. Still never comes to a conclusion about him. Her final thoughts is that it´s easy to mislynch Lenlo and that those suspecting him is suspicious. That argument hasn´t much to do with this game at all.

* she seems unvilling to take a stand on Pizza even though she mostly seem to suspect him. She says he buddied the vocal players initially, that he is condemning her for awkward tone, he is supecting Lenlo (see above) and that she can´t clear him yet. I wondered why she accused Pizza for condemning her for awkward tone - Pizza never answers this and she dropped it too. Not sure what´s going on between those two (in the game). 

 

 

Result: scummy

 

Still Null on Nikon- Fair enough.

 

Sooh- Disagree on her view of Sooh's stance on Pizza.  Still dont understand her take on Sooh concerning Lenlo. You like that she has reads on Cory and BFG,  You feel like you dont like her stance on Pizza and Lenlo (?) but feel that her reads are vague?  Seems like she has a handle on some reads regardless of if you think that they are right.  I mean youve got some null reads yourself.  Really feels to me like youre stretching for your reasoning to suss Sooh and that reads scummy to me.

 

 

Besie:

 

She seems to be going with the flow* a lot and a lot of her posts are not game related. She asks questions but don´t do anything with the answers. I have not played with her before so I can´t judge her from previous games so I don´t know why Zander is saying she is town. 

 

* many have had the same oppinion so it´s hard to say that this is purely negative. I have expressed some of the same thoughts.

 

Result: null - scummy

 

 

BFG:

 

She is posting a lot, asking a lot of good questions. Still, I don´t know what she thinks about people. She posted a list where she was uncertain of most people, I don´t know why she posted that list at all. 

 

Result: depends on what she will contribute with next.

 

 

 

Nolder:

 

A big ?.  He is saying that he don´t want to say much during D1 so it´s hard to say anything about him. 

 

Result: null 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

So of these people I guess I find Sooh  most scummy. BFG is in an category of her own. I will take a new look at Lenlo (and others) later.

 

Right now [unvote] .

 

Wether or not I decide to change my mind or not about Lenlo, my vote isn´t doing any good right now. 

 

Those that I won´t take another look at are Dice and Cory. Dice because I have not seen anything yet to change my town read on him and Cory because I know I won´t get any wiser by that. 

 

 

Disagree with Tina concerning Besie obv.  And weird to add her to Null-Scummy as opposed to just Null with the reasoning she uses imo.

 

BFG- No leans at all.  I find that hard to believe that fwiw.

 

Nolder: No leans at all

 

I find this pretty ironic considering part of the reason youre sussing Sooh is that she has vague reads......

 

And then you unvote Len...cause your votes doing no good......really....still time left before you start talking that.

 

 

[Zander?]

Tina ISO Pt 4

 

 

Iso´d Shad.

 

Still want to know what he meant in #361. (Sucks to not have a nk?) Was it a joke? Know something that I don´t?

 

He talks a lot about other games and compare people to how they played in those, which doesn´t help me at all since I either didn´t play in those games or have forgotten them. 

 

He still hasn´t voted. 

 

Still he feels into the game and have some good comments. I feel like he is trying to explain things more than make small things look scummy. 

 

Result: Null to town. 

 

 

I have delibrety not read Lenlo-Pizza. My initial thoughts was that Lenlo was scum and that is of course why I voted him. Pizza shared some of my thoughts on how he was handeling Dice. But then I didn´t agree with his tunnelling and saying that everything Lenlo did was scummy. And that unvote doesn´t really look good either. I have no idea how to read this. Both look scummy to me but Lenlo more so first and Pizza then later. 

 

My daughter will soon arrive so I will give my read list and then I´ll be back when she has gone to sleep.

 

 

This took longer time than I expected so I will just post a list and get back tomorrow. 

 

 

Town:

Tina 

Cory - I still haven´t seen anything scummy from Cory. I don´t feel like he is trying to manipulate people. 

Zander 

Dice - from his earlier posts. If he doesn´t give us something new he will be moving down. I don´t like that he is telling me to be more active when I´m trying and have posted more today. 

 

Null - town:

 

Shad

 

Null:

 

Nikon

BFG - BFG will move down unless she comes in with some focused thoughts about other players. 

Nolder

 

Null - Scum:

 

Besie

 

 

Scum:

 

Sooh - I liked some of the content on her list but I don´t understand why she gets so angry with Zander. 
Lenlo 

Pizza

 

No, I don´t think that Lenlo and Pizza are both mafia. Right now I think Lenlo´s posts are more scummy and Pizza´s behaviour is more scummy. 

 

 

 

 

 

Lenlo - you asked me who I thought was most scummy of you and Pizza. When I wrote that post I couldn´t decide and I still have a hard time deciding. I feel good about my case on you but it was an early case and I don´t know how stubborn I should be. I guess this is right for most people but I don´t always trust myself. Should I let go or not? Then Pizza got worse with his posting and I didn´t like his unvote either. People often end up saying that it´s a town/town fight after this kind of battles but I´m more worried that one of you is mafia and will slip away now. From what I have read after your post I will go with Pizza as mafia.

 

First because how he tunnelled you and then unvoted when you didn´t back down. He has then turned his eyes on Shad and me. I kind of get his reasons for Shad but not for myself. He spend a lot of his posts to talk about himself and his own meta, linking to other games. That tells me absolutely nothing, it´s just filling up the thread. I also don´t like how Sooh defends him and she is another suspect of mine. Zander said that he didn´t like that Pizza initially cleared him and Cory. I find it equaly strange that Sooh has a town read on both me and Pizza, who is supicious of her. 

 

 

 

Besie:
 
She seems to be going with the flow* a lot and a lot of her posts are not game related. She asks questions but don´t do anything with the answers. I have not played with her before so I can´t judge her from previous games so I don´t know why Zander is saying she is town. 
 
* many have had the same oppinion so it´s hard to say that this is purely negative. I have expressed some of the same thoughts.
 
Result: null - scummy
 
 
BFG:
 
She is posting a lot, asking a lot of good questions. Still, I don´t know what she thinks about people. She posted a list where she was uncertain of most people, I don´t know why she posted that list at all. 
 
Result: depends on what she will contribute with next.
 
Nolder:
 
A big ?.  He is saying that he don´t want to say much during D1 so it´s hard to say anything about him. 
 
Result: null 
 
So of these people I guess I find Sooh  most scummy. BFG is in an category of her own. I will take a new look at Lenlo (and others) later.
 
Right now unvote.
 
Wether or not I decide to change my mind or not about Lenlo, my vote isn´t doing any good right now. 
 
Those that I won´t take another look at are Dice and Cory. Dice because I have not seen anything yet to change my town read on him and Cory because I know I won´t get any wiser by that.

 
Spacing and vote tag omitted.
 
I generally find the hard unvote scummy.
 
I know I did it myself this game and it's pretty rare that I just unvote and then not follow it up with my next suspect. I know my reasons for doing so.
 
I also iirc remember Dice doing the same thing. But, that's mitigated a lot by the fact that he looked genuine to me for a lot of the early day one. It also might be less rare for him, I'm not sure. I know he parked his vote before but that's not a large enough sample size.
 
It's fine if you don't know what your next move is going to be, and perhaps it might be more important to unvote and not revote in a game with hybrid hammer.
 
That said, Tina has stated several persons she is questionable on and isn't using the vote to push them.

And she hasn't even changed her mind on Lenlo, but she's still unvoting him. That makes no sense.
 
Why is her vote "not doing any good" if she still thinks Lenlo is scummy? That's never a townie's brainwave.
 
There's a VERY specific reason why a townie unvotes a suspect- because they now look townie, or because there's someone else who needs to be lynched now, and your vote is required to make that happen.
 
Tina has no such reason.

 

Tina please address this next time you're around

Also curious as to when I've mafia.d against you?

 

 

Nothing much to adress. I didn´t know who I wanted to vote at that time. I do get the point though because I have been a little curious to why many didn´t vote before. 

 

As for the first post that Pizza pointed out - that I asked for a vc. First of all, I do need something to have in the back as I move on. You are talking to the person that often have to iso herself to remember what she has thought about people earlier. I have a really bad memory. Second, I wanted to see if Lenlo had voted you or not since one of my reasons for suspecting him was that he tried to make Dice look guilty without voting him.

 

[v] Pizza [/v]

 

I could vote Sooh as well.

 

I´ll continue to watch Lenlo as we move on. 

 

 

You keep saying you havent been following the Len/Pizza fight.  Yet other then what i assumed was a joke vote on Dice, you proceed to vote Len then Pizza??  Like really...come on now thats just horribad.  You've also talked about them the most and and have them and Sooh all in your Scum reads for very weak reasoning especially after YOU said YOU weren't following along.  Pizza's town flip makes this look even worse imo.

[Shad_]

Hi.

I've got maybe 30 minutes or so. Flip kind of derails where my head was at but doesn't really impact my POE. Going to look over Tina a bit. I don't think this is some crazy Cory Zander scum rofl game and the pool is pretty narrow.  Worst case we have three shots to catch the first, right?  I struggle to think there aren't any in Tina/Nikon/Nolder.
 

[Shad_]

Honestly I need to rethink Nolder because my meh feeling about him is pretty dated and I've missed a lot of his more recent content.

[Shad_]

I'll try to do both.  I don't think Nikon is going to be resolved short of a flip at this point.

[Zander?]

Tina ISO Pt 5

 

 

 

[v]Tina[/v]

 

Trending down

 

OMGUS?

 

 

What I would like to see is something new from Dice. I also really, really look forward to BFG´s thoughts about everyone. 

 

 

Will admit I feel the same here.

 

 

 

I would like as many people as possible to do the following for me:

In order from likeliest town -> scum list the follow four players:

Tina

Nikon
Shad

Pizza

 

Tina

Shad/Nikon

Pizza

 

 

lolololololololololol

 

 

*SNIP*

 

I can´t get too focused on Cory and making him satisfied. I´ll play and I hope he will see me as town. Cory is going up and down between null and town. I don´t base that on what he believes about me. I haven´t found anything scummy with his play so far. He doesn´t seem to have an agenda. (But... I need to add a but... I´m not sure I would notice if he had one.) 

 

I don´t see how you (or anyone) can have Sooh that high on the list.

 

To answer Cory´s earlier question: Right now I´m most sure about Zander and Pizza. I wish I could be as sure about Dice as I was earlier but he hasn´t done much lately. 

 

From the posts I have read today not much have changed my mind. I think I just need a flip. If people would rather vote Sooh than Pizza then I´m okay with jumping on that train. 

 

 

 

Fence sitting on Cory

 

Agree about Sooh

 

Still most sure on Me and Pizza?

 

Don't hate the last statement.

 

 

 

I see that I missed the whole day. Pizza being town makes me need to re-think my list. If I'm alive that is. I would still suggest killing Sooh.

 

Strange how that works eh

 

 

I have only read the last pages quick so I won't comment much on it now but I want to adress Sooh's vote on me again. It was totally OMGUS after I voted her, nothing else. There were no reasons stated. "Trending down" is not a reason.

 

I feel there are more reasons and better ones then you are using on Sooh.  What else is making her your top Scum read?

 

 

 

I'm town. That's why. Maybe I can be of more use tomorrow when I know two alignments.

 

 
Why shouldn't I lynch you tomorrow assuming you don't get shot by Pizza?

Hi Cory.

 

 

 

You can understand hopefully if people choose not to believe this.

 

 

I know that you are not asking me but I find it hard to judge someone that isn't even caught up on the game.

 

Sometimes you gotta at least try and make some sort of read some way for someone EoD 1.  Also is it any worse then someone who has claimed to be read up but continues to say that that are deliberately ignoring the Len Pizza fight which was the major talking point of the day?

 

 

TLDR-

 

Dont like her whole take on Pizza Len-  I didnt read it all but Ill make some points concerning it but either way here's my top Scum Reads.

 

I think she's reaching for reasons for voting Sooh especially early on. 

 

Contradicts herself by saying Sooh's reads are vague when her own are as well.

 

Feel like shes been fence sitting as well as some of her reads/comments.  Also doesnt seem to be progressing them really at all as well.

 

Still wanna ISO Shad/Sooh and I wanna say Nikon but......really not all that much point but I will anyways.  But atp I'd have no problems voting Tina tomorrow or Pizza shooting her.

[Guest]

Here, catching up.

 

 

 

Boy I wish I could edit. This blue is irritating to me and I'd love to spoiler my big posts.

What's Pral going to do, modkill you?

Pump the brakes, hon. No need for that.

 

Try a darker, almost-black blue, Pizza?

[Guest]

Okay, ignore that. Just read all posts that null that one.

 

Sorry. :/

[Zander?]

Here, catching up.

 

 

Boy I wish I could edit. This blue is irritating to me and I'd love to spoiler my big posts.

What's Pral going to do, modkill you?

Pump the brakes, hon. No need for that.

 

Try a darker, almost-black blue, Pizza?

 

 

I can straight up almost guarantee that I wont even remember to do this and prolly, no offense Pral, wont even try to.  We should be capable of remembering who is alive and dead.

 

I'll prolly be the first to mess that up as well.....lololololololol