World's End Mafia - town wins comprehensively

[Pralaya]

And now I really need to go. From memory the pub we're meeting at has no signal, and other than that I'm driving so probably won't be around until early evening. That's several hours before the deadline though.

 

 

 

Pizza, I would love for you to explain your early thoughts on Dice, your opinion on Shad, Tina and Sooh as fully as you can. I guess your thoughts on Dice can wait in preference to the other 3

You sure there are no androids there? :)

[Guest]

Besie, you might want to talk to me before firin your lazar.

Fine.

 

Why did you start posting more words only after it was stated that town pizza does that?

 

Why have you stopped being sarcastic in terms of being wolf?

 

I felt that you were overconfident then. And now you stopped, so does it indicate that you feel threatened (as wolf) or that you're actually trying to prove you're villa?

 

 

Why did you decide to go after Lenlo when your reasoning now is that his behaviour was typical for town?

 

His behaviour being to think of tactics that might work to win the game as villa/town.

 

[Nolder]

I agree more with the nothing to gain argument than the townies make bad arguments argument (lol).

I mean, you're not wrong they do make bad arguments all the time. But my point is that it shouldn't be allowed to stand.

There is a chance, a decent chance, that Lenlo was mafia trying to nudge the town into making a stupid move.

I think that deserves followup in the form of a lynch.

[Guest]

It feels like I'm walking in butter. Might make a cream donut when I'm done.

 

:/

[Zander?]

 

Then lynch Pizza imo.  Chances of killing scum significantly > 0% and if he flips town you'll probably get your wish tonight.

 

@ All

 

Reverse the order.

 

Both Pizza and Shad still die, but true town heroes revealed.

 

 

 

It works fine for me either way,  And one can only assume that the true town heroes will be me and Cory saving this village right?

[Nolder]

16 hours to deadline, I should be back within 8.

 

Hammer generally doesn't fall that early without strong consensus on this site. If it does, that will be telling as well.

 

Explain why Tina is mafia? I have her as POE, but that's not the same thing

Ditto this. 

[Guest]

 

 

*snip*

 

 

 

 

id vote shad not pizza

Im fine with Shad but why not Pizza DIce?

cause i think he is town and because half the arguments for lynching him seems to be "but hes hard to read! lets play safe" not a fan

Dice so towny!

Yeah I don't see how this makes him towny AT ALL. At all. There's so many other factors that contribute to Pizza being the most scummy.

 

Are you, Sooh, and Dice, w/w?

*snip*

Really?

 

I admit I'm not great at this game when wolfing, but it would be ridiculous of a wolf me to put our trio so close together.

 

Dice is towny because Dice does Dice. He takes stances regardless of their popularity and defends them. This is one of those cases in which I believe his thinking is completely towny.

It would be foolish, yes. But also great to be a method to clear some of the trio.

 

I only said you and Dice though. Didn't include Pizza in that specific sentence. Too many commas, I guess.

[Nolder]

 

16 hours to deadline, I should be back within 8.

 

Hammer generally doesn't fall that early without strong consensus on this site. If it does, that will be telling as well.

 

Explain why Tina is mafia? I have her as POE, but that's not the same thing

 

Cory is a townie

Nolder is a townie

Zander is a townie

Pizza is a townie

Besie is a townie

BFG is a townie

Lenlo is a townie

Dice is a townie

 

That's why Tina is a scum.

 

Why Tina over Shad, Sooh, or Nikon?

[Guest]

 

@BFG

 

 

 

 

 

@ BFG

 

I dislike that you say I go with the flow.

 

 

 

 

 

ISO's Besie and doesn't like how she's going with the flow

I can even pinpoint to the post that probably formed this idea in the back of your mind.

 

 

Besie:

 

She seems to be going with the flow* a lot and a lot of her posts are not game related. She asks questions but don´t do anything with the answers. I have not played with her before so I can´t judge her from previous games so I don´t know why Zander is saying she is town.

 

* many have had the same oppinion so it´s hard to say that this is purely negative. I have expressed some of the same thoughts.

 

 

I'm not going with the flow. I'm making my own deductions from my own ways of reasoning. The only way I'm going with the flow is in reading, understanding and agreeing with several people's arguments. Including you. Do you WANT me to make a very random list? My list differs conciderably from Pizza's. Many people are at different alignments when compared to Cory and Zander's, with the main being Shad, I believe. And you just went and moved Shad to null-town, so I don't see how that's a problem. The only other thing I did was to move Len quite a bit, and you could possibly have seen that as going with the flow. It was not. It was my thoughts about things he said early game. And once again, no. I'm not referring to the "secret info" that Cory saw and Zander apparently sees too. It's my own, and I actually added even more to Len's villa after his argument with Pizza, and Pizza's reasoning.

 

If you want to say that I'm sheeping (cause that's what go with the flow is!) then at least give proper examples. I'm NOT sheeping my top scum read. I'm not even sheeping my top town reads, except on Tina. Want me to stop going with the flow? Then I refuse to vote someone who I have no experience with and can see no reason for their negative alignment.

 

Another example is Dice. I don't feel good on him. And he's towny for most people. Is that going with the flow too?

 

:/

 

 

 

Are you deepwolfing with Tina?

Just read the first line.

 

that's my summary of the post you quoted from within Tina's ISO.

 

Everything within the spoiler is either a summary of Tina's ISO or my reaction to it. I'll try to make it clearer which is which in future

 

 

I apologize.

Why?

 

 

 

You secretly British?

 

South African... which is pretty much the same. I've heard Canadians apologize just as much. Teehee.

[Zander?]

Odds of me flipping wolf are about the same as Cory becoming a mute.

 

[Zander?]

 

 

 

id vote shad  not pizza

 

 

Im fine with Shad but why not Pizza DIce?

 

 

cause i think he is town and because half the arguments for lynching him seems to be "but hes hard to read! lets play safe"   not a fan

 

Dice so towny!

 

 

 

lol why cause he agrees with you about not lynching Pizza?  Cause if thats the reason its quite weak imo.

[Sooh]

 

 

*snip*

 

 

 

id vote shad not pizza

Im fine with Shad but why not Pizza DIce?

cause i think he is town and because half the arguments for lynching him seems to be "but hes hard to read! lets play safe" not a fan

Dice so towny!

Yeah I don't see how this makes him towny AT ALL. At all. There's so many other factors that contribute to Pizza being the most scummy.

 

Are you, Sooh, and Dice, w/w?

*snip*

Really?

 

I admit I'm not great at this game when wolfing, but it would be ridiculous of a wolf me to put our trio so close together.

 

Dice is towny because Dice does Dice. He takes stances regardless of their popularity and defends them. This is one of those cases in which I believe his thinking is completely towny.

It would be foolish, yes. But also great to be a method to clear some of the trio.

 

I only said you and Dice though. Didn't include Pizza in that specific sentence. Too many commas, I guess.

 

Ah, I read that wrong then.

 

Still, that's a wifom argument which could be made about anyone clearing anyone else. Plus if I'm scum, would I not try to clear my teammates?

[Zander?]

Adding Dice to my top town reads. 

 

The site ate the post where I quoted and stuff.

 

 

hmmmmmmmmmmmm.......

[Sooh]

 

 

 

 

id vote shad  not pizza

 

 

Im fine with Shad but why not Pizza DIce?

 

 

cause i think he is town and because half the arguments for lynching him seems to be "but hes hard to read! lets play safe"   not a fan

 

Dice so towny!

 

 

 

lol why cause he agrees with you about not lynching Pizza?  Cause if thats the reason its quite weak imo.

 

*waits for Zander to catch up*

[Zander?]

I won't be arguing with Lenlo (about his alignment anyway) anymore.

 

I hate letting wolves go free so I wouldn't have unvoted him if he was anywhere near more likely to be scummy than not.

 

He's not blue because godawful opening-midday. But he's not where the wolves are.

 

The wolves are contained within Tina and Shad.

 

Sooh not voting Shad is problem.

 

Pretty sure theres prolly 3 of them no?  Unless you were insinuating Sooh as the 3rd which is what Im assuming from this post anyways.

[Zander?]

 

 

 

"Let us raid Zander's wardrobe! If we find pants aflame, we'll know he's a dirty liar!"

*opens wardrobe*  See only Villager Blue in here!!!!!

I'm a villager and I can prove it:

 

OMW lol. Bonus points for the keyboard though.

 

 

 

 

Yes Dice

 

Yes Dice

Goodbye Wolf

 

Somebody wanna explain what I have to do with these 2 posts?

I felt the same way when I read it. Left me like... HUH?

 

 

@ cory

 

let me guess.  Youre nodding.

 

 

nods

*nods*

 

 

 

 

I'm grounded from Mafia tomorrow night fwiw for lady reasons. Advance warning.

RIP me

Really unnecessary. :/

 

 

TinaPizzaShad wagons people

 

Let's get with the program

Change that to TinaPizzaSooh and I'll join.

 

And only because I trust you people with Tina experience.

 

>.>

 

<.<

 

 

 

 

id vote shad  not pizza

 

Im fine with Shad but why not Pizza DIce?

cause i think he is town and because half the arguments for lynching him seems to be "but hes hard to read! lets play safe"   not a fan

Not true AT ALL. Have you even read the thread?

 

 

Feisty, I like it!!!!!!

[Guest]

 

 

 

 

 

 

*snip*

 

 

 

id vote shad not pizza

Im fine with Shad but why not Pizza DIce?

cause i think he is town and because half the arguments for lynching him seems to be "but hes hard to read! lets play safe" not a fan

Dice so towny!

Yeah I don't see how this makes him towny AT ALL. At all. There's so many other factors that contribute to Pizza being the most scummy.

 

Are you, Sooh, and Dice, w/w?

*snip*

Really?

 

I admit I'm not great at this game when wolfing, but it would be ridiculous of a wolf me to put our trio so close together.

 

Dice is towny because Dice does Dice. He takes stances regardless of their popularity and defends them. This is one of those cases in which I believe his thinking is completely towny.

It would be foolish, yes. But also great to be a method to clear some of the trio.

 

I only said you and Dice though. Didn't include Pizza in that specific sentence. Too many commas, I guess.

 

Ah, I read that wrong then.

 

Still, that's a wifom argument which could be made about anyone clearing anyone else. Plus if I'm scum, would I not try to clear my teammates?

I understand why you are saying that, but I don't think it's valid. If I were scum, I'd specifically include scum in both my scum list AND town list so that if I flipped scum people would assume all my town reads were scum team members.

 

I know people know that and do that. So ton counteract that, it's possible to include all the scum within your scum reads. That way, people (villa!) will still think the scum was dispersed along your list, and they'll believe that some of your scum reads are villa. Does that make sense?

 

It's two ways of playing as scum. Tactics. I don't doubt that you could have done the latter. You are, as you called me, cunning enough to do that.

[Zander?]

 

 

Assassin in the palace, all alt accounts named Zander, real one's the king.

 

 

imo

 

lololololololololol

 

RIP Lemmy

 

Zander, that was creepy coincidence.

 

 

 

RIP Lemmy...you truly were.....

 

 

[Sooh]

 

 

 

 

 

*snip*

 

 

 

id vote shad not pizza

Im fine with Shad but why not Pizza DIce?

cause i think he is town and because half the arguments for lynching him seems to be "but hes hard to read! lets play safe" not a fan

Dice so towny!

Yeah I don't see how this makes him towny AT ALL. At all. There's so many other factors that contribute to Pizza being the most scummy.

 

Are you, Sooh, and Dice, w/w?

*snip*

Really?

 

I admit I'm not great at this game when wolfing, but it would be ridiculous of a wolf me to put our trio so close together.

 

Dice is towny because Dice does Dice. He takes stances regardless of their popularity and defends them. This is one of those cases in which I believe his thinking is completely towny.

It would be foolish, yes. But also great to be a method to clear some of the trio.

 

I only said you and Dice though. Didn't include Pizza in that specific sentence. Too many commas, I guess.

 

Ah, I read that wrong then.

 

Still, that's a wifom argument which could be made about anyone clearing anyone else. Plus if I'm scum, would I not try to clear my teammates?

I understand why you are saying that, but I don't think it's valid. If I were scum, I'd specifically include scum in both my scum list AND town list so that if I flipped scum people would assume all my town reads were scum team members.

 

I know people know that and do that. So ton counteract that, it's possible to include all the scum within your scum reads. That way, people (villa!) will still think the scum was dispersed along your list, and they'll believe that some of your scum reads are villa. Does that make sense?

 

It's two ways of playing as scum. Tactics. I don't doubt that you could have done the latter. You are, as you called me, cunning enough to do that.

 

But do you see that this argument from here on out can not go beyond WIFOM?

 

It's an "If...then" argument which will vary from how we approach the game. 

 

I argued the same that you're doing now in another game. That scum surely would put team mates in various places in their reads. I was wrong. That person had cleared all his team mates.

[Zander?]

 

I won't be arguing with Lenlo (about his alignment anyway) anymore.

 

I hate letting wolves go free so I wouldn't have unvoted him if he was anywhere near more likely to be scummy than not.

 

He's not blue because godawful opening-midday. But he's not where the wolves are.

 

The wolves are contained within Tina and Shad.

 

Sooh not voting Shad is problem.

Why?

 

I could vote him.

 

I wasn't confident on my slightly towny read of him before, and I'm still not convinced he's a wolf, but I'm willing to trust others on this read because I've proven before that I can't catch ShadWolf.

 

Right now I'm more comfortable with Tina though, and seeing as she's one of your wolves, why is it a problem that I'm voting for her and not your other wolf?

 

 

Why are you concerned with only voting from Pizza's "scum" reads anyways?

[Guest]

Please tell me what WIFOM stands for before I answer?

[Sooh]

 

 

I won't be arguing with Lenlo (about his alignment anyway) anymore.

 

I hate letting wolves go free so I wouldn't have unvoted him if he was anywhere near more likely to be scummy than not.

 

He's not blue because godawful opening-midday. But he's not where the wolves are.

 

The wolves are contained within Tina and Shad.

 

Sooh not voting Shad is problem.

Why?

 

I could vote him.

 

I wasn't confident on my slightly towny read of him before, and I'm still not convinced he's a wolf, but I'm willing to trust others on this read because I've proven before that I can't catch ShadWolf.

 

Right now I'm more comfortable with Tina though, and seeing as she's one of your wolves, why is it a problem that I'm voting for her and not your other wolf?

 

 

Why are you concerned with only voting from Pizza's "scum" reads anyways?

 

I was responding to his line of questioning.

[Sooh]

Please tell me what WIFOM stands for before I answer?

Wine in front of me.

 

It's from Princess Bride.

 

Two glasses of wine I set on the table, one for you, one for me. One of them is poisoned. Would I set that wine in front of you or myself?

[Askthepizzaguy]

 

16 hours to deadline, I should be back within 8.

 

Hammer generally doesn't fall that early without strong consensus on this site. If it does, that will be telling as well.

 

Explain why Tina is mafia? I have her as POE, but that's not the same thing

 

Cory is a townie

Nolder is a townie

Zander is a townie

Pizza is a townie

Besie is a townie

BFG is a townie

Lenlo is a townie

Dice is a townie

 

That's why Tina is a scum.

 

 

Cory- early game enthusiasm of the specific sort I needed, plus the sabotage comment. Why that's always townie is because if Cory is a scum, he knows for a fact that I'm not a scum, and his first reaction to me threatening to shoot Zander because he's not villaging properly is to call it sabotage. That's not what a scumbag says there. Even if Zander is his partner. There's no way Cory-scum dissuades me from that shot, ever, even if Zander was his partner, especially not by using that reasoning. That's not a scum reason for trying to chastise that behavior, it's always townie and it is currently the reason why he's voting for me, and I understand that, because that behavior (my threatening Zander in that precise manner) is seen by Cory to be anti-town, and if there's doubt in Cory's mind about me, he's going to lynch the anti-town behavior.

 

Cory is wrong because Anti-town behavior is not scum behavior, it's against the town team in his opinion and mine, but in MY POSITION, I cannot allow myself to be the lynch and I have to attempt to persuade Zander not to lynch me, and I can't because he stonewalled me and stopped asking me solving questions. He asked a couple when he was catching up but when he was fully caught up, which is what I was waiting for, he did not pursue any further questions, and there's not a damned thing I can possibly do as his teammate to change his mind, he needs to see the flip first. That's bad for the reasons I told to his face, and he's letting me down.

 

It wasn't an idle threat but it was me doing what I could to affect the outcome.

 

My questions about his alignment because he was active but not pressing his suspects that hard disappeared in his later posts. The tack he's taken on me is so much more dangerous and straightforward than so many options he had available to him as a scumbag in his position of being town-read so much with an easy D1 lynch in his pocket.

 

Nolder's leans list looks outdated to me due to missing information, the kind you'd get from coming from a position of not being in the know and trying to get to the same page everyone else is. That kind of piecemeal information leans list is harder to fake as a scum and it rarely occurs to a scum to have such a list.

 

Zander has a responsibility to the scum team and should in no way be afraid of pretending to ask me solving questions, but it's possible(?).... it's less likely when the alternative is I shoot him tonight. He's letting me down in a big way by hiding in fear of the big scary pizza monster by saying to me that he's afraid if he asks me questions it might change my mind, so he's gotta kill me because I'm a wolf lean. Killing pizza without a fair trial when you've got me on the witness stand and you're allowed to ask me questions is bad prosecution, period. That lesson needs to be learned for future games. He didn't budge from his position under threat, which he really should have if he's a townie, but almost undoubtedly would have budged if he were scum. I had questions about his alignment from his poor prosecution which read differently from the last game, but he's got balls of steel or is deliberately sabotaging his scum team today by not prosecuting me properly and therefore being en prise for no reason when he was being universally town-read again, even by the person he was trying to lynch.

 

I'm a townie because that's what I rolled. And I demonstrated that all round. It's not being listened to because big scary pizza monster might live for one more day. Thanks for the compliment but this is a self-inflicted wound. I towned and it wasn't exactly what it was in the previous game, and I'm being lynched, as I predicted, by Cory, for that exact reason that I predicted.

 

I am aware of how people react to my posts and I still made them.

 

Besie was a town lean, but I think there's little or no risk for Besie to put me at L-1, because she's not under a ton of suspicion. I don't know Besie, so this one is a little harder to say is a lock. But I'd not shoot her tonight if I died. If Besie instead lynches Tina and Tina is a scum, Besie can be blue until final 3.

 

I have repeatedly and in detail explained why Lenlo looked so godawful to me and that reversed, and it's very specific and very strong. And it's not bullshit. And it's really unlikely to be wrong.

 

Dice is voting where the PoE should be. Dice can be the deepwolf, but he's not going to survive the whole game if he lynches his not-deep wolves day one and then is never the murder or the retaliatory night lynch. I also went over Dice before and I'll do it again.

 

Sooh is voting where the PoE should be. I still don't trust her because her leans and votes have been opposite to mine most of the game. Lean on Lenlo started wrong and ended up right too quickly, imo. Seems reluctant to lynch Shad. If Tina is town and Shad is scum you must lynch Sooh. Sooh voting where the PoE should be isn't clearing for her the way it is for Dice because she's also under suspicion and she doesn't have a lot of choice, if she lynches me today she always dies.

 

Nikon is null-POE. I don't trust him, but I need more time to read him.

 

Shad is bad for the reasons that are subtle but have been noticed by not just me.

 

Tina is bad because of that hard unvote and no real pushing. Lenlo was going to look bizarre early game for what he was doing, that was an easy thing for a wolf to attack. Tina's suspects weren't getting pushed and her vote also vanished from Lenlo when the wagon didn't look like it was going that way.

 

I can and did thoroughly and at length explain my unvote, and it's never a reason that comes from Pizza-scum.

 

Tina's was never explained and makes no sense from a villaging perspective.

[Guest]

 

 

Please tell me what WIFOM stands for before I answer?

Wine in front of me.

 

It's from Princess Bride.

 

Two glasses of wine I set on the table, one for you, one for me. One of them is poisoned. Would I set that wine in front of you or myself?

In that case...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

*snip*

 

 

 

id vote shad not pizza

Im fine with Shad but why not Pizza DIce?

cause i think he is town and because half the arguments for lynching him seems to be "but hes hard to read! lets play safe" not a fan

Dice so towny!

Yeah I don't see how this makes him towny AT ALL. At all. There's so many other factors that contribute to Pizza being the most scummy.

 

Are you, Sooh, and Dice, w/w?

*snip*

Really?

 

I admit I'm not great at this game when wolfing, but it would be ridiculous of a wolf me to put our trio so close together.

 

Dice is towny because Dice does Dice. He takes stances regardless of their popularity and defends them. This is one of those cases in which I believe his thinking is completely towny.

It would be foolish, yes. But also great to be a method to clear some of the trio.

 

I only said you and Dice though. Didn't include Pizza in that specific sentence. Too many commas, I guess.

 

Ah, I read that wrong then.

 

Still, that's a wifom argument which could be made about anyone clearing anyone else. Plus if I'm scum, would I not try to clear my teammates?

I understand why you are saying that, but I don't think it's valid. If I were scum, I'd specifically include scum in both my scum list AND town list so that if I flipped scum people would assume all my town reads were scum team members.

 

I know people know that and do that. So ton counteract that, it's possible to include all the scum within your scum reads. That way, people (villa!) will still think the scum was dispersed along your list, and they'll believe that some of your scum reads are villa. Does that make sense?

 

It's two ways of playing as scum. Tactics. I don't doubt that you could have done the latter. You are, as you called me, cunning enough to do that.

 

But do you see that this argument from here on out can not go beyond WIFOM?

 

It's an "If...then" argument which will vary from how we approach the game.

 

I argued the same that you're doing now in another game. That scum surely would put team mates in various places in their reads. I was wrong. That person had cleared all his team mates.

Understood. It serves no purpose talking about this; I agree.