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A WHEEL OF TIME COMMUNITY
Kamen Marin

The Companion preview on Amazon

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Why nobody is speaking about that? What about the crazy One Power levels that was published by someone? Cadsuane stronger than Egwene? Annoura not strong enough to Travel? Mesanna stronger than Nynaeve? Semirhage as strong as Lanfear? Nynaeve stronger than just one female Forsaken - Moghedien, when Jordan told us that she is in the middle of the female Forsakens? Elayne stronger than Viendre, when there is a quote by herself that Viendre is stronger? Theodrin three levels above Faolain (this is the one that I could accept, but I don't feel it right)?

 

The male are not such a surprise, may be because there is not so much abut their power in the books. But Rahvin as strong as Ishamael and Rand is crazy.How is that possible?!?!? If Rand at book 5 is X strong, and Rahvin is also X strong , than how is possible Rand to feel that Sammael is X strong too some months later? This List says clearly that if Rand and Rahvin are X, Sammael should be X-1. Than how Rand is stronger in book 5 than himself in book 7?!?!?!? I can accept Be'laal being weakest, it doesn't contradict the story at all, but everything else.... oh c'mon....

 

I see one big flow on this list Jordan told us that he made this list to keep track of the Aes Sedai characters but, there are missing key players in that. One of the few really straight mention of power differences is in the scene where Merana is thinking about Verin and Alanna, so I assume that there have to be at last place for this three characters on his list, but there is NO MENTION OF VERIN level on the list. What about Sareitha we know that she is stronger than Careane, weaker that Adelese and Vandene but she is not in the list too. So how is possible Jordan to say that this list is to keeping track of the chanelers than not mention in it two of the characters for whom is pretty clear where they stand. The same with Sheriam. We know that she is the Strongest at Salidar  before Romanda and Lelain come...

 

What about Javindhra who said to Pevara that she will not go out of the Black Tower no matter what Pevara say. Pevara is putted on charge by their Highest and she is 11 (yes eleven) levels above Javindhra?!?!?! If that was true no matter how odd is going everything in the Black Tower, Pevara should make a note about the behavior of Javindhra. 11 levels?!?!? In that list Bera is just 3 levels above Merana , but we all saw what happened at LoC. We saw what Merana was thinking, and how Bera and Kiruna react to her speaking. 

 

And Nime the Windfinder that is "almost as strong than Raynin" at last in the books. In the List she is 3 levels down. Than why nobody calls Merana "almost as strong as Bera"?

 

What about Andaya? One level under Vandene and Adelese? And a Sitter? Speaking no mater who is in the room? No defer to anyone? Nobody order her... strange, don't you think? And Covarla three levels above her, the same Covarla who "can not lead anybody"...

 

 
 

So the question is IS THAT LIST REAL? OR IT IS MADE BY SOMEONE WHO IS TRYING TO MAKE A FUSS?

So the question is IS THAT LIST REAL? OR IT IS MADE BY SOMEONE WHO IS TRYING TO MAKE A FUSS?

Edited by me.asmodean

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I will wait untill the book is published. I expect it is yet less canon than the books. I expect it is pretty well canon. Let's just see!

 

I have it ordered on Amazon, I have something of a reread going on, I'm not sure yet when I'll read it. I'll be glad to have it, but until I read it, I can consider this and that, even tit for tat (and to that expression does tit mean a bird or a part of female body, and does then tat mean some part of male--- anyway) It is bound to be a spoiler, get it, but do not read it, until you're sure. (That's what I think.(Must be published now not later thought))

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Why nobody is speaking about that?

 

 

We don't care about it. :unsure: 

 

After a quick glance: well, I will not buy it. Terrible "definitions", horrible "articles". I'm so disappointed.

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Why nobody is speaking about that? What about the crazy One Power levels that was published by someone? Cadsuane stronger than Egwene? Annoura not strong enough to Travel? Mesanna stronger than Nynaeve? Semirhage as strong as Lanfear? Nynaeve stronger than just one female Forsaken - Moghedien, when Jordan told us that she is in the middle of the female Forsakens? Elayne stronger than Viendre, when there is a quote by herself that Viendre is stronger? Theodrin three levels above Faolain (this is the one that I could accept, but I don't feel it right)?

 

The male are not such a surprise, may be because there is not so much abut their power in the books. But Rahvin as strong as Ishamael and Rand is crazy.How is that possible?!?!? If Rand at book 5 is X strong, and Rahvin is also X strong , than how is possible Rand to feel that Sammael is X strong too some months later? This List says clearly that if Rand and Rahvin are X, Sammael should be X-1. Than how Rand is stronger in book 5 than himself in book 7?!?!?!? I can accept Be'laal being weakest, it doesn't contradict the story at all, but everything else.... oh c'mon....

 

I see one big flow on this list Jordan told us that he made this list to keep track of the Aes Sedai characters but, there are missing key players in that. One of the few really straight mention of power differences is in the scene where Merana is thinking about Verin and Alanna, so I assume that there have to be at last place for this three characters on his list, but there is NO MENTION OF VERIN level on the list. What about Sareitha we know that she is stronger than Careane, weaker that Adelese and Vandene but she is not in the list too. So how is possible Jordan to say that this list is to keeping track of the chanelers than not mention in it two of the characters for whom is pretty clear where they stand. The same with Sheriam. We know that she is the Strongest at Salidar  before Romanda and Lelain come...

 

What about Javindhra who said to Pevara that she will not go out of the Black Tower no matter what Pevara say. Pevara is putted on charge by their Highest and she is 11 (yes eleven) levels above Javindhra?!?!?! If that was true no matter how odd is going everything in the Black Tower, Pevara should make a note about the behavior of Javindhra. 11 levels?!?!? In that list Bera is just 3 levels above Merana , but we all saw what happened at LoC. We saw what Merana was thinking, and how Bera and Kiruna react to her speaking. 

 

And Nime the Windfinder that is "almost as strong than Raynin" at last in the books. In the List she is 3 levels down. Than why nobody calls Merana "almost as strong as Bera"?

 

What about Andaya? One level under Vandene and Adelese? And a Sitter? Speaking no mater who is in the room? No defer to anyone? Nobody order her... strange, don't you think? And Covarla three levels above her, the same Covarla who "can not lead anybody"...

 

 

 

So the question is IS THAT LIST REAL? OR IT IS MADE BY SOMEONE WHO IS TRYING TO MAKE A FUSS?

So the question is IS THAT LIST REAL? OR IT IS MADE BY SOMEONE WHO IS TRYING TO MAKE A FUSS?

I'm assuming you got my link to the list either at Theoryland or RAFO.

 

The list is NOT complete. It only includes those strengths that I could find by search. 

 

For Cadsuane, her own entry says she is strength level 5(+8). In Nicola's entry, though, Cadsuane is said to be level 9(+4). RJ seems to have had two possible strengths for her.

 

All the rest is real. As for Javindhra and Andaya, remember that once you are named a Sitter, or placed in any kind of position of responsibility, your strength doesn't matter. The only reason Merana's authority was questioned, as she says herself, is because there had been no Amyrlin or Hall in Salidar when she left, so Bera and Kiruna felt comfortable overruling her. 

 

Here's an updated list, and this contains even more women, including Sheriam (level 14) and Verin (level 17):

 

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1LgUvi6JyRrikxm6jiRUwQlTFo64Hz2X7ng9ucZSWWfY/edit?usp=sharing

Edited by fionwe1987

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Ok, but look how Seaine is feeling about confront Saerin.All of the time she is thinking about the One Power.... I guess there are not 11 levels between them. Pevara is a Sitter too. Javindhra and Pevara are both Red Sitters. To act like that is really strange. Thank you about providing the List. Just it contradict the facts in the books...Is it possible this List to be early version of the real one?

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Ok, but look how Seaine is feeling about confront Saerin.All of the time she is thinking about the One Power.... I guess there are not 11 levels between them. Pevara is a Sitter too. Javindhra and Pevara are both Red Sitters. To act like that is really strange. Thank you about providing the List. Just it contradict the facts in the books...Is it possible this List to be early version of the real one?

The Amazon preview is of the final book.

 

But Seaine herself explains why she doesn't feel comfortable standing up to Saerin. They are doing something that is illegal, and thus outside of the Hall's authority. So the fact that Sitters did not expect deference from other Sitters was set aside, since they couldn't very well claim Sitter's precedence in something like this.

 

As for Pevara and Javindhra, they were about Ajah business. Sure, Pevara was placed at the head of the expedition, but it isn't like she, Tarna and Javindhra were stripped of their positions. Nor was what they were doind against any law. So Pevara likely continued to extend the courtesy due to Javindhra as a Sitter, even though she was so much stronger.

 

Incidentally, just did a search, and Seaine is level 17(5), so 3 levels below Peavara, Yukiri and Saerin.

Edited by fionwe1987

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Ok, but look how Seaine is feeling about confront Saerin.All of the time she is thinking about the One Power.... I guess there are not 11 levels between them. Pevara is a Sitter too. Javindhra and Pevara are both Red Sitters. To act like that is really strange. Thank you about providing the List. Just it contradict the facts in the books...Is it possible this List to be early version of the real one?

The Amazon preview is of the final book.

 

But Seaine herself explains why she doesn't feel comfortable standing up to Saerin. They are doing something that is illegal, and thus outside of the Hall's authority. So the fact that Sitters did not expect deference from other Sitters was set aside, since they couldn't very well claim Sitter's precedence in something like this.

 

As for Pevara and Javindhra, they were about Ajah business. Sure, Pevara was placed at the head of the expedition, but it isn't like she, Tarna and Javindhra were stripped of their positions. Nor was what they were doind against any law. So Pevara likely continued to extend the courtesy due to Javindhra as a Sitter, even though she was so much stronger. 

 

There is some logic :) But I feel that 11 levels are enough to listen what the higher have to say even for ordering..

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Ok, but look how Seaine is feeling about confront Saerin.All of the time she is thinking about the One Power.... I guess there are not 11 levels between them. Pevara is a Sitter too. Javindhra and Pevara are both Red Sitters. To act like that is really strange. Thank you about providing the List. Just it contradict the facts in the books...Is it possible this List to be early version of the real one?

The Amazon preview is of the final book.

 

But Seaine herself explains why she doesn't feel comfortable standing up to Saerin. They are doing something that is illegal, and thus outside of the Hall's authority. So the fact that Sitters did not expect deference from other Sitters was set aside, since they couldn't very well claim Sitter's precedence in something like this.

 

As for Pevara and Javindhra, they were about Ajah business. Sure, Pevara was placed at the head of the expedition, but it isn't like she, Tarna and Javindhra were stripped of their positions. Nor was what they were doind against any law. So Pevara likely continued to extend the courtesy due to Javindhra as a Sitter, even though she was so much stronger. 

 

There is some logic :) But I feel that 11 levels are enough to listen what the higher have to say even for ordering..

 

It is explicitly stated that what your strength is doesn't matter once you have a position of authority like Sitter granted to you. For instance, Moiraine notes that Duhara would have to obey her orders based on strength, but when she was Keeper that didn't matter one bit.

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Ok, but look how Seaine is feeling about confront Saerin.All of the time she is thinking about the One Power.... I guess there are not 11 levels between them. Pevara is a Sitter too. Javindhra and Pevara are both Red Sitters. To act like that is really strange. Thank you about providing the List. Just it contradict the facts in the books...Is it possible this List to be early version of the real one?

The Amazon preview is of the final book.

 

But Seaine herself explains why she doesn't feel comfortable standing up to Saerin. They are doing something that is illegal, and thus outside of the Hall's authority. So the fact that Sitters did not expect deference from other Sitters was set aside, since they couldn't very well claim Sitter's precedence in something like this.

 

As for Pevara and Javindhra, they were about Ajah business. Sure, Pevara was placed at the head of the expedition, but it isn't like she, Tarna and Javindhra were stripped of their positions. Nor was what they were doind against any law. So Pevara likely continued to extend the courtesy due to Javindhra as a Sitter, even though she was so much stronger. 

 

There is some logic :) But I feel that 11 levels are enough to listen what the higher have to say even for ordering..

 

It is explicitly stated that what your strength is doesn't matter once you have a position of authority like Sitter granted to you. For instance, Moiraine notes that Duhara would have to obey her orders based on strength, but when she was Keeper that didn't matter one bit.

 

Do you have skype brother? I'm looking for somebody with who  we can speak about the books. But anybody thinking around :) Mine is marty_zyb

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Back on track: who is stronger Hulk or Superman? I mean

 

 The epic tournament of fantasy champions on Suvudu is down to its final match: Rand al'Thor, the Dragon Reborn, versus Ser Jaime Lannister, the Kingslayer.

 

“Ser Lannister, you do not fool me with your ‘challenge’–nor do I feel challenged in any way by our upcoming match.
“I will meet on whatever field of battle you deem fit; it makes no difference to me. If you prefer for your people to be able to see your demise, I salute that.
“Bring as many of your warriors as you can muster–you need not even limit yourself to seven.
“As for me? I will be alone, comforted in the knowledge that I have nothing to fear from any you.
“I wish you well, Jaime. For soon you will be nothing but a name in The White Book, just as you are nothing but a man in golden armor.”

 

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The "Look Inside" preview on Amazon reveals most of the Companion, interesting to scroll through and read.  My copy just shipped for delivery tomorrow. :-)

 

Asmodean's entry is revealed, and the closing line is that Graendal was the person that actually killed him.  I was under the impression that she contracted Slayer to do it -- Slayer pulled him into T'A'R and killed him there (which is why he couldn't be resurrected.)  I didn't think Graendal actually pulled the trigger (so to speak.)

 

Did I just completely miss that?

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.

Thanks for the heads up. Sarlic.

 

I am checking out the preview now. However, my version skips his entry(it omitted the entire page 82 with a note that some pages are omitted on the preview. LOL)

 

I guess that I will have to wait until tomorrow.

 

I am about halfway through my aMoL reread, and am DYING to gaze upon the map of the great valley of Thakan'dar, as I am having a difficult time of visualizing it's layout.

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@sarlic,

 

robert jordan milked the who killed asmodean for far too long(like he did with many other

story arcs),and then..well,he died.

team jordan probably had no idea how to integrate the missing piece of information in the

ongoing narrative,so it was treated as an afterthought,just read graendal's  entry in the towers

of midnight glossary,the answer to who killed asmodean is there.

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@jack of shadows,

 

That was my recollection as well.  Was just surprised that the Companion would be at odds with a Glossary entry.

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The "Look Inside" preview on Amazon reveals most of the Companion, interesting to scroll through and read.  My copy just shipped for delivery tomorrow. :-)

 

Asmodean's entry is revealed, and the closing line is that Graendal was the person that actually killed him.  I was under the impression that she contracted Slayer to do it -- Slayer pulled him into T'A'R and killed him there (which is why he couldn't be resurrected.)  I didn't think Graendal actually pulled the trigger (so to speak.)

 

Did I just completely miss that?

There's no indication in the text that Slayer or T'a'r were involved, and every indication that it was Graendal acting alone - she killed him as a crime of opportunity, she didn't go out of her way to do it.

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I thought Rahvin would be tier 2 as well, bit shocking...However, he was certain he would wreck Lanfear. The author(s) stated that if LTT took over in book 5, Lanfear was toast. And Rand has not reached full OP strength in book 5. 

 

Logain is ranked, but Taim is not.

 

Not surprised that Alivia is as strong as Lanfear, I always suspected. However, Semirhage? Nowhere does it state or imply in the novels that she has crazy strength. This is RJ's scale, so it is canon. 

 

 

Rand would wreck Jaime in a purely blademaster contest btw. Jaime is too weak mentally. 

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I attribute the discrepency to the horrible editing that plagued the entire series. Sorry Harriett but facts are facts. I just got the Companion and one of the first things I looked up was Tar Valon only to find that there was NO entry for it.

 

An ommission that huge is inexcusable i think the entire series could have benefitted from some college interns proof reading, for the ridiculous amounts of typos in the books and  looking for ommissions in the case of the Companion because clearly Harriett and staff were not up to the task.

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But just becuase Rhavin think he could wreck Lanfear doesn't necesarily mean he could. 

 

Also have to remember the companion is just notes and such that never made it in the book.  So if RJ didn't have it written down then it's not going to be in the companion.  It could be Taim's strength was just something RJ forgot to write down since we now know Taim was really going to be Dem.  So it's possible RJ never put down Taim's strength and was just going to make him as strong as Dem.

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I found the book to be a total disappointment. For the record I did not buy it and have it from the library. i have been able to renew it 3 times which would never happen with any of the novels. That just goes to show the lack of interest in the book.

 

I wish that the different topics had been put into direct categories rather than in complete alphabetical order.

 

Do have one question that I have not been able to figure out and that is the second number following the strength of the females.

 

IE Elayne 8(+5) or Nynaeve 3(+10)

Thanks for you help.

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Not sure lack of interest, it's pretty much geared for the more die hard WOT fan and after a couple of reads through it there isn't much need to read it again.

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I found the book to be a total disappointment. For the record I did not buy it and have it from the library. i have been able to renew it 3 times which would never happen with any of the novels. That just goes to show the lack of interest in the book.

 

I wish that the different topics had been put into direct categories rather than in complete alphabetical order.

 

Do have one question that I have not been able to figure out and that is the second number following the strength of the females.

 

IE Elayne 8(+5) or Nynaeve 3(+10)

Thanks for you help.

 

The second number is their strength in AS terms before the super girls and forsaken level channelers show up. Supposedly. So Elayne is stronger than what the AS historically considered the strongest channeler, significantly so. Except that Cadsuane was clearly alive for a couple hundred of those years and off he chart. Anyway, the long and the short of it is you just subtract 12 from the first number and you'll have the second number, thereby making the entire enterprise pointless. If the second number has a + in front of it its because they are off the AS chart and a negative sign there would be even more confusing.

 

Also sometimes they did the math wrong in the companion.

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