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firstfuerst

How did Moiraine find Rand?

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Because Slayer was needed to make Perrin strong enough in TAR to beat Lanfear and stop her from killing Rand (i'd guess). A tragedy for Luc though, Issam to inbox own way.

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Mb, but Jordan made it very clear that there was a lot to these Talents, like Foretelling, that the AS didnt understand and may not be accurate about.  So just because the AS named this Talent "Foretelling", that doesnt mean that a Foretell-er can ONLY see the future. 

Could you provide exact words and a link?

 

Searched the Robert Jordan section of the 13th Depository site.  Did not find anything telling those things.

 

Still think that it was told before fulfillment.  Earliest time for fulfillment; I think minutes after it was told.

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But again Moraine called it foretelling, maybe a word would need to be created in regards to a vision at the exact time its happening.  But both Moraine and Siuan were content with calling what happened as foretelling.  The words she used made it clear it was happening as she said it.  So is it accurate to call it foretelling, I think foretelling for the Aes Sedai just covers "visions' wether it happens at that moment or at a future date while awake, where a dreamer has visions but when asleep.. 

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I would take it as it was very  imminent. She says it. Then it happens. A second before it happens is still before it happens, thus still a foretelling. This is personal opinion mind you, I have nothing to back this up

Edited by pxnsolid

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I don't have a link or know of words he said from an interview (though I'm sure he addressed it over the years). I just mean that through his writing, Jordan made the ignorance of the AS pretty clear. Verin talks quite a bit about knowledge that has been lost, and even talks about how many things are done a certain way simply because they've always been done that way. Ergo, "Visioning" might be a more correct term for the ability than "Foretelling", but the sisters present at the first foretelling dubbed it a "foretelling", so that is what it's been called for generations now.

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Gitara's foretelling was spoken in the present sense and with a great degree of urgency.  She actually dropped dead the moment she had finished uttering it.  That suggests to me that Rand's birth was, at the very least, extremely imminent.  Also, given Tam's account from his feverish ramblings in EotW we know that Rand's birth took place very shortly after the end of the fighting in the Aiel War.  As others have pointed out, it's rather immaterial whether or not the foretelling actually took place before the birth or during it.  It was still knowledge that Gitara couldn't have known by any normal means and is therefore a "foretelling" as that is what spontaneous, spoken prophecies made by Aes Sedai are called in the Wheel of Time.

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Just because something is called "foretelling" doesn't mean it can't tell the present, or even the past. A name is just a name, not a feature specification.

 

It is pretty clear to me that Gitara's foretelling happens at the exact moment Rand was born. It would make very little sense for her to drop dead otherwise.

 

Interestingly enough, the Aes Sedai make the same mistake of assuming Gitara was talking about the future.

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If you read about the male gentling program the BA got the reds to do, it was all because of that.  The problem was when they question Tamara they were left not knowing it was a newborn so that's why any male who showed the slighest possibility of being able to channel was targeted.  All they knew is he had already been born, but not when.  The BA never targeted newborns.

 

Her telling people you need to go into the blight or the waste is what most would consider foretelling.  Though does seem like she needlessly sent Luc to his death. Her saying he lives at the moment the dragon was reborn and then dropping dead might not be "classic foretelling" but I think what she did just gets lumped into foretelling anyway.

Edited by Sabio

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29 minutes ago, Sabio said:

If you read about the male gentling program the BA got the reds to do, it was all because of that.  The problem was when they question Tamara they were left not knowing it was a newborn so that's why any male who showed the slighest possibility of being able to channel was targeted.  All they knew is he had already been born, but not when.  The BA never targeted newborns.

 

Her telling people you need to go into the blight or the waste is what most would consider foretelling.  Though does seem like she needlessly sent Luc to his death. Her saying he lives at the moment the dragon was reborn and then dropping dead might not be "classic foretelling" but I think what she did just gets lumped into foretelling anyway.

 

I don't think it was ever explained what exactly the BA got out of Tamra. It seems that all they know is the Dragon had been reborn, and Tamra had sent out AS to find him. They might not even know about Gitara.

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The companion is the only source for it,.  They didn't know about the actual foretelling when it happened. They grew suspicious when Tamara was seen pulling Aes Sedai aside and feared it could be something about the BA, so they paniced and tortured her.  She was able to hold some stuff back because the BA  bungled matters in their haste.  So all the BA knew was he had been reborn, not when.  They also assumed she would only involve experienced senior Aes Sedai so they started killing Aes Sedai they knew were involved and senior Aes Sedai they simply suspected.  She didn't reveal Moiraine and Siuan because she actually didn't know they were still involved after being raised and because the BA assumed she would never involve such newly raised to the shawl.

Edited by Sabio

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