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Darian

why wasn't lanfear spared?

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after moraine pushed lanfear (along with herself) into the ter'angreal, Moraine was spared and somehow teleported to that shiny black tower...yet why hadn't lanfear done the same?

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Guest Barmacral

I believe it has something to do with the fact that she is a known servant of the Shadow. You also notice in later books that she is weaker than before she fell into the doorway, and my belief on this one is that the Eelfinn somehow took part of her strength in the one power and actually gave it to Moiraine, so that Moiraine will be stronger when she gets out. Of course, I could be wrong on that last part.

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It is the same domain, Finland, where Lanfear was held and Moiraine still is. Where the Aelfinn and Eelfinn live. It is possible Lanfear would have died because she tried to escape, or was killed because of her being a Darkfriend, or some other reason. However, the ter'angreal gives safe access to Finland, there is that pact that if those who come bring no iron, musical instruments or devices for making light, they get their answers or bargain. The Tower of Ghenjei is apparently also a way into the Realm, though apparently without any pact. So to answer, it is the same place. Perhaps Moiraine didn't do anything rash to escape because she knew her only chance of that was for the three guys saving her, if they come and succeed.

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Guest cwestervelt

She was transported to the realm of the Finn. She confirms this in Winter's Heart when Cyndane refers to her captivity.

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Maybe its because Lanfear melted the door on her way in. Also, she is much more likely than Moiraine to try to fight the Eelfinn.

 

You also notice in later books that she is weaker than before she fell into the doorway, and my belief on this one is that the Eelfinn somehow took part of her strength in the one power and actually gave it to Moiraine, so that Moiraine will be stronger when she gets out.

 

I think it more likely that Moiraine and Lanfear were both burned out as a result of their proximity to the melting ter'angreal, and that Cyndane was healed by a woman. There was extensive discussion on this in another thread, but suffice to say, we have no evidence that the Eelfinn can in any way affect a person's innate ability to channel.

 

However, the ter'angreal gives safe access to Finland, there is that pact that if those who come bring no iron, musical instruments or devices for making light, they get their answers or bargain.

 

We don't really know that those are the only provisions of the treaty. Another might reasonably be "don't melt the doorway, which is the basis for this treaty", but they don't have to ask travellers about that, because its obvious whether or not someone did it.

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Moiraine and Lanfear are both responsible for the melting of the door. Wouldn't Moiraine share the punishment that Lanfear recieved?

 

Sorry Robert I can't see death as punishment for melting the doorway as an option.I am also having a hard time with the healed by a woman theory. The only Forsaken that knows Cyndane is Lanfear is Moridin. The rest only think she is Lanfear reborn. Very few darkfriends are under the control of a single Forsaken. Over and over we have seen multiple Forsaken command the same DF. If a DF female channeller had healed Lanfear, I just think some other of the Forsaken would know of it.

 

I think we will have our answer to the riddle of Cyndane when Moiraine is rescued.

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The tower is just an access key to Finnland.

 

Lanfear said she was held captive. Now she's in a new body.

 

basically had to have died or made a wish. Let's assume she died.

Then the DO would ressurect her into another body, and she's then free of the Finns. The question is, why is she weaker in the One Power than before? Was it something They did to her, or the DO, or what? She's in a new body, so she's been put there by someone.

 

I'm thinking Morainne killed her, she commited suicide, or the Finns granted her a wish she didn't expect, which ultimately lead to her death.

 

Morainne has never died, and of course wouldn't be ressurected if she did, so she is still held captive, and still in her own body.

 

Thom and Matt with their swords / knives, illuminator matches, and musical instruments, have all the tools needed to Cheat the Finns in whatever way is needed to save her.

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their swords and knices r steel they need to find sum iron.

 

well technically, Iron is used to make steel. Steel is made out of Iron.

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Guest cwestervelt
their swords and knices r steel they need to find sum iron.

 

well technically' date=' Iron is used to make steel. Steel is made out of Iron.[/quote']

 

In a traditional sense the interpretation would be "cold iron" which is not the same as steel.

 

Edit: References are a little vague on that... Some refer to only iron that was never heated, others to anything derived from iron. I generally subscribe to the first view.

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their swords and knices r steel they need to find sum iron.

 

well technically' date=' Iron is used to make steel. Steel is made out of Iron.[/quote']

 

In a traditional sense the interpretation would be "cold iron" which is not the same as steel.

 

Edit: References are a little vague on that... Some refer to only iron that was never heated, others to anything derived from iron. I generally subscribe to the first view.

 

now you're really splitting hairs, better off to have said - how would they bind the finns with swords or daggers? They probably will bring along some other sort of iron like a chain, but I can't see why, and I can't think of anything iron that they have with them other than swords, daggers, and Matt's Ashawandi thingie, if you loosely examine the word Iron to include Steel.

 

The Iron to Bind may refer to what is holding Moraine, she may be chained up like Princess Leia in Star Wars. Yum.

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Guest cwestervelt

Iron to Bind doesn't meen the Finn have to be physically restrained. The connection to "cold iron" would be its ability to repel fey creatures and render them powerless. Thus it would be a figurative binding. As such, a hair splitting can be a crucial distinction.

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Mat had his throwing knives with him when he went through the doorway in Tear. I believe when the first snake person (snakes are Aelfinn, right?) asks if he has iron he thinks to himself that he has his knives, but they were steel, not iron. Apparently we're having the same argument that Matt was having in his head. :lol:

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A few things.

1. The most logical explaination for the severing of Lan's bond and Lanfear's drop in strength is that they were both stilled.

2. Having your door melted is probably quite distressing and so as punishment Lanfear and Moiraine were imprissoned.

3. Niether would enjoy imprissonment, but Moiraine had her visions from the rings to guide her Lanfear lacking those decieded to stroll on out.

4. Prisoners should not escape, kill them when they attempt it.

5. Lanfear was recycled before Flinn healed stilling so Lanfear was healed by a woman.

 

6. The Finns don't count steel as iron. Mat had steel knives in the first and received his steel ash'andri in the second. The two materials have differant properties. Mat needs to get some iron daggers.

 

I am not sure how much I like the healing and stilling part but for the rest I would be surprised if I am very far off.

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The simplest explanation (usually being the right one) is that her connection to the Shadow was the reason for her different treatment. We know that the Aelfinn have a dislike for the Shadow in the fact that any questions touching the shadow are punished extremely, therefore given that there is at least some connection with the Eelfinn, and that alleigence is the main difference between Moiraine and Lanfear, i would suggest that it is fairly obviously the connection to the shadow that resulted in her ultimate death.

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^ Incorrect. The simplest explanation is that we do not know enough about the Finn, their powers, and the properties of their world. Until we do, we're wasting our time with this complete guessing game, because we have almost no evidence of any kind.

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Lanfear died one of two ways one the elfin killed her because she worked for the shadow. Two:Moiriane kicked her tail.

Lanfear 2.0 is weaker because the body her soul is in now was weaker in the power than Lanfear's old one.

By the way I would also like to point that prositiutes are like old bananas: most are bruised and no one wants to eat them.

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^ Incorrect. The simplest explanation is that we do not know enough about the Finn, their powers, and the properties of their world. Until we do, we're wasting our time with this complete guessing game, because we have almost no evidence of any kind.

 

Uh buddy... thats not an explanation. But kudos on the brilliant deductive ability.

 

What a waste of a post.

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Lanfear died one of two ways one the elfin killed her because she worked for the shadow. Two:Moiriane kicked her tail.

Lanfear 2.0 is weaker because the body her soul is in now was weaker in the power than Lanfear's old one.

 

Darthbob - if Lanfear's new body is weaker in the Power, then why hasn't that happened before with all the other Chosen resurrected? Lanfear is the only one weaker than she was before she died, so we can assume channeling is a part of the soul, not a part of the body. It would be nearly impossible for the DO to find bodies that have the ability to channel as strongly as the Chosen, so you're wrong.

 

you also missed a third way Lanfear may have died - suicide. She could assume that the DO would resurrect her, so in order to get free of the Finns she may have axed herself.

 

Maybe the DO is the cause of her loss of power, maybe giving her to Moridin was her only punishment, in which case, maybe she was cured by one of the sisters (a dark sister) that Nyaneve taught the healing weave.

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Guest Barmacral

Doc, I don't think that Lanfear would consider suicide in hopes of ressurection. The first of the Forsaken to be ressurected came back in book 6, and Lanfear died in book 5. I doubt that she knew of this possibility.

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