Jump to content

DRAGONMOUNT

A WHEEL OF TIME COMMUNITY
Jason Denzel

The "OMG I just finished!" Thread

Recommended Posts

 

 

 

-The willingness of people at DM to break their own fourth wall.?

What does that even mean? Are you seriously trying to suggest that Brandon didn't does this a number of times in an utterly blunt way?
 

Don't lump me in entirely with his original post, but there's a lot of complaints about Brandon breaking the fourth wall. Literally speaking, he didn't do that.

Not sure what you mean by "literally speaking" he didn't do that?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This about sums up how I feel about AMOL.

 

From the AV Club review of the book:

 

"There’s a reason for damning A Memory Of Light with what may sound like faint praise. It’s an impossible book. It’s an attempt to bring to a climax thousands of pages of build-up involving hundreds of characters, to somehow satisfy 20-plus years of anticipation over an event that has been promised from the start: Rand al’Thor, the Dragon Reborn, confronting the Dark One, fulfilling any number of prophecies, and if all goes well, saving the world. Unless Jordan had some kind of major ace up his sleeve from day one, the odds were that the further away the ending got, the more anticlimactic it would feel when it finally arrived. 

 

"And that was back when it seemed like Jordan would be around for the long haul. Sanderson worked off Jordan’s remaining notes to complete the story, turning the final planned book into three volumes, and there’s no serious question of his commitment to following Jordan’s vision. But he’s still following, which means a certain disconnect runs almost subliminally through the text. Heroes whose behavior has been locked into place for dozens of chapters behave like they always do—right up until they don’t. These off moments (usually relegated to unexpectedly modern turns of phrase or weirdly abrupt decisions) are never more than a momentary distraction, but they serve as an ever-present reminder that this frequently thrilling compromise is still unquestionably a compromise."

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

 

 

-The willingness of people at DM to break their own fourth wall.?

What does that even mean? Are you seriously trying to suggest that Brandon didn't does this a number of times in an utterly blunt way?
 

Don't lump me in entirely with his original post, but there's a lot of complaints about Brandon breaking the fourth wall. Literally speaking, he didn't do that.

Not sure what you mean by "literally speaking" he didn't do that?

 

Brandon didn't actually put in asides where characters addressed the audience. Even cases where there was an obvious nod to a popular fan theory or a character was explaining something, I felt they didn't break me out of the experience and that they were better masked in AMoL than they have been in previous WoT books.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

TheVitaleMob is completely right that there are a huge majority of people on this forum that were going to hate the book regardless of how it ended. You have no idea what was actually written by BS or RJ, but because BS had a hand in it, you complain. If RJ was still here and wrote the exact same book, you would praise it as a masterpiece.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

-The willingness of people at DM to break their own fourth wall.?

What does that even mean? Are you seriously trying to suggest that Brandon didn't does this a number of times in an utterly blunt way?
 

Don't lump me in entirely with his original post, but there's a lot of complaints about Brandon breaking the fourth wall. Literally speaking, he didn't do that.

Not sure what you mean by "literally speaking" he didn't do that?
 

Brandon didn't actually put in asides where characters addressed the audience. Even cases where there was an obvious nod to a popular fan theory or a character was explaining something, I felt they didn't break me out of the experience and that they were better masked in AMoL than they have been in previous WoT books.

Splitting hairs rather fine don't you think Agitel? He broke the 4th wall in the classic sense a number of times. It has been comented on in almost every review of the book. Just because it didn't bother you doesn't mean it didn't happen. Theories were not the only time he did it btw.

 

TheVitaleMob is completely right that there are a huge majority of people on this forum that were going to hate the book regardless of how it ended. You have no idea what was actually written by BS or RJ, but because BS had a hand in it, you complain. If RJ was still here and wrote the exact same book, you would praise it as a masterpiece.

 

Very curious as to who this directed towards?(aside from Mark D ;P) Aside from teh fact that it is rather disengenious to say we might have had the same book we do have a clear idea on who wrote what in a good deal of instances. We also know RJ only had 200 pages of material scattered through all three books. Finally I really don't understand who all these people you refer to who are holding up Jordan's work as a "masterpiece". He was a top tier fantasy writer, nothing more, nothing less. One whose work know looks rather quaint when compared to the current top tier who have raised the bar a fair amount. The literary quality under Brandon is flawed and a good deal less than that however. Again even the people defending him for the most part agree on that. They just aren't overly bothered by the prose issues and mistakes like some of us.

Edited by Suttree

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

-The willingness of people at DM to break their own fourth wall.?

What does that even mean? Are you seriously trying to suggest that Brandon didn't does this a number of times in an utterly blunt way?
 

Don't lump me in entirely with his original post, but there's a lot of complaints about Brandon breaking the fourth wall. Literally speaking, he didn't do that.

Not sure what you mean by "literally speaking" he didn't do that?
 

Brandon didn't actually put in asides where characters addressed the audience. Even cases where there was an obvious nod to a popular fan theory or a character was explaining something, I felt they didn't break me out of the experience and that they were better masked in AMoL than they have been in previous WoT books.

Splitting hairs rather fine don't you think Agitel? He broke the 4th wall in the classic sense a number of times. It has been comented on in almost every review of the book. Just because it didn't bother you doesn't mean it didn't happen. Theories were not the only time he did it btw.

 

I mentioned explanations that were there only for the benefit of the audience. I felt such things were much better masked in AMoL. I don't consider more modern speaking to be a breach of the fourth wall, personally. There were a couple of times, though. "Arabesque." He used that word to describe a type of architecture somewhere. That is a breach. There weren't many of those that I noticed, though.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, Sanderson's dialog and tone was definitely clunky sometimes and broke the immersion into Jordan's world. The explanations on the Horn and Olver were so forced. But again, the readers knew what they were getting into after RJ passed.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I finished the book in a marathon read, slept few hours between. Hard to find words, I did like the ending, it was the right ending but there were few things I really disliked, Sharan`s appearing being the biggest. I can get emotionally connected to characters when watching movies but I didnt expect tears to form in my eyes, still when Noal would return from the dead, mind you, to one who had lost everything. To one who has lost, which at times feels close to everything, it was something that really affected me. I`ll have to spend day or two before jumping into discussions, a bit to think trough.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Put together a list of what you liked and didn't like; you'll be surprised at how quickly the process helps you evaluate the book as a whole.

 

Olver was a perfect candidate for the Hornsounder; I'm glad he was able to see that sometimes the Pattern does give back.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

First of all, I enjoyed it, but feel that Robert Jordan's notes maybe weren't that complete and it showed, particularly regarding Rand's final showdown with the DO.

 

Somethings weren't really addressed. The bombshell that sul'dam could learn to channel pretty much allowed to slide. It should bring down the Seanchan. Would have like a glimpse into the future too. Did the peace hold, did the Aiel avoid their future, did the 4th age kick start an Age of Legends? I suspect these questions may be answered in ghost written sequels.

 

Overall, a magnificent series that will be re-read over and over again.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

After the fiasco ith the Portal Stone in TGH and the lifetime flashbacks in TSH, the confrontation with the DO just felt like a retread. It surprised me that Jordan didn't just focus on the ending before he died. Sanderson is a competent writer; he could have gotten the series from CoT through Towers of Midnight.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I, too, am feeling sad and have a sense of loss.  I had just finished reading all of the books just before AMoL was released and jumped right into it.  I finished the book last night and couldn't sleep because I kept thinking about all that happened during the LB.  Reading the final chapter and not wanting it to end.  I wanted to read more and find out what happens to the remaining characters in the 4th Age.  I find myself almost in tears when I start thinking about it.  I have read some many books and not a one has ever made me feel like this one did.  Call it good, call it bad, but it was an ending.  In a story where there were no beginnings or endings, this was a end.  It was an end to the greatest series ever written.  Thank you Robert Jordan for giving me such a wonderful story.  I laughed, I cried, I read and now it is over.  Sure there is the ability to reread the books, but it won't be the same.  I won't feel the anticipation of waiting for the last book.  I almost wish I wasn't so impatient to get the final book. 

 

Share your feelings.. No other book/series has ever come close to WOT for me. Re-reading wont be the same again. There will always be a sense of loss... It really is the greatest series ever written.. I doubt there will be any series out there which will even come close to WOT in terms of connect with fans and getting them totally immersed in the world.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

I mentioned explanations that were there only for the benefit of the audience. I felt such things were much better masked in AMoL. I don't consider more modern speaking to be a breach of the fourth wall, personally. There were a couple of times, though. "Arabesque." He used that word to describe a type of architecture somewhere. That is a breach. There weren't many of those that I noticed, though.

 

The word Arabesque is an artistic and architectural term dating from the 1500s.....I don't see the problem.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I just finished the book and I´m so sad. I knew I would be. This was the end.

 

The book has made me curse, laugh and cry. There are things that I don´t understand. Unanswered questions. I need to check this board now to see if someone has those answers. :)

 

My mind is still in chaos but some random thoughts:

 

Strongest moment that made me cry: Noal coming for Olver. Non of them have been my favourite characters but that scene made me cry.

 

Other strong moments: Egwene dying. That was horrible. Lan "dying" and living. Rhuarc under compulsion.

 

I laughed at Graendal´s and Cadsuan´s faiths in the end.

 

Best heroes: Androl and Pevara. May they live happily ever after.

 

The writing was sometimes wonderful and sometimes horrible. So many times a chapter ended great - I just had to know what would happen next - and then... nothing. Maybe a comment four chapters later telling what had happened. Moiraines return was great and then... bah! Rand´s and Mat´s parts could have been much better. So I´m a bit disappointed in a lot of ways.

 

Still, I´m very happy that there was an ending to read. Very grateful. And when I´m not in this emotional chaos I might add more to this. :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Again, I think the overwhelming sentiment of the fans is conflicted; there was really no way AMOL was going to live up to expectations, and Sanderson had a nearly impossible task to fulfill.

 

He!!, RJ would have had just as much trouble and he wrote the series.

 

Sanderson did a serviceable job, which is all we could have asked from him.

 

 

That being said, none of the Wise Ones was a DF? I was waiting for some serious betrayal at Shayol Ghul. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

TheVitaleMob is completely right that there are a huge majority of people on this forum that were going to hate the book regardless of how it ended. You have no idea what was actually written by BS or RJ, but because BS had a hand in it, you complain. If RJ was still here and wrote the exact same book, you would praise it as a masterpiece.

I don't think that's fair.

 

I personally hate the Sharans as the bad guys popping out of no where, felt a little cheap.  And that was undoubtably a RJ decision.

 

 

The characters got left behind in this novel to make room for the action.  I prefer character interaction over battle scenes.  Hence why it left a very sour taste in my mouth.

 

 

PS.  Lots of people say they were crying at parts in this book...this is one of the few WoT books where I've felt disconnected to the characters and even key deaths were a 'meh' event.  (and ToM had more than a few that had me emotionally invested, so it's not the author so much as the tone/rush)

Edited by Jak o' the Shadows

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Same here, Jak. I felt like I was reading a summary of what the characters were thinking and doing, and what happened as a result. Complete disconnect, although perhaps I brought it upon myself by burning through it in 3 sessions.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I feel kinda sad not coz of how it end but coz it did end,its like we reached end of the road and now part ways we watched them grow and become heroes and we grew with them and now its kinda sad there wont be anymore new adventures from them :(

what makes WOT special is that it took so long to finish and that no matter how many times you read it you can always find something new to admire in it

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What I really want to see is an abridged version that tightens the storylines, eliminates some of the sluggishness (Faile captivity, Windfinders), and comes in at around 8-10 books. It could easily be done with the right team of editors.

 

Actually, what I really want to see is a whole new section detailing the transformation of life at the Black Tower. Imagine meeting Androl in book 7?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Almost twenty years ago my roommate handed me The Dragon Reborn and said, 'you've got to read this!" I didn't know he knew how to read:). I am so grateful he did. The journey here was well worth it. As for my "OMG I just finished it", thinking how Rand rode off into the sunset(sort of), a horse thief, that made me LOL, his pipe, no matches but the will to light his pipe, and a 'see the world' attitude. It seemed like it was RJ's send off.

 

Mat telling Toun, "when you looked at me and saw I had a knife ready to throw, you looked back over your shoulder....."

 

One of my favorite chapters, "The walk was wrong...." Tom, just had me smiling as he thought out how history would be relived thru his words.

 

Another favorite, "I'm just a man....." I read that scene a dozen times before going on. Lan IS the best swordsman at that time!

 

Mat and Rand, in front of THEE HIGHEST:), "I can't believe you're even comparing achievements..."

 

Demandred, "This has to be Lews Therin....." I think Demandred was written perfectly. So powerful but I could see the TP driving him crazier and crazier. I did think Mat was going to kill him.

 

Lanfear, oh, she was gooooooooood.

 

I really really loved reading this series. I hope, but understand why not, that there are some more writings about Mat mainly. I loved the entire ending, well it wasn't an ending but a beginning and I for one am very grateful to BS for finishing the story. I look forward to reading more people's post on here, especially if someone could tell who Mat really is???

Edited by Express

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think the problem with it is that it has the term "arab" in it.

 

It should have just been "Ogieresque"

Good one, Tiger!

 

Brandon's modernisms have bothered me in the past, but remember, this book was sort of "written by committee," so maybe there had to be some give-and-take on the subject.  Maybe a whole lot of worse things were edited out and Team Jordan didn't want to get overly picky and discouraging.  Those who create something from nothing, sometimes just called artists at our best, are a touchy breed sometimes.  Overall, I think the Sanderson modernisms have slowly decreased in all of his works, but he still goes way over the top with the psychological musings for me.  I guess that's another example of "tell instead of show," which is not the ideal, in case any of you were not sure. = ]

 

Back to Jason's original intent for this thread:  I finished yesterday.  I share so many of the feelings expressed here.  I came to Dragonmount to vent and gripe and share the awe, not really intending to post.  I have no close friends who are reading this, so I join this community for the first time in a loooong time for the shared experience, as so many lurkers seem to be doing.   Thanks, all.

Edited by Princess of Pie

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have just finished the last book in this series that I have read since I was in high school, through the military, all the way until now. The need to find out what happened in this last book made me read as fast as I ever have. I feel a loss now that the series is over, and the thought of no more Wheel of Time books saddens me. However, it is nice to know the ending. Lan defeating Demandred was epic. Nynaeve has always been my favorite character and so I am more than mildly disappointed that she was left out of most of the book. When I started this last book, I looked forward to reading more about her awesomeness. A Memory of Light was so epic that it almost made up for the lack of Nynaeve in it.

 

I am sad and happy at the same time. Happy that the ending has been written. Sad there will be no more.

 

At least there is the comprehensive Wheel of Time encyclopedia that is planned. Maybe some secrets will be shared with us :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

...hate it when writers leave the ending unwritten. I want to know what happened I don't want to imagine it. Pisses me off when this happens in books and movies. Seriously absolutely hate it. I'm big time disappointed :/I'd rather have less drawn out fights and more explanation of what happens at the end. I dont want to have to imagine and dwell on what happened to the characters after the fact, I have better things to do. Give me a conclusion and be done with it.

"The purpose of a storyteller is not to tell you how to think, but to give you questions to think upon."  - Hoid, The Way of Kings

 

Jordan and Sanderson are storytellers first and foremost, and while i realize it can be argued that the quote above was never intended to apply here, I think it fits.  

 

 

And with that out of the way...  OMG Egwene died in the most epic way possible.  

 

Demandred was a dunce, but I understand that his selfish obsession with Lews Therin blinded him to the possibility that Rand was fighting the Dark One before he even showed up and on top of that, the Kinslayer is nothing more than a set of memories now, literally and finally dead.  But yeah, what a selfish idiot.  

 

Do wish Moiraine had been able to do more, but I doubt she could have done too much without the Choedan Kal or something close, considering how weak she became.  

 

I never cared much about Bela the magical wonderhorse, but I found it amazing that I was wondering in passing if Mat really was still bound to the horn after Rahvin killed him just a week before AMOL arrived in the mail, and then OLVER is the Hornsounder!  I was bracing for the worst, only to be shocked awake when I read that!  

 

And Perrin... Maybe its just me, maybe its the fast pace, but I feel like the scene where he Power-forges his hammer sent more chills down my spine than his entire arc in the final book.

 

And I've been rooting for Rand to kill the Dark One since sixth grade (about 12 years or so), but I realized a Pattern without a Dark One to imprison would indeed be a world where nobody is capable of choosing evil, and the Dark One's presence inside the pattern allows him to influence it in very subtle ways, possibly unconscious ways.  I imagine if the Dark One escaped and imprisoned the Creator before going on his merry way, the world would be much like the one Rand saw where everybody was Turned to the Light.

 

Finally, my only true complaint:  No boat scene.  I wanted Rand to live, but beyond that, I wanted to see him on a boat with his three chicks.  Min had a viewing on it, so it must be true, and I really wanted to read that.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wow is all I can say. I just finished the book and it's near three-thirty in the morning here. (Yeah I got it late) I don't think I've laughed and cried as much over a book as I have with this one. But then again, this series isn't normal. 

 

Some outstanding moments. 

Hearing Rand truly laugh.

Egwene, I cried, not gonna lie. She grew on me over the last few books. 

Moghedian at the end, priceless. 

Cadsuane at the end, also priceless

When Mat tells Hawkwing to go meet Tuon. I wish I could have seen that.

Lanfear, I honestly didn't see that coming at all.

Rand and Mat comparing their accomplishments in front of Tuon.  

Mat's internal monologue for the entire book was hilarious. Brandon writes him the best imo

When Tam took the torch to light the pyre... 

When Lan finally killed that loudmouth annoying idiot. That whole scene was great. 

There were so many "hope is lost" moments in this book and they were masterfully done. 

Also, I never thought that one book could contain so many ways of calling someone an idiot, or insulting them. 

Those last words were something special too.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...