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A WHEEL OF TIME COMMUNITY

What you dislike most about the series?


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First and MOST important - that the next book isnt out yet.

 

 

Oh and I suppose after that.... probably Aes Sedai or Egwene... difficult to pick

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What I found bothered me continuously throughout the series was the lack of trust and communication between the three supposed best friends Rand, Mat, and Perrin. I mean Jebus perrin, Just tell mat you talk to wolves! No big deal, considering Mat got hung, then survived.. AND visited another world and all. :dry:

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All of these are criticisms I have.

 

Notably:

 

-Perrin's storylines, outside of his most recent battle with slayer, have been a SNORE

-----OMG Slayer is still alive!!!!!

-Frustrating how some of the characters talk to each other. Manipulation was cool at first, then it just got old

-Why isn't everyone kissing Rand's feet? Get with it people. He's the Dragon Reborn.

-The screen time of the Forsaken has decreased. The first few books were awesome in large part because of Lanfear and Asmodean.

-The Black Tower, Logain, and Taim need more screen time.

-Moiraine is finally saved....tbh....I kinda didn't care. Took much longer than it needed. Thom might actually have a storyline haha.

-Meh, I wish Rand would have wiped out the Seanchan and I wish the Aes Sedai weren't so stupid and inept wrt battling. After seeing Moiraine, I thought all Aes Sedai were as knowledgeable in the power, respectful, and honest. Lies all lies!

-The pacing

Edited by MauricXe
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the complete and utter worthlessness of the forsaken and the villains in general. seriously they are all cartoonish villains with the exception of padan fain. struggle between good and evil? give me a bloody break. This aint no struggle.

 

The apparent invulnerability of the emond fielders. I am so sick of it now. And this disease has caught on to the support cast as well.

 

 

after 13 books not one single major character has met its end. what a friggin joke. No tension whatsoever in this series

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Then stop reading the books, if it annoys you so much :) Not every fantasy story have to be a blood bath with major characters dying left and right.

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No, not every story has to be like ASOFAI, true. But like another poster stated, the "gee I bent over to pick up a quarter and wow that arrow just missed me" does get old after awhile. Ninety percent of the Perrin/Faile story line could have been edited out, and it wouldn't have hurt anything. I skimmed over 3/4 of CoT and didn't miss anything..that says something. Minute details repeated over and over just gets old after awhile, I mean after 5 books do we still need to know how slow Perrin is or how Mat is better with the girls than Rand is? I swear I've never read

in any book how women smooth their skirts to show uneasiness. Over and over..

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Faile. I really don't like her, to be quite honest.

 

 

Also, if I read about any more of Elayne's baths in AMoL, I'm burning it.

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the complete and utter worthlessness of the forsaken and the villains in general. seriously they are all cartoonish villains with the exception of padan fain. struggle between good and evil? give me a bloody break. This aint no struggle.

 

The apparent invulnerability of the emond fielders. I am so sick of it now. And this disease has caught on to the support cast as well.

 

 

after 13 books not one single major character has met its end. what a friggin joke. No tension whatsoever in this series

While I do agree that the "good guys" are just way too unrealistically invulnerable to defeat, I have only observed that you seem to criticize this series in every post you've made (at least every one I've seen). I ponder why you bother venturing to a Wheel of Time message board then. That said, yes, I do wish there was a bit more realism and less redudancy in always having the antagonists get their butts kicked by a "supposedly" weaker group of heroes.

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the complete and utter worthlessness of the forsaken and the villains in general. seriously they are all cartoonish villains with the exception of padan fain. struggle between good and evil? give me a bloody break. This aint no struggle.

 

The apparent invulnerability of the emond fielders. I am so sick of it now. And this disease has caught on to the support cast as well.

 

 

after 13 books not one single major character has met its end. what a friggin joke. No tension whatsoever in this series

While I do agree that the "good guys" are just way too unrealistically invulnerable to defeat, I have only observed that you seem to criticize this series in every post you've made (at least every one I've seen). I ponder why you bother venturing to a Wheel of Time message board then. That said, yes, I do wish there was a bit more realism and less redudancy in always having the antagonists get their butts kicked by a "supposedly" weaker group of heroes.

 

Imho, this kind of balances the early books where the Wondergirls were captives of Black Ajah, Senchean, cutpurses, Yellow Ajah eyes and ears, etc. and they spent a ton of time just waiting around for Mat to rescue them. Iirc, I was actually surprised when Nynaeve beat Moggy for the first time in Tanchico, and even then, they almost all got slaughtered by the Gholam except for a timely rescue by Mat.

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1) Perrin after TSR. He did nothing interesting other than Dumai's wells from LoC to Tom.

2) Too many characters. Who doesn't wish that Demanded, Taim, Logain, Thom, and Lan had appeared more than in passing after book 6, if at all?

3) Plot lines that were too long. Like all of Perrin, or the bowl of winds.

4) Mat was RAPED and no other characters cared, and he has not thought about it since... Really?

5) The forsaken stopped being a threat after one of them died at the end of half of the books. None of them even threatened Perrin or Mat.

 

I love RJ, but I feel as though if he had handed it to Brandon after book 6, the editors might have said no more often.

Edited by ArborCantor
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4) Mat was RAPED and no other characters cared, and he has not thought about it since... Really?

 

 

because he liked it....eventually :)

Edited by MauricXe
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My chief complaint these days is Mat's characterization post-RJ. Yes, we get it. He's a womanizer. But that doesn't mean I have to read a scene where he admires literally EVERY woman in the tavern yet claims he doesn't care because he's married. And okay, Mat saved all the girls at one point or another. Great. Also, his sense of humor was waaaaay less subtle.

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I love RJ, but I feel as though if he had handed it to Brandon after book 6, the editors might have said no more often.

 

You mean RJ's wife might have said no more often? Yeah, I suspect you're right.

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Then stop reading the books, if it annoys you so much :) Not every fantasy story have to be a blood bath with major characters dying left and right.

 

 

too late for that now.

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4) Mat was RAPED and no other characters cared, and he has not thought about it since... Really?

 

 

because he liked it....eventually :)

stockholm syndrome

 

 

 

my main complaint is these forums and topics that keep coming up like: Who is Mat really?

 

it just irritates me how many times i have seen that type of topic pop up

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my main complaint is these forums and topics that keep coming up like: Who is Mat really?

 

it just irritates me how many times i have seen that type of topic pop up

 

Mat was RJ's avatar, so it's fairly predictable that sites will be overrun with Mat fanbois.

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I have to go with Egwene's great idea of rallying everyone together to tell Rand NOT to break the dark one's seals. Just what was she thinking? Thanks for letting Camelyn fall buddy. Now why don't you just go play in the corner while the grown ups handle the Last Battle.

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Hmmm... well, there are characters I dislike, but that's going to be the case in any book. As far as what I think could be improved, I think the relationships could definitely have been improved upon. People seem to fall wildly in love almost out of nowhere, all major characters end up being paired off, and, as people have mentioned, there's very little in the way of platonic relationships between males and females in the series. Mat- Birgitte and Nynaeve- Rand are the only two that jump to mind. That said, those two friendships, I do enjoy very much. More so than a lot of the same- gender friendships. Nynaeve, Egwene and Elayne were supposedly a friendship group, at least Egwene calls Elayne and Nynaeve her friends, but by the gods, most of the time they don't seem to like each other.

 

So yes, I think the friendships/ romances between characters aren't always well written or believable, though there are many, like the two aforementioned friendships, and the Perrin/ Faile relationship (yes, really :P) that I love and think were done well.

Edited by Himiko
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I have to go with Egwene's great idea of rallying everyone together to tell Rand NOT to break the dark one's seals. Just what was she thinking? Thanks for letting Camelyn fall buddy. Now why don't you just go play in the corner while the grown ups handle the Last Battle.

 

WOW...I have seen Eggy blamed for just about everything on this site but putting the Shadow's attack against Caemlyn on her is a definite first. By that rationale the attack on Maradon is Rand's fault because he is the reason the Borderlander's left their post. Both are fairly ridiculous of course.

 

As for being against breaking the seals. Let's see a man that as far as you know has taint induced madness, waltzes into the WT, says he is going to break the seals and set the DO free and then refuses to discuss the situation with you. WHAT was she thinking!!! You can disagree with how she is going about it as the book progresses, but a frist reaction of trying to stop it and questioning if he has a plan(which he refused to discuss and at this point the plan is let's hope Min figures something out from those old books) is a very valid reaction. Not to mention Rand, for whatever reason purposely antagonized her and AS maneuvered her into doing exactly what he wanted her to do.

Edited by Suttree
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I have to go with Egwene's great idea of rallying everyone together to tell Rand NOT to break the dark one's seals. Just what was she thinking? Thanks for letting Camelyn fall buddy. Now why don't you just go play in the corner while the grown ups handle the Last Battle.

 

WOW...I have seen Eggy blamed for just about everything on this site but putting the Shadow's attack against Caemlyn on her is a definite first. By that rationale the attack on Maradon is Rand's fault because he is the reason the Borderlander's left their post. Both are fairly ridiculous of course.

 

As for being against breaking the seals. Let's see a man that as far as you know has taint induced madness, waltzes into the WT, says he is going to break the seals and set the DO free and then refuses to discuss the situation with you. WHAT was she thinking!!! You can disagree with how she is going about it as the book progresses, but a frist reaction of trying to stop it and questioning if he has a plan(which he refused to discuss and at this point the plan is let's hope Min figures something out from those old books) is a very valid reaction. Not to mention Rand, for whatever reason purposely antagonized her and AS maneuvered her into doing exactly what he wanted her to do.

 

The attack itself was not her fault but with all of this madness going on around the world at this moment would you leave the capitol of the biggest nation basically undefended? and is it not Rand's duty to fight the dark one? It's like she is still hoping that the Last Battle is a far off thing which it is not. It's right around the corner and if Rand believes he is ready then by god I think everyone should support him. Rand has shown a stubborn streak in the past, Egwene especially should have been aware of that, did she really believe they could talk him out of something in which he has dug his heels in on?

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For me be worst aspects of RJ's WOT is that following LoC, the books stopped reading like novels and became increasingly serials. This was apparently by design. As none of the books following LoC seemed to be not much of a clear beginning, middle, and end of a story within the same book. Story lines were left to play out over the course of multiple books. This format simply did not work for me. Even events like, for example, the cleansing of the taint seemed sapped of their dramatic significance because of the the general lack of build up. Thankfully, this has been largely resolved under Sanderson.

 

I fully agree that too many of the relationships charachters are having just don't work for me either. I think the problems I am having stem from two factors. First the PoV as plot device is designed to keep us in the dark about character's motivations and not to show us how they really feel. It is poorly suited to capture these details in a cast this size. There are far too many PoV characters, and far too many irrelevant supporting roles. Perversely every single character introduced in book 1, even those that seem totally superfluous, seem to come back to do some entirely forgettable deed which we have to read about later on. As a result far too much happens "off screen" for the main characters. Its not uncommon to lose track of main characters for whole books or more. Strangely, the one romance that actually is well developed and that makes sense to me where the partners truly do seem to love each other, Perrin and Faile, seems to be the least popular among fans.

 

The second larger problem with characterisation is that RJ has chosen a surreal parody May Sue all-star team cast of characters. The wheel of time is supposed to be a tale about the ultimate struggle between light and dark for the fate reality. Yet, the single main character who seems to die can't stay dead.

Edited by Jong
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I think someone already mentioned this but my least favorite thing would have to be Thom Merrilins fade from the spotlight. For the first few books my fav char. was not rand, mat or perrin but Thom i think he really made those first books as good as they are, I dont really mind the massive cast of characters but having Thom pushed aside the way he was made the series seem less in my eyes. I mean who didnt at least almost cry when he saved mat and rands life at whitbridge seemingly at the cost of his own? All Hail the Grey Fox!

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The second larger problem with characterisation is that RJ has chosen a surreal parody May Sue all-star team cast of characters.

 

Actually, I am surprised at this reaction since I started reading the boards here. I re-read the whole series, and up until book 7-8 or so, the Wondergirls were prisoners at least once per book. Egwene herself, currently the most hated of the three, was a prisoner in the White Tower from book 8 all the way to book 12. The wondergirls have only dominated since a) Nynaeve broke her barrier in Tanchico, and b) Egwene repelled the Seanchan invasion in book 12. Elayne has been captured or nearly killed by the black ajah nearly every book since KoD. Aviendha has been an apprentice from book 4 to book 13.

 

To me, their recent successes are completely overshadowed by their early failures. I was rather shocked that Egwene defeated Mesanna by herself, but even then it was close.

 

Even Mat and Rand have had their share of defeats, near escapes, and lucky breaks. The only character, imho, who deserves the Mary Sue label is Perrin. I believe he's like 20-0-1 vs all enemies. The one draw was with Slayer in ToM.

Edited by Toy'varen
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I think someone already mentioned this but my least favorite thing would have to be Thom Merrilins fade from the spotlight. For the first few books my fav char. was not rand, mat or perrin but Thom i think he really made those first books as good as they are, I dont really mind the massive cast of characters but having Thom pushed aside the way he was made the series seem less in my eyes. I mean who didnt at least almost cry when he saved mat and rands life at whitbridge seemingly at the cost of his own? All Hail the Grey Fox!

Quoted for truth.

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