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Luckystrike

The Dark One?

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What do you feel about the idea of the Dark One? Is he omnipresent or has a more solid form? (And all of the other questions like this.)

 

The only screentime The DO's had is speaking to the forsaken. In that scene, if I remember correctly, only the forsaken who he spoke to could hear him (like speaking inside their head and not at all real existing sound/voice.)

 

I know what I don't want the Dark One to be, and it is a big monster (or some kind of a huge black god, or something in that vein). If he's not omnipresent, I would like him to be a more human-kind of something.

 

But as in theory, it would be cool if he's like the creator; not really existing in the pattern, more like beyond it.

Kind of omnipresent-like.

 

I would want to know what you guys think?

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Ok, I'll say it... Bela?

 

Seriously though, I'm thinking (hoping) the DO is just gonna be a voice - not a physical manifestation. I think Shaidar Haran is the physical manifestation.

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Ok, I'll say it... Bela?

 

Seriously though, I'm thinking (hoping) the DO is just gonna be a voice - not a physical manifestation. I think Shaidar Haran is the physical manifestation.

 

Bela! Why didn't I think of it! :P

 

Yeah, I somewhat don't even hope he is a voice. I have always thought that to be cheesy. Even when he spoke to the forsaken, I just hoped he was twisting their minds to form the words he want to say. :P

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He is the sticky lumpy bits in the gravy.

 

He is also the act of shaving! He has many forms

 

I reckon the Dark One is the True Power, and to channel him is to invite him into your body. Do it enough, and you aint getting your body back.

Edited by Drekka Mort

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I reckon the Dark One is the True Power, and to channel him is to invite him into your body. Do it enough, and you aint getting your body back.

^This.Maybe a wildshot but it fits.

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I reckon the Dark One is the True Power, and to channel him is to invite him into your body. Do it enough, and you aint getting your body back.

^This.Maybe a wildshot but it fits.

 

Ive never seen anyone else try to explain why Graendal would mistake Moridin for the Dark One. But yeah, possession definitely. I think Ba'alzamon was not Ishamael, and the Watcher was not Moridin. Both were the Dark One being in control of a human body.

 

Yes, you read that right. I think we have had a Dark One PoV already.

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I always remember a moment when there was still a voice in Rand's head and there was talk of how the creator had made the world like a gardener cultivates a flower and then moves on...can't remember the exact book...anyway it made me think of the darkone as rot or cancer that tries to currupt the living 'flower'. i guess this makes the bore a still infected sore, could callandor be the lance? :smile:

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He is the sticky lumpy bits in the gravy.

 

He is also the act of shaving! He has many forms

 

I reckon the Dark One is the True Power, and to channel him is to invite him into your body. Do it enough, and you aint getting your body back.

 

I reckon your on to something there. The forsaken going on about how crazy Ishy was and how he thought he was the dark one. Well maybe he was.

 

Also the dark one is having to get up from bed to urinate.

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He is the sticky lumpy bits in the gravy.

 

He is also the act of shaving! He has many forms

 

I reckon the Dark One is the True Power, and to channel him is to invite him into your body. Do it enough, and you aint getting your body back.

 

I reckon your on to something there. The forsaken going on about how crazy Ishy was and how he thought he was the dark one. Well maybe he was.

 

Also the dark one is having to get up from bed to urinate.

 

Demandred: Damnit Moridin cant you ever clean up after yourself?

Moridin: Uh, sorry, that was the Great Lord, and he... er... needs target practice.

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Hoping too that the Dark One will not be anything more than a voice (or a spiritual manifestation) and a physical avatar in the name of Shaidar Haran. He sure can possess bodies, but as far as it is concerned, I really do hope it is not anything physical.

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It says some things about him/her/it in the BWB. RJ said some things about him/her/it as well.

 

The Dark One is the Dark Counterpart to the Creator. Not a fallen angel or anything like that. The Dark One has no true physical form. The Dark One has the power to destroy the Wheel and end time, if ever he/she/it is "free" to do so.

 

Crossroads of Twilight Book Tour 18 January 2003 - Cambridge, MA

Q: Can the Dark One be balefired?

RJ: No.

Netherlands tour 7 April 2001, Elf Fantasy Fair - Aan'allein reporting

 

Kurafire: And the rest of the Shadowspawn?

RJ: What? Do they have souls you mean?

Kurafire: Yeah, and how do their threads work?

RJ: The threads work in the way, in the same way that the thread of any living thing works. It is part of the Pattern. They are not outside of the Pattern. Neither are the Forsaken. But the Pattern in a thing that is open, that's change. It is not a matter of the lives being forced necessarily. It's wide, you have the Pattern, the Heroes that are bound to the Wheel, they're not always heroes in the way of someone who rides in galloping with a sword, or carries out daring rescues. The people, the Heroes who are bound to the Wheel, are the corrective mechanisms. Human behavior is throwing the Pattern out. It's throwing the balance off. And the Wheel spins out the proper correctives. Put everything back in the balance. So not even the Forsaken are apart from that, they're not outside. The only things that are outside are the Creator and the Dark One. Neither affected by the Pattern.

Letter to Paul Ward from RJ - March 2000

Q: (paraphrased) Is the DO pure TP? Why does the Creator ignore Randland except to talk to Rand at the end of TEotW?

RJ: No, the Dark One is not pure True Power. Who says the Creator takes little interest in the activities of mankind? And I will neither confirm nor deny that the Creator spoke to Rand.

Barnes and Noble chat 11 November 1997

 

Brandon from Mission Viejo: Mr. Jordan, it's fairly common knowledge that the Dark One was bound by the Creator outside of the Pattern at the moment of creation. Would it then be safe to assume, after concepts brought to light in the new release, that the world before the opening of the prison never knew true evil? If so, then was each Age before the opening of the Age of Legends different facets of some utopia? As well, without major conflict between good and evil, what caused ages to pass? Thanks.

RJ: Given that time is cyclic, you must assume that there is a time when the prison that holds the Dark One is whole and unbroken. There is a time when a hole is drilled into that prison and it is thus open to that degree. And there is a time when the opening has been patched in a makeshift manner. But following this line, the cyclic nature of time means that we have at some time in the future inevitably a whole and unbroken prison again. Unless, of course, the Dark One breaks free, in which case all bets are off -- kick over the table and run for the window.

Chat #2 - 27 June 1996

 

DayTripr1: And also is the Dark One the only source of the True Power?

RobtJordan: Yes, the Dark One is the only source of the True Power.

 

AOL Chat #1 - 27 June 1996

 

AaronB20 asks: Can you clarify who can tell when one is using the True Power?

RJ: No one can tell if you're using the True Power except the Dark One, of course.

Edited by Nightstrike

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I've always thought of the DO as just a byproduct of the creation of the Wheel/Pattern. He's the "rounding error" if you want to go all Matrix-like, and he's essential yet at the same time destructive to the Wheel, so the Creator just locked him up. Then the Wheel spins out certain safeguards to keep him in his prison. Often that's the "Dragon." But if the Dragon is turned to the shadow, like Ishmael believes, some other hero(s) have to step up.

 

At the same time, however, the Wheel must also be trying to free the DO. Think about it: RJ says the DO cannot touch the Pattern when he is sealed away. This means it must be the will of the Pattern itself to occasionally drill a hole into the prison.

 

Basically, the continuing spinning of the Wheel seems to require a never-ending struggle between light and dark. Maybe its this struggle that actually causes the Wheel to spin.

 

And now I've gone cross-eyed. Bottom line is, this is a fantasy. Let's not get too worked up about all the imaginary details. Rand is going to kick the Dark One's ass into another Age.

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Compuserve Chat 26 June 1996

 

Martin Reznick: How was the Dark One created, i.e. is he a fallen angel, an inherent part of the universe, etc.?

RJ: I envision the Dark One as being the dark counterpart, the dark balance if you will, to the Creator carrying on the theme, the yin yang, light dark, necessity of balance theme that has run through the books . . . it's somewhat Manichean I know, but I think it works.

 

The Dark One is not a by-product of the Wheel. I'd say so because of the "Manichean" remark.

Edited by Nightstrike

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If the One Power is the motive force behind the Wheel and the Pattern then I think the DO may be a form of dark matter with a consciousness. Given RJs background in physics it would not be surprising if it were something along that line of thinking. I could also see the Creator and DO being one and the same, just flip sides of the same coin or different aspects of the same entity. RJ also had a penchant for Eastern philosophies and the concepts of balance and the old Yin and Yang. It will be interesting to see how much of the DO's true nature is revealed in the end, or how much of his personal notes and information will be released once the series concludes. A nice no questions barred interview with Harriet, Maria, and/or Brandon would be awesome after AMOL is published.

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Thanks for the replies!

 

Well, reading what you have written I see that I share the same opinions about the Dark One and the Creator as many of you. To cut it short; some sort of Yin and Yang.

 

The thing is; when I read the part where DO speaks to the forsaken I became a little disappointed. I want the DO to be as the creator; not really existing in Randland, but just is. I don't want the DO to be the stereotype-bad guy, but somehow the nature of wrong and evil in the world.

 

Well, we shall find out more about the Dark One in A Memory of Light I suppose... and hope.

 

Btw, the Charlie Sheen-post cracked me up! :P

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From a Towers of Midnight Viewing (been reading Encyclopaedia's pages), I take the Dark One will be a faceless darkness during Tarmon Gaidon.

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